I need info on New Zealand!
August 1, 2005 1:33 PM Subscribe
I'm getting an urge to move out of the USA, and have heard positive but not specific things about New Zealand.
Hence, I'd like to find some resources about New Zealand such as:
- Personal experiences living there (especially compared to the US (Florida in specific))
- Political information (especially in relation to technology issues and personal privacy)
- Anything that would draw a person there or turn them away.
Most of the sites I've found so far center around tourism and travel, not alot (or my google-fu is shifty today) about actually LIVING there.
Thanks!
Hence, I'd like to find some resources about New Zealand such as:
- Personal experiences living there (especially compared to the US (Florida in specific))
- Political information (especially in relation to technology issues and personal privacy)
- Anything that would draw a person there or turn them away.
Most of the sites I've found so far center around tourism and travel, not alot (or my google-fu is shifty today) about actually LIVING there.
Thanks!
The first thing you might want to do before deciding if you want to move to NZ is find out if you actually qualify. For as much grief as the USA takes with regard to race issues and immigration, it is orders of magnitude easier to move to the United States than to most other nations, including New Zealand.
There are two main ways to qualify: One, have a boatload of cash you can invest. Something like $3,000,000 US. Two, be young, healthy, educated, and most importantly a worker in one of New Zealand's "priority" occupations. The criteria for immigration is easy to find on the web.
I say do that part first because it would really suck to settle on New Zealand as your definite goal and then find out they don't want you.
posted by Justinian at 1:59 PM on August 1, 2005
There are two main ways to qualify: One, have a boatload of cash you can invest. Something like $3,000,000 US. Two, be young, healthy, educated, and most importantly a worker in one of New Zealand's "priority" occupations. The criteria for immigration is easy to find on the web.
I say do that part first because it would really suck to settle on New Zealand as your definite goal and then find out they don't want you.
posted by Justinian at 1:59 PM on August 1, 2005
I haven't lived in the US, so can't help much with comparisons, but have recently returned to NZ after several years overseas. The official info you want can be found here, including all visa information.
As for political information, we're in an election year, so there's a wealth of stuff around for you to read - but it's also difficult to predict the immediate outcome (polling is swinging back and forth). The NZ Herald (main national newspaper) has some good summaries of the key election issues which you may want to skim here.
As far as pros/cons, my decision came down to lifestyle factors (climate, pace of life, being surrounded by beaches, international isolation were all drawcards). You have to balance that against the fact that we are a very remote nation (travelling to anywhere else is time-consuming and expensive) and our tiny population makes us a little backward in some things (Desperate Housewives just started screening here, it costs 60c per digital print to get photos developed as opposed to 10p in the UK, we won't get our Tivo-equivalent until this Christmas).
That said, it's without doubt one of the most beautiful countries on earth, has an amazing and vibrant culture, and I wouldn't live anywhere else if you paid me. Hope this helps.
posted by szechuan at 3:44 PM on August 1, 2005
As for political information, we're in an election year, so there's a wealth of stuff around for you to read - but it's also difficult to predict the immediate outcome (polling is swinging back and forth). The NZ Herald (main national newspaper) has some good summaries of the key election issues which you may want to skim here.
As far as pros/cons, my decision came down to lifestyle factors (climate, pace of life, being surrounded by beaches, international isolation were all drawcards). You have to balance that against the fact that we are a very remote nation (travelling to anywhere else is time-consuming and expensive) and our tiny population makes us a little backward in some things (Desperate Housewives just started screening here, it costs 60c per digital print to get photos developed as opposed to 10p in the UK, we won't get our Tivo-equivalent until this Christmas).
That said, it's without doubt one of the most beautiful countries on earth, has an amazing and vibrant culture, and I wouldn't live anywhere else if you paid me. Hope this helps.
posted by szechuan at 3:44 PM on August 1, 2005
Email me (profile, etc.) if you want some personal perspectives on an American from the Southeast living in NZ. I wasn't in the cities much, and it's been a few years since I've been there, but I could certainly get you some pointers.
posted by socratic at 3:55 PM on August 1, 2005
posted by socratic at 3:55 PM on August 1, 2005
If you want to try out life in New Zealand for a year and are under 35 you can go there through Bunac. This might help you figure out if you like the country enough to stay as well as put you in the position to talk to companies that could get you a more permanent work visa.
posted by MsMolly at 5:25 PM on August 1, 2005
posted by MsMolly at 5:25 PM on August 1, 2005
Because it is small things can change quickly. The people are generally nice enough, formality is frowned upon. Prices are different than the U.S. in that most things are expensive comparatively with random items being inordinately cheap. Also the USD exchange is pretty bad right now. South Island is cold (compared to Florida at least), can't speak for the North.
Technology and Telco infrastructure are lacking making the political ramifications non-issues at present. You learn to love rugby. Asian cuisines are available in the cities, Mexican food is just a cruel joke and the seafood is suprisingly bad for a remote island. There is a high value on human life (the driving age might get bumped up because of a four fatality accident). If you enjoy outdoor activities it will be spectacular, if you enjoy urban conveniences you will be left wanting.
Politically, there is an election in 2.5 weeks which could change the landscape significantly. So keep your eye on NZ news. Don't expect it to be some total liberal bastion however, the ties to the Crown are still there even if they aren't terribly strong.
posted by arruns at 5:34 PM on August 1, 2005
Technology and Telco infrastructure are lacking making the political ramifications non-issues at present. You learn to love rugby. Asian cuisines are available in the cities, Mexican food is just a cruel joke and the seafood is suprisingly bad for a remote island. There is a high value on human life (the driving age might get bumped up because of a four fatality accident). If you enjoy outdoor activities it will be spectacular, if you enjoy urban conveniences you will be left wanting.
Politically, there is an election in 2.5 weeks which could change the landscape significantly. So keep your eye on NZ news. Don't expect it to be some total liberal bastion however, the ties to the Crown are still there even if they aren't terribly strong.
posted by arruns at 5:34 PM on August 1, 2005
You can also check out this previous thread on NZ immigration (I'm sure there are others). Eighteen months on, my comment there strikes me as a little shrill, and probably says more about my state of mind than it does about the country, but whatever.
Things to bear in mind. (i) There's an election coming up next month in which there's a good chance that a hard-Right, monetarist government will be elected. This could change the desirability of living here pretty rapidly (depending, of course, on your own political viewpoint). There's a (Left-leaning) election blog here. (For news and commentary, the whole Public Address site is worth looking at, particularly Russell Brown's Hard News. (See especially his technology-related and telecommunications posts.)
(ii) Technology. Wireless isn't anywhere nearly as prevalent or accessible here as in the US.
(iii) Cost of living. Rents are pretty stable here at the moment, but house prices are increasing pretty much everywhere in-line with the global housing bubble. As scody mentioned in the other thread I linked to, things like books and clothing tend to be expensive here, because of the high costs of importing to a small market. (The high NZ dollar [in relation to the greenback, anyway] has alleviated this to some extent, recently.) Food is relatively expensive, and public transport (outside of Wellington) is undercapitalized and often unreliable.
(iv) Incomes. Incomes are lower here than in the US or Australia for comparable work, due to the effects of new employment legislation in the early '90s, weak unions, and so on. Wage growth (outside of upper management) was almost static for ten years or so, and even now isn't increasing substantially (and this in the boom period of an economic cycle).
(v) Housing quality: not good. No central heating (almost always); bad insulation; damp and mould problems. Winters here are by no means severe, but they certainly are experientially, when it's 3 degrees celsius in the house every morning when you're trying to get ready for work. Most NZers have never lived overseas, so have no idea that this isn't a necessary part of life.
This is getting shrill again, but, yeah, I've tried to concentrate on (negative) things you might notice about every-day life if you lived here. There are upsides, of course -- the most obvious being the considerable natural beauty of the place. And the coffee. The coffee is good.
posted by Sonny Jim at 6:15 PM on August 1, 2005
Things to bear in mind. (i) There's an election coming up next month in which there's a good chance that a hard-Right, monetarist government will be elected. This could change the desirability of living here pretty rapidly (depending, of course, on your own political viewpoint). There's a (Left-leaning) election blog here. (For news and commentary, the whole Public Address site is worth looking at, particularly Russell Brown's Hard News. (See especially his technology-related and telecommunications posts.)
(ii) Technology. Wireless isn't anywhere nearly as prevalent or accessible here as in the US.
(iii) Cost of living. Rents are pretty stable here at the moment, but house prices are increasing pretty much everywhere in-line with the global housing bubble. As scody mentioned in the other thread I linked to, things like books and clothing tend to be expensive here, because of the high costs of importing to a small market. (The high NZ dollar [in relation to the greenback, anyway] has alleviated this to some extent, recently.) Food is relatively expensive, and public transport (outside of Wellington) is undercapitalized and often unreliable.
(iv) Incomes. Incomes are lower here than in the US or Australia for comparable work, due to the effects of new employment legislation in the early '90s, weak unions, and so on. Wage growth (outside of upper management) was almost static for ten years or so, and even now isn't increasing substantially (and this in the boom period of an economic cycle).
(v) Housing quality: not good. No central heating (almost always); bad insulation; damp and mould problems. Winters here are by no means severe, but they certainly are experientially, when it's 3 degrees celsius in the house every morning when you're trying to get ready for work. Most NZers have never lived overseas, so have no idea that this isn't a necessary part of life.
This is getting shrill again, but, yeah, I've tried to concentrate on (negative) things you might notice about every-day life if you lived here. There are upsides, of course -- the most obvious being the considerable natural beauty of the place. And the coffee. The coffee is good.
posted by Sonny Jim at 6:15 PM on August 1, 2005
If you're considering NZ, you may wish to consider Australia which has most of the benefits (small country, friendly people) but a greater choice of climates (hot all the time, hot most of the time, hot in summer + freezing in winter - we have them all!).
And hell, if you're mainly considering NZ because of the people well... most of them are over here anyway! ;)
/requisite aussie plug
posted by coriolisdave at 7:18 PM on August 1, 2005
And hell, if you're mainly considering NZ because of the people well... most of them are over here anyway! ;)
/requisite aussie plug
posted by coriolisdave at 7:18 PM on August 1, 2005
also, new zealand girls aren't that hot,except for around christchurch
posted by yonation at 7:29 PM on August 1, 2005
posted by yonation at 7:29 PM on August 1, 2005
I'm in the same boat, and I plan on travelling to NZ in December to find out more about these possibilities -
posted by growabrain at 7:31 PM on August 1, 2005
posted by growabrain at 7:31 PM on August 1, 2005
I also would suggest going there to visit first. If you don't fall in love on a week or two vacation, I certainly wouldn't move there, regardless of what you've heard from people.
posted by smackfu at 7:49 PM on August 1, 2005
posted by smackfu at 7:49 PM on August 1, 2005
In my experience, personal privacy is far better in NZ than the US, due to some strong privacy laws and a (not so strong) commissoner to oversee them. The blade cuts both ways of course, and sometimes you'll get companies claiming privacy legislation as a (legally) BS excuse to not give you information they don't want released, etc. But the result that I notice is that there is nowhere near the same level of obnoxious corporate databases you can't seem to get your info out of, (or even correct errors), far less direct marketing, and I think identity theft is a lot lower, but that probably has more to do with fewer major ID screwups like how half the USA uses SSN for identification while the other half uses it for authentication... :-)
For a good feel of what privacy extends to in New Zealand, check out the Privacy Commission website.
Yes - New Zealand is a place where the frontpage of an official office is a political cartoon :-)
Once past the cartoon, click on "casefiles", for a list of privacy complaints and a very readable down-to-earth description of what happened, and what (if any) resolution was reached. Note that this is not the USA - the purpose of these investigations is not about suing or lawsuits (though sometimes financial reparations are made).
Plus there are explanations of what the privacy laws in NZ mean for people etc.
Also (probabaly obvious), privacy is often only given lip service in the US these days due to Americans being terrified of terrorism. New Zealand isn't living in fear to the same extent, so there is less pressure undermining the real-world treatment of privacy rights. However, if you became a person of interest to a secret agency, my observation from news articles is that you would be just as powerless against any abuses of authority as you are in the US, regardless of the lofty words about rights written in high-falutin' legal documents in both countries :-)
Re: Technology and politics, NZ (like all countries) was under pressure from the US to introduce DMCA-style extensions to copyright, so was debating that a few years back, I don't think that kind of thing has gone through, but whether that means it was defeated or is still grinding through the system, I don't know.
Also of note to Americans - New Zealand moved to a proportional voting system, that while rocky at first, has been a huge improvement on the moronic state of affairs previously afflicting NZ and still afflicting the US. Ie if a party gets 10% of the vote nationwide, they get 10% of parliment, (as opposed to the US where 10% of the citizens can vote for a party and be given no representitives at all) which in turn largely precludes the two-headed horse race idiocy like the democrat/republican party - small parties are viable enough to keep larger parties from getting so big they can ram through their ideological agendas without check. Generally in the proportional system, it's very difficult to push partisan legislation, since you need other parties to agree with it. (Hence it makes sense to many voters to vote for small parties that more acurrately represent them rather than juggernaut parties that are merely the lesser evil, consequently, juggarnaut parties lose their voters to the small parties, and cease to be able to obtain the absolute majorities that allow a party to ride roughshod over a nation)
posted by -harlequin- at 8:35 PM on August 1, 2005
For a good feel of what privacy extends to in New Zealand, check out the Privacy Commission website.
Yes - New Zealand is a place where the frontpage of an official office is a political cartoon :-)
Once past the cartoon, click on "casefiles", for a list of privacy complaints and a very readable down-to-earth description of what happened, and what (if any) resolution was reached. Note that this is not the USA - the purpose of these investigations is not about suing or lawsuits (though sometimes financial reparations are made).
Plus there are explanations of what the privacy laws in NZ mean for people etc.
Also (probabaly obvious), privacy is often only given lip service in the US these days due to Americans being terrified of terrorism. New Zealand isn't living in fear to the same extent, so there is less pressure undermining the real-world treatment of privacy rights. However, if you became a person of interest to a secret agency, my observation from news articles is that you would be just as powerless against any abuses of authority as you are in the US, regardless of the lofty words about rights written in high-falutin' legal documents in both countries :-)
Re: Technology and politics, NZ (like all countries) was under pressure from the US to introduce DMCA-style extensions to copyright, so was debating that a few years back, I don't think that kind of thing has gone through, but whether that means it was defeated or is still grinding through the system, I don't know.
Also of note to Americans - New Zealand moved to a proportional voting system, that while rocky at first, has been a huge improvement on the moronic state of affairs previously afflicting NZ and still afflicting the US. Ie if a party gets 10% of the vote nationwide, they get 10% of parliment, (as opposed to the US where 10% of the citizens can vote for a party and be given no representitives at all) which in turn largely precludes the two-headed horse race idiocy like the democrat/republican party - small parties are viable enough to keep larger parties from getting so big they can ram through their ideological agendas without check. Generally in the proportional system, it's very difficult to push partisan legislation, since you need other parties to agree with it. (Hence it makes sense to many voters to vote for small parties that more acurrately represent them rather than juggernaut parties that are merely the lesser evil, consequently, juggarnaut parties lose their voters to the small parties, and cease to be able to obtain the absolute majorities that allow a party to ride roughshod over a nation)
posted by -harlequin- at 8:35 PM on August 1, 2005
also, new zealand girls aren't that hot,except for around christchurch
Heh, my biggest impression in this field is that each nation has a different idea of what "hot" is. And most comments I have heard suggest the opposite impression - surprise at the large amount of hotness. I think you're both wrong, I think it's seeing the abundance of a different flavor of hot that can produce either reaction.
Given a heap of photos, I could sort them into piles that I think would show the difference in the two country's ideals of hot (there is plenty of overlap of course), but using text, briefly, the best I can do is a crass generalisation that probably won't help - in the US, the ideal of hot leans a bit more towards the blond Britteny Spears / Jenifer Aniston look than in NZ, while NZ leans a bit more towards the sporty pony-tail less-makeup look than the US. If you like exotic, you'll prefer whichever country you didn't grow up in, or if hollywood/US media strongly affects your ideals, you'll probably gravitate to the US.
In both cases, exceptions are far more common than adherences to this desciption - it's the general trend I'm talking about, not specific individuals, and the trend is dwarfed by the varience among people. (But if you waste enough of your life hooked on rating sites like HotOrNot, you'll probably see that the things that voters cue on differ by country as much or more than by audience demographic)
posted by -harlequin- at 8:58 PM on August 1, 2005
Heh, my biggest impression in this field is that each nation has a different idea of what "hot" is. And most comments I have heard suggest the opposite impression - surprise at the large amount of hotness. I think you're both wrong, I think it's seeing the abundance of a different flavor of hot that can produce either reaction.
Given a heap of photos, I could sort them into piles that I think would show the difference in the two country's ideals of hot (there is plenty of overlap of course), but using text, briefly, the best I can do is a crass generalisation that probably won't help - in the US, the ideal of hot leans a bit more towards the blond Britteny Spears / Jenifer Aniston look than in NZ, while NZ leans a bit more towards the sporty pony-tail less-makeup look than the US. If you like exotic, you'll prefer whichever country you didn't grow up in, or if hollywood/US media strongly affects your ideals, you'll probably gravitate to the US.
In both cases, exceptions are far more common than adherences to this desciption - it's the general trend I'm talking about, not specific individuals, and the trend is dwarfed by the varience among people. (But if you waste enough of your life hooked on rating sites like HotOrNot, you'll probably see that the things that voters cue on differ by country as much or more than by audience demographic)
posted by -harlequin- at 8:58 PM on August 1, 2005
I have 2 questions:
- Is it better to apply with an American or European passport?
- How wide spread is broad-band?
posted by growabrain at 10:49 PM on August 1, 2005
- Is it better to apply with an American or European passport?
- How wide spread is broad-band?
posted by growabrain at 10:49 PM on August 1, 2005
growabrain:
- A commonwealth passport is probably better than American or European.
- broadband, are you talking availability or popularity? (Either way, I can't give an authoritive answer, but my limited experience suggests "you should be able to get broadband unless you're out in the middle of nowhere, but it might not be your preferred method of broadband, eg you might have to get microwave instead of cable".
NZ television (including pay channels) is primarily airwaves, so there isn't a US-style extensive cable-TV infrastructure to co-opt into broadband. The flip side is that the cable systems that are in NZ were put in place for broadband instead of analogue television, so are state of the art for digital. Unfortunately, that's no help if the network is not in your area, as is probably the case :-)
Also, NZ is a long way from all those US-based servers, so if you're into games with friends back in the US, you ping is likely to be lower, so make sure to play on a server closer to you than them :)
posted by -harlequin- at 11:39 PM on August 1, 2005
- A commonwealth passport is probably better than American or European.
- broadband, are you talking availability or popularity? (Either way, I can't give an authoritive answer, but my limited experience suggests "you should be able to get broadband unless you're out in the middle of nowhere, but it might not be your preferred method of broadband, eg you might have to get microwave instead of cable".
NZ television (including pay channels) is primarily airwaves, so there isn't a US-style extensive cable-TV infrastructure to co-opt into broadband. The flip side is that the cable systems that are in NZ were put in place for broadband instead of analogue television, so are state of the art for digital. Unfortunately, that's no help if the network is not in your area, as is probably the case :-)
Also, NZ is a long way from all those US-based servers, so if you're into games with friends back in the US, you ping is likely to be lower, so make sure to play on a server closer to you than them :)
posted by -harlequin- at 11:39 PM on August 1, 2005
Compared with the US, New Zealand doesn't have broadband.
There's two main options for residential customers, Xtra the main telcos ISP (it's called jetstream and is sub-sold by other ISPs) and TelstraClear (this is run off a cable-TV infrastructure but it's limited to Wellington and Christchurch)
posted by X-00 at 1:11 AM on August 2, 2005
There's two main options for residential customers, Xtra the main telcos ISP (it's called jetstream and is sub-sold by other ISPs) and TelstraClear (this is run off a cable-TV infrastructure but it's limited to Wellington and Christchurch)
posted by X-00 at 1:11 AM on August 2, 2005
You haven't really said what you actually like to do... If you like to watch bullfights, you can't do that here.
Broadband:
I have a 2meg dsl connection at home, retail price is about NZ$70 a month, or thereabouts. It doesn't count as real broadband though, as the upstream speed is only about 192k. You have more choice in provider than X-00 would indicate, but the lines are pretty much all owned by Telecom.
There are lots of multiplayer games servers in NZ, so you don't need to worry about that too much, for less popular games, your ping can sometimes be in the less than ideal range of 200 - 250ms.
Passport:
I don't know what passport you're better off applying with, I think it would be more significant if you have particular skills which you can convince an NZ employer they really need, our unemployment rate is outrageously low, so we have skills shortages in some fields.
New Zealand might look small on a map, but there are big differences (maybe only apparent to locals, I don't know) moving from one region to another, you would have a vastly different time if you lived in Invercargill (a small wet city way down at the bottom of South Island, nearby Gore which is the butt of most of our equivalent of US hillbilly/southern idiot jokes) than in Nelson at the top of South Island, and lovely warm and sunny.
Those are just small places to illustrate a point, and I'd expect you're more likely to want to move to one of our larger cities - this doesn't mean you're conrete bound by any stretch, though, as wherever you are, you're pretty close to a beach and some bush.
Regions:
The only real city is Auckland, it's probably equal to all the other cities in NZ combined... And even from the middle of the city you're never more than a few minutes away from a park - some pretty cool volcanic cones are dotted around the city, with the biggest and most impressive being out in the gulf - Rangitoto Island. You can take a ferry from the city over to Devonport and other small ports on the north shore, or to several islands in the gulf, the most heavily populated being Waiheke, with some nice beaches, vineyards, etc. (Or indeed to Rangitoto if you want to walk up the cone.) You can also rent a canoe and paddle around the gulf, or if you're into boating, boat ownership is pretty popular and reasonably accessible. (If you can't a afford a boat, you can't afford to buy your way in.)
If you live in Auckland, or anywhere rural, you will have to get a car, a lot of the cars on our roads are inexpensive Japanese imports, but you can get pretty much anything your taste desires, but if that extends to a Hummer, expect dirty looks - for the most part we don't favour ostentatious displays of wealth.
Food:
We have a growing Asian population, particularly in Auckland, which is where pretty much everyone moves to, so if you like Thai / Korean / Chinese / Japanese / Malay / Laos food, you'll like Auckland. Of course we have pretty much every type of food you might want, loads of middle-Eastern places, and all of the fastfood chains you're used to, you won't have complete culture shock being forced to eat at Uncle Hemis Quick Hangi, or anything like that, our foodcourts are as littered with the detritus of American consumer culture as the rest of the world, so expect to see your Burger King, McDonalds, Subway, and KFC, but they'll be slotted in next to a Japanese place, and on the other side will be a curry stall. As has already been mentioned, Mexican is a problem, my partner lived in Texas for a while, and really misses it. Every now and then someone has a go, but they usually shut up shop again shortly. I guess we don't really have a taste for it. (I'm guessing. I like it, but you know.)
From Auckland you can travel west (about 45 minutes from central) to the west coast for surfing / bush walks / scenery / what have you.
East takes you pretty much nowhere, unless your car has pontoons, in which case you'll eventually hit Coromandel, if you miss that it's South America for you. Coromandel is a great place, especially up the peninsula, beaches and bush, and not much else. (I suppose this isn't great if you don't like the outdoors.)
North from central Auckland will take you to more swimmer friendly beaches, then on up to places like Goat Island, which is a marine reserve, very snorkle friendly and well stocked with protected fish (not exciting colourful coral fish, but I like it). There's a small city up there called Whangarei, you don't want to live there. But there are lots of small towns to visit, and places to camp or take it easy.
South takes you... to the rest of the country.
If you like surfing you can head to Raglan which is on the west coast, nice cafes and so forth.
The nearest city south of Auckland is Hamilton, I guess it's okay, but you probably don't want to live there either.
After that there's not much other than countryside and small towns until you hit Taupo, which is that huge lake you'll see in the middle of North Island, this is another volcanic cone. You could go west to Rotorua (actually, before you hit Taupo, but I'm simplifying) which is probably the most volcanically active area in the country, with bubbling mud pools and geysers and so on - also a real touristy hole, but it can be a fun place to visit, every motel room comes with a spa, and there are fun activities like a gondola ride up to a luge track, which twists and turns down some steep terrain.
Further out east of there are some wonderful little places to visit (but places I've never lived) like Tauranga, which seems to be mostly for old people to go to and die... Or Gisborne which I believe has some of the best weather in the country, or so they claim. Also the first to see the sun of the new day. (We're right out here at GMT+12/+13.)
Taupo itself is a touristy town as well, and while I've stayed a night there, it's only ever been on the way to do other things - there's some great skiing around the other side of the lake on Mt Ruapehu, with a couple of good ski fields, and the small towns that tend to servide such things. In years when the mountain is active (it's another volcano) these towns wither and die. But there is great fun to be had in the region in summer as well, with some great walking tracks, ranging from several days long, to a 30 minutes.
Wellington is the capital city, it's pretty small and is located at the bottom of North Island, if you live centrally you can probably get by without a car, public transport is okay, it has the hairiest airport I've ever landed at, with terrifying gusting wind throwing the plane around, it just about makes the blood drain from my face merely talking about it). Wellington would definitely make my shortlist of places to live, it's much (!) smaller than Auckland, and I think it's more limited, but it's still fun, and anyway, Auckland (or Sydney, Melbourne, etc) are pretty short plane rides (Auckland is about 40 minutes, Sydney / Melbourne only about 3 hours, and contrary to what others have said, you can get pretty cheap flights over there, under NZ$400 certainly).
South Island, or as some prefer is The Mainland, is much more sparsely populated, someone mentioned Wanaka, I don't know why on earth you'd want to live there. It's a holiday town. So unless you work in Tourism, do what everyone else does and *visit* when you want to, but live somewhere with more happening (and probably more employment).
There is one main city in South Island, Christchurch, it's okay. I guess you could live there. You can get some great houses a bit out of the city, and traffic is much less of a problem than in Auckland... But still, it's little. If you like that, great. I didn't think there was much variety of food when I was last there. But for all I know that's last on your list of things to do.
Ohy, another thing about Wellington occurs to me, they have probably the most pervasive wireless 'broadband' in the country (they only get away with this due to the tiny scale of the central city), being the seat of government, there are lots of grey faced public servant types, but there are also lots of little development houses, and some really fun nightlife as well.
Wait, can I get banned for rambling on? Maybe you can clarify exactly what you want to do for a living, and the things you like to do in your spare time and so on, for a more high quality answer.
posted by The Monkey at 1:40 AM on August 2, 2005
Broadband:
I have a 2meg dsl connection at home, retail price is about NZ$70 a month, or thereabouts. It doesn't count as real broadband though, as the upstream speed is only about 192k. You have more choice in provider than X-00 would indicate, but the lines are pretty much all owned by Telecom.
There are lots of multiplayer games servers in NZ, so you don't need to worry about that too much, for less popular games, your ping can sometimes be in the less than ideal range of 200 - 250ms.
Passport:
I don't know what passport you're better off applying with, I think it would be more significant if you have particular skills which you can convince an NZ employer they really need, our unemployment rate is outrageously low, so we have skills shortages in some fields.
New Zealand might look small on a map, but there are big differences (maybe only apparent to locals, I don't know) moving from one region to another, you would have a vastly different time if you lived in Invercargill (a small wet city way down at the bottom of South Island, nearby Gore which is the butt of most of our equivalent of US hillbilly/southern idiot jokes) than in Nelson at the top of South Island, and lovely warm and sunny.
Those are just small places to illustrate a point, and I'd expect you're more likely to want to move to one of our larger cities - this doesn't mean you're conrete bound by any stretch, though, as wherever you are, you're pretty close to a beach and some bush.
Regions:
The only real city is Auckland, it's probably equal to all the other cities in NZ combined... And even from the middle of the city you're never more than a few minutes away from a park - some pretty cool volcanic cones are dotted around the city, with the biggest and most impressive being out in the gulf - Rangitoto Island. You can take a ferry from the city over to Devonport and other small ports on the north shore, or to several islands in the gulf, the most heavily populated being Waiheke, with some nice beaches, vineyards, etc. (Or indeed to Rangitoto if you want to walk up the cone.) You can also rent a canoe and paddle around the gulf, or if you're into boating, boat ownership is pretty popular and reasonably accessible. (If you can't a afford a boat, you can't afford to buy your way in.)
If you live in Auckland, or anywhere rural, you will have to get a car, a lot of the cars on our roads are inexpensive Japanese imports, but you can get pretty much anything your taste desires, but if that extends to a Hummer, expect dirty looks - for the most part we don't favour ostentatious displays of wealth.
Food:
We have a growing Asian population, particularly in Auckland, which is where pretty much everyone moves to, so if you like Thai / Korean / Chinese / Japanese / Malay / Laos food, you'll like Auckland. Of course we have pretty much every type of food you might want, loads of middle-Eastern places, and all of the fastfood chains you're used to, you won't have complete culture shock being forced to eat at Uncle Hemis Quick Hangi, or anything like that, our foodcourts are as littered with the detritus of American consumer culture as the rest of the world, so expect to see your Burger King, McDonalds, Subway, and KFC, but they'll be slotted in next to a Japanese place, and on the other side will be a curry stall. As has already been mentioned, Mexican is a problem, my partner lived in Texas for a while, and really misses it. Every now and then someone has a go, but they usually shut up shop again shortly. I guess we don't really have a taste for it. (I'm guessing. I like it, but you know.)
From Auckland you can travel west (about 45 minutes from central) to the west coast for surfing / bush walks / scenery / what have you.
East takes you pretty much nowhere, unless your car has pontoons, in which case you'll eventually hit Coromandel, if you miss that it's South America for you. Coromandel is a great place, especially up the peninsula, beaches and bush, and not much else. (I suppose this isn't great if you don't like the outdoors.)
North from central Auckland will take you to more swimmer friendly beaches, then on up to places like Goat Island, which is a marine reserve, very snorkle friendly and well stocked with protected fish (not exciting colourful coral fish, but I like it). There's a small city up there called Whangarei, you don't want to live there. But there are lots of small towns to visit, and places to camp or take it easy.
South takes you... to the rest of the country.
If you like surfing you can head to Raglan which is on the west coast, nice cafes and so forth.
The nearest city south of Auckland is Hamilton, I guess it's okay, but you probably don't want to live there either.
After that there's not much other than countryside and small towns until you hit Taupo, which is that huge lake you'll see in the middle of North Island, this is another volcanic cone. You could go west to Rotorua (actually, before you hit Taupo, but I'm simplifying) which is probably the most volcanically active area in the country, with bubbling mud pools and geysers and so on - also a real touristy hole, but it can be a fun place to visit, every motel room comes with a spa, and there are fun activities like a gondola ride up to a luge track, which twists and turns down some steep terrain.
Further out east of there are some wonderful little places to visit (but places I've never lived) like Tauranga, which seems to be mostly for old people to go to and die... Or Gisborne which I believe has some of the best weather in the country, or so they claim. Also the first to see the sun of the new day. (We're right out here at GMT+12/+13.)
Taupo itself is a touristy town as well, and while I've stayed a night there, it's only ever been on the way to do other things - there's some great skiing around the other side of the lake on Mt Ruapehu, with a couple of good ski fields, and the small towns that tend to servide such things. In years when the mountain is active (it's another volcano) these towns wither and die. But there is great fun to be had in the region in summer as well, with some great walking tracks, ranging from several days long, to a 30 minutes.
Wellington is the capital city, it's pretty small and is located at the bottom of North Island, if you live centrally you can probably get by without a car, public transport is okay, it has the hairiest airport I've ever landed at, with terrifying gusting wind throwing the plane around, it just about makes the blood drain from my face merely talking about it). Wellington would definitely make my shortlist of places to live, it's much (!) smaller than Auckland, and I think it's more limited, but it's still fun, and anyway, Auckland (or Sydney, Melbourne, etc) are pretty short plane rides (Auckland is about 40 minutes, Sydney / Melbourne only about 3 hours, and contrary to what others have said, you can get pretty cheap flights over there, under NZ$400 certainly).
South Island, or as some prefer is The Mainland, is much more sparsely populated, someone mentioned Wanaka, I don't know why on earth you'd want to live there. It's a holiday town. So unless you work in Tourism, do what everyone else does and *visit* when you want to, but live somewhere with more happening (and probably more employment).
There is one main city in South Island, Christchurch, it's okay. I guess you could live there. You can get some great houses a bit out of the city, and traffic is much less of a problem than in Auckland... But still, it's little. If you like that, great. I didn't think there was much variety of food when I was last there. But for all I know that's last on your list of things to do.
Ohy, another thing about Wellington occurs to me, they have probably the most pervasive wireless 'broadband' in the country (they only get away with this due to the tiny scale of the central city), being the seat of government, there are lots of grey faced public servant types, but there are also lots of little development houses, and some really fun nightlife as well.
Wait, can I get banned for rambling on? Maybe you can clarify exactly what you want to do for a living, and the things you like to do in your spare time and so on, for a more high quality answer.
posted by The Monkey at 1:40 AM on August 2, 2005
Response by poster: Specifically, I was looking into the options of a student visa for Java development (or similar programing) giving me time to learn more about the country and then try and move into the local job pool.
For recreation, I like to pretty much hang out with friends and chill most of the time, but I am trying to be more active. I like to walk around and see the what's out there, but I'm not a back packer or hiker.
Currently I'm an in house webmaster for a hospital, and I've looked at the 'preferred jobs' for immagration to NZ and webmaster isn't on there, so I though I'd slightly shift gears and expand my knowledge and get some time in in NZ by going to school there.
That said, are there any comments about the unviersities in NZ or their quality?
posted by Ikazuchi at 3:38 AM on August 2, 2005
For recreation, I like to pretty much hang out with friends and chill most of the time, but I am trying to be more active. I like to walk around and see the what's out there, but I'm not a back packer or hiker.
Currently I'm an in house webmaster for a hospital, and I've looked at the 'preferred jobs' for immagration to NZ and webmaster isn't on there, so I though I'd slightly shift gears and expand my knowledge and get some time in in NZ by going to school there.
That said, are there any comments about the unviersities in NZ or their quality?
posted by Ikazuchi at 3:38 AM on August 2, 2005
Prices: cost of living is lower, but anything that is bought on the international market is more expensive, so it balances out.
Cost of living varies hugely within the US and within NZ, but for broad ballpark gist: housing/rent and a lot of groceries cost about the same in NZ dollars as you would spend on them in US dollars if living in the US. Since the NZ dollar is worth less, they're cheaper, but chances are your wage/salary would be roughly the same in NZ dollars as it would be in US dollars doing the job in the US, so most of that cancels out. UNLESS you can get a telecommute job in the US where you are paid in US dollars while living in NZ. That is an awesome situation if you can get it.
That said, anything where manufacturing costs are set by stuff like the international price of precious metals, or require global infrastructure, etc (eg any computer hardware or other cutting edge imported gadgets), will cost, at the very best, the same in US dollars in NZ as in the US, but because the NZ dollar is worth less, it will cost more NZ dollars, thus making it more expensive relative to the standard of living. Since NZ is small and isolated, typically there will be a bit of a premium on top of that, for shipping, or for the domestic economy (or retailer) not being big enough to muscle the best bulk deals, etc.
I find it evens out, but my cost of living in the US is not necessarily the same as yours :)
As to universities, I can't directly compare, since I haven't studied in the US, but they are proper institutions. Not near the kind of international prestige as places like Oxford or Yale or MIT, but definitely respectable. Not sure if that's what you mean by "quality" :) One difference from the US though - many of the Bachelor degrees can realistically be achieved in 3 years in NZ if you don't fail any courses (or if you fail very few and work extra hard to make it up), while you're more likely to need 4 years in the US. A BSc in computer science (guessing at your interest) can be done in 3 years.
posted by -harlequin- at 4:29 AM on August 2, 2005
Cost of living varies hugely within the US and within NZ, but for broad ballpark gist: housing/rent and a lot of groceries cost about the same in NZ dollars as you would spend on them in US dollars if living in the US. Since the NZ dollar is worth less, they're cheaper, but chances are your wage/salary would be roughly the same in NZ dollars as it would be in US dollars doing the job in the US, so most of that cancels out. UNLESS you can get a telecommute job in the US where you are paid in US dollars while living in NZ. That is an awesome situation if you can get it.
That said, anything where manufacturing costs are set by stuff like the international price of precious metals, or require global infrastructure, etc (eg any computer hardware or other cutting edge imported gadgets), will cost, at the very best, the same in US dollars in NZ as in the US, but because the NZ dollar is worth less, it will cost more NZ dollars, thus making it more expensive relative to the standard of living. Since NZ is small and isolated, typically there will be a bit of a premium on top of that, for shipping, or for the domestic economy (or retailer) not being big enough to muscle the best bulk deals, etc.
I find it evens out, but my cost of living in the US is not necessarily the same as yours :)
As to universities, I can't directly compare, since I haven't studied in the US, but they are proper institutions. Not near the kind of international prestige as places like Oxford or Yale or MIT, but definitely respectable. Not sure if that's what you mean by "quality" :) One difference from the US though - many of the Bachelor degrees can realistically be achieved in 3 years in NZ if you don't fail any courses (or if you fail very few and work extra hard to make it up), while you're more likely to need 4 years in the US. A BSc in computer science (guessing at your interest) can be done in 3 years.
posted by -harlequin- at 4:29 AM on August 2, 2005
To expand a little bit on -harlequin-'s (excellent) advice: yeah, NZ Universities are pretty respectable. In the 2004 Times Higher Education Supplement rankings of the world's top 200 universities, for instance, the University of Auckland came out at 67, pretty much on-par with the University of Wisconsin, Madison, and a little above the likes of Northwestern, Boston College and the University of California at Santa Barbara. There were a couple of other NZ univs. in the same list. But, yeah: 7 of the 8 universities in NZ are international-quality.
Be aware though that on a student visa you'll be paying international fees -- 5-6x what an NZ citizen or permanent resident would be paying. This is the kind of thing you'd be looking at. As a US citizen, you'd be eligible for a Fulbright, but only if you were working at the Masters or Doctorate level. (And the Fulbrights are obviously pretty competitive.) There's also the University 360 student exchange programme, but you'd need to be enrolled in a US university to start with.
Have a look at the various compsci courses and programmes available in the country (if you haven't already), and make up your own mind...
You could also get in touch with this guy, who's in IT, and moved from the Bay Area to NZ a couple of years ago, I believe.
Good luck.
posted by Sonny Jim at 5:01 PM on August 2, 2005
Be aware though that on a student visa you'll be paying international fees -- 5-6x what an NZ citizen or permanent resident would be paying. This is the kind of thing you'd be looking at. As a US citizen, you'd be eligible for a Fulbright, but only if you were working at the Masters or Doctorate level. (And the Fulbrights are obviously pretty competitive.) There's also the University 360 student exchange programme, but you'd need to be enrolled in a US university to start with.
Have a look at the various compsci courses and programmes available in the country (if you haven't already), and make up your own mind...
You could also get in touch with this guy, who's in IT, and moved from the Bay Area to NZ a couple of years ago, I believe.
Good luck.
posted by Sonny Jim at 5:01 PM on August 2, 2005
Thanks for a great discussion.
I have another question: What is the basic taxation system?
posted by growabrain at 9:15 PM on August 2, 2005
I have another question: What is the basic taxation system?
posted by growabrain at 9:15 PM on August 2, 2005
I assume you mean income tax. The non-residency situation is discussed here. For resident taxpayers we have three broad tax bands (most income earners paying 33%), discussed in detail here.
All other tax info can also be found on that site - but remains subject to the discussions above about our impending election.
posted by szechuan at 9:56 PM on August 2, 2005
All other tax info can also be found on that site - but remains subject to the discussions above about our impending election.
posted by szechuan at 9:56 PM on August 2, 2005
More on taxation.
It's a graduated system, so you don't actually pay 33% on all your income, for the first $40k or so you only pay 20%'ish. I'm not sure what the average income is currently, I think it's probably late NZ$30Ks. So most people do NOT pay 33%.
We have GST (Goods & Services Tax) of 12.5% on all purchases as well, but it's not as bad as in some countries where you get surprised at the register or have to work it out yourself, it's mandated in the law that unless a product or service is for business use (businesses claim back their GST) the price tag must *include* the GST.
Oh, our taxes do useless things like... Pay for ACC (Accident Compensation) which means if you break your leg, the hospital will fix you up and give you a smile, not ask you for your insurance details.
Tipping is not part of our culture, some places put a jar or bowl on the counter, these people are trying it on. The waiter / waitress is the employee of the restaurant / bar /cafe, they pay them so you don't have to.
More on Interweb.
I sort of brushed by this up-thread... There are wireless providers, in Auckland we have a couple, one is Wired Country, they're resold by lots of providers (and have actually been having some trouble with leeches and such causing their network to suck) and another called Woosh, which have been known to have reception problems. In addition to this we have competing cellular phone networks (Telecom, the big former government owned monster; and Vodafone the even bigger but more foreign owned player) which also provide for (kind of expensive) mobile data.
If you've seen any photos of Auckland, you'll see the great big needle building in the middle of the city, that's the Skytower, and is where lots of these wireless providers plant their gear. You can jump off the skytower if you want,
Internet access is very widespread, with good penetration into schools and homes and businesses and so on. It's just not quite as fast as in countries which have, you know, land borders, and stuff. Oh, you'll notice (if you dig at all) that our entire government is all online, I paid my dog registration on Friday night on the Auckland City Council website. Also, internet banking is incredibly popular.
I have to take the just mentioned dog out for a walk (in the cold cold night) now, if anyone else mentions anything, or if you have any more questions, I might post more. (Oh boy!)
posted by The Monkey at 1:56 AM on August 3, 2005
It's a graduated system, so you don't actually pay 33% on all your income, for the first $40k or so you only pay 20%'ish. I'm not sure what the average income is currently, I think it's probably late NZ$30Ks. So most people do NOT pay 33%.
We have GST (Goods & Services Tax) of 12.5% on all purchases as well, but it's not as bad as in some countries where you get surprised at the register or have to work it out yourself, it's mandated in the law that unless a product or service is for business use (businesses claim back their GST) the price tag must *include* the GST.
Oh, our taxes do useless things like... Pay for ACC (Accident Compensation) which means if you break your leg, the hospital will fix you up and give you a smile, not ask you for your insurance details.
Tipping is not part of our culture, some places put a jar or bowl on the counter, these people are trying it on. The waiter / waitress is the employee of the restaurant / bar /cafe, they pay them so you don't have to.
More on Interweb.
I sort of brushed by this up-thread... There are wireless providers, in Auckland we have a couple, one is Wired Country, they're resold by lots of providers (and have actually been having some trouble with leeches and such causing their network to suck) and another called Woosh, which have been known to have reception problems. In addition to this we have competing cellular phone networks (Telecom, the big former government owned monster; and Vodafone the even bigger but more foreign owned player) which also provide for (kind of expensive) mobile data.
If you've seen any photos of Auckland, you'll see the great big needle building in the middle of the city, that's the Skytower, and is where lots of these wireless providers plant their gear. You can jump off the skytower if you want,
Internet access is very widespread, with good penetration into schools and homes and businesses and so on. It's just not quite as fast as in countries which have, you know, land borders, and stuff. Oh, you'll notice (if you dig at all) that our entire government is all online, I paid my dog registration on Friday night on the Auckland City Council website. Also, internet banking is incredibly popular.
I have to take the just mentioned dog out for a walk (in the cold cold night) now, if anyone else mentions anything, or if you have any more questions, I might post more. (Oh boy!)
posted by The Monkey at 1:56 AM on August 3, 2005
This being the interwebnet, maybe you'd like some linkification? Here are a few of the things I've mentioned.
Government:
NZ Government.
Auckland City Council.
Wellington City Council.
Communications:
Vodafone.
Telecom.
Woosh.
Wired Country.
My favourite ISP: Quicksilver Internet.(Disclosure: I have commercial ties to Quicksilver, my company resells some of their products - but I was a customer long before this relationship started.)
ISP price guide. (This is from Consumer Magazine, they're generally pretty reliable and trustworthy.)
Property:
RealEnz. (A great way to compare prices, I'd reckon. A lot of the listings link off to other real estate sites.)
Trademe Property. (Also a general auction site, our equivalent of Ebay.)
NZ Herald Property.
Employment:
Seek.
Netcheck.
NZ Herald Employment Listings.
News / Newspapers:
New Zealand Herald. (Auckland.)
Otago Daily Times.
Evening Post. (Wellington.)
Scoop.
Stuff.
TVNZ.
Political Parties:
Labour. (Current major partner in coalition Government. Centre/Left.)
National. (Main opposition. Right.)
New Zealand First. (Populist / Nationalist.)
Greens. (Way Left.)
Act. (Waaaay Right.)
United Future. (Centre Right, they say. Christian party that is pro-family, which seems to mean anti-gay.)
There are others, of course, but we have lots of political parties (having a functioning proportional representation system, you understand.)
Oh, BTW, polling day is Saturday, so you don't need to worry about getting time off work to go and stand in a queue, and we don't use Diebold machines, we use cardboard and felt pens. And even with this archaic mechanism, we tend to get a final result a couple of hours after the polls close. (Now that I've said this, the next election will be a complete fiasco, just watch.)
Important:
My dog.
posted by The Monkey at 4:25 AM on August 3, 2005
Government:
NZ Government.
Auckland City Council.
Wellington City Council.
Communications:
Vodafone.
Telecom.
Woosh.
Wired Country.
My favourite ISP: Quicksilver Internet.
ISP price guide. (This is from Consumer Magazine, they're generally pretty reliable and trustworthy.)
Property:
RealEnz. (A great way to compare prices, I'd reckon. A lot of the listings link off to other real estate sites.)
Trademe Property. (Also a general auction site, our equivalent of Ebay.)
NZ Herald Property.
Employment:
Seek.
Netcheck.
NZ Herald Employment Listings.
News / Newspapers:
New Zealand Herald. (Auckland.)
Otago Daily Times.
Evening Post. (Wellington.)
Scoop.
Stuff.
TVNZ.
Political Parties:
Labour. (Current major partner in coalition Government. Centre/Left.)
National. (Main opposition. Right.)
New Zealand First. (Populist / Nationalist.)
Greens. (Way Left.)
Act. (Waaaay Right.)
United Future. (Centre Right, they say. Christian party that is pro-family, which seems to mean anti-gay.)
There are others, of course, but we have lots of political parties (having a functioning proportional representation system, you understand.)
Oh, BTW, polling day is Saturday, so you don't need to worry about getting time off work to go and stand in a queue, and we don't use Diebold machines, we use cardboard and felt pens. And even with this archaic mechanism, we tend to get a final result a couple of hours after the polls close. (Now that I've said this, the next election will be a complete fiasco, just watch.)
Important:
My dog.
posted by The Monkey at 4:25 AM on August 3, 2005
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by mark7570 at 1:57 PM on August 1, 2005