What neighborhood do we want to relocate to in Phoenix?
May 28, 2012 5:45 AM Subscribe
Where do two long-term, typical residents of inner SE Portland want to live in the Phoenix, AZ area? We're a straight couple with no kids relocating for my husband's job in a month, looking for neighborhoods to rent a house in.
My husband has accepted a job in Phoenix, AZ and we'll be living there within the month. It's a sudden change, but we're both excited about it and excited about his new position -- also, I am chronically ill and a desert environment has been suggested by several of my doctors.
We don't know the area at all, and are eager to hear any input MeFites have about where to live. Our preference / neighborhood history:
-Most significantly, long term residents of inner SE PDX / Portland. Like everything typical of this: going out to cheap eats, food trucks, vintage clothing, eco-everything, indie movie theaters, nerd stuff, book stores, comic book stores, like density, like historic houses
-Pit stop in Seattle has us HATING the town. What we hate about it: everything is spread out, not walkable, hilly, aside from a few neighborhoods businesses are few and far between, fewer independent businesses, public transit is terrible, traffic is gnarly
Even if there were a dense, quirky neighborhood that was only 10-20 square blocks and relatively flat, I think we'd be into that. Preliminary investigations say to consider Old town Scottsdale? Maybe Tempe? Totally open to ideas. How bikeable is Phoenix/Scottsdale -- one moreso than the other? We're going to do a short term rental at first to get settled. We'd like to have a house (the idea of being able to rent a house tickles us, because we totally can't afford that in Seattle -- Phoenix is much cheaper) and our budget is pretty open by Phoenix area standards. Which are the golden funky neighborhoods? What terms should I put into craigslist to start fantasizing?
My husband has accepted a job in Phoenix, AZ and we'll be living there within the month. It's a sudden change, but we're both excited about it and excited about his new position -- also, I am chronically ill and a desert environment has been suggested by several of my doctors.
We don't know the area at all, and are eager to hear any input MeFites have about where to live. Our preference / neighborhood history:
-Most significantly, long term residents of inner SE PDX / Portland. Like everything typical of this: going out to cheap eats, food trucks, vintage clothing, eco-everything, indie movie theaters, nerd stuff, book stores, comic book stores, like density, like historic houses
-Pit stop in Seattle has us HATING the town. What we hate about it: everything is spread out, not walkable, hilly, aside from a few neighborhoods businesses are few and far between, fewer independent businesses, public transit is terrible, traffic is gnarly
Even if there were a dense, quirky neighborhood that was only 10-20 square blocks and relatively flat, I think we'd be into that. Preliminary investigations say to consider Old town Scottsdale? Maybe Tempe? Totally open to ideas. How bikeable is Phoenix/Scottsdale -- one moreso than the other? We're going to do a short term rental at first to get settled. We'd like to have a house (the idea of being able to rent a house tickles us, because we totally can't afford that in Seattle -- Phoenix is much cheaper) and our budget is pretty open by Phoenix area standards. Which are the golden funky neighborhoods? What terms should I put into craigslist to start fantasizing?
You may want to temper your expectations a bit. I left Phoenix in 2008, but unless things have changed considerably, some of your criteria isn't going to be met. Everything will be more spread out and unwalkable than ever before. I'd caution you away from bikes altogether: even when the weather is pleasant enough in the winter, there's so much traffic by such stupid drivers that I felt like I was taking my life in my hands.
Take heart though: For a long time, I thought that there was nothing interesting in Phoenix. Turns out I was wrong -- it's just diffuse. And since a lot of people don't explore beyond their enclaves, it's hard to find out about. Resign yourself to traveling for the good stuff -- to taking 20 minutes by car to get from a dinner to an event that you secretly thing *ought* to be next to one another. That's just how Phoenix is.
posted by .kobayashi. at 6:21 AM on May 28, 2012
Take heart though: For a long time, I thought that there was nothing interesting in Phoenix. Turns out I was wrong -- it's just diffuse. And since a lot of people don't explore beyond their enclaves, it's hard to find out about. Resign yourself to traveling for the good stuff -- to taking 20 minutes by car to get from a dinner to an event that you secretly thing *ought* to be next to one another. That's just how Phoenix is.
posted by .kobayashi. at 6:21 AM on May 28, 2012
thing = think. This, and its converse, is my most frequently committed typo.
posted by .kobayashi. at 6:22 AM on May 28, 2012
posted by .kobayashi. at 6:22 AM on May 28, 2012
from an outsider perspective, scottsdale & tempe are the only neighborhoods I've personally seen in Phoenix (which is huge, you can live there all your life and not know most of the neighborhoods) that would be arguably walkable. I think they're also somewhat pricey, though, aren't they? though everything's expensive, there...
If you're going in a month, you will just have time to find temporary accommodations right now, so I'd suggest you at least do the math on trying to first find a short term or month to month place and putting off the more long term decision until you've had time to look around on the ground. See what's on the tram line that you like. (Though my wife, who grew up there, is always telling me you just don't plan to walk much of anywhere in the summer.)
posted by lodurr at 6:24 AM on May 28, 2012
If you're going in a month, you will just have time to find temporary accommodations right now, so I'd suggest you at least do the math on trying to first find a short term or month to month place and putting off the more long term decision until you've had time to look around on the ground. See what's on the tram line that you like. (Though my wife, who grew up there, is always telling me you just don't plan to walk much of anywhere in the summer.)
posted by lodurr at 6:24 AM on May 28, 2012
Agreeing with the above - Phoenix is all sprawl. I lived downtown last summer, and it's the quietest downtown I've ever seen. Tempe is somewhat more walkable by virtue of the fact that it's a college campus. I'm not sure I'd ever bike anywhere off a trail - drivers in Phoenix are only slightly more considerate than the ones in Chicago.
posted by honeybee413 at 8:43 AM on May 28, 2012
posted by honeybee413 at 8:43 AM on May 28, 2012
I have family in Phoenix, and I live in Portland. They are absolutely nothing alike. Phoenix is all Walgreens, Wal-Mart, massive city blocks, chain stores and concrete. There really are no "golden funky neighborhoods" - there are just 'hoods that are less boring than others.
How bikeable is Phoenix/Scottsdale -- one moreso than the other?
Phoenix is more bikeable than Scottsdale, in the sense that the having the flu is better than having pneumonia. There is pretty much nothing bike-friendly about the Phoenix metro area - cars don't expect there to be bikes on the streets, and streets for the most part aren't set up for bikes. Public transit is sort of ridiculously bad, too, unless you live along the new light-rail system.
If you want historic houses, you should look in the city of Phoenix proper. Being a massive sprawly explosion, Phoenix started in Phoenix and spread outwards, so in general the further out you get from Phoenix the newer the housing stock/neighborhoods.
As a side note, prepare to be shocked by the cost of energy and water when you get there.
I hate to sound negative, but if you're looking for a little pocket of Portland in Phoenix, you won't find it. That's not to say you won't have a good experience living in Phoenix, especially if it's better for your health issues, but Phoenix is really, truly a different city than Portland (or Seattle, for that matter) and if you go down there expecting to replicate a Portland living experience, you'll be disappointed.
posted by pdb at 8:57 AM on May 28, 2012 [2 favorites]
How bikeable is Phoenix/Scottsdale -- one moreso than the other?
Phoenix is more bikeable than Scottsdale, in the sense that the having the flu is better than having pneumonia. There is pretty much nothing bike-friendly about the Phoenix metro area - cars don't expect there to be bikes on the streets, and streets for the most part aren't set up for bikes. Public transit is sort of ridiculously bad, too, unless you live along the new light-rail system.
If you want historic houses, you should look in the city of Phoenix proper. Being a massive sprawly explosion, Phoenix started in Phoenix and spread outwards, so in general the further out you get from Phoenix the newer the housing stock/neighborhoods.
As a side note, prepare to be shocked by the cost of energy and water when you get there.
I hate to sound negative, but if you're looking for a little pocket of Portland in Phoenix, you won't find it. That's not to say you won't have a good experience living in Phoenix, especially if it's better for your health issues, but Phoenix is really, truly a different city than Portland (or Seattle, for that matter) and if you go down there expecting to replicate a Portland living experience, you'll be disappointed.
posted by pdb at 8:57 AM on May 28, 2012 [2 favorites]
I am sorry to tell you this, but as a Northwesterner living in Arizona right now, you are going to be bitterly disappointed if you try to find any kind of facsimile of Portland in Phoenix, because they are truly polar opposites. As others have mentioned, Scottsdale or Tempe will offer a certain amount of the urban density and bikeability that you're looking for, but the vibe is nothing like any neighborhood in Portland (especially SE). Scottsdale is a luxury enclave that is more suggestive of LA's Arizona branch. You will see more Escalades than Priuses or bikes. Tempe is a relatively pleasant student neighborhood that has bars, a couple of breweries, restaurants and shops, but it is really college-student focused, so you should think about whether that will meet your needs.
I really suggest coming to the Phoenix area in person before you start daydreaming to check things out for yourself.
posted by anonnymoose at 8:59 AM on May 28, 2012
I really suggest coming to the Phoenix area in person before you start daydreaming to check things out for yourself.
posted by anonnymoose at 8:59 AM on May 28, 2012
And I would also echo lodurr's sentiment - summers are awful there. 110+ degrees on a regular basis, and then as a bonus you get monsoon season in August! Translated into new-resident-what-do-I-do speak, that means get the biggest house you can afford, and get an attached garage, ideally one that has AC in it (getting into a car you have left on the street in the summer is like getting into an easy-bake oven), because you'll be spending a large amount of time indoors from May until October.
Winters, though? Man, there's nothing like wearing shorts to Christmas dinner, which is being grilled and eaten outdoors. That part is nice.
posted by pdb at 9:01 AM on May 28, 2012
Winters, though? Man, there's nothing like wearing shorts to Christmas dinner, which is being grilled and eaten outdoors. That part is nice.
posted by pdb at 9:01 AM on May 28, 2012
Also: be prepared for a 180 degree general regional attitude between Portland and Phoenix. This attitude encompasses city planning priorities, political issues, environmental policies, and a whole host of issues. Phoenix is sure something, but Portland it ain't.
posted by anonnymoose at 9:07 AM on May 28, 2012
posted by anonnymoose at 9:07 AM on May 28, 2012
Former Portlander and current PHX resident here. Yep, as the others have mentioned, Phoenix is an alien landscape compared to the PNW. Spread out is putting it mild. When I first moved here, the downtown core felt like a ghost town compared to downtown Portland. But there is some hope.
It sounds like your tastes run similar to mine, and I would suggest that central Phoenix can be a great place to live. The historic districts around the downtown have neighborhoods similar to SE Portland. I have friends who live in the Roosevelt district, I live in the East Evergreen district (website with map of districts). The housing is quite affordable (and attractive, I think.) I can walk/bicycle to local stores/activities as well as use the light rail. It isn't as dense with stores and activities as you're used to, but we have a farmer's market, as well as some interesting community gardening collectives like the Roosevelt Growhouse. The downtown food trucks are thriving and proud, with periodic food truck festivals. We have a great little indie film theater, FilmBar. Cultural activities are regularly available downtown. The local cultural-creatives work hard to carve out an alternative to the Scottsdale-Kinkadites (heh). We have a regular gallery crawl/festival (First Fridays on Roosevelt--as well as a more sedate Third Fridays). First Fridays can be a bit crazy, I actually prefer Third Fridays.
I am pretty meh about Scottsdale, even Old Scottsdale. Scottsdale tends to be more Lexus SUV than I enjoy. Restaurants and stores tend to reflect that. Tempe is decent and is relatively bicycle friendly with plenty of shopping, eating, and cultural activities available, but it is student-centric--ASU-Tempe has 58,000 undergraduate students. I think getting temporary housing first and then exploring is a great plan. Check things out and get a feel for what is available.
posted by insert.witticism.here at 9:25 AM on May 28, 2012 [5 favorites]
It sounds like your tastes run similar to mine, and I would suggest that central Phoenix can be a great place to live. The historic districts around the downtown have neighborhoods similar to SE Portland. I have friends who live in the Roosevelt district, I live in the East Evergreen district (website with map of districts). The housing is quite affordable (and attractive, I think.) I can walk/bicycle to local stores/activities as well as use the light rail. It isn't as dense with stores and activities as you're used to, but we have a farmer's market, as well as some interesting community gardening collectives like the Roosevelt Growhouse. The downtown food trucks are thriving and proud, with periodic food truck festivals. We have a great little indie film theater, FilmBar. Cultural activities are regularly available downtown. The local cultural-creatives work hard to carve out an alternative to the Scottsdale-Kinkadites (heh). We have a regular gallery crawl/festival (First Fridays on Roosevelt--as well as a more sedate Third Fridays). First Fridays can be a bit crazy, I actually prefer Third Fridays.
I am pretty meh about Scottsdale, even Old Scottsdale. Scottsdale tends to be more Lexus SUV than I enjoy. Restaurants and stores tend to reflect that. Tempe is decent and is relatively bicycle friendly with plenty of shopping, eating, and cultural activities available, but it is student-centric--ASU-Tempe has 58,000 undergraduate students. I think getting temporary housing first and then exploring is a great plan. Check things out and get a feel for what is available.
posted by insert.witticism.here at 9:25 AM on May 28, 2012 [5 favorites]
It's not ALL sprawl here in Phoenix! Please check out the historic districts around central Phoenix and downtown. Also, if you want walkable, the area around the Bridle Path in central Phoenix is both walkable and beautiful. The only people who only know sprawl in Phoenix are the tourists who fly into Sky Harbor, go shopping in Scottsdale and go home. For biking? We have an ENTIRE canal system that links all the neighborhoods for biking, as well as Tempe Town Lake and the Scottsdale Greenway. I suggest you come visit and keep an open mind. I'm a northeasterner and I love it here, mostly because the weather is gorgeous (you get used to the heat the same way you get used to the gray skies in the northwest). Winter is impossibly temperate and amazing. There's some fantastic dining here, great theater and plenty of truly charming coffee shops.
posted by nubianinthedesert at 1:27 PM on May 28, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by nubianinthedesert at 1:27 PM on May 28, 2012 [1 favorite]
everything is spread out, not walkable, hilly, aside from a few neighborhoods businesses are few and far between, fewer independent businesses, public transit is terrible, traffic is gnarly
Well, it's not that hilly and traffic is only gnarly during rush hour.... Other than that, this description fits for Phoenix far better than it does for Seattle. Sorry.
How bikeable is Phoenix/Scottsdale -- one moreso than the other?
I am so sorry to add to the chorus here, but it sounds like you're in for a rather rude discovery.
You have to keep in mind that Phoenix is hot as hell. I'm sure you know that, but I don't think you've really grokked yet how much of a difference in lifestyle that leads to. I'm working from the assumption that you're like the other people I know from the Pacific Northwest -- that you are entirely conditioned to an incredibly temperate, cool climate. Having moved from Phoenix to the Seattle area, I can tell you that most people here just have no idea what it's like living in the heat.
There is a technical sense in which Scottsdale and Tempe are bikeable. But, there are months of the year where biking a short distance is literally dangerous. Not impossible, no, but dangerous. If you're new to 110-degree heat, it is not the sort of thing you should expect to be able to do. Maybe you'll get used to the heat quickly and be able to go back to biking regularly, but I strongly encourage you not to plan your life in Phoenix around the assumption that you'll be able to bike. There are countless little ways in which the daily decisions you make are altered by living in such an incredible heat--expect your lifestyle to change once you're there. I can't say exactly how it'll change, and I can't say exactly how you'll react to the extreme heat, but brace yourself. Expect a hard and painful transition, and be grateful if it turns out easier!
You will also want to be careful when looking for housing. Now, most housing is especially designed for insulation. But, if you're looking for cutesy/historic houses, you may end up with really poor insulation. Remember: 110-degree weather. When you're looking for a place to rent, please keep "Cooling costs" in mind. My one-bedroom apartment (which faced North) had energy bills over $100 during the summer months, and that's when I kept the thermostat set at 80.
With all this said, I encourage you to focus more in Tempe than Scottsdale. Scottsdale skews towards rich older folk -- lots of jewelery stores and art exhibits. Tempe, on the other hand, skews towards cooky college folk -- more nerd coffee shops and weirdo bookstores. (Do keep in mind, though, that ASU has a reputation for being a party school. And it's well earned.) Downtown Mesa is also really cute and rather insulated from the noisiness of ASU, but it may be far from your husband's job.
I loved living in Phoenix. I love the amazing, wonderful feeling of walking outdoors into a flood of warmth. It's like the world is an oven, only in a good way. I love being able to walk at midnight and feel warm in shorts and t-shirt. I also don't mind having to drive a couple of miles to get to this neato shop or that... Please don't be dismayed at the prospects of living in Phoenix -- just, try to temper your expectations at the start.
One thing to get excited about? The Asian and Middle Eastern markets. There is an amazing selection of "ethnic" markets in the Tempe/Mesa/Phoenix area. Seattle ain't exactly wanting for cultural diversity, but Phoenix is amazing. Be willing to drive around, and be willing to stop inside small holes-in-walls in unassuming strip malls. It's awesome.
posted by meese at 3:33 PM on May 28, 2012
Well, it's not that hilly and traffic is only gnarly during rush hour.... Other than that, this description fits for Phoenix far better than it does for Seattle. Sorry.
How bikeable is Phoenix/Scottsdale -- one moreso than the other?
I am so sorry to add to the chorus here, but it sounds like you're in for a rather rude discovery.
You have to keep in mind that Phoenix is hot as hell. I'm sure you know that, but I don't think you've really grokked yet how much of a difference in lifestyle that leads to. I'm working from the assumption that you're like the other people I know from the Pacific Northwest -- that you are entirely conditioned to an incredibly temperate, cool climate. Having moved from Phoenix to the Seattle area, I can tell you that most people here just have no idea what it's like living in the heat.
There is a technical sense in which Scottsdale and Tempe are bikeable. But, there are months of the year where biking a short distance is literally dangerous. Not impossible, no, but dangerous. If you're new to 110-degree heat, it is not the sort of thing you should expect to be able to do. Maybe you'll get used to the heat quickly and be able to go back to biking regularly, but I strongly encourage you not to plan your life in Phoenix around the assumption that you'll be able to bike. There are countless little ways in which the daily decisions you make are altered by living in such an incredible heat--expect your lifestyle to change once you're there. I can't say exactly how it'll change, and I can't say exactly how you'll react to the extreme heat, but brace yourself. Expect a hard and painful transition, and be grateful if it turns out easier!
You will also want to be careful when looking for housing. Now, most housing is especially designed for insulation. But, if you're looking for cutesy/historic houses, you may end up with really poor insulation. Remember: 110-degree weather. When you're looking for a place to rent, please keep "Cooling costs" in mind. My one-bedroom apartment (which faced North) had energy bills over $100 during the summer months, and that's when I kept the thermostat set at 80.
With all this said, I encourage you to focus more in Tempe than Scottsdale. Scottsdale skews towards rich older folk -- lots of jewelery stores and art exhibits. Tempe, on the other hand, skews towards cooky college folk -- more nerd coffee shops and weirdo bookstores. (Do keep in mind, though, that ASU has a reputation for being a party school. And it's well earned.) Downtown Mesa is also really cute and rather insulated from the noisiness of ASU, but it may be far from your husband's job.
I loved living in Phoenix. I love the amazing, wonderful feeling of walking outdoors into a flood of warmth. It's like the world is an oven, only in a good way. I love being able to walk at midnight and feel warm in shorts and t-shirt. I also don't mind having to drive a couple of miles to get to this neato shop or that... Please don't be dismayed at the prospects of living in Phoenix -- just, try to temper your expectations at the start.
One thing to get excited about? The Asian and Middle Eastern markets. There is an amazing selection of "ethnic" markets in the Tempe/Mesa/Phoenix area. Seattle ain't exactly wanting for cultural diversity, but Phoenix is amazing. Be willing to drive around, and be willing to stop inside small holes-in-walls in unassuming strip malls. It's awesome.
posted by meese at 3:33 PM on May 28, 2012
Current Phoenix resident here. Ive lived all over the valley, and I don't have anything more eloquent to say than insert.witticism.here is 100% correct in this matter. Downtown Phoenix, without question, is the coolest place to live in all of the Phoenix metro area.
posted by LyndsayMW at 5:55 PM on May 28, 2012
posted by LyndsayMW at 5:55 PM on May 28, 2012
I've lived in the Phoenix area my whole life -- Phoenix, Tempe, now the east valley. The only spots with even a ghostly semblance of culture and walkability are within a half mile these markers, and I still wouldn't live any of these places without a car. You just can't do it.
FWIW, currently planning a move to the PNW. I'll miss the mexican food but not much else.
posted by Chris4d at 10:52 PM on May 29, 2012
FWIW, currently planning a move to the PNW. I'll miss the mexican food but not much else.
posted by Chris4d at 10:52 PM on May 29, 2012
« Older My spouse flipped out on me and I don't know what... | Freddy? Jason? Damien? Is that you? Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
Scottsdale and Tempe are good choices to start with.
posted by sandmanwv at 5:57 AM on May 28, 2012 [1 favorite]