How do I cope with the difference between me and my girlfriend
February 9, 2012 5:19 AM Subscribe
My girlfriend often talks about "stupid" topics - am I an idiot for thinking so?
Well, me and my girlfriend have been together for 6 years, living together for 3½. We are the same type of persons in a lot of areas; only major difference is that she puts all her effort in her studies, but not much else; so she isn't much interested in the news, philosophical topics, music, etc. she isn't really that devoted to "culture" beyond what she studies.
I am a culture addict, I read a lot, one of my passions is exploring music and film, and I enjoy discussing philosophy, psychology, literature, etc. with my friends (we're not snobs at all we just also talk about this stuff among other stuff).
The problem is that I get in this conflict since my girlfriend often talks about celebrities, lame TV shows, fitness, and these kind of things with me, and she's usually too tired to talk about anything that I'm interested in. I usually just talk with her about these things anyway, but I don't feel like it at all is I'm honest to myself. She isn't really curious about the same things that I am. I've accepted that long ago, and moved those things to "friends only" talk. The thing is that I've had periods where I think negative of my girlfriend, because of this: Sometimes we feel soooo far apart because we often think about things in two different ways, while I usually feel much more linked in thought to my friends - and I'm not talking in a man-to-man gender-based solidarity, I'm talking of an overall view, curiosity and interest in anything cultural. For example it took my girlfriend a lot of time to realize how a movie can actually change your output in life; that culture actually has a function beyond mere entertainment or in relation to studying.
Sometimes I just question why we're even together, even though I love her with all my heart and would sacrifice myself for her. There's this place where we connect, but there's also this place where we seriously disconnect (at least for me) - and in those times I feel really sad, almost like I betray her, for thinking negative thoughts and having doubts about us.
Can anyone more experienced relate or tell me if this is a normal dilemma in a relationship? Am I supposed to accept that what I share with my girlfriend will always be tenderness, caring, loving, but not the intellectual and culturally curious aspect of a human relationship that I share with my friends?
Well, me and my girlfriend have been together for 6 years, living together for 3½. We are the same type of persons in a lot of areas; only major difference is that she puts all her effort in her studies, but not much else; so she isn't much interested in the news, philosophical topics, music, etc. she isn't really that devoted to "culture" beyond what she studies.
I am a culture addict, I read a lot, one of my passions is exploring music and film, and I enjoy discussing philosophy, psychology, literature, etc. with my friends (we're not snobs at all we just also talk about this stuff among other stuff).
The problem is that I get in this conflict since my girlfriend often talks about celebrities, lame TV shows, fitness, and these kind of things with me, and she's usually too tired to talk about anything that I'm interested in. I usually just talk with her about these things anyway, but I don't feel like it at all is I'm honest to myself. She isn't really curious about the same things that I am. I've accepted that long ago, and moved those things to "friends only" talk. The thing is that I've had periods where I think negative of my girlfriend, because of this: Sometimes we feel soooo far apart because we often think about things in two different ways, while I usually feel much more linked in thought to my friends - and I'm not talking in a man-to-man gender-based solidarity, I'm talking of an overall view, curiosity and interest in anything cultural. For example it took my girlfriend a lot of time to realize how a movie can actually change your output in life; that culture actually has a function beyond mere entertainment or in relation to studying.
Sometimes I just question why we're even together, even though I love her with all my heart and would sacrifice myself for her. There's this place where we connect, but there's also this place where we seriously disconnect (at least for me) - and in those times I feel really sad, almost like I betray her, for thinking negative thoughts and having doubts about us.
Can anyone more experienced relate or tell me if this is a normal dilemma in a relationship? Am I supposed to accept that what I share with my girlfriend will always be tenderness, caring, loving, but not the intellectual and culturally curious aspect of a human relationship that I share with my friends?
...even though I love her with all my heart and would sacrifice myself for her
That's why you're together.
My SO is a total bimbo. She hasn't a cultural clue but I love her little socks off. Can't explain beyond that - just do is all.
posted by the noob at 5:28 AM on February 9, 2012 [15 favorites]
That's why you're together.
My SO is a total bimbo. She hasn't a cultural clue but I love her little socks off. Can't explain beyond that - just do is all.
posted by the noob at 5:28 AM on February 9, 2012 [15 favorites]
You don't have to share the same interests to love one another. Do you listen when she talks about the topics she likes? Maybe you should, and ask her to listen when you talk about yours.
posted by xingcat at 5:36 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by xingcat at 5:36 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
Sometimes I just question why we're even together, even though I love her with all my heart and would sacrifice myself for her.
Outside of Hollywood, the grand gesture is no substitute for compatibility and mutual respect.
You don't have to share all the same interests, but if you're gritting your teeth just to get through the ordeal of talking to her about hers, and pretending to be interested in things you think are "stupid" while resenting her for not being your cultural equal, then the celebrity talk is the least of your worries.
posted by headnsouth at 5:39 AM on February 9, 2012 [32 favorites]
Outside of Hollywood, the grand gesture is no substitute for compatibility and mutual respect.
You don't have to share all the same interests, but if you're gritting your teeth just to get through the ordeal of talking to her about hers, and pretending to be interested in things you think are "stupid" while resenting her for not being your cultural equal, then the celebrity talk is the least of your worries.
posted by headnsouth at 5:39 AM on February 9, 2012 [32 favorites]
This sounds like a fundamental incompatibility to me -- part of having an adult, mature relationship is having a foundation of shared respect and interest.
posted by ellF at 5:41 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by ellF at 5:41 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Hey, as stated in the topic title ("am I an idiot?"), I KNOW that it might be "the least of my worries" - if you could be more specific I might actually gain something from what you're saying and get things more clear instead of just feeling even more like (a) shit.......
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 5:42 AM on February 9, 2012
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 5:42 AM on February 9, 2012
Hey, I know that since I started school again, my ability to deal with/interest in more highbrow culture fell. My brain's pretty tired most of the time, and I don't want to deal with heavy stuff. I devote a lot of time to reading about economics and trying to figure out how to fix poverty, so no, I don't want to talk politics when I'm not studying. Could this be what's going on with your girlfriend? You've been together for a while; if she wasn't in school at some point along the line, how did you feel about her interests then?
That all said, being able to connect to your partner on an intellectual level is pretty important - as is being respected by your partner.t
posted by punchtothehead at 5:50 AM on February 9, 2012 [14 favorites]
That all said, being able to connect to your partner on an intellectual level is pretty important - as is being respected by your partner.t
posted by punchtothehead at 5:50 AM on February 9, 2012 [14 favorites]
In any relationship, there will be something about each person's interests and abilities that the other just doesn't get. The problem isn't that she doesn't share your cultural curiosity, it's that you look down on her for it. Shared interests and similar levels of intellect aren't necessary for a good relationship, but mutual respect is. In addition to loving someone, you have to like her too.
If it's ultimately a dealbreaker, that's okay. Doesn't mean you're a snob or she's an airhead. But if you can refrain from judging her by her shallower interests, it doesn't have to be a dealbreaker.
posted by Metroid Baby at 5:52 AM on February 9, 2012 [6 favorites]
If it's ultimately a dealbreaker, that's okay. Doesn't mean you're a snob or she's an airhead. But if you can refrain from judging her by her shallower interests, it doesn't have to be a dealbreaker.
posted by Metroid Baby at 5:52 AM on February 9, 2012 [6 favorites]
Best answer: From here it looks like you are looking down on her intellectually, and that you think you are smarter than she is. Or at least you are more 'cultured' or something. If that's the case, then it's up to you if it matters. If you are still torn about this six years into the relationship then I'd say it matters to you.
I will say that I have been with people who were very close to my level with regard to this type of subject matter - i.e. on a dating profile we would look perfect for each other. But in real life, those kinds of things matter very little.
What I would focus on if I were you is why she is "too tired to talk about anything that I'm interested in". From here, I'd say she feels like she is being lectured at. Maybe at the end of the day - she takes classes, right? That's what you meant by her 'studies'? - she doesn't want to be challenged and have intellectual debate. Maybe she just wants to turn her brain off, chill out, be loved by her partner and be treated like an equal instead of like a sullen student.
Investigate it from her perspective - by which I mean: don't just try and figure it out on your own, ASK her about it.
posted by 8dot3 at 5:52 AM on February 9, 2012 [39 favorites]
I will say that I have been with people who were very close to my level with regard to this type of subject matter - i.e. on a dating profile we would look perfect for each other. But in real life, those kinds of things matter very little.
What I would focus on if I were you is why she is "too tired to talk about anything that I'm interested in". From here, I'd say she feels like she is being lectured at. Maybe at the end of the day - she takes classes, right? That's what you meant by her 'studies'? - she doesn't want to be challenged and have intellectual debate. Maybe she just wants to turn her brain off, chill out, be loved by her partner and be treated like an equal instead of like a sullen student.
Investigate it from her perspective - by which I mean: don't just try and figure it out on your own, ASK her about it.
posted by 8dot3 at 5:52 AM on February 9, 2012 [39 favorites]
There is a very key concept everyone has zeroed in on: respect. Tastes and energy levels and interests can either dovetail completely or diverge wildly in happy couples, as long as there is mutual respect.
The word that jarred me in your question was "stupid". There is nothing inherently lofty about any particular topic, you know.
posted by likeso at 5:54 AM on February 9, 2012 [14 favorites]
The word that jarred me in your question was "stupid". There is nothing inherently lofty about any particular topic, you know.
posted by likeso at 5:54 AM on February 9, 2012 [14 favorites]
Can anyone more experienced relate or tell me if this is a normal dilemma in a relationship? Am I supposed to accept that what I share with my girlfriend will always be tenderness, caring, loving, but not the intellectual and culturally curious aspect of a human relationship that I share with my friends?
I think it's a common dilemma but how much it matters to you depends on how much that particular thing -- sharing about those topics - is important to you. Like for some people incompatible sex drives or unmatched senses of humor might be relationship-killers. For others, they're a little more flexible on those topics.
I would have a really hard time with being in a relationship where I couldn't talk about the stuff that interested me with someone also interested in those things. It would kind of kill me. But I'm a pretty introverted person and I don't have tons of outlets, so maybe that's more important to me than to other people.
But I think it's really about kind of having in your head what your big needs are in a relationship. You know you're not going to get every need met and that's fine, but you want to get the big ones met or I think that in the back of your head, you're always hoping to get that need met somewhere.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 5:54 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
I think it's a common dilemma but how much it matters to you depends on how much that particular thing -- sharing about those topics - is important to you. Like for some people incompatible sex drives or unmatched senses of humor might be relationship-killers. For others, they're a little more flexible on those topics.
I would have a really hard time with being in a relationship where I couldn't talk about the stuff that interested me with someone also interested in those things. It would kind of kill me. But I'm a pretty introverted person and I don't have tons of outlets, so maybe that's more important to me than to other people.
But I think it's really about kind of having in your head what your big needs are in a relationship. You know you're not going to get every need met and that's fine, but you want to get the big ones met or I think that in the back of your head, you're always hoping to get that need met somewhere.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 5:54 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
You don't have share the same interests, but you probably have to respect each other, for the relationship to work...
posted by zeek321 at 6:05 AM on February 9, 2012
posted by zeek321 at 6:05 AM on February 9, 2012
Best answer: Can anyone more experienced relate or tell me if this is a normal dilemma in a relationship?
Yeah, it's common, but to be honest, having different interests isn't a problem. The implied contempt for her because she doesn't share your interests is.
As to fixing it, maybe finding places in which your interests intersect? For example, she's into celebrities. You're into music and film. How about chatting about famous film celebrities of the past, or maybe watching old films together? The key isn't to be like HEY I AM EDUCATING YOU WITH THESE THINGS AND I AM SOOOO SMART AND INTELLECTUAL AND WE ARE BEING SMART AND INTELLECTUAL TOGETHER AND LET US HAVE AN ~ INTELLECTUAL DISCOURSE ABOUT IT ~!, but HEY THIS IS RELEVANT TO BOTH OUR INTERESTS! WANNA COME SIT ON THE COUCH WITH ME WHILE THIS ORSON WELLES MOVIE IS PLAYING (PS: LOOK AT THE DRESS RITA HAYWORTH IS ROCKING DID YOU KNOW THIS FILM WAS [__________])
Example from my relationship: my husband is super-into the (not-American-style) football, especially things like social/political movements and how they intersect with the sport. I am not into sports, but I am into small, cute animals and goodlooking men. (Acting out gender stereotypes, ahoy!)
He got me around my lack of interest by renaming certain football teams with names incorporating cute animals (Tottenham Hamspur), chatted about which football players were thought to be attractive by ladies on the Internet, and while I still don't want to watch a whole game all the way through, I do know that Fabio Capello is out as the new England national manager, that media rumors have Harry Redknapp heavily favored as the next manager, and the fact that St. Pauli is the most left-wing club in the German top-flight league, the Bundesliga. We can talk about it on walks together or while we're making dinner, and it works.
posted by joyceanmachine at 6:06 AM on February 9, 2012 [16 favorites]
Yeah, it's common, but to be honest, having different interests isn't a problem. The implied contempt for her because she doesn't share your interests is.
As to fixing it, maybe finding places in which your interests intersect? For example, she's into celebrities. You're into music and film. How about chatting about famous film celebrities of the past, or maybe watching old films together? The key isn't to be like HEY I AM EDUCATING YOU WITH THESE THINGS AND I AM SOOOO SMART AND INTELLECTUAL AND WE ARE BEING SMART AND INTELLECTUAL TOGETHER AND LET US HAVE AN ~ INTELLECTUAL DISCOURSE ABOUT IT ~!, but HEY THIS IS RELEVANT TO BOTH OUR INTERESTS! WANNA COME SIT ON THE COUCH WITH ME WHILE THIS ORSON WELLES MOVIE IS PLAYING (PS: LOOK AT THE DRESS RITA HAYWORTH IS ROCKING DID YOU KNOW THIS FILM WAS [__________])
Example from my relationship: my husband is super-into the (not-American-style) football, especially things like social/political movements and how they intersect with the sport. I am not into sports, but I am into small, cute animals and goodlooking men. (Acting out gender stereotypes, ahoy!)
He got me around my lack of interest by renaming certain football teams with names incorporating cute animals (Tottenham Hamspur), chatted about which football players were thought to be attractive by ladies on the Internet, and while I still don't want to watch a whole game all the way through, I do know that Fabio Capello is out as the new England national manager, that media rumors have Harry Redknapp heavily favored as the next manager, and the fact that St. Pauli is the most left-wing club in the German top-flight league, the Bundesliga. We can talk about it on walks together or while we're making dinner, and it works.
posted by joyceanmachine at 6:06 AM on February 9, 2012 [16 favorites]
Best answer: I think you may have to give some thought to how important it is to you that your girlfriend's interests overlap with yours.
I know that, for some people, not being able to have conversations with their partner about abstract, 'intellectual' topics would be unacceptable. For others, like me, it's not an issue. My wife and I come from very different places, at least educationally and in terms of interests. She left school at 16, whereas I have a university education and postgraduate qualifications. She watches a lot of 'reality' TV and medical dramas, while I prefer reading or watching documentaries about science and the arts. But despite that, we're never short of things to talk about - our home, our children, our mutual friends and acquaintances, food, travel, the few things we watch together on TV. I don't see any 'lack' in our relationship, I don't look down on her, and while she's perfectly aware that I know a lot of things that she doesn't, she doesn't feel in any way the lesser person. She's capable of just as many other things that I'm not, and her social skills leave mine in the dust. We're very much equals, even if we're not equal on every level.
It's ultimately down to what you want your relationship to be, and whether you expect your partner to meet your needs on every count, or whether you are willing to accept that certain needs will necessarily have to be met outside the relationship. There's no shame in the latter.
posted by le morte de bea arthur at 6:06 AM on February 9, 2012 [15 favorites]
I know that, for some people, not being able to have conversations with their partner about abstract, 'intellectual' topics would be unacceptable. For others, like me, it's not an issue. My wife and I come from very different places, at least educationally and in terms of interests. She left school at 16, whereas I have a university education and postgraduate qualifications. She watches a lot of 'reality' TV and medical dramas, while I prefer reading or watching documentaries about science and the arts. But despite that, we're never short of things to talk about - our home, our children, our mutual friends and acquaintances, food, travel, the few things we watch together on TV. I don't see any 'lack' in our relationship, I don't look down on her, and while she's perfectly aware that I know a lot of things that she doesn't, she doesn't feel in any way the lesser person. She's capable of just as many other things that I'm not, and her social skills leave mine in the dust. We're very much equals, even if we're not equal on every level.
It's ultimately down to what you want your relationship to be, and whether you expect your partner to meet your needs on every count, or whether you are willing to accept that certain needs will necessarily have to be met outside the relationship. There's no shame in the latter.
posted by le morte de bea arthur at 6:06 AM on February 9, 2012 [15 favorites]
Response by poster: I understand that, and in this situation I guess I lose my respect because to me these topics are, at length, just too shallow for me. I am not especially clever or intellectual, but I do have certain things that I really feel aren't enjoyable to talk about. I can respect it to a certain degree, but not when celibrities or TV references show up so much in conversation, as if it was the only reference point there is.
I made this topic in order for someone, who's perhaps been in a similar situation, to re-think this, and make me change my patterns into a way of recognizing and respecting or changing this, since I don't want to break up this relationship at all. I am just stuck in this negative thinking. How do I get to this respect? That's all I ask.
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 6:09 AM on February 9, 2012
I made this topic in order for someone, who's perhaps been in a similar situation, to re-think this, and make me change my patterns into a way of recognizing and respecting or changing this, since I don't want to break up this relationship at all. I am just stuck in this negative thinking. How do I get to this respect? That's all I ask.
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 6:09 AM on February 9, 2012
Response by poster: Made the last post before the two recent ones showed up. Great replies, thanks :)
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 6:11 AM on February 9, 2012
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 6:11 AM on February 9, 2012
It is a mistake to think that your SO should some how fulfill all your desires. No one person can fill all the needs of another. You need to consider this as part of the overall question of is this relationship making me happy. It sounds like you are saying it does. So find other ways to fill your needs.
Do make sure to discuss your feelings with her as well. Don't talk about your wishes or what you want. Just tell your SO how you feel, then ask her how she feels. Repeat as necessary.
Also if there is a feeling of disrespect for her due to this you need to get to why that is. Not respecting your partner for who and what they are is a cancer that will rot any relationship in time.
posted by The Violet Cypher at 6:12 AM on February 9, 2012
Do make sure to discuss your feelings with her as well. Don't talk about your wishes or what you want. Just tell your SO how you feel, then ask her how she feels. Repeat as necessary.
Also if there is a feeling of disrespect for her due to this you need to get to why that is. Not respecting your partner for who and what they are is a cancer that will rot any relationship in time.
posted by The Violet Cypher at 6:12 AM on February 9, 2012
Best answer: I guess I lose my respect because to me these topics are, at length, just too shallow for me.
What makes you think that your girlfriend doesn't think these topics are shallow too? I'm betting she does, and that you're not giving her enough credit. Most people enjoy a little low-brow in their lives.
posted by le morte de bea arthur at 6:17 AM on February 9, 2012 [15 favorites]
What makes you think that your girlfriend doesn't think these topics are shallow too? I'm betting she does, and that you're not giving her enough credit. Most people enjoy a little low-brow in their lives.
posted by le morte de bea arthur at 6:17 AM on February 9, 2012 [15 favorites]
You do not undergo a Vulcan mind meld when you partner. It's normal for you to have your interests and she to have hers. What will help give both daily and long term value to your relationship is if you also expend together some effort to cultivate a shared interest or two. In my house, these are the dog, internet things, some British history and some political issues (although I engage in only a sub-set of the issues that absorb my partner's attention.) I consider these items to be "overlap of attraction" rather than "overlap of necessity" and rate them more highly than the house, cooking, the paint color for the bathroom, and our various social obligations as a couple. YMMV.
posted by DarlingBri at 6:17 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by DarlingBri at 6:17 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
Is it possible that the reason she's talking about celebrities so much is because she's thinking "oh, dear, he's really into movies and film and I don't know anything about that, the only way I have to relate to that is to talk about the people in the movies HEY BOYFRIEND LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT SOMETHING THAT THS ACTOR DID BECAUSE HE'S A FILM STAR AND YOU'RE REALLY INTO FILM SO MAYBE THIS IS SOMETHING WE CAN TALK ABOUT"?
I will also say that if she's heavily into her studies, that may be the reason why she's not following the news -- intellectually she's exhausted. I'm fairly intellectual, but I get that way too if I'm concentrating on something like that (I couldn't tell you much about politics, but that's because I'm starting a writing class now and am knee-deep in "must read a lot of personal essays and study their construction for class").
What is she studying? Can you talk to her about that? Or how about asking -- in a genuine, supportive way -- "I have to admit that I don't know much about [a topic she's interested in], can you tell me more about it so I see what excites you about it?" Maybe you'll get why she's so jazzed about it, or at least her enthusiasm will come through (and enthusiasm is always attractive), and maybe you'll see that it isn't as shallow as you thought, maybe.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:20 AM on February 9, 2012 [4 favorites]
I will also say that if she's heavily into her studies, that may be the reason why she's not following the news -- intellectually she's exhausted. I'm fairly intellectual, but I get that way too if I'm concentrating on something like that (I couldn't tell you much about politics, but that's because I'm starting a writing class now and am knee-deep in "must read a lot of personal essays and study their construction for class").
What is she studying? Can you talk to her about that? Or how about asking -- in a genuine, supportive way -- "I have to admit that I don't know much about [a topic she's interested in], can you tell me more about it so I see what excites you about it?" Maybe you'll get why she's so jazzed about it, or at least her enthusiasm will come through (and enthusiasm is always attractive), and maybe you'll see that it isn't as shallow as you thought, maybe.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:20 AM on February 9, 2012 [4 favorites]
I think you're wrong to think she's not smart because she's not into the same things you are, i.e., (possibly because she studies a lot) you are into "high" culture and she is into "low" culture.
The way I would think about this is, are there things you can talk about that you both enjoy? Is there some middle ground between Schopenhauer and the Kardashians? If there is, you're fine -- you don't need to get everything from that one person. If there's not, that's a problem, because you will wind up unable to talk and/or full of resentment.
The other issue I see is that this is a long term relationship, and you're apparently not capable of discussing issues like this with her. Work on that. If you can't do that, that, too, is a big problem.
posted by J. Wilson at 6:20 AM on February 9, 2012
The way I would think about this is, are there things you can talk about that you both enjoy? Is there some middle ground between Schopenhauer and the Kardashians? If there is, you're fine -- you don't need to get everything from that one person. If there's not, that's a problem, because you will wind up unable to talk and/or full of resentment.
The other issue I see is that this is a long term relationship, and you're apparently not capable of discussing issues like this with her. Work on that. If you can't do that, that, too, is a big problem.
posted by J. Wilson at 6:20 AM on February 9, 2012
I'm going to echo a number of comments above in slightly different words. Maybe the way to develop that respect is to look at and/or take in to consideration whatever she's studying? I am an academic. So intellectual thinking is my *job*. (A totally awesome job, but still, my job.) When I get together with other academics, a common topic of discussion is . . . the Real Housewives of CityX (whichever is playing at the time). Because sometimes we need to be doing something that is clearly *not our job* and those shows are about as mentally taxing as oatmeal while providing fun "social" activity to gossip about. It sounds like her studies are her job right now, which a) suggests she's not shallow, but quite deserving of respect and b) might make other intellectual discussion feel like work.
The other thing is, um, celebrities, TV shows and fitness are culture. They may be pop culture, but they're still culture. (The Devil Wears Prada Cerulean monologue comes to mind) So maybe together with the tips above about engaging her in your interests, you can look for pieces of your interests in the things she likes to talk about. Really, some of those reality shows are spectacular fodder for philosophical and psychological analysis. Break out the DSMIV with a bucket of popcorn and you'll be all set.
posted by synapse at 6:22 AM on February 9, 2012 [13 favorites]
The other thing is, um, celebrities, TV shows and fitness are culture. They may be pop culture, but they're still culture. (The Devil Wears Prada Cerulean monologue comes to mind) So maybe together with the tips above about engaging her in your interests, you can look for pieces of your interests in the things she likes to talk about. Really, some of those reality shows are spectacular fodder for philosophical and psychological analysis. Break out the DSMIV with a bucket of popcorn and you'll be all set.
posted by synapse at 6:22 AM on February 9, 2012 [13 favorites]
How do you get to this respect? By really acknowledging that she is just as "smart" as you but in different ways. Recognising you are judgemental is a good start; since you like to think deeply about things tease out the whole thought process that lead to you thinking that your interests have more value than her's? When she is discussing celebrities is she not also discussing psychology? ("why would Britney shave her head!!!" to use an older example) Do reality tv stars not explore the same archetypes that great literature is based on?
FWIW, I am a student of cultural studies and philosophy with a strong interest in psychology. I love discussing "low-culture" with people that have a passion for it because they are much more insightful and honest than a lot of the academic papers out there.
posted by saucysault at 6:25 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
FWIW, I am a student of cultural studies and philosophy with a strong interest in psychology. I love discussing "low-culture" with people that have a passion for it because they are much more insightful and honest than a lot of the academic papers out there.
posted by saucysault at 6:25 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
Some people look to entertainment to be entertained, not fulfilled, uplifted, improved or changed. Just to get their mind off whatever serious stuff is in their life at the time. That may not be your preferred view of music and film, but it's certainly a perfectly valid one.
It sounds like your girlfriend studies some serious stuff, though you don't specify what, and when she's not devoting her intellectual energy to that, prefers not to be in her head all the time. That doesn't make her a bad person, it doesn't make her stupid or shallow. In fact, it may well mean that of the two of you, she's more balanced, because she doesn't over-intellectualize every experience.
posted by jacquilynne at 6:25 AM on February 9, 2012 [7 favorites]
It sounds like your girlfriend studies some serious stuff, though you don't specify what, and when she's not devoting her intellectual energy to that, prefers not to be in her head all the time. That doesn't make her a bad person, it doesn't make her stupid or shallow. In fact, it may well mean that of the two of you, she's more balanced, because she doesn't over-intellectualize every experience.
posted by jacquilynne at 6:25 AM on February 9, 2012 [7 favorites]
Try to find more common ground between your interests and her interests. Look at it as an interesting challenge. What use is your philosophy and psychology if it can't find some meaning even in celebrity gossip? And don't even try to put your concerns in highfalutin language, or with citations that she'll never check. Try to think about what you've read about authenticity and try to square it with Lana del Rey, or whatever.
Where your interests still diverge, don't look at it as her job to share them. It's not! Talk about those things with your friends. Look at this as an advantage - in addition to having a life with your SO, you also have a private life where you have a different set of referents and values.
posted by Sticherbeast at 6:31 AM on February 9, 2012
Where your interests still diverge, don't look at it as her job to share them. It's not! Talk about those things with your friends. Look at this as an advantage - in addition to having a life with your SO, you also have a private life where you have a different set of referents and values.
posted by Sticherbeast at 6:31 AM on February 9, 2012
Also you seem to say that these are shallow subjects without depth. I have never encountered such a subject. All topics have depth if one only bothers to look. One man is hit on the head by falling fruit and is mad, another asks why and learns about the universe. I think you need to reconsider what is a worthy conversation topic.
On a slightly different note it also sounds more like you feel like she is not intellectually curious.
And that is something you find important in a partner.
posted by The Violet Cypher at 6:31 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
On a slightly different note it also sounds more like you feel like she is not intellectually curious.
And that is something you find important in a partner.
posted by The Violet Cypher at 6:31 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: We're both humanistic academics at master's degree phase now. She's in architecture and I'm in what in broad terms could be called "cultural dissemination" or cultural studies.
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 6:34 AM on February 9, 2012
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 6:34 AM on February 9, 2012
There's depth and complexity in everything, even celebrity and fitness and reality shows. All this stuff is just a gateway into various aspects of the human condition. You could turn a critical eye to these things and try to understand what they say and what they can tell us about contemporary society. You could try to isolate exactly what is appealing about a particular pop culture thing, e.g. a particular celebrity -- why this person, at this time? What's going on in the world that makes this person interesting to so many people? You could try to trace influences from previous generations of pop culture (or even classical culture, mythology, etc) and try to identify archetypes and references that the content producers are using and manipulating. People write PhD dissertations on this stuff. True, many people engage at a surface level, but that's not the only level there is, and moreover often what seems like a simple discussion is actually about these deeper more complex things in ways that are usually not consciously articulated. Pay attention and use this big fancy brain of yours, in other words.
posted by PercussivePaul at 6:34 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by PercussivePaul at 6:34 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
Just missed your comment, and it figures, you're a cultural studies major. Hah. I guess I don't have to tell you these things. Still I'm surprised you're not able to find something to talk about when pop culture is the topic.
posted by PercussivePaul at 6:36 AM on February 9, 2012
posted by PercussivePaul at 6:36 AM on February 9, 2012
She's in architecture and I'm in what in broad terms could be called "cultural dissemination" or cultural studies.
So, um, basically, you relate to the world entirely from the perspective of your academic discipline and you're annoyed that she won't talk to you about your work, or through the lens of your work, constantly.
This might be too low-brow a reference for you, but have you ever seen the TV show Bones? The character of Dr. Brennan is what happens when you can't ever turn it off. And while people close to her do grow to love her, they are also frequently aggravated and annoyed by her. People who aren't close to her are just aggravated and annoyed.
posted by jacquilynne at 6:39 AM on February 9, 2012 [21 favorites]
So, um, basically, you relate to the world entirely from the perspective of your academic discipline and you're annoyed that she won't talk to you about your work, or through the lens of your work, constantly.
This might be too low-brow a reference for you, but have you ever seen the TV show Bones? The character of Dr. Brennan is what happens when you can't ever turn it off. And while people close to her do grow to love her, they are also frequently aggravated and annoyed by her. People who aren't close to her are just aggravated and annoyed.
posted by jacquilynne at 6:39 AM on February 9, 2012 [21 favorites]
Wait, you're a cultural studies major? And she doesn't want to discuss cultural studies stuff with you? I am going to totally repeat what I said above: she doesn't see it as conversation, she sees it as 3 more credit hours she has to sit through every night when she gets home from work. How would you feel about her bestowing architecture lectures every night over dinner to 'better' or 'educate' you?
posted by 8dot3 at 6:40 AM on February 9, 2012 [18 favorites]
posted by 8dot3 at 6:40 AM on February 9, 2012 [18 favorites]
You are not wrong to want a partner who you can have intellectually stimulating discussions with. You are also not wrong to want shared interests with your partner. These things are very important to some and not so much for others and that will show in the responses. I live with a smart, creative and culturally-minded person who shares many but not all of my interests. I really can't imagine being happy with someone who couldn't hold a conversation or express an intellectually curious outlook. Maybe you are like me?
posted by Orchestra at 6:40 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by Orchestra at 6:40 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
The undertone of your complaint suggests that in this disconnect the default assumption is that she should to gravitate more towards your interests than you to hers - that it is her job to bridge the gap. This seems rather one sided - it puts the onus entirely on her to connect with you in your language and gets you off the hook for trying to connect with her in her language.
Since you dismiss her interests as shallow and lame, it seems clear that you are not willing to stretch yourself in the same way that you think she should stretch herself. Perhaps you should ask yourself what's in it for her in trying to meet you on your side of the fence if you won't do the same.
I'm sure you know the whole 'you can't change anyone but yourself blah blah blah'...What you can change is challenging the implication that your interests are somehow more superior than yours. They're not, just different.
If you know beyond doubt that for you intellectual connections animate emotional ones then you should leave the relationship. As painful as that might be, in the long run its less painful than being in a relationship with someone who doesn't respect you.
posted by space_cookie at 6:44 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
Since you dismiss her interests as shallow and lame, it seems clear that you are not willing to stretch yourself in the same way that you think she should stretch herself. Perhaps you should ask yourself what's in it for her in trying to meet you on your side of the fence if you won't do the same.
I'm sure you know the whole 'you can't change anyone but yourself blah blah blah'...What you can change is challenging the implication that your interests are somehow more superior than yours. They're not, just different.
If you know beyond doubt that for you intellectual connections animate emotional ones then you should leave the relationship. As painful as that might be, in the long run its less painful than being in a relationship with someone who doesn't respect you.
posted by space_cookie at 6:44 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
A masters in architecture is a professional degree, and a very hardcore, serious-burn-out-creating degree. The 2-3 hours of sleep per night (which increases to 4-5 hours in the third year) don't really make for a lot of time to spend on interesting topics (outside of architecture). When you're not in studio, you're sleeping.
My advice is to at least wait until your gf is in the real world to see what topics she has time to look at outside of school. At this point, architecture school is all she's thinking about... The fact that she's studying architecture alone means that's she's got to be able to think about and use knowledge from a million different fields. That seems reason enough to stay for now.
posted by Kronur at 6:45 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
My advice is to at least wait until your gf is in the real world to see what topics she has time to look at outside of school. At this point, architecture school is all she's thinking about... The fact that she's studying architecture alone means that's she's got to be able to think about and use knowledge from a million different fields. That seems reason enough to stay for now.
posted by Kronur at 6:45 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
You know, I'm caught by this even as you're denying it:
Sometimes we feel soooo far apart because we often think about things in two different ways, while I usually feel much more linked in thought to my friends - and I'm not talking in a man-to-man gender-based solidarity, I'm talking of an overall view, curiosity and interest in anything cultural.
When I read this question, it could easily be said that you're privileging traditionally male areas of culture (literature, philosophy, a certain view of music and what is considered "news" and what isn't) over what's traditionally considered female interests: "celebrities, lame TV shows, fitness".
Definitely in intellectual circles, female interests have most often been considered lesser. It is very easy in our society to think of "girl stuff" as "shallow stuff": being interested in people over "culture".
I have intellectual interests and I really enjoy analyzing the world around me. I think deeply on a lot of topics, but a lot of academic work leaves me cold. I'm pretty rigid myself in what I'll read or watch - I simply cannot bother with books and movies that are not well-made; but well-made is actually a different thing from culturally valued. I've read romance novels that were well-written. A lot of "high" culture feels chilly and, well, wanky, to me; therefore it's boring and I just can't care. That doesn't make me shallow, at all. In fact from my POV it kind of makes someone who would judge me as shallow simply because I enjoy talking about a certain reality TV show as pretty shallow themselves.
posted by flex at 6:46 AM on February 9, 2012 [28 favorites]
Sometimes we feel soooo far apart because we often think about things in two different ways, while I usually feel much more linked in thought to my friends - and I'm not talking in a man-to-man gender-based solidarity, I'm talking of an overall view, curiosity and interest in anything cultural.
When I read this question, it could easily be said that you're privileging traditionally male areas of culture (literature, philosophy, a certain view of music and what is considered "news" and what isn't) over what's traditionally considered female interests: "celebrities, lame TV shows, fitness".
Definitely in intellectual circles, female interests have most often been considered lesser. It is very easy in our society to think of "girl stuff" as "shallow stuff": being interested in people over "culture".
I have intellectual interests and I really enjoy analyzing the world around me. I think deeply on a lot of topics, but a lot of academic work leaves me cold. I'm pretty rigid myself in what I'll read or watch - I simply cannot bother with books and movies that are not well-made; but well-made is actually a different thing from culturally valued. I've read romance novels that were well-written. A lot of "high" culture feels chilly and, well, wanky, to me; therefore it's boring and I just can't care. That doesn't make me shallow, at all. In fact from my POV it kind of makes someone who would judge me as shallow simply because I enjoy talking about a certain reality TV show as pretty shallow themselves.
posted by flex at 6:46 AM on February 9, 2012 [28 favorites]
I am, by all quantitative measures, "smart." I score high on standardized testing, have a high IQ (of course we all know the actual relevance of those two facts, but still, I'm making a point here), know big words, speak a couple foreign languages quite passably, and can geek out with the best of them on a number of topics spanning science, engineering, history, English, etc. I have read Big Important Books, I can watch and understand Big Important Documentaries and Films, etc.
I also have an intellectually demanding job and a volunteer position that becomes a second full-time job during the first half of the year. I answer email from both at all hours of the day and night, take phone calls whenever I need to, network my ass off whenever given the opportunity, and then also do freelance writing when I have some free time.
So what do I do with my very limited actual free time? I read trashy historical fiction and watch silly comedies on Netflix. Lately, since I've gotten engaged, I read trashy wedding blogs and ogle dress galleries. I hate it when someone tries to convince me to watch a Film (tm) or
Some people have outlets for their intellectual interests at their job or at school. Some people don't and thus enjoy it in their free time. There is nothing wrong with either and you shouldn't look down on it on someone handling it differently. As others have said, if you want someone else for whom this is a free-time activity, not a 9-to-5 activity, then THAT might be a dealbreaker. But there's nothing wrong with someone wanting a break after they're done with their day. God knows it's the only way I stay sane.
posted by olinerd at 6:47 AM on February 9, 2012 [9 favorites]
I also have an intellectually demanding job and a volunteer position that becomes a second full-time job during the first half of the year. I answer email from both at all hours of the day and night, take phone calls whenever I need to, network my ass off whenever given the opportunity, and then also do freelance writing when I have some free time.
So what do I do with my very limited actual free time? I read trashy historical fiction and watch silly comedies on Netflix. Lately, since I've gotten engaged, I read trashy wedding blogs and ogle dress galleries. I hate it when someone tries to convince me to watch a Film (tm) or
Some people have outlets for their intellectual interests at their job or at school. Some people don't and thus enjoy it in their free time. There is nothing wrong with either and you shouldn't look down on it on someone handling it differently. As others have said, if you want someone else for whom this is a free-time activity, not a 9-to-5 activity, then THAT might be a dealbreaker. But there's nothing wrong with someone wanting a break after they're done with their day. God knows it's the only way I stay sane.
posted by olinerd at 6:47 AM on February 9, 2012 [9 favorites]
I know a lot of us are reacting because it sounds like you're being judgmental and kind of a snob, and I think that might be valid. But, you also want/need what you want/need in a relationship/partner. It's certainly possible that she's just not it for you.
Sure, you love her. You've been together for six years. That's a long time -- especially if you're both masters students, making you, what, 22 or 23? You got together when you were very young. Sometimes people do grow apart, or realize they aren't as compatible as they want to be, especially as they grow up. That's okay.
I'm not saying you should break up. You clearly have some things to figure out. What you need to work on, I think, is figuring out what you want and whether you can find a solution to the problem you present here. Because as framed right now, there is a problem: you don't respect her views or interests and don't like your current manner of interaction.
posted by J. Wilson at 6:48 AM on February 9, 2012
Sure, you love her. You've been together for six years. That's a long time -- especially if you're both masters students, making you, what, 22 or 23? You got together when you were very young. Sometimes people do grow apart, or realize they aren't as compatible as they want to be, especially as they grow up. That's okay.
I'm not saying you should break up. You clearly have some things to figure out. What you need to work on, I think, is figuring out what you want and whether you can find a solution to the problem you present here. Because as framed right now, there is a problem: you don't respect her views or interests and don't like your current manner of interaction.
posted by J. Wilson at 6:48 AM on February 9, 2012
Wait -- your master's is in cultural studies, and yet you don't want to talk to her about pop culture?
Dude, what you're not seeing is that she could be your master's thesis. If you're not interested in discussing pop culture, I have a feeling exploring how culture disseminates may be the wrong course of study for you.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:55 AM on February 9, 2012 [17 favorites]
Dude, what you're not seeing is that she could be your master's thesis. If you're not interested in discussing pop culture, I have a feeling exploring how culture disseminates may be the wrong course of study for you.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:55 AM on February 9, 2012 [17 favorites]
In fact I am so smart I posted after trailing off in a sentence about Film. Yeah whatever. I'm going to go read some wedding blogs and not give a shit.
posted by olinerd at 6:56 AM on February 9, 2012 [20 favorites]
posted by olinerd at 6:56 AM on February 9, 2012 [20 favorites]
It sounds like you have standards, you understand your wants and needs, and you value emotional honesty and staying true to yourself.
A lot of the time, reading relationship questions on AskMe will make you feel like those are bad things. They're not. An important part of relationships is making you feel fulfilled.
You understand your options. You know that none of them are easy or completely without negatives. But you're mature enough to evaluate them honestly and reach a decision you can live with.
posted by Nomyte at 6:59 AM on February 9, 2012 [6 favorites]
A lot of the time, reading relationship questions on AskMe will make you feel like those are bad things. They're not. An important part of relationships is making you feel fulfilled.
You understand your options. You know that none of them are easy or completely without negatives. But you're mature enough to evaluate them honestly and reach a decision you can live with.
posted by Nomyte at 6:59 AM on February 9, 2012 [6 favorites]
If she's spending all her brain energy on her studies, then it's not surprising that she just wants to indulge in mental junk food. Take a walk on the cheezey pop culture side and let her talk about that stuff.
When she's been less overwhelmed with her studies, has she been more amenable to talking about the stuff that interests you?
posted by rmd1023 at 7:03 AM on February 9, 2012
When she's been less overwhelmed with her studies, has she been more amenable to talking about the stuff that interests you?
posted by rmd1023 at 7:03 AM on February 9, 2012
Mod note: We don't play "ftfy" games here, knock it off please. Thanks.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 7:05 AM on February 9, 2012
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 7:05 AM on February 9, 2012
Do you talk about architecture with her? What happens then?
posted by BibiRose at 7:05 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by BibiRose at 7:05 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
FYI- Architecture is not one of the humanities.
I'm also in a Masters program- in the social sciences- and when I get a chance to talk about something besides my discipline, I go right to marathon training ("fitness"), wondering if House is up on Hulu ("lame TV"), and whatever the latest mild Republican primary scandal is (more "celebrity" than "politics"). My SO thinks I'm interesting and awesome because I can talk about more than just my degree.
posted by thewestinggame at 7:05 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
I'm also in a Masters program- in the social sciences- and when I get a chance to talk about something besides my discipline, I go right to marathon training ("fitness"), wondering if House is up on Hulu ("lame TV"), and whatever the latest mild Republican primary scandal is (more "celebrity" than "politics"). My SO thinks I'm interesting and awesome because I can talk about more than just my degree.
posted by thewestinggame at 7:05 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
When I was doing my MA, I was desperate to talk about anything but my work, to the point where anything remotely intellectually stimulating felt like it took too much energy. It sounds to me like you're the kind of person who constantly wants to talk about your work and your interests and this thing you just read/watched/saw that relates to your studies, and to her, this might be exhausting. You should ask her how she feels. Maybe she doesn't mind listening to you talk while she mindlessly watches tv or something; you'll never know unless you ask.
posted by toerinishuman at 7:26 AM on February 9, 2012
posted by toerinishuman at 7:26 AM on February 9, 2012
I assume you think the particular TV shows she likes are lame and shallow, not that all TV is lame and shallow, right? Because there are a lot of really amazing, deep shows out there (and a lot more that fall on various parts of the spectrum between fluff and profound.) I can't imagine, out of the hundreds of shows past and present, you can't find one you'd both enjoy watching and talking about. Ask her what she likes in TV shows and try to find something along those lines that appeals to you too (hell, make it your next AskMe-- "she likes ABC and I like XYZ, what shows would we both enjoy?" You might be surprised.)
posted by EmilyClimbs at 7:32 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by EmilyClimbs at 7:32 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
I'm wondering how much of this has to do with the things you think about, and how much to do with conversational style. This is one of the things you've posted that struck me:
I made this topic in order for someone, who's perhaps been in a similar situation, to re-think this, and make me change my patterns into a way of recognizing and respecting or changing this, since I don't want to break up this relationship at all.
To me, this is incredibly twisty and unfocused and gives the impression of someone who thinks things through by talking-- or talks instead of thinking. It's incredibly abstract and gives me almost no sense of anything concrete that's actually going on. It starts out sounding very goal-oriented but you get to the end and there's no real summarizable point. (For instance, when you say, "In order for someone to re-think this" do you mean to re-think it for themselves or for you? Do you even know what you mean?)
Now, presumably your girlfriend doesn't mind being with someone who talks that way. But I'm wondering if maybe she can't engage with you to your satisfaction on certain topics because she is not built to converse like that.
posted by BibiRose at 7:33 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
I made this topic in order for someone, who's perhaps been in a similar situation, to re-think this, and make me change my patterns into a way of recognizing and respecting or changing this, since I don't want to break up this relationship at all.
To me, this is incredibly twisty and unfocused and gives the impression of someone who thinks things through by talking-- or talks instead of thinking. It's incredibly abstract and gives me almost no sense of anything concrete that's actually going on. It starts out sounding very goal-oriented but you get to the end and there's no real summarizable point. (For instance, when you say, "In order for someone to re-think this" do you mean to re-think it for themselves or for you? Do you even know what you mean?)
Now, presumably your girlfriend doesn't mind being with someone who talks that way. But I'm wondering if maybe she can't engage with you to your satisfaction on certain topics because she is not built to converse like that.
posted by BibiRose at 7:33 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
I think there could be two different problems at play, and I'm not sure which one you have, or if it's a combo.
Problem one would be different interests. Problem two is lack of intellectual curiosity.
My husband and I have problem one, very different interests - he loves to talk and read about electricity, and how machines work, and data base design. I'm much more interested in painting, and crafts, and supernatural TV shows. But this actually isn't a problem for us - we listen to each other, we share other things in common, and we have some great intersections like a craft group we attend together, me for the knitting and him for the social aspect and beer.
What we don't have is problem two. We are both curious about things that interest us, and read and learn about them continually. So while I may not follow a long explanation of electrical thingies, I totally respect his knowledge and his research on the subject. And he probably doesn't want to hear too much about what just happened on "Lost Girl," but I know he respects my passion.
I guess you need to consider which problem you have, and if it's only problem one, could you work on respecting her interests? Is she passionate about architecture - would she like to talk to you about new things she's learned in her course work?
posted by Squeak Attack at 7:34 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
Problem one would be different interests. Problem two is lack of intellectual curiosity.
My husband and I have problem one, very different interests - he loves to talk and read about electricity, and how machines work, and data base design. I'm much more interested in painting, and crafts, and supernatural TV shows. But this actually isn't a problem for us - we listen to each other, we share other things in common, and we have some great intersections like a craft group we attend together, me for the knitting and him for the social aspect and beer.
What we don't have is problem two. We are both curious about things that interest us, and read and learn about them continually. So while I may not follow a long explanation of electrical thingies, I totally respect his knowledge and his research on the subject. And he probably doesn't want to hear too much about what just happened on "Lost Girl," but I know he respects my passion.
I guess you need to consider which problem you have, and if it's only problem one, could you work on respecting her interests? Is she passionate about architecture - would she like to talk to you about new things she's learned in her course work?
posted by Squeak Attack at 7:34 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
You know, there are lots of reasons why reality tvis hugely popular. Being a cultural studies dude, id have thought you'd have at least a little bit of curiosity as to why.
Basicaly what I'm saying is this: you love your girlfriend. You know she is smart. You know she loves these "shallow" topics. How come you can't figure out a way to respect her interests? Unless maybe you think that all the millions of real houswives viewers are just stupid.
Celebrity culture and our interest in it is incredibly interesting. There is tons of smarty pants books on it. Start there.
posted by Blisterlips at 7:34 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
Basicaly what I'm saying is this: you love your girlfriend. You know she is smart. You know she loves these "shallow" topics. How come you can't figure out a way to respect her interests? Unless maybe you think that all the millions of real houswives viewers are just stupid.
Celebrity culture and our interest in it is incredibly interesting. There is tons of smarty pants books on it. Start there.
posted by Blisterlips at 7:34 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
I'm just posting to a previously asked question that I think is relevent and may help the OP gather additional perspectives.
posted by Wolfster at 7:35 AM on February 9, 2012
posted by Wolfster at 7:35 AM on February 9, 2012
Shakespeare was low culture in his day. He wrote soap operas and bawdy comedies. With perspective, he sure did write some great characters.
I don't really like a strong emphasis on "high" and "low" culture. I think it's a shallow categorization, and implies judgement of whatever portion of culture one doesn't really like. On one hand, people who like high culture are snobs. On the other, folks who like "low" culture are shallow and less intelligent.
Fashion has been an extremely important cultural expression for humans pretty much always. Thinking about ones own fashion in a more day to day way is about patterns and textures and color and balance. It's visual expression.
I'm not sure how fitness is a shallow topic? It's more of a practical topic. And it's pretty fascinating to learn about. I love learning about how the body works, and the ins and outs of nutrition. It's applied biology.
It's also not very nice of you to call shows she likes "lame". You might not like them, but she obviously does. Maybe if you could get yourself to use different language around this stuff it would help you get your mind around it. Everytime you use a judgy word like lame, stop and replace it, or just remind yourself that it's perfectly ok to have interests that are less intellectually demanding.
I'm a pretty intellectual person. I love philosophy and language. I love music and movies. I also LOVE a lot of stuff you'd probably consider lame. I think celebraty culture is fascinating. Both because it's a bit of silly fun, and because thinking about how celebrities relate to their audience, or what the celebreties we choose says about us as a culture. Take Brittney Spears as an example. Not exactly high brow. I like her pop music, but one doesn't have to in order to talk about her in an interesting way. She was a childhood star, you could think about the pressures that involves, what cultural factors lead to that. She had a completely public breakdown. You can think about what led to that, how it must have affected her as a person. She got her shit back together and restarted her career. She's now successful and seems to be strong mentally. Think about what all that means psychologically, what the entire series of events implies. What kinds of questions does it raise? Is this how we treat people as a culture? Is it OK for us to treat celebrities like this? Why or why not?
The world is fascinating. There is so much interesting shit on every level that I'm a bit horrified that my life is going to be too short to think about all of it. Take your interest in philosophy, culture, psychology, and imagine how all of that relates to your girlfriends interests. Those connections are there, and it's not all on her to find them.
As a side note, I've known a couple of architechture majors. She does not have the mental energy to engage complicated topics. I'm sort of surprised she can manage to form coherent sentences that don't relate to her studies. Her brain needs a BREAK. I'm not even involved in studies or demanding work, and sometimes I have to put down the harder novels and read a cheesy lesbian romance novel. Or watch Bring It On for the 50th time.
posted by f_panda at 7:48 AM on February 9, 2012 [7 favorites]
I don't really like a strong emphasis on "high" and "low" culture. I think it's a shallow categorization, and implies judgement of whatever portion of culture one doesn't really like. On one hand, people who like high culture are snobs. On the other, folks who like "low" culture are shallow and less intelligent.
Fashion has been an extremely important cultural expression for humans pretty much always. Thinking about ones own fashion in a more day to day way is about patterns and textures and color and balance. It's visual expression.
I'm not sure how fitness is a shallow topic? It's more of a practical topic. And it's pretty fascinating to learn about. I love learning about how the body works, and the ins and outs of nutrition. It's applied biology.
It's also not very nice of you to call shows she likes "lame". You might not like them, but she obviously does. Maybe if you could get yourself to use different language around this stuff it would help you get your mind around it. Everytime you use a judgy word like lame, stop and replace it, or just remind yourself that it's perfectly ok to have interests that are less intellectually demanding.
I'm a pretty intellectual person. I love philosophy and language. I love music and movies. I also LOVE a lot of stuff you'd probably consider lame. I think celebraty culture is fascinating. Both because it's a bit of silly fun, and because thinking about how celebrities relate to their audience, or what the celebreties we choose says about us as a culture. Take Brittney Spears as an example. Not exactly high brow. I like her pop music, but one doesn't have to in order to talk about her in an interesting way. She was a childhood star, you could think about the pressures that involves, what cultural factors lead to that. She had a completely public breakdown. You can think about what led to that, how it must have affected her as a person. She got her shit back together and restarted her career. She's now successful and seems to be strong mentally. Think about what all that means psychologically, what the entire series of events implies. What kinds of questions does it raise? Is this how we treat people as a culture? Is it OK for us to treat celebrities like this? Why or why not?
The world is fascinating. There is so much interesting shit on every level that I'm a bit horrified that my life is going to be too short to think about all of it. Take your interest in philosophy, culture, psychology, and imagine how all of that relates to your girlfriends interests. Those connections are there, and it's not all on her to find them.
As a side note, I've known a couple of architechture majors. She does not have the mental energy to engage complicated topics. I'm sort of surprised she can manage to form coherent sentences that don't relate to her studies. Her brain needs a BREAK. I'm not even involved in studies or demanding work, and sometimes I have to put down the harder novels and read a cheesy lesbian romance novel. Or watch Bring It On for the 50th time.
posted by f_panda at 7:48 AM on February 9, 2012 [7 favorites]
This and your previous questions indicate to me that you have a hard time going outside yourself or related to people who are not fully on your same personal/intellectual wavelength. You're also quite young and, from the perspective of experience, I can tell you that it takes a long time to learn to relate to people from a different background and intellectual temperament. she's a hardcore architecture major, and it's clear you don't "relate" to that and what it entails.
my girlfriend often talks about celebrities, lame TV shows, fitness, and these kind of things with me, .... I'm in what in broad terms could be called "cultural dissemination" or cultural studies.
I'd have thought that "cultural studies" contains a broad component of discussion of poop culture, including TV and celebrity culture and how it influences us and why people are interested in it. I simply would have assumed that having a background in "cultural studies" meant that you had an understanding and interest in what we call "low culture."
posted by deanc at 7:51 AM on February 9, 2012 [4 favorites]
my girlfriend often talks about celebrities, lame TV shows, fitness, and these kind of things with me, .... I'm in what in broad terms could be called "cultural dissemination" or cultural studies.
I'd have thought that "cultural studies" contains a broad component of discussion of poop culture, including TV and celebrity culture and how it influences us and why people are interested in it. I simply would have assumed that having a background in "cultural studies" meant that you had an understanding and interest in what we call "low culture."
posted by deanc at 7:51 AM on February 9, 2012 [4 favorites]
She doesn't find them stupid, if she is studying hard, and using her brain hard every day these things are a release for her a way to relax, something easy and fun to talk about that don't require much brain effort on her part. She won't be studying forever but right now she is, support her through that.
Good news is it seems pretty normal to me, that's what friends are for, one person can't be everything to another person. My husband loves nothing more than to talk about computer games, after the first hour of that I want to kill him, so now he goes and hangs out with his brother and they geek out for hours on end. I love scrapbooking and crafts, my husband think's I'm just cutting and pasting, I go to crops and talk to other scrapbookers. I love non fiction books, he loves science fiction books. When we do stuff together we focus on the things we both like to do. Maybe find some less mentally strenuous activities you both like to do together while she is studying to help you feel close and go out to coffee with some friends that like to talk about what you like to talk about by yourself sometimes.
posted by wwax at 7:53 AM on February 9, 2012
Good news is it seems pretty normal to me, that's what friends are for, one person can't be everything to another person. My husband loves nothing more than to talk about computer games, after the first hour of that I want to kill him, so now he goes and hangs out with his brother and they geek out for hours on end. I love scrapbooking and crafts, my husband think's I'm just cutting and pasting, I go to crops and talk to other scrapbookers. I love non fiction books, he loves science fiction books. When we do stuff together we focus on the things we both like to do. Maybe find some less mentally strenuous activities you both like to do together while she is studying to help you feel close and go out to coffee with some friends that like to talk about what you like to talk about by yourself sometimes.
posted by wwax at 7:53 AM on February 9, 2012
This has been covered, but I also want to emphasize that for a lot of people, doing something intellectually rigorous during the day means that they need to take an intellectual break from it when they aren't at school / work.
I'm in law school, and I spent a lot of time in class or doing schoolwork. I also spend a lot of free time reading makeup blogs. My girlfriend is a lawyer, and works long hours, but she spends an hour most evenings watching escapist television.
It's not because we are aren't intellectually curious; we both are, or we wouldn't be in law. It's just that the intellectually curious parts of us are fulfilled by our schoolwork/jobs, so we need to spend some of our free time escaping the pressure and doing something totally mindless.
posted by insectosaurus at 7:54 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
I'm in law school, and I spent a lot of time in class or doing schoolwork. I also spend a lot of free time reading makeup blogs. My girlfriend is a lawyer, and works long hours, but she spends an hour most evenings watching escapist television.
It's not because we are aren't intellectually curious; we both are, or we wouldn't be in law. It's just that the intellectually curious parts of us are fulfilled by our schoolwork/jobs, so we need to spend some of our free time escaping the pressure and doing something totally mindless.
posted by insectosaurus at 7:54 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
People are being pretty harsh to the OP.
OP, I have no way of knowing whether your gf is a smart person indulging in some mind-quieting relaxation; or if she's someone who believes reality TV is real and loves to talk about people being fat. I couldn't handle the latter. If you find her conversation boring, well, that's... valid, you know? You've been with her for six years. Only you know whether respect her or not. If you do, then remember we all have goofy habits and flaws. You can indulge her celebrity gossip habit the way she indulges your goofy habits.
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:57 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
OP, I have no way of knowing whether your gf is a smart person indulging in some mind-quieting relaxation; or if she's someone who believes reality TV is real and loves to talk about people being fat. I couldn't handle the latter. If you find her conversation boring, well, that's... valid, you know? You've been with her for six years. Only you know whether respect her or not. If you do, then remember we all have goofy habits and flaws. You can indulge her celebrity gossip habit the way she indulges your goofy habits.
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:57 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
One of my close friends is a professor in college. She's always studying and working on papers. She aboslutely LOVES trashy reality shows and terrible music (my opinion of course). I love to talk about things you do. That's an escape for me. Trashy shows and music is escape for her. So, I respect those lines when communicating with her, so, it's a little gossip with some philosophical edge.
posted by InterestedInKnowing at 8:56 AM on February 9, 2012
posted by InterestedInKnowing at 8:56 AM on February 9, 2012
I think its really important to decouple can't and won't in this situation. Sure these things might be shallow and lowbrow (although an argument could be made about that being snobby) but not wanting to connect with "higher" things doesn't mean she can't.
When you conflate the two it leads to contempt. I'm fairly sure you make choices she thinks are stupid, because we all do at times, but like this is their your choice to make. Only you can decide if you being in a relationship with someone who chooses the same distractions with you is a deal breaker.
posted by SpaceWarp13 at 8:58 AM on February 9, 2012
When you conflate the two it leads to contempt. I'm fairly sure you make choices she thinks are stupid, because we all do at times, but like this is their your choice to make. Only you can decide if you being in a relationship with someone who chooses the same distractions with you is a deal breaker.
posted by SpaceWarp13 at 8:58 AM on February 9, 2012
To a degree it doesn't matter why she likes lame TV shows, celebrity gossip, etc, if you don't want to talk about it, then you don't want to talk about it.
Personally, I would despise "exploring music and film" and "discussing literature". I love talking with my roommate about his PhD work in astrophysics, or with other friends about different computer algorithms, or various pure math topics. Honestly, architecture seems more intellectually rigorous to me so I'd probably rather talk with your girlfriend than you. :-p
But all that is neither here nor there. The question is whether you can find things to talk about that both of you find interesting. Do you ever talk with her about her studies? Surely there are TV shows that both of you would be interested in? Maybe some shared hobby like music or something?
Basically, if you don't want to talk about celebrity gossip, then don't. But don't frame it as a lack of respect or looking down on her for liking it; frame it as something that you just don't want to talk about (in the same way that your topics of choice don't interest your GF), and find something you both find interesting.
posted by losvedir at 9:01 AM on February 9, 2012
Personally, I would despise "exploring music and film" and "discussing literature". I love talking with my roommate about his PhD work in astrophysics, or with other friends about different computer algorithms, or various pure math topics. Honestly, architecture seems more intellectually rigorous to me so I'd probably rather talk with your girlfriend than you. :-p
But all that is neither here nor there. The question is whether you can find things to talk about that both of you find interesting. Do you ever talk with her about her studies? Surely there are TV shows that both of you would be interested in? Maybe some shared hobby like music or something?
Basically, if you don't want to talk about celebrity gossip, then don't. But don't frame it as a lack of respect or looking down on her for liking it; frame it as something that you just don't want to talk about (in the same way that your topics of choice don't interest your GF), and find something you both find interesting.
posted by losvedir at 9:01 AM on February 9, 2012
I was going to write a long thing about how she's burned out and probably too tired from reading and just needs a break for her mind, and then I saw that you were a cultural studies scholar who is shitting on her cultural consumption because it's not the same as yours, and all I have to say is:
go re-read Raymond Williams, and then reconsider your own epistemological and theoretical approach to culture, because it's broken, and you are already behind.
posted by vivid postcard at 9:08 AM on February 9, 2012 [28 favorites]
go re-read Raymond Williams, and then reconsider your own epistemological and theoretical approach to culture, because it's broken, and you are already behind.
posted by vivid postcard at 9:08 AM on February 9, 2012 [28 favorites]
It sounds like you are talking, more generally, about your girlfriend being stupider than you, or at least liking stupid things way more than you do.
If this is true, well, you can either take her or leave her, but don't expect her to change what she talk about much or likes to do in her time off.
It's entirely possible that she's the type who can devote her intellectual resources/capacities to fulfilling a prescribed academic course load, but is not otherwise especially intellectually curious or inclined. There are tons of these people walking around.
Some people don't mind this. If you really do, well, intentionally or not, you're introducing the bunker-buster of relationship bombs into the equation: contempt. Dating someone with a particularly contempt-inducing characteristic is a recipe for disaster. Soooo....
Either decide to practice non-judgement about the things she does that bother you, and to love her unconditionally, or find a partner who is on a similar wavelength to you. You can't change her, only the way you respond to her. Dwelling on her positive qualities may help you drown out the annoyance you feel regarding her interest in low-brow subjects. If that's not possible for you, then maybe she's not the right fit for you.
I'd focus on doing things together that don't involve a lot of talking and get my intellectual kicks elsewhere, or else just leave her, if it were me.
posted by devymetal at 9:23 AM on February 9, 2012
If this is true, well, you can either take her or leave her, but don't expect her to change what she talk about much or likes to do in her time off.
It's entirely possible that she's the type who can devote her intellectual resources/capacities to fulfilling a prescribed academic course load, but is not otherwise especially intellectually curious or inclined. There are tons of these people walking around.
Some people don't mind this. If you really do, well, intentionally or not, you're introducing the bunker-buster of relationship bombs into the equation: contempt. Dating someone with a particularly contempt-inducing characteristic is a recipe for disaster. Soooo....
Either decide to practice non-judgement about the things she does that bother you, and to love her unconditionally, or find a partner who is on a similar wavelength to you. You can't change her, only the way you respond to her. Dwelling on her positive qualities may help you drown out the annoyance you feel regarding her interest in low-brow subjects. If that's not possible for you, then maybe she's not the right fit for you.
I'd focus on doing things together that don't involve a lot of talking and get my intellectual kicks elsewhere, or else just leave her, if it were me.
posted by devymetal at 9:23 AM on February 9, 2012
Hi, I'm your girlfriend. Or rather you were my exboyfriend. Seriously I dated a guy like you for 5 years and throughout the entire time I was working full time as a librarian and eventually added going back to school for a phd in History. He constantly gave me shit about liking "stupid" television like Buffy and whatever version of CSI we are on. He gave me grief about being shallow and spending time playing video games. He lectured me repeatedly on how I bored his friends with my insipid knowledge of popular culture and useless facts.
I'm telling you, the best thing I've ever done was to dump his ass. I didn't want to "elevate" my level of discussion. I didn't want to spend hours being lectured by him after spending hours getting lectured for class. I got so tired of never feeling like I was good enough. Granted, there were other major issues in our relationship, but the biggest was that I got sick of feeling bad about not being the person he wanted.
My husband loves that I love football and video games. He adores my crappy tv shows and shares my love of movies that go boom. Sure, there are some things that he doesn't get like the cheerleader movies or the trashy vampire romance novels. And he does from time to time tease me about getting a phd and liking such lowbrow shit. But he loves me and is proud of me. He knows I'm smart and I no longer feel like I have to prove myself at every turn. As a result, we sometimes talk about smarty pants things and like it. But only if there's nothing good on. :)
posted by teleri025 at 9:26 AM on February 9, 2012 [34 favorites]
I'm telling you, the best thing I've ever done was to dump his ass. I didn't want to "elevate" my level of discussion. I didn't want to spend hours being lectured by him after spending hours getting lectured for class. I got so tired of never feeling like I was good enough. Granted, there were other major issues in our relationship, but the biggest was that I got sick of feeling bad about not being the person he wanted.
My husband loves that I love football and video games. He adores my crappy tv shows and shares my love of movies that go boom. Sure, there are some things that he doesn't get like the cheerleader movies or the trashy vampire romance novels. And he does from time to time tease me about getting a phd and liking such lowbrow shit. But he loves me and is proud of me. He knows I'm smart and I no longer feel like I have to prove myself at every turn. As a result, we sometimes talk about smarty pants things and like it. But only if there's nothing good on. :)
posted by teleri025 at 9:26 AM on February 9, 2012 [34 favorites]
You've described pretty much every relationship I've ever had. My SO likes America's Next Top Model and other retarded reality shows (not Jersey Shore -- that would be a deal breaker). But as long as she's capable of intellectual thought, who cares?
People are all into different stuff; that's what makes them interesting. (Also, people give me shit for liking Buffy and Melrose Place. Fuck 'em.)
posted by coolguymichael at 9:27 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
People are all into different stuff; that's what makes them interesting. (Also, people give me shit for liking Buffy and Melrose Place. Fuck 'em.)
posted by coolguymichael at 9:27 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
For example it took my girlfriend a lot of time to realize how a movie can actually change your output in life; that culture actually has a function beyond mere entertainment or in relation to studying.
I'm not sure what "change your output in life" means, but it sounds to me like (1) you value intellectualism very highly in people and (2) you have very little intellectual respect for her. Neither of those things is necessarily wrong, but you can't force yourself to respect people because you love them; it's backwards. There are relationships that can survive this kind of incompatibility, but they're generally conducted by people who define what they're able to respect in a way that plausibly includes the person they're with. You're attaching adjectives to things she enjoys and care about that are extremely contemptuous ("lame," "shallow") and to you, those are not subjective descriptions but objective ones.
"There's this place where we connect" is the kind of nebulous description of a relationship that always makes me imagine, rightly or wrongly, a relationship that is not going to survive. You seem to be asking how to force yourself to respect her and insisting you don't want to break up with her, but you're also asking whether you should accept that this is what it's going to be like.
I think the answer is that the world is full of people who want nothing to do with pop culture and entertainment -- I hear from them every single day of my life. You will find someone like that who won't bore you to tears talking about things you don't care about, and she will find someone to do more than patiently tolerate her. Everyone deserves better than being bored, and everyone deserves better than being tolerated.
posted by Linda_Holmes at 9:43 AM on February 9, 2012 [7 favorites]
I'm not sure what "change your output in life" means, but it sounds to me like (1) you value intellectualism very highly in people and (2) you have very little intellectual respect for her. Neither of those things is necessarily wrong, but you can't force yourself to respect people because you love them; it's backwards. There are relationships that can survive this kind of incompatibility, but they're generally conducted by people who define what they're able to respect in a way that plausibly includes the person they're with. You're attaching adjectives to things she enjoys and care about that are extremely contemptuous ("lame," "shallow") and to you, those are not subjective descriptions but objective ones.
"There's this place where we connect" is the kind of nebulous description of a relationship that always makes me imagine, rightly or wrongly, a relationship that is not going to survive. You seem to be asking how to force yourself to respect her and insisting you don't want to break up with her, but you're also asking whether you should accept that this is what it's going to be like.
I think the answer is that the world is full of people who want nothing to do with pop culture and entertainment -- I hear from them every single day of my life. You will find someone like that who won't bore you to tears talking about things you don't care about, and she will find someone to do more than patiently tolerate her. Everyone deserves better than being bored, and everyone deserves better than being tolerated.
posted by Linda_Holmes at 9:43 AM on February 9, 2012 [7 favorites]
My guess is that she can tell you think her interests are stupid, and that she's not culturally engaged enough, and that you correct her constantly, or tell her why her views on XYZ are wrong or "not right", and that engaging means her meeting you on your level.
I just got back from a cultural studies / media studies where approximately 80% of the academic papers were on pop culture, 'low' culture, their form of engagement with the world, and what they do for the audiences which love them.
posted by barnone at 9:50 AM on February 9, 2012
I just got back from a cultural studies / media studies where approximately 80% of the academic papers were on pop culture, 'low' culture, their form of engagement with the world, and what they do for the audiences which love them.
posted by barnone at 9:50 AM on February 9, 2012
Nthing the whole: "lowbrow culture can be relaxing when you're devoting so much of your mental efforts to school." I presume that she'll be finished her studies soon, so she'll probably be more willing to engage about "higher level" topics once she is done.
I know that, as I recently started grad school, my level of interest in "high culture" is pretty minimal outside of my studies. Ironically, I find that I watch more TV now than I did before I went back to school, because by the time I'm done studying I just don't have the mental energy to read a good book or watch an art film. (There are exceptions, of course, but this is the general rule for me.)
Your girlfriend is likely the same.
posted by asnider at 9:54 AM on February 9, 2012
I know that, as I recently started grad school, my level of interest in "high culture" is pretty minimal outside of my studies. Ironically, I find that I watch more TV now than I did before I went back to school, because by the time I'm done studying I just don't have the mental energy to read a good book or watch an art film. (There are exceptions, of course, but this is the general rule for me.)
Your girlfriend is likely the same.
posted by asnider at 9:54 AM on February 9, 2012
My husband and I are both smart, educated people. Our interests overlap considerably, but are definitely not a union. I'm a classical musician, he likes butt rock; he's a political wonk, I like fashion and gay shows. But he's willing to come along into my world, and I'm willing to come along into his. This means he sits on the couch with me while I watch RuPaul's Drag Race and catches up on his RSS feed on his phone, or even genuinely watch the Miss America pageant and offer insightful commentary. Mind you, this commentary is often of the tone of "Why does she have a vagina-flower on her shoulder? Do they actually literally tape their boobs together or is that some sort of black magic?" but he's a smart man and he can find things to talk about and angles of interest in nearly anything.
He also comes to some of my concerts, or we attend classical music events together; I once made him come to a show that I was pretty sure he was going to hate, because I had busted my *ass* to learn this work and I wanted him to be there when I performed it. And when the show was done, yeah, he didn't particularly like it or understand it, but he had interesting and intelligent questions to ask.
In other words, assume your girlfriend has good reasons for liking the stuff she likes. And if you don't know what those reasons are? Ask her! You can have a good, engaging conversation on the topic of "I don't understand how a competitive modeling show even WORKS; tell me about these different people and their different strengths and weaknesses." You can respect her enjoyment of these media even if you don't share it, and you might even find some hook by which you can engage yourself, too.
posted by KathrynT at 10:02 AM on February 9, 2012 [5 favorites]
He also comes to some of my concerts, or we attend classical music events together; I once made him come to a show that I was pretty sure he was going to hate, because I had busted my *ass* to learn this work and I wanted him to be there when I performed it. And when the show was done, yeah, he didn't particularly like it or understand it, but he had interesting and intelligent questions to ask.
In other words, assume your girlfriend has good reasons for liking the stuff she likes. And if you don't know what those reasons are? Ask her! You can have a good, engaging conversation on the topic of "I don't understand how a competitive modeling show even WORKS; tell me about these different people and their different strengths and weaknesses." You can respect her enjoyment of these media even if you don't share it, and you might even find some hook by which you can engage yourself, too.
posted by KathrynT at 10:02 AM on February 9, 2012 [5 favorites]
Start reframing this as "She is interested in some things I'm not interested in" rather than getting all BEING INTERESTED IN ALTHUSSER IS JUST PLAIN BETTER THAN BEING INTERESTED IN RUPAUL'S DRAG RACE because a) that shit gets old real fast, and b) the very smartest people I have ever known or spoken with in my life were fascinated by popular culture. For example: I met Jacques Derrida a couple of times, and the longest conversation I ever had with him (and a couple of other fancy Deconstructionist scholars) was about Johnny Hallyday.
From a pragmatic point of view, if you want to get ahead in academia, you'll lose the "I am superior to popular culture" shtick.
posted by Sidhedevil at 10:12 AM on February 9, 2012 [13 favorites]
From a pragmatic point of view, if you want to get ahead in academia, you'll lose the "I am superior to popular culture" shtick.
posted by Sidhedevil at 10:12 AM on February 9, 2012 [13 favorites]
You may have simply outgrown the relationship. You sound young -- you're entitled. Happens all the time and you don't have to feel guilty about it. Just think it over and if you want to move on, be nice and honor the time you've shared.
posted by thinkpiece at 10:22 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by thinkpiece at 10:22 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
I don't want to be a jerk, but I'll just go there in the hope that it might help. You sound a lot like a type of guy I've known well. What I would say that that type is: Talking with your friends about how deep Fight Club is does not make you an intellecutal. Ditto "Kiss Kiss Bang Bang" or any other number of films that many guys think hung the moon but are actually in the shallow end of the culture pool. Ditto "psychology" that is actually just the latest pop psychology journalism from Psychology Today.
Disregard this if you're actually talking about German art house cinema. If not, always, always remember that someone else can culturally out-class you. Doesn't feel great, right? Remember that.
posted by stockpuppet at 10:28 AM on February 9, 2012 [7 favorites]
Disregard this if you're actually talking about German art house cinema. If not, always, always remember that someone else can culturally out-class you. Doesn't feel great, right? Remember that.
posted by stockpuppet at 10:28 AM on February 9, 2012 [7 favorites]
Relationships are a team sport, and not just among yourselves.
I am a software engineer and spend way too much time following politics, history, medical dramas and terrible reality TV. I also appreciate bourbon, smoked meats, sports, craft beers, etc,etc. My relatively easy career choice has afforded me the time to pick up all my interests.
My wife is a surgeon and we were together in college and through residency. Her interests have fallen to the side because of her INSANE career choice. She no longer has much time to follow any politics, pick a favorite beer, thrift store shop, cook, nothing. It is pretty much work and more work and has been that way for twelve years.
What happened? Is this a failure? No, not in the least. I could have easily judged her on her changing and diminished 'interest' in things that I like. I fill in the gaps for her. We tag-team life. We meet up with friends and she talks shop about medical stuff (yawn) and I talk to the spouses not in the medical field about all other things that I find interesting.
Her fellow doctor friends think I am incredibly intelligent and manly. Really, I am just a pretty normal guy, who sits in front of a computer all day, with the ability to soak up and enjoy pop-culture. She loves that she can bring me around anywhere and I have something to talk about and bring to the table. My friends love her and really enjoy what she brings to the table (even the "OMG is Grays Anatomy how it really is?!?"). They don't expect her to know about Snookie, but they also know she won't high brow them if they are talking about it.
She is entirely smarter than me, but it requires me to fill in the gaps and give her the daily run down on Newt and Maddow, then we talk about her day and then we may turn on Parenthood from the DVR and then off to bed.
We are a team and we pick up where the other one falls off.
I don't know how you fix your relationship, it sounds like you are lacking this concept or ability to just play within its bounds. If my wife treated me like a mushroom because I don't get to experience a whipple, nor will I have to tell a family that a loved one will die -- well, I don't know how we would work.
posted by LeanGreen at 11:01 AM on February 9, 2012 [8 favorites]
I am a software engineer and spend way too much time following politics, history, medical dramas and terrible reality TV. I also appreciate bourbon, smoked meats, sports, craft beers, etc,etc. My relatively easy career choice has afforded me the time to pick up all my interests.
My wife is a surgeon and we were together in college and through residency. Her interests have fallen to the side because of her INSANE career choice. She no longer has much time to follow any politics, pick a favorite beer, thrift store shop, cook, nothing. It is pretty much work and more work and has been that way for twelve years.
What happened? Is this a failure? No, not in the least. I could have easily judged her on her changing and diminished 'interest' in things that I like. I fill in the gaps for her. We tag-team life. We meet up with friends and she talks shop about medical stuff (yawn) and I talk to the spouses not in the medical field about all other things that I find interesting.
Her fellow doctor friends think I am incredibly intelligent and manly. Really, I am just a pretty normal guy, who sits in front of a computer all day, with the ability to soak up and enjoy pop-culture. She loves that she can bring me around anywhere and I have something to talk about and bring to the table. My friends love her and really enjoy what she brings to the table (even the "OMG is Grays Anatomy how it really is?!?"). They don't expect her to know about Snookie, but they also know she won't high brow them if they are talking about it.
She is entirely smarter than me, but it requires me to fill in the gaps and give her the daily run down on Newt and Maddow, then we talk about her day and then we may turn on Parenthood from the DVR and then off to bed.
We are a team and we pick up where the other one falls off.
I don't know how you fix your relationship, it sounds like you are lacking this concept or ability to just play within its bounds. If my wife treated me like a mushroom because I don't get to experience a whipple, nor will I have to tell a family that a loved one will die -- well, I don't know how we would work.
posted by LeanGreen at 11:01 AM on February 9, 2012 [8 favorites]
What strikes me reading this question is the element of score-keeping that seems to be underpinning it. There are things YOU like, and things SHE likes, and you're keeping a mental record of whose things are discussed more often. I've been trying for the past couple minutes to come up with a corresponding score for my boyfriend and me, and drawing a blank, because there's no "this is a thing he wants to talk about but I don't"/"this is a thing I want to talk about but he doesn't" divide - our conversations just happen, and they're about whatever.
I mean, yes, there are topics that each of us likes that the other doesn't really get into, but when there's football (his thing) on, I'll sit with my laptop, half-watch the game, and occasionally ask stupid questions (the Superbowl this year wrought, "what? why does the clock matter, if they get a touchdown they can win, why aren't they playing to score?"). When I have a new episode of Glee to watch (my thing), he checks his email, listens to me sing along awkwardly, and occasionally asks stupid questions ("wait, so Santana likes girls, but she had sex with Finn? what?"). There's no sense of "oh, FINE, I'll do you a favor by not screaming in response your singing, but you owe me three sports history conversations in exchange!" when we're doing these things; we're just coexisting, and because we're interested in each other, we're also interested in what the other seems to think is important. I'll never really get why men have an obsession with throwing balls around, and he'll never understand why I sneer at "soap operas" but religiously watch things like Glee, and that doesn't matter, because there are enough "us" things built out of trying to understand each other's "me" things.
Do you and your girlfriend have any "us" things? Is there any gap-bridging at all, or is it "tonight I suppose you can talk about fitness, as long as you don't expect me to listen"? Can you put your finger on why it seems the topic of each conversation is so starkly evident to you, so much so that you can actually define who gets to talk about "their" thing more? I guess what I'm saying is that reading this question made me think you're talking AT each other rather than WITH each other, and I wonder why that is. I don't think the topics are the bottom-line problem here, so much as the inability to actually engage with each other.
posted by badgermushroomSNAKE at 11:26 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
I mean, yes, there are topics that each of us likes that the other doesn't really get into, but when there's football (his thing) on, I'll sit with my laptop, half-watch the game, and occasionally ask stupid questions (the Superbowl this year wrought, "what? why does the clock matter, if they get a touchdown they can win, why aren't they playing to score?"). When I have a new episode of Glee to watch (my thing), he checks his email, listens to me sing along awkwardly, and occasionally asks stupid questions ("wait, so Santana likes girls, but she had sex with Finn? what?"). There's no sense of "oh, FINE, I'll do you a favor by not screaming in response your singing, but you owe me three sports history conversations in exchange!" when we're doing these things; we're just coexisting, and because we're interested in each other, we're also interested in what the other seems to think is important. I'll never really get why men have an obsession with throwing balls around, and he'll never understand why I sneer at "soap operas" but religiously watch things like Glee, and that doesn't matter, because there are enough "us" things built out of trying to understand each other's "me" things.
Do you and your girlfriend have any "us" things? Is there any gap-bridging at all, or is it "tonight I suppose you can talk about fitness, as long as you don't expect me to listen"? Can you put your finger on why it seems the topic of each conversation is so starkly evident to you, so much so that you can actually define who gets to talk about "their" thing more? I guess what I'm saying is that reading this question made me think you're talking AT each other rather than WITH each other, and I wonder why that is. I don't think the topics are the bottom-line problem here, so much as the inability to actually engage with each other.
posted by badgermushroomSNAKE at 11:26 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
Yes, you are being an idiot if you judge all her interests to be stupid. She's in a M.Arch program, she's probably not actually devoid of intellectual interests.
Why not try to find tv & movies that she might enjoy that would also enjoy? This may require you talk to her about interests, and find out what she likes about them.
posted by Heart_on_Sleeve at 11:30 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
Why not try to find tv & movies that she might enjoy that would also enjoy? This may require you talk to her about interests, and find out what she likes about them.
posted by Heart_on_Sleeve at 11:30 AM on February 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
As a female who'd rather date men who like to talk about psychology, physics, and/or music instead of reality TV and who did what in the celebverse, I'd say there's nothing wrong with feeling the way you feel. I find talking about celebrities, TV shows, and fitness pretty mind numbing as well, and don't tend to have many close female friends who talk about those things. Don't get me wrong - I have silly obsessions (anime, mixing nail polish, trying out new recipes, Law & Order, ) but I discuss them in depth with people who care about the those things (yay forums!), not usually the guy I'm with, although I'd expect him to be encouraging and supportive towards those little enjoyable distractions because they make me happy.
Not all women are into that stuff, frankly, and some of these answers trying to make you feel bad about not wanting to share your life with a woman who wants to discuss those things with you on a daily basis (and not her female friends... does she spend much time with a group of girl friends?) are a bit harsh IMO.
Frankly, not everyone is intellectually curious beyond the scope of their field of study or job (and that's okay)! Only you can decide whether intellectual stimulation is indispensable for you in a lifelong relationship with your SO. You're going to be spending a lot of time with this woman over the course of your life, and if you don't manage to have a good time together, it indicates there might be other compatibility issues besides a lack of common interests.
posted by sunnychef88 at 11:33 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
Not all women are into that stuff, frankly, and some of these answers trying to make you feel bad about not wanting to share your life with a woman who wants to discuss those things with you on a daily basis (and not her female friends... does she spend much time with a group of girl friends?) are a bit harsh IMO.
Frankly, not everyone is intellectually curious beyond the scope of their field of study or job (and that's okay)! Only you can decide whether intellectual stimulation is indispensable for you in a lifelong relationship with your SO. You're going to be spending a lot of time with this woman over the course of your life, and if you don't manage to have a good time together, it indicates there might be other compatibility issues besides a lack of common interests.
posted by sunnychef88 at 11:33 AM on February 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
I can relate to your problem, but we're both wrong. ;) Do you spend a lot of time talking to people in your program? I have this problem with my bf. I'm in my 3rd year studying clinical psychology and basically I talk psychology/philosophy all day, do therapy with clients, and spend a lot of time thinking about the human condition. Then I come home and expect my bf to want to talk about phenomenological approach to experience with me too, and he rolls his eyes. My bf is an intelligent guy, but he's in his own discipline and isn't immersed in these ideas in the ways that I am. I just see people in my program as the people to talk about this with, they're as excited about it and immersed in it as me! My bf is there to have a different sort of relationship with, and talk about different things. He's also great for getting me out of my head and taking me on adventures. Instead of wishing your gf was someone she's not, maybe appreciate what she offers that you couldn't get by chatting after class with a classmate?
posted by amileighs at 2:23 PM on February 9, 2012
posted by amileighs at 2:23 PM on February 9, 2012
I'll come in like stockpuppet and be the jerk as well.
She is going to be an architect. You are in cultural studies.
She works hard in a hard discipline. You wax lyrically over cultural events.
She is tired from thinking so hard. You just don't stop waxing lyrically.
She will design buildings. You'll ask if you want fries with that.
I keed, I keed, I keed . . .
In reality it speaks to a different struggle that I find in society as a whole. See I am a medicinal chemist doing a postdoc at a university. It is very fun and very challenging, but I can't really talk to anyone outside the field about it because people just say that it is wicked hard (yep) and they couldn't understand it (yep well without a multi year crash course in chemistry yep I could explain the basics to nearly anyone who is interested but to actually understand it would take a lot of time to get up to speed). I understand the fact that many people don't understand what I do and have come to live with teh fact that I can't just babble on about it to everyone. I also know that I can get stuck on an idea and end up leaping from simple concepts to difficult concepts with little regard for if the other people are understanding. I come from a difficult technical background understanding of things, so I try not to wander into that realm often.
Conversely when you head to an intellectual dinner party people get upset if you won't talk about the deeper meaning of this, the philosophical implications of that, even though it is their area of research you are expected to be up to speed on it because it falls under the umbrella of culture. All learned people are expected to have an opinion and know about certain things because they are part of the shared culture, which you study. This to me is completely unfair I don't go around asking people what they think about this route in stereoselective synthesis versus a different route, but I have to know about what certain people consider important culture.
You've heard the I don't know art, but I know what I like quote before, well it applies to other cultural events as well.
posted by koolkat at 5:02 AM on February 10, 2012 [2 favorites]
She is going to be an architect. You are in cultural studies.
She works hard in a hard discipline. You wax lyrically over cultural events.
She is tired from thinking so hard. You just don't stop waxing lyrically.
She will design buildings. You'll ask if you want fries with that.
I keed, I keed, I keed . . .
In reality it speaks to a different struggle that I find in society as a whole. See I am a medicinal chemist doing a postdoc at a university. It is very fun and very challenging, but I can't really talk to anyone outside the field about it because people just say that it is wicked hard (yep) and they couldn't understand it (yep well without a multi year crash course in chemistry yep I could explain the basics to nearly anyone who is interested but to actually understand it would take a lot of time to get up to speed). I understand the fact that many people don't understand what I do and have come to live with teh fact that I can't just babble on about it to everyone. I also know that I can get stuck on an idea and end up leaping from simple concepts to difficult concepts with little regard for if the other people are understanding. I come from a difficult technical background understanding of things, so I try not to wander into that realm often.
Conversely when you head to an intellectual dinner party people get upset if you won't talk about the deeper meaning of this, the philosophical implications of that, even though it is their area of research you are expected to be up to speed on it because it falls under the umbrella of culture. All learned people are expected to have an opinion and know about certain things because they are part of the shared culture, which you study. This to me is completely unfair I don't go around asking people what they think about this route in stereoselective synthesis versus a different route, but I have to know about what certain people consider important culture.
You've heard the I don't know art, but I know what I like quote before, well it applies to other cultural events as well.
posted by koolkat at 5:02 AM on February 10, 2012 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: All right guys..... The main thing is the honesty here; I'm honest about myself and this honesty shows a lesser sympathetic side of me that I'm aware of and want to change. A lot of guys here really don't like that, it seems. But we all have these sides, or what? I really hope that all those posters that just scorn me are as perfect themselves as their negative and insulting posts imply. I don't understand why you get "mean" just because I actually am honest about a negative aspect of myself. Either try to help and be sympathetic or don't write at all. I already write in the topic head that I might be an idiot. But I also write that I want to change this and get a new way of looking at this. About 33% of the posts attack my person anyway, and don't come up with anything constructive. Those 33%: You wasted both your and my time, but I hope you feel real good about yourself (BTW consider your own motivation for posting...).
Again: I wanted to hear about shared experiences and get constructive input. A lot of these answers are really great and have helped me rethink the whole thing. I had a conversation with my girlfriend about this yesterday and told her that I'm sorry I can be such an idiot sometimes about this, and that I understand she needs to zone out to these things.
I don't even know why I bother answering to the insults, but I just want to clarify that I might perhaps not fit into some weird box you insulters want to place me in:
I'm not into Fight Club. I enjoy anything from Bergman to silly hollywood comedies to obscure horror movies. I read trash literature, I read Ulysses. I watch TV like Six Feet Under (we watched it together which was a great experience) cooking shows, The Shield, The Wire etc. etc... Actually it's very very few things that I won't watch, mainly Reality TV, and celebrity worshipping TV; something I find repulsive as a cultural phenomenon. I'm well aware that guys like Slavoj Zizek and Derrida among others have a lot to say about "popular culture" - hell everyone writes about these phenomenons nowadays, which is precisely one of the reasons I'm sick of talking about it. But as far as I'm aware, the iGeneration, celibrity culture, etc. don't get that many positive words from these guys. Perhaps I'm wrong. I can see it can be interesting from a theoretical point of view, as a phenomenon in society, but it's all over the place, taking the whole focus away from a lot of other subjects. And my belief that all these reality shows, celibrity/model worshipping, is a negative thing, might be why I react as I do when these topics get talked about a lot.
The insult about my language: Thanks, but I'm a European so I can accept that I make a mistake once or twice with the english language.
I thought the users of Metafilter were above this to be honest.
You also have to seperate my dislike for these subjects and talking about them a lot, from the idea that I despise or dislike my own girlfriend - come on. I love her and respect her as a person. This whole post was about this surprising negativity in me, when she talks about these topics. I surprise myself with this reaction - and again, I learned a lot from the good answers here, and I've come to a realization that I should back off and respect that we can talk about these things, and that it's me that has to change my attitude towards this.
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 7:57 AM on February 10, 2012 [3 favorites]
Again: I wanted to hear about shared experiences and get constructive input. A lot of these answers are really great and have helped me rethink the whole thing. I had a conversation with my girlfriend about this yesterday and told her that I'm sorry I can be such an idiot sometimes about this, and that I understand she needs to zone out to these things.
I don't even know why I bother answering to the insults, but I just want to clarify that I might perhaps not fit into some weird box you insulters want to place me in:
I'm not into Fight Club. I enjoy anything from Bergman to silly hollywood comedies to obscure horror movies. I read trash literature, I read Ulysses. I watch TV like Six Feet Under (we watched it together which was a great experience) cooking shows, The Shield, The Wire etc. etc... Actually it's very very few things that I won't watch, mainly Reality TV, and celebrity worshipping TV; something I find repulsive as a cultural phenomenon. I'm well aware that guys like Slavoj Zizek and Derrida among others have a lot to say about "popular culture" - hell everyone writes about these phenomenons nowadays, which is precisely one of the reasons I'm sick of talking about it. But as far as I'm aware, the iGeneration, celibrity culture, etc. don't get that many positive words from these guys. Perhaps I'm wrong. I can see it can be interesting from a theoretical point of view, as a phenomenon in society, but it's all over the place, taking the whole focus away from a lot of other subjects. And my belief that all these reality shows, celibrity/model worshipping, is a negative thing, might be why I react as I do when these topics get talked about a lot.
The insult about my language: Thanks, but I'm a European so I can accept that I make a mistake once or twice with the english language.
I thought the users of Metafilter were above this to be honest.
You also have to seperate my dislike for these subjects and talking about them a lot, from the idea that I despise or dislike my own girlfriend - come on. I love her and respect her as a person. This whole post was about this surprising negativity in me, when she talks about these topics. I surprise myself with this reaction - and again, I learned a lot from the good answers here, and I've come to a realization that I should back off and respect that we can talk about these things, and that it's me that has to change my attitude towards this.
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 7:57 AM on February 10, 2012 [3 favorites]
I can see it can be interesting from a theoretical point of view, as a phenomenon in society, but it's all over the place, taking the whole focus away from a lot of other subjects. And my belief that all these reality shows, celibrity/model worshipping, is a negative thing, might be why I react as I do when these topics get talked about a lot.
When we're in our early 20s, we tend to be kind of self-righteous and obsessed about our own concerns, and then once we get older, the edge totally comes off. It's perfectly fine to joke around saying that Jersey Shore is "Everything That's Wrong With America"™, but crying that this sort of thing is "all over the place, taking the whole focus away from a lot of other subjects" just makes you sound like a self-righteous stick in the mud. We all have our vices. Allow your girlfriend to indulge in hers. If she were the one calling you shallow and "taking yourself to seriously" because you didn't have any interest in celebrity culture and reality shows, then she'd be the bad guy, but I don't get the impression that this is what's happening here.
For the record, I don't watch reality shows, but if you can't make a joke about or laugh at someone saying, "Ever since Kim Kardashian and Kris Humphries divorced, I just can't believe in true love, anymore!" then you have no soul.
posted by deanc at 8:58 AM on February 10, 2012
When we're in our early 20s, we tend to be kind of self-righteous and obsessed about our own concerns, and then once we get older, the edge totally comes off. It's perfectly fine to joke around saying that Jersey Shore is "Everything That's Wrong With America"™, but crying that this sort of thing is "all over the place, taking the whole focus away from a lot of other subjects" just makes you sound like a self-righteous stick in the mud. We all have our vices. Allow your girlfriend to indulge in hers. If she were the one calling you shallow and "taking yourself to seriously" because you didn't have any interest in celebrity culture and reality shows, then she'd be the bad guy, but I don't get the impression that this is what's happening here.
For the record, I don't watch reality shows, but if you can't make a joke about or laugh at someone saying, "Ever since Kim Kardashian and Kris Humphries divorced, I just can't believe in true love, anymore!" then you have no soul.
posted by deanc at 8:58 AM on February 10, 2012
I'm in your situation (in my case: the bachelor, glee, jersey shore), but I just listen (in an attempt to grok it), nod, and smile and occasionally ask questions to show her that I'm engaged (and I genuinely am despite this candid explanation). She does the same for me when I talk about the latest project euler problem or whatever other programming escapade I'm into at the moment so I figure I owe it to her to do the same.
This stuff is fun/important to her in the same way that the media and activities you partake in are fun/important to you. So give it the same level of respect. Doesn't she do this for you? Or if you can't do that (or if she refuses to do that for you)... leave.
On the other hand, I do tend to get a little bit "grar" about this stuff if she begs and whines about getting me to watch it with her and I give in. But the root of my bad feelings are more about her nagging than the media itself. I mean, it's not like I try to make her learn programming or anything! (... although I try and get her to learn to take care of her own problems with technology and this might be equivalent.) This is a separate issue, but perhaps this is also what's happening in your situation?
posted by symbollocks at 9:25 AM on February 10, 2012 [1 favorite]
This stuff is fun/important to her in the same way that the media and activities you partake in are fun/important to you. So give it the same level of respect. Doesn't she do this for you? Or if you can't do that (or if she refuses to do that for you)... leave.
On the other hand, I do tend to get a little bit "grar" about this stuff if she begs and whines about getting me to watch it with her and I give in. But the root of my bad feelings are more about her nagging than the media itself. I mean, it's not like I try to make her learn programming or anything! (... although I try and get her to learn to take care of her own problems with technology and this might be equivalent.) This is a separate issue, but perhaps this is also what's happening in your situation?
posted by symbollocks at 9:25 AM on February 10, 2012 [1 favorite]
My husband and I have many different interests and some common ones. We have rules about what topics each of us is willing to talk about. He is a musician and early in our relationship would bore me tears with very technical discussions about music theory, the science of recording music, blah, blah, blah... I couldn't stand it and I told him so. He also loves mechanics of all sorts and if I let him, he would talk about this non-stop. I have some of my own interests that I could drone on and on about. At this point we know which topics of conversation are "acceptable" and which aren't.
The way we make this work is largely due to the fact that we still have a ton of other things to talk about, such as the character motivation behind Vic Mackey. We do occasionally slip up and talk about things that the other person isn't interested in. When that happens we usually catch ourselves early on and apologize and then change the subject. Or if that doesn't happen, we allow the other person to complete their thought and then say "I can't discuss this with you". No one's feelings get hurt, we know each other quite well and love and respect each other very much.
There is nothing wrong with disliking reality tv. I pretty much despise it myself, but I have been known to sit through marathon sessions of The Biggest Loser when I am at my mother's house, because I can enjoy that particular show and my mother likes it. However if my husband is around, we would not do this. It would be basically torture for him.
Sometimes part of showing respect for a person, is knowing them well enough to NOT subject them to things that they dislike.
posted by citizngkar at 9:25 AM on February 10, 2012
The way we make this work is largely due to the fact that we still have a ton of other things to talk about, such as the character motivation behind Vic Mackey. We do occasionally slip up and talk about things that the other person isn't interested in. When that happens we usually catch ourselves early on and apologize and then change the subject. Or if that doesn't happen, we allow the other person to complete their thought and then say "I can't discuss this with you". No one's feelings get hurt, we know each other quite well and love and respect each other very much.
There is nothing wrong with disliking reality tv. I pretty much despise it myself, but I have been known to sit through marathon sessions of The Biggest Loser when I am at my mother's house, because I can enjoy that particular show and my mother likes it. However if my husband is around, we would not do this. It would be basically torture for him.
Sometimes part of showing respect for a person, is knowing them well enough to NOT subject them to things that they dislike.
posted by citizngkar at 9:25 AM on February 10, 2012
I don't understand why you get "mean" just because I actually am honest about a negative aspect of myself.
My intention wasn't to be mean for the sake of being mean, it really wasn't. I was trying to get across the point to you that some people put "obscure horror movies" and "reality TV" in the same box. There's an artificial divide between your interests and hers because the line for "lowbrow" and "highbrow" is arbitrary depending on who you ask. You're interested in a wide array of movies, books, etc., so why is it so hard for you to accept reality tv? That's very strange to me- the more open-minded and curious you claim to be, the less any one show or aspect of media culture should be a problem or "beneath" you, right?
I wanted to make another point as well- honestly, remember that these people are taking your money. Movies, TV shows and advertising, and books are all products being sold. You are probably aware of that at the back of your mind, but the implication is that it's all designed to psychologically appeal to you to some extent for the sake of you opening your wallet. Not just "lofty ideas" - and many directors even know of your hunger for ideas and exploit that to, guess what, take your money. I'm sorry that I lumped you in with the quintessential example of this- the stereotype of the 'High Fidelity" type guy who obsessively judges others based on media consumption. You're being bought and sold if you let that define you. While I think widespread media consumption is a nice hobby, it also comes down to time and money to some degree.
My point was that someone from a very removed height might look down on what you're doing and what she's doing and really not see much difference. It's all perspective.
posted by stockpuppet at 2:36 PM on February 10, 2012
My intention wasn't to be mean for the sake of being mean, it really wasn't. I was trying to get across the point to you that some people put "obscure horror movies" and "reality TV" in the same box. There's an artificial divide between your interests and hers because the line for "lowbrow" and "highbrow" is arbitrary depending on who you ask. You're interested in a wide array of movies, books, etc., so why is it so hard for you to accept reality tv? That's very strange to me- the more open-minded and curious you claim to be, the less any one show or aspect of media culture should be a problem or "beneath" you, right?
I wanted to make another point as well- honestly, remember that these people are taking your money. Movies, TV shows and advertising, and books are all products being sold. You are probably aware of that at the back of your mind, but the implication is that it's all designed to psychologically appeal to you to some extent for the sake of you opening your wallet. Not just "lofty ideas" - and many directors even know of your hunger for ideas and exploit that to, guess what, take your money. I'm sorry that I lumped you in with the quintessential example of this- the stereotype of the 'High Fidelity" type guy who obsessively judges others based on media consumption. You're being bought and sold if you let that define you. While I think widespread media consumption is a nice hobby, it also comes down to time and money to some degree.
My point was that someone from a very removed height might look down on what you're doing and what she's doing and really not see much difference. It's all perspective.
posted by stockpuppet at 2:36 PM on February 10, 2012
I really wanted to help you until I read your last response in this thread. Consider, while adjusting your attitude, thinking about adjusting your communication style to be less condescending and defensive -- I personally find that kind of communication style to be off-putting even when it's a topic I'm interested in. While I've never heard you speak I have no idea if that's how you come across in real life... but still, something to consider.
posted by sm1tten at 10:03 AM on February 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by sm1tten at 10:03 AM on February 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Ok guys I learned a lot from this topic and replies. I still have one follow-up:
Perhaps this whole thing is actually about, that my girlfriend has been so busy, that she hasn't been integrated in my life outside our home - and vice verca. The life outside our home is a life I care a LOT about as well. We've both grown these years as persons. I have projects going, and I know quite a lot of people. But my girlfriend hasn't been a part of this development, and now it's like I live two different lives. And when I get home I can't talk about a lot of the things that really mean a lot to me. But I'm used to be able to talk about these things with most other people I'm with. We can talk about lots of other things, which is great, but I really want to talk about these things with her too, and not just the things we have in common. I also want her to talk more about the things she's interested in, so our worlds can sort of, re-unite, to be a bit dramatic. I feel like shit when I connect with others because of general common interests, but can't speak with her about these things. Then I get confused, sad, and feel more a home with "the others". And since she hasn't been part of this circle, the two spheres feel even more seperated. And I haven't been proven wrong since she doesn't have the time to participate.
And that's when all these things that remind me of our differences come in, and I started to be a bit of an asshole. I basically got angry because it cemented our differences and made me feel even more at home when I'm out with everyone else.....
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 1:02 PM on March 4, 2012
Perhaps this whole thing is actually about, that my girlfriend has been so busy, that she hasn't been integrated in my life outside our home - and vice verca. The life outside our home is a life I care a LOT about as well. We've both grown these years as persons. I have projects going, and I know quite a lot of people. But my girlfriend hasn't been a part of this development, and now it's like I live two different lives. And when I get home I can't talk about a lot of the things that really mean a lot to me. But I'm used to be able to talk about these things with most other people I'm with. We can talk about lots of other things, which is great, but I really want to talk about these things with her too, and not just the things we have in common. I also want her to talk more about the things she's interested in, so our worlds can sort of, re-unite, to be a bit dramatic. I feel like shit when I connect with others because of general common interests, but can't speak with her about these things. Then I get confused, sad, and feel more a home with "the others". And since she hasn't been part of this circle, the two spheres feel even more seperated. And I haven't been proven wrong since she doesn't have the time to participate.
And that's when all these things that remind me of our differences come in, and I started to be a bit of an asshole. I basically got angry because it cemented our differences and made me feel even more at home when I'm out with everyone else.....
posted by Lotsofcoffee at 1:02 PM on March 4, 2012
It sounds, then, like you have a different problem -- or that you maybe just needed to frame it in a different way.
What I mean is: there's a difference between "my problem is that I can't talk to my girlfriend because I think the stuff she cares about is stupid" and "my problem is that I feel like my girlfriend and I are growing in two different directions, and I'd like us to feel like we're a team again."
I'd bet if you came to your girlfriend with that second framing and talked to HER about it that way, that may be a very good conversation for the two of you. Good luck.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 2:46 PM on March 4, 2012 [2 favorites]
What I mean is: there's a difference between "my problem is that I can't talk to my girlfriend because I think the stuff she cares about is stupid" and "my problem is that I feel like my girlfriend and I are growing in two different directions, and I'd like us to feel like we're a team again."
I'd bet if you came to your girlfriend with that second framing and talked to HER about it that way, that may be a very good conversation for the two of you. Good luck.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 2:46 PM on March 4, 2012 [2 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by orange swan at 5:28 AM on February 9, 2012 [1 favorite]