High-rise living

July 2, 2005 1:03 PM

Aside from longer elevator rides, are they any less obvious drawbacks to living on the 23rd floor of a 23-floor apartment building -- as opposed to, say, the 10th or 15th?

Living on the first few stories means practically climbable stairs, and a a plausible out-the-window escape in case of fire. But beyond the 5th or 6th floor, is there anything else to lose?

posted by onshi to home & garden (24 comments total)

check to make sure you're not responsible for leaks in the roof (and make sure that whoever is responsible - some kind of owner's association, i guess - is active and has funds in the bank). ditto for who is responsible for the lift (since you're more reliable on it that somone lower down).

apart from that, you should be ok. being on the top floor is typically quieter (no-one walking on the ceiling). earthquakes are more, errr, interesting, but i don't think it's any more dangerous than being on a lower floor (if the worst happens, you get to crush the people below you).

hmmm. although you might consider finding out how high the local fire rescue ladders reach.
posted by andrew cooke at 1:15 PM on July 2, 2005

You'd think it would be quieter. True, nobody's stomping around upstairs. But when I lived on the top floor of a twelve-story building my experience was the antennae and such up on the roof creaked and made peculiar noises when it was windy (which it usually is when you're up in a highrise). Also it becomes tedious knowing your elevator ride will always be the longest. But, love that view!

With some people, that sliding-glass door leading to the open balcony can become an annoying distraction, if you're feeling at all suicidal.
posted by Rash at 1:23 PM on July 2, 2005

If you have dogs (or plan to get some,) you might come across problems with them peeing in the hallways or elevators 'cause they're too excited to hold it for 23 floors when you take them out for a walk.

Lugging groceries and other items, week in/week out soon turns into a dreadful process as well.
posted by icontemplate at 1:25 PM on July 2, 2005

When the power fails pumps that provide your water supply can also fail. I think the 10th floor is too high for that too.
posted by Chuckles at 1:31 PM on July 2, 2005

Not just longer elevator rides -- you become more reliant on the elevator. Elevators are complex hardware with lots of moving parts, so they are prone to malfunction, and any service downtime is going to be hell. Of course, a 23+-floor building might have redundant elevators to increase uptime, and might have service contracts that ensure speedier repair than smaller buildings; but it's still a liability.
posted by gentle at 1:40 PM on July 2, 2005

Fire Alarms. You may have gravity on your side, but walking down that many floors suuuuccckkks. Harder on the legs than you'd think.

Power malfunctions. You're walking up 23 flights of stairs.

And you won't have any water when you get up there until the power is restored. The lower floors will still have water pressure, but electric pumps are used to get the water to the upper floors. (On preview, Chuckles said that already.)

And then there's the simmering resentment of those on lower floors who use the elevator, which is somehow amplified/seems justified when you're on the very top floor. If you're prone to irritation/rage, you may soon hate everyone who uses the elevator and irrationally fantasize about having the damn thing to yourself for a change.

On the other hand, it's neat to be at the top.
posted by desuetude at 2:37 PM on July 2, 2005

As someone who's been serious leaked on, I'd be upfront in asking whether there's a history of leaks, and what was done about them. If there haven't been problems for 3+ years then it's probably not a problem.

Huh, the person I know in Ontario with your name is someone else.
posted by Aknaton at 2:48 PM on July 2, 2005

What kind of shithole is onshi moving in to where complete elevator shutdowns and power failures are regular problems?
posted by punishinglemur at 3:03 PM on July 2, 2005

Living above the first 5-6 floors really detaches you from the surrounding neighbourhood, too. On the 5th floor, the stuff happening below your balcony and out your windows is stuff around you, but on the 20th story it might as well be in the next neighbourhood over. If the building isn't in a particularly vibrant local neighbourhood that might be fine, but if you're moving somewhere because of the neighbourhood don't inadvertently move out of it vertically.

Also, at 20 stories up you'll notice the building moving a bit in heavy winds. That might or might not bother you.

Lastly, if you're paying for heat and living someplace with a real winter, the top floor will be harder to heat because you don't have the extra 100 feet of insulation above you that a lower apartment would have.
posted by mendel at 3:04 PM on July 2, 2005

detachment can be an advantage too, if your neighbourhood is "too vibrant".

you might see if you can look at the roof - we bought a top floor flat (not as high as this!) and it was a big help to me being able to see that it had recently been re-covered (although not so recently that it hadn't rained since...).
posted by andrew cooke at 3:09 PM on July 2, 2005

Thanks for your answers. I don't think anyone would call the neighborhood vibrant, no, and while Toronto winters are indeed real, the heat/hydro/electricity is included in the rent.

I guess the flipside (and some of you have hit this) is, are there any unexpected bonuses to being so high? After a couple of years spent living at street level, I'm sure I won't miss being woken up by passing busses, trucks, and street sweepers at 5am.
posted by onshi at 4:04 PM on July 2, 2005

two other thoughts.

Higher floors have easier heating problems (except the top floor). Higher floors have it a bit harder cooling in the summer (especially the top floor).

I live on the 11th floor, and we've had the occasioinal fire drill/real fire. Without power, 11 floors can be hard to climb...or healthy exercise. But in a real fire it would be difficult to get off the 11th floor (especially at certain parts of the building.)
posted by filmgeek at 4:08 PM on July 2, 2005

Advantages: If you have access to your roof (unlikely) or can gain unauthorized access (More likely, although being so high up the roof probably won't be part of your building's fire escape route.), you can have a sweet party. Just make friendly with your neighbors on the top floor so there's no noise complaints, and get keg beer instead of bottles, so people can't throw glass off.
posted by TheOnlyCoolTim at 5:22 PM on July 2, 2005

Depending on...well, a zillion factors that I'm not scientific enough to explain the physics of...you may not be able count on not being woken up by street noise. I was amazed at how much sound could travel up to the 17th floor. The dumpsters full of glass from the nearby bar being dumped...jackhammers for construction, car alarms, drunken yelled conversations at 3 am...all sounded pretty much like they were outside my window.
posted by desuetude at 5:47 PM on July 2, 2005

filmgeek's insight is important. Heat rises. On the fifth floor of many dorms around here people keep their windows open in the very cold winter because of all the residual heat rising. I've even seen some with fans going in 20 degree (F) weather.
posted by ontic at 6:11 PM on July 2, 2005

Fire department ladders, in Canada and the US, can reach between 75' and 100' (some cities have 95' and 110'). On the 23rd floor you are going to be out of luck.

Be careful if you ever have to use the fire escape. This article [pdf] details how many fire escapes are structurally unsafe because of rust and corrosion.

A more important consideration is, are there sprinklers in the building? Are there sprinklers in the common hallways? And are they working/turned on? Don’t laugh – there have been fatal fires where it was later determined that the sprinklers were turned off while construction work was being done and never turned back on.

Make sure your building is in compliance with the Ontario law that requires "fire safety plans" are available for the fire department in the lobby of the building.

The construction of your building is an important consideration. High rise buildings are made of concrete and a fire in an apartment or a floor will “usually” be contained. Sometimes it is more dangerous to flee your apartment than it is to remain inside it.

If there is ever a fire in your building, it will be important to listen to the instructions that are broadcast over your apartment intercom. It may be a fire that is being successfully extinguished by the fire department, but a door from a fire floor may have been propped open by a fleeing resident allowing a deadly combination of heat and smoke to fill the stairwell.

After September 11, 2001, many people unfamiliar with firefighting will tell you, “people who listened to the instructions and remained in the tower died”. That is true. In a “normal” (i.e., a fire that does not involve a jet crashing into a building) fire scenario, however, people fleeing high rise fires have died after being overcome by heat and smoke in stairwells.

There are a number of factors concerning your building that I am not familiar with. What you should do is talk with someone from the fire department in your area and ask them to address these questions.
posted by MLIS at 7:09 PM on July 2, 2005

In summer it gets really hot on the top floor of a high rise, mostly because of all that sun on the roof. Also, your balcony may be uncovered and thus will get rained on. For these reasons, I would try for the second-highest floor instead. The view is just as nice from there.
posted by blue grama at 8:38 PM on July 2, 2005

My experience leads me to believe that you will have the best view from the 16th to 18th floors. The 27th floor was so high that you could not enjoy the view without standing up / walking to the balcony.

With regards to noise, it will be better than ground floors but you will still hear trucks and motorcycles (especially late at night when people tend to speed).

Depending on how your building is designed, you may have problems with high winds (i.e. if you open the front door while balcony doors are opened wide the rush of wind may scatter things a bit).

I wouldn't worry about the elevator. Tall buildings usually have more than one and it is VERY rare for all of them to be out of service at the same time (I've only had it happen once and even then it was back online within fifteen minutes).

I wouldn't worry too much about fires, either. While you should follow MLIS's excellent advice about checking with the fire department, fires are a risk one takes whenever one lives on a floor that can't be reached by a fire truck ladder. You will have to decide whether the risks are worth the benefits.

You will not have to worry about insects any more. I have found that mosquitos are rare at higher floors and cockroaches are non-existent (then again, if you live in Ontario you've probably never even seen a cockroach). :)

You will, however, have to worry about break-ins. Anyone with access to the roof would have access to top floor apartments.
posted by cup at 10:09 PM on July 2, 2005

punishinglemur: What kind of shithole is onshi moving in to where complete elevator shutdowns and power failures are regular problems?

It isn't about how regular it is. Some people in Toronto got caught for a couple of days without water when the blackout happened. While it isn't exactly life and death, I would prefer to avoid that inconvenience. I think the odds of a similar blackout in the next twenty years are about 50/50... It certainly isn't a major problem, but it is something worth considering.

And shithole? Some buildings actually had generators, I would guess that those are the shitholes. The fancy condos built in the last ten years sure didn't have generators! (okay, maybe the generators in the shitholes didn't work, that would make it the well maintained 40 year old buildings that had the functioning generators... Maybe somebody has more info on this).

cup: You will not have to worry about insects any more. I have found that mosquitos are rare at higher floors and cockroaches are non-existent (then again, if you live in Ontario you've probably never even seen a cockroach). :)

Understand that I choose basements because of the economics involved. However, I can remember seeing a dead roach carcass while reviewing an apartment somewhere between the 10th and 20th floor, in Toronto.
posted by Chuckles at 10:29 PM on July 2, 2005

The higher up you are, the further the paper airplanes fly.
posted by five fresh fish at 12:10 AM on July 3, 2005

I read studies back in the 90s that suggested that children who live on higher floors tend to be healthier and do better in school. They hypothesis was that it's quieter, and less poluted than at ground level. But it's been a good long time since I read them, so they may have been disproved by now.
posted by jacquilynne at 9:33 AM on July 3, 2005

the comments about the power and water are not always true, many high rise buildings have a very large storage tank of the roof that provides water and water pressure without the pump, now if hte power is out for a long time and the pump to get water into the tank can not work after its empty.. then you have a problem, but that would be a prolonged power outtage.

23rd floor is nothing, When i was in NYC I had clients living on the 50th, 60th, and up! Try living on the 93rd and tell me about elevator rides! Its actually kinda scary.. Ony client of mine was on the 53rd and her windows aroudn the apartment that opened were on the base board and opened outward about 4 inches..!!! now to big for a baby to fall out but still very scary! and if you have a small cat.. or any rodent pets, haha keep those suckers closed! I once got on tthe floor and looked down.. I almost puked..
posted by crewshell at 10:26 AM on July 3, 2005

The correlation between apartment height and healthy/high-achieving children is probably a function of wealth/income, as pretty much all housing about a certain floor-level (say, 30th?), at least in any city I've ever visited, is luxury housing. In most studies, family income is the strongest predictor of health and academic success for children.
posted by onshi at 4:28 PM on July 3, 2005

I lived in a highrise, and they charged more for apartments on higher floors then for identical apartments on lower floors (I guess because the view makes them more desireable).

I'm mentioning this in case you are looking at a particular apartment - ask them if getting the same apartment on a different floor would change the cost.
posted by clarissajoy at 7:47 AM on July 6, 2005