Is emotionless sex the norm in one's early 20s?
August 23, 2011 3:10 PM Subscribe
A girl I dated(ish) for a few weeks dumped me because she wanted less emotion in the relationship(-type-thing)/the sex. This, and the ensuing discussion, has shaken my confidence in finding a compatible match... Do most young 20s women prefer less emotion in a relationship, and see sex as a physical, recreational activity?
Special snowflake story: met her through a mutual friend; hung out in mostly-group settings and hit it off a couple more times; met up with her and her friends for drinks before promptly going back to my place and having sex. (All within a week.) Next two weeks, see her twice (one on one): cocktails -> sex, movie in my bed -> sex. Lots of compatible interests and great, wide-ranging conversations, so I thought this was going somewhere. But, we take a week off due to logistics, meet up for dinner yesterday night, and afterward I get the "I think we should just be friends" line.
My immediate reaction was "I agree," because... the sex was pretty unsatisfying. Despite my definite interest in her as a person, lack of compatibility there kills it. I enjoy emotional and immersive sex, in the sense of "letting oneself go" and seeing the kind of primal effect I am having on the woman. Whereas she actually mentioned feeling "disembodied" and kept pushing to keep the sex short and to the point; never did I feel like she was immersed, which was a huge turn-off for me. It felt very neat, tidy, and punctual---honestly not much better than masturbation.
My strategy was to just not get too invested, and hope she opened up. Instead, apparently, I scared her off. In the discussion that followed, she basically said she didn't come into this precluding a relationship, but as things developed found me too emotionally open. And she claimed that I was the abnormal one here, saying that her friends had very "libertine" attitudes toward sex and that she, and they, thought of it as just physical and recreational, not emotional. Indeed, she urged me to sleep around a lot more.
So this has got me scared that I'm misaligned with my age group in what I'm looking for in a relationship, even if just a casual sexual one.
Now, I'm definitely not "clingy" or prone to "falling in love" easily; in short, I am not the stereotypical guy who scares women off by being too emotionally invested too early. My relationship style, especially early-stages, is very laid back and accepting: not demanding or needy or easily riled by "The Rules"-style behavior. "I want you, but don't need you" is the motto here. It's just sex that brings out the more emotional side of me.
Still, clearly there was a mismatch here, and by her account, there would be between me and any of her friends as well. Is that representative? Am I going to scare off everyone, in a similar fashion? And by "everyone," I mean attractive (and thus probably experienced) young-20s women living in NYC. Am I the abnormal one? Do I need to work on this aspect of myself? Maybe just rein it in for the initial stages of a relationship?
Special snowflake story: met her through a mutual friend; hung out in mostly-group settings and hit it off a couple more times; met up with her and her friends for drinks before promptly going back to my place and having sex. (All within a week.) Next two weeks, see her twice (one on one): cocktails -> sex, movie in my bed -> sex. Lots of compatible interests and great, wide-ranging conversations, so I thought this was going somewhere. But, we take a week off due to logistics, meet up for dinner yesterday night, and afterward I get the "I think we should just be friends" line.
My immediate reaction was "I agree," because... the sex was pretty unsatisfying. Despite my definite interest in her as a person, lack of compatibility there kills it. I enjoy emotional and immersive sex, in the sense of "letting oneself go" and seeing the kind of primal effect I am having on the woman. Whereas she actually mentioned feeling "disembodied" and kept pushing to keep the sex short and to the point; never did I feel like she was immersed, which was a huge turn-off for me. It felt very neat, tidy, and punctual---honestly not much better than masturbation.
My strategy was to just not get too invested, and hope she opened up. Instead, apparently, I scared her off. In the discussion that followed, she basically said she didn't come into this precluding a relationship, but as things developed found me too emotionally open. And she claimed that I was the abnormal one here, saying that her friends had very "libertine" attitudes toward sex and that she, and they, thought of it as just physical and recreational, not emotional. Indeed, she urged me to sleep around a lot more.
So this has got me scared that I'm misaligned with my age group in what I'm looking for in a relationship, even if just a casual sexual one.
Now, I'm definitely not "clingy" or prone to "falling in love" easily; in short, I am not the stereotypical guy who scares women off by being too emotionally invested too early. My relationship style, especially early-stages, is very laid back and accepting: not demanding or needy or easily riled by "The Rules"-style behavior. "I want you, but don't need you" is the motto here. It's just sex that brings out the more emotional side of me.
Still, clearly there was a mismatch here, and by her account, there would be between me and any of her friends as well. Is that representative? Am I going to scare off everyone, in a similar fashion? And by "everyone," I mean attractive (and thus probably experienced) young-20s women living in NYC. Am I the abnormal one? Do I need to work on this aspect of myself? Maybe just rein it in for the initial stages of a relationship?
Do most young-20s women prefer anything?
I am a young-20s woman. I do not want exactly what your ex wants, or exactly what any of the many many young-20s women I know what.
posted by i_am_a_fiesta at 3:16 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
I am a young-20s woman. I do not want exactly what your ex wants, or exactly what any of the many many young-20s women I know what.
posted by i_am_a_fiesta at 3:16 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
Best answer: You can definitely find women with the same outlook as yourself in your 20s. I don't think they're any more common or rare than at any other age. The difference in your 20s vs. later in life is that women (and men) are generally less confident and emotionally settled.
It didn't work out with this particular person. It's a sample size of one and it isn't worth generalizing to everyone.
posted by MillMan at 3:17 PM on August 23, 2011 [5 favorites]
It didn't work out with this particular person. It's a sample size of one and it isn't worth generalizing to everyone.
posted by MillMan at 3:17 PM on August 23, 2011 [5 favorites]
Still, clearly there was a mismatch here, and by her account, there would be between me and any of her friends as well. Is that representative?
Do not listen to this woman. Do not take her advice unless you want to land more women like her--and, because the sex was "pretty unsatisfying," why would you want to do that? There are plenty of women who are nothing like her. Keep looking.
posted by massysett at 3:27 PM on August 23, 2011 [3 favorites]
Do not listen to this woman. Do not take her advice unless you want to land more women like her--and, because the sex was "pretty unsatisfying," why would you want to do that? There are plenty of women who are nothing like her. Keep looking.
posted by massysett at 3:27 PM on August 23, 2011 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: To clarify, I realize everyone's preferences are unique, so asking for "most" is definitely loaded, but let's rephrase it this way: am I going to have trouble dating with my current mindset, due to the statistical distribution of preferences among those in the demographic I plan on dating?
posted by Jacen Solo at 3:30 PM on August 23, 2011
posted by Jacen Solo at 3:30 PM on August 23, 2011
Best answer: Over the past three years, the last three younger women that I dated (22, 23, 25) were all looking for something serious and ok with something casual (one monogamous, two nonmonogamous). Women closer to my age, 31-32, one wanted something very serious, the other was looking for something serious, but ok with something casual and nonmonogamous. This was a mix of east coast and Chicago.
These are anecdotes to you, but my conclusion is, don't generalize. Keep meeting new people, keep refining what you're looking for in another person, allow yourself to be surprised, hold your ideal loosely, communicate and listen for individual complexity, communication not labels, listen to your feelings, push yourself, tolerate ambiguity and uncertainty when doing so feels right, be patient, be kind, have lots of fun, date lots, repeat, you'll be fine.
posted by zeek321 at 3:31 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
These are anecdotes to you, but my conclusion is, don't generalize. Keep meeting new people, keep refining what you're looking for in another person, allow yourself to be surprised, hold your ideal loosely, communicate and listen for individual complexity, communication not labels, listen to your feelings, push yourself, tolerate ambiguity and uncertainty when doing so feels right, be patient, be kind, have lots of fun, date lots, repeat, you'll be fine.
posted by zeek321 at 3:31 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
I'm a girl in my early (okay, mid) 20's and I fall more on your side than on this girl's side. My friends range widely but I have seen more get attached more often after hooking up than not. I think it just depends on the girl-- you can't generalize off one person, and just because this girl didn't want what you wanted doesn't mean none will.
posted by queens86 at 3:36 PM on August 23, 2011
posted by queens86 at 3:36 PM on August 23, 2011
Response by poster: All right, it's getting to the point where I feel silly for asking the question; thanks everyone for the reassurance :).
As long as I'm getting a few voices from the other side, I'll not adopt the generalizations she laid out as my own. I think my brain just launches into vulnerable mode post-breakup, and is highly susceptible to such thoughts and fears.
posted by Jacen Solo at 3:47 PM on August 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
As long as I'm getting a few voices from the other side, I'll not adopt the generalizations she laid out as my own. I think my brain just launches into vulnerable mode post-breakup, and is highly susceptible to such thoughts and fears.
posted by Jacen Solo at 3:47 PM on August 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
"It's not x, it's y" is a cliche, but it's applicable here. It was not you, it was her. So don't internalize what was going on with her. Many women of varying ages are totally into emotionally significant sex, so don't be afraid.
posted by crankylex at 3:58 PM on August 23, 2011
posted by crankylex at 3:58 PM on August 23, 2011
Consider too that she may not be a reliable guide to what her friends really do or look for in relationships. In my experience people (especially young people) are not super open and honest about that stuff with friends, and many people also assume that the people they like act and think just like them.
It's sort of a weird red flag to me that she would "urge" you to sleep around more - it seems weirdly over-invested in what other people do, as does insisting that her friends are just like her and they're the norm. I wonder if she was scared you would judge her, and went on the offensive?
FWIW I tended to act more like her than you before I got married, and I felt very much the outlier, and sometimes like people judged me for being cold or being a slut. I think there are people like you both out there, and it's all fine, but people like you are much more common. Calm down, you sound like you deal with relationships in a really healthy way.
posted by crabintheocean at 4:04 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
It's sort of a weird red flag to me that she would "urge" you to sleep around more - it seems weirdly over-invested in what other people do, as does insisting that her friends are just like her and they're the norm. I wonder if she was scared you would judge her, and went on the offensive?
FWIW I tended to act more like her than you before I got married, and I felt very much the outlier, and sometimes like people judged me for being cold or being a slut. I think there are people like you both out there, and it's all fine, but people like you are much more common. Calm down, you sound like you deal with relationships in a really healthy way.
posted by crabintheocean at 4:04 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
she claimed that I was the abnormal one here, saying that her friends had very "libertine" attitudes toward sex and that she, and they, thought of it as just physical and recreational, not emotional. Indeed, she urged me to sleep around a lot more.
That's a really weird/rude suggestion for her to make. I wouldn't listen to anything else she said either in terms of "what you need to do."
posted by wondermouse at 4:07 PM on August 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
That's a really weird/rude suggestion for her to make. I wouldn't listen to anything else she said either in terms of "what you need to do."
posted by wondermouse at 4:07 PM on August 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
And she claimed that I was the abnormal one here, saying that her friends had very "libertine" attitudes toward sex and that she, and they, thought of it as just physical and recreational, not emotional. Indeed, she urged me to sleep around a lot more.
Low self-esteem is contagious. Be sure to wash your hands thoroughly.
posted by Inspector.Gadget at 4:11 PM on August 23, 2011 [10 favorites]
Low self-esteem is contagious. Be sure to wash your hands thoroughly.
posted by Inspector.Gadget at 4:11 PM on August 23, 2011 [10 favorites]
I am mid-20s... but at no time in my life can I relate to what this girl is saying. You definitely sound like the normal one here.
posted by DoubleLune at 4:21 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by DoubleLune at 4:21 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
because... the sex was pretty unsatisfying
It's possible that she felt the same way, and was struggling with how to put it.
posted by grog at 4:27 PM on August 23, 2011
It's possible that she felt the same way, and was struggling with how to put it.
posted by grog at 4:27 PM on August 23, 2011
Best answer: It's also possible that she was in a period in her life when she wanted to experiment sexually and sow some wild oats without being in a relationship. Societies message to women about that particuar urge is really harmful and leads to things like 'im not going to open up even a microparticle to anything emotional because that means i'm letting my feelings down by simply exploring myself sexually' or the aforementioned 'if i just want to have random sex with a bunch of people, i must not like myself very much'
Sounds like you and this specific girl were not compatible, as stated above. Thank her for the sex and move on.
posted by softlord at 4:39 PM on August 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
Sounds like you and this specific girl were not compatible, as stated above. Thank her for the sex and move on.
posted by softlord at 4:39 PM on August 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
OK, this:
Whereas she actually mentioned feeling "disembodied" and kept pushing to keep the sex short and to the point
Is truthfully kind of weird and creepy. Don't waste your time worrying what this girl thinks.
posted by dithmer at 6:12 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
Whereas she actually mentioned feeling "disembodied" and kept pushing to keep the sex short and to the point
Is truthfully kind of weird and creepy. Don't waste your time worrying what this girl thinks.
posted by dithmer at 6:12 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Woman in her early twenties here!
You are not abnormal - shame on her for making you for feeling ashamed of how you personally conduct yourself as a sexual being! Gendered pressure surrounding sexual behaviour usually creates frustration and confusion - kinda like here! Just a little bit! You two just weren't compatible, but it says nothing about you as a man.
I'd brush my shoulders off and keep it moving. Casual hookups are a random assortment of mismatched wires and the occasional spark, even when you connect wires not intending to be FWBs. Good luck finding yours :)
posted by Ashen at 6:19 PM on August 23, 2011
You are not abnormal - shame on her for making you for feeling ashamed of how you personally conduct yourself as a sexual being! Gendered pressure surrounding sexual behaviour usually creates frustration and confusion - kinda like here! Just a little bit! You two just weren't compatible, but it says nothing about you as a man.
I'd brush my shoulders off and keep it moving. Casual hookups are a random assortment of mismatched wires and the occasional spark, even when you connect wires not intending to be FWBs. Good luck finding yours :)
posted by Ashen at 6:19 PM on August 23, 2011
Best answer: Oh and to answer your title question: on my campus, yes. As a general trend, the answer becomes less murky. There's definitely pressure in the media, but it doesn't mean you won't find young women who don't have similar styles of interaction where you live.
posted by Ashen at 6:21 PM on August 23, 2011
posted by Ashen at 6:21 PM on August 23, 2011
If there is one thing I wish I had known about sex in my twenties -- well, to be honest, I wish I'd known it in my teens -- it's that it's okay to want what you want, and if you know what you want, can articulate it clearly, and ask for it when appropriate, you really, honest to god, might get it, and not before then.
posted by endless_forms at 6:40 PM on August 23, 2011 [7 favorites]
posted by endless_forms at 6:40 PM on August 23, 2011 [7 favorites]
I sorta assume people are into more casual sex than I am, and that I tend to get more emotionally attached. But maybe that assumption is the problem.
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 7:03 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 7:03 PM on August 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
The average age of first marriage for women is 26. If most of the women are libertine in their early 20s, how are they finding That Special Someone and settling down so young?
posted by Houstonian at 7:09 PM on August 23, 2011
posted by Houstonian at 7:09 PM on August 23, 2011
Best answer: Women in their teens and twenties are pretty brainwashed by media and peer pressure in this culture to be focused on the presentation of their desirability. They have not had a chance to become as emotionally and sexually knowledgeable and confident as they might be later on.
It sounds to me, however, that you might be talking about sensuality as well as emotion. You can perceive cues about a young woman's sensuality pretty easily, even before she actually connects the importance of it to her own sexuality. Try dating those girls, they might not be the 'hottest' or prettiest; they'll be the ones who like to go barefoot, almost unconsciously stop feel textures, always stops to smell the roses, etc. They might also use more "feel" words than "look" words. (The trick here is to differentiate actual sensual experience from the performance of sexual desirability--licking an ice cream cone might be either one, you know).
I can predict, if you are a man who appreciates the sensuality and emotion in a relationship with a woman, and you learn how to find those women and how to be a good partner to them, you can be pretty sure of having great sex for as long as you are interested in having it. Good luck.
posted by Anitanola at 7:53 PM on August 23, 2011 [5 favorites]
It sounds to me, however, that you might be talking about sensuality as well as emotion. You can perceive cues about a young woman's sensuality pretty easily, even before she actually connects the importance of it to her own sexuality. Try dating those girls, they might not be the 'hottest' or prettiest; they'll be the ones who like to go barefoot, almost unconsciously stop feel textures, always stops to smell the roses, etc. They might also use more "feel" words than "look" words. (The trick here is to differentiate actual sensual experience from the performance of sexual desirability--licking an ice cream cone might be either one, you know).
I can predict, if you are a man who appreciates the sensuality and emotion in a relationship with a woman, and you learn how to find those women and how to be a good partner to them, you can be pretty sure of having great sex for as long as you are interested in having it. Good luck.
posted by Anitanola at 7:53 PM on August 23, 2011 [5 favorites]
Best answer: So I really like casual sex. I'm in my late 20s now, but I really liked casual sex in my early 20s too. Sex is fun! For me, sex can most definitely be
just physical and recreational, not emotional.
However. That no-strings-attached, recreational sex I'm having? It's not GOOD recreational sex unless it's
immersive sex, in the sense of "letting oneself go" and seeing the kind of primal effect I am having on the [man].
It all depends on your definition of emotional sex, I suppose. It sounds to me like she hasn't yet learned (or maybe subconsciously knows it's not possible for her personally) to fully immerse herself in the sex without getting emotionally attached.
On preview, what Anitanola said. Sensual sex vs. emotional sex. Sounds like she wasn't yet comfortable with sensual sex.
posted by JuliaIglesias at 11:58 PM on August 23, 2011
just physical and recreational, not emotional.
However. That no-strings-attached, recreational sex I'm having? It's not GOOD recreational sex unless it's
immersive sex, in the sense of "letting oneself go" and seeing the kind of primal effect I am having on the [man].
It all depends on your definition of emotional sex, I suppose. It sounds to me like she hasn't yet learned (or maybe subconsciously knows it's not possible for her personally) to fully immerse herself in the sex without getting emotionally attached.
On preview, what Anitanola said. Sensual sex vs. emotional sex. Sounds like she wasn't yet comfortable with sensual sex.
posted by JuliaIglesias at 11:58 PM on August 23, 2011
Best answer: Hi, 20-something female here! And me and my friends (as far as I know, they have steady boyfriends) are only really interested in "emotional" sex. I don't think you can extrapolate from that one encounter, no it is not representative.
Consider also that people with her attitude are more likely to be friends with other people sharing their views. Which will probably be why her friends agree with her, as opposed to it being the "norm".
posted by stillnocturnal at 2:54 AM on August 24, 2011
Consider also that people with her attitude are more likely to be friends with other people sharing their views. Which will probably be why her friends agree with her, as opposed to it being the "norm".
posted by stillnocturnal at 2:54 AM on August 24, 2011
She sounds like a big jerk. Anyone who tries to convince you that your sexual style or preferences or reactions are "wrong" or "abnormal" is someone you should not bother to give one more second of your time.
posted by yarly at 7:51 AM on August 24, 2011
posted by yarly at 7:51 AM on August 24, 2011
Best answer: I complained about a guy being "too emotional" and "too invested" in a relationship once after I broke up with him, but in retrospect that just meant that I wasn't into him enough to be equally emotional/invested on my part.
Take it as a sign that you two weren't compatible (and possibly that she isn't the nicest lady around), and don't worry about the future. Women are heterogeneous people and have their own individual preferences.
posted by vanitas at 2:06 PM on August 25, 2011 [1 favorite]
Take it as a sign that you two weren't compatible (and possibly that she isn't the nicest lady around), and don't worry about the future. Women are heterogeneous people and have their own individual preferences.
posted by vanitas at 2:06 PM on August 25, 2011 [1 favorite]
Do most young 20s women prefer less emotion in a relationship, and see sex as a physical, recreational activity?
I would say it's the opposite. Neither I nor any of my many female friends felt like this in our teens, early 20s, or now in our later 20s. Now, there are definitely women out there who do feel this way, as you know, but I feel pretty comfortable saying it's a small minority.
she actually mentioned feeling "disembodied"
Preferring sex as recreation is one thing, but this actually sounds pretty abnormal to me, like she has some kind of psychological issue that she is trying to cover up with bravado about not wanting emotion, etc.
posted by Ashley801 at 11:12 PM on August 25, 2011
I would say it's the opposite. Neither I nor any of my many female friends felt like this in our teens, early 20s, or now in our later 20s. Now, there are definitely women out there who do feel this way, as you know, but I feel pretty comfortable saying it's a small minority.
she actually mentioned feeling "disembodied"
Preferring sex as recreation is one thing, but this actually sounds pretty abnormal to me, like she has some kind of psychological issue that she is trying to cover up with bravado about not wanting emotion, etc.
posted by Ashley801 at 11:12 PM on August 25, 2011
This thread is closed to new comments.
"Most" anybodies don't "prefer" anything. Everyone is different.
It sounds like this particular lady is just not that into you and is trying to find a way to say it that does not have to include the words, "dude, I'm just not that into you."
Sorry.
There are lots of ladies your age out there who would love an emotionally open guy. Go find one of them. Don't get too hung up on what's "normal" or "abnormal". Just be yourself.
posted by phunniemee at 3:15 PM on August 23, 2011 [13 favorites]