What's the deal with baggy pants?
August 2, 2011 2:57 PM Subscribe
Ok hivemind: what's the deal with baggy pants? I mean the kind frequently associated with gangbanger style, where the top of the pants is below the wearer's bottom.
What is this style meant to convey? Fashion-wise, did guys start wearing them lower and lower to outdo each other? Is it tremendously more comfortable for some reason? I guess my question is, is it done because of style or is it because of convenience/reason I'm not familiar with? Thanks for any insight...
What is this style meant to convey? Fashion-wise, did guys start wearing them lower and lower to outdo each other? Is it tremendously more comfortable for some reason? I guess my question is, is it done because of style or is it because of convenience/reason I'm not familiar with? Thanks for any insight...
Same question on the late and somewhat lamented Google Answers.
posted by artlung at 3:00 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by artlung at 3:00 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
Wikipedia puts forward the suggestion that it's based on prison wear. The idea is that belts are often forbidden in prison settings, hence the falling-downness.
posted by flipper at 3:04 PM on August 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
posted by flipper at 3:04 PM on August 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
Growing up going to schools where the "gangbanger style" was predominant I've heard a couple of theories from the mouths of wearers of this style. One is that it came from wearing the baggy hand-me-downs from your brother and that morphing into an intentional style. Another is that it's easier to hide a weapon.
Also, closer to 2000, lots of skaters would wear very baggy pants, claiming that it protected your skin, but didn't restrict movement and was cooler (temperature-wise).
I can't vouch for any of this in any way.
posted by cmoj at 3:17 PM on August 2, 2011
Also, closer to 2000, lots of skaters would wear very baggy pants, claiming that it protected your skin, but didn't restrict movement and was cooler (temperature-wise).
I can't vouch for any of this in any way.
posted by cmoj at 3:17 PM on August 2, 2011
The two theories I've heard, repeated in this thread, are that it comes from the necessities of prison life, where belts are prohibited, and that it's a product of growing up wearing your older brother's hand-me-downs. The bit about it being easier to hide a weapon is probably a very nice side effect.
It now functions as an in-group marker to indicate that the possibility of being in prison, the fact of being poor, and the necessity of carrying a concealed weapon are all relevant to your life.
posted by Sticherbeast at 3:21 PM on August 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
It now functions as an in-group marker to indicate that the possibility of being in prison, the fact of being poor, and the necessity of carrying a concealed weapon are all relevant to your life.
posted by Sticherbeast at 3:21 PM on August 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
Many years ago, I read an interesting article about how youth trends in fashion often involve breaking a rule of some kind--so, flappers didn't do up their rain boots, for instance. That's the earliest example I remember the article mentioning. In my own youth, there was a big trend for wearing your shirttails hanging out from under your sweater vests, or girls wearing v-neck sweaters backwards. Or bras as outerwear, or bra straps showing, or pajama bottoms as pants. Or baseball caps turned backwards. Or a necktie as a belt. Whatever the specific origin of droopy pants--and I strongly suspect that any origin stories are probably unverifiable, just-so stories--it has always seemed to me as an expression of that broader tendency.
posted by not that girl at 3:22 PM on August 2, 2011 [11 favorites]
posted by not that girl at 3:22 PM on August 2, 2011 [11 favorites]
To build on cmoj, having taught in schools where this style was appropriate wear, another reason I was given was low-slung pants, paired with the ubiquitous oversized plain white tee, confused people as to the height, bulk, and description of a particular individual. This could be for several reasons. Many of the students I taught were constantly hassled for no reason, sometimes for good reason, and sometimes they hassled each other. Its not hard to imagine this kind of dress allows for individuals to belnd in, disappear, or conceal body type.
posted by oflinkey at 3:23 PM on August 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
posted by oflinkey at 3:23 PM on August 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
I've heard the prison explanation from pretty reliable sources. That's what I tell my students and it seems to dull the appeal a little for some of them. So in other words, job done!
posted by guster4lovers at 3:23 PM on August 2, 2011
posted by guster4lovers at 3:23 PM on August 2, 2011
Although I have heard the prison explanation, I've also been told wearing pants baggy can be a way of showing sexual prowess, ie. Only the wearer's genitalia is holding the pants up, so they have a package that satisfies.
posted by Giggilituffin at 3:32 PM on August 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by Giggilituffin at 3:32 PM on August 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
Expanding on the prison wear explanation - I read (and when I recall the book i will post it, but the title eludes me) that in prison, all the clothes are just thrown together, and are chosen by "pecking order" - the higher ranking men get to choose earlier, so very few prisoners get to choose properly sized clothing. If you can get it on your body, that's about as good as it's going to get.
Extrapolating from that - originally it was the lower echelon men who ended up wearing the saggy pants. I can imagine a large population wanting to take that back and reinterpret it as something fashionable to preserve their pride. I can easily see it being exported to the outside as street wear that way, by newer, younger prisoners who were serving shorter sentences - qualities that would automatically place one lower in the prison hierarchy, but in a better position to influence fashion.
posted by louche mustachio at 3:53 PM on August 2, 2011
Extrapolating from that - originally it was the lower echelon men who ended up wearing the saggy pants. I can imagine a large population wanting to take that back and reinterpret it as something fashionable to preserve their pride. I can easily see it being exported to the outside as street wear that way, by newer, younger prisoners who were serving shorter sentences - qualities that would automatically place one lower in the prison hierarchy, but in a better position to influence fashion.
posted by louche mustachio at 3:53 PM on August 2, 2011
Slight derail: a friend of mine is married to a former 'school resource officer' --- you know, the police officer stationed on-site at the school. He said that although he and his fellow cops tended to hate the style's sloppy look, as a middle-aged guy sometimes having to run down some teenage miscreant he appreciated how well the droopy pants slowed the kids down.....
posted by easily confused at 3:54 PM on August 2, 2011 [10 favorites]
posted by easily confused at 3:54 PM on August 2, 2011 [10 favorites]
For some reason, super baggy pants remind me a lot of the Incroyables and Marveilleuses.
It doesn't seem particularly weird to me. It's fashion, yeah? Fashion is frequently pretty ridiculous when viewed from the outside, by someone who doesn't "get" it. I mean, I think neckties are a pretty ridiculous thing, but since they're really common attire associated with professional people, they're not seen as threatening or "omg kids today."
posted by Kutsuwamushi at 4:02 PM on August 2, 2011
It doesn't seem particularly weird to me. It's fashion, yeah? Fashion is frequently pretty ridiculous when viewed from the outside, by someone who doesn't "get" it. I mean, I think neckties are a pretty ridiculous thing, but since they're really common attire associated with professional people, they're not seen as threatening or "omg kids today."
posted by Kutsuwamushi at 4:02 PM on August 2, 2011
Snopes.com has a discussion of the various myths about this phenomenon, and the true origin, according to them.
In short, according to them, it has its origins in oversized, ill-fitting prison-issue garments coupled with a lack of belts, a style that was popularized by rappers.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 4:03 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
In short, according to them, it has its origins in oversized, ill-fitting prison-issue garments coupled with a lack of belts, a style that was popularized by rappers.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 4:03 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
Something to keep in mind about this fashion trend is that, like all fashion trends, the vast majority of wearers are not participating because they consciously identify with its roots (i.e. woke up and decided to imitate prison dress) but because it's now a long-standing fashion tradition that they've been told is cool. Assuming people adopting this mode of dress are actively interested in criminal activity is a bit like assuming all women wearing pants are doing so in a conscious attempt to subvert gender norms.
posted by Anonymous at 4:08 PM on August 2, 2011
posted by Anonymous at 4:08 PM on August 2, 2011
Response by poster: But is it comfortable? I know that people suffer often for fashion, but I'm genuinely curious if some men prefer the style because it is more comfortable for some reason. Where is a handgun worn, if there is a gun involved - in the waist of the underwear, or down in the pants somewhere?
posted by agregoli at 4:10 PM on August 2, 2011
posted by agregoli at 4:10 PM on August 2, 2011
The prison thing sounds persuasive. Beyond that, though, it's kind of a power thing; the droopy pants wearer wants us to shiver and be scared and "respectful." Like guys used to wear black motorcycle jackets and greasy jeans for the same reason, wear their hair in ducktails, like Brando in "The Wild Ones." You won't remember that, probably. "What are you rebelling against?" "Whattya got?" What it truly conveys is that these dudes are sheep, like most of us, and follow whatever "style" the people they (we) think are cool think is cool. So yeah, fashion, basically, the fashion of rebellion, which is different from, say, preppy fashion or nerdy fashion. Of course, real rebels don't need that stuff. Why did I get a tattoo when I was a dumbass kid?
Sorry, wine with dinner, didn't mean to ramble.
posted by fivesavagepalms at 4:11 PM on August 2, 2011
Sorry, wine with dinner, didn't mean to ramble.
posted by fivesavagepalms at 4:11 PM on August 2, 2011
Sticherbeast: "It now functions as an in-group marker to indicate you want everyone to think that the possibility of being in prison, the fact of being poor, and the necessity of carrying a concealed weapon are all relevant to your life."
FTFY. As a college teacher, the kids I see wearing this style the most lately are the posers, who are no more about to go to prison than I am.
Also, it looks like the most uncomfortable style to walk in. Guys have to walk like cowboys in order to keep their pants up. I've seen unintentional trouser drops, I've seen guys running while holding up their pants, and I've seen them drop everything they're carrying AND their pants, because trying to walk like you have giant balls and hold up your pants and carry your stuff was just too much. In some ways it cracks me up, because, really?? why do you think I want to see your boxers?, but it also reminds me of the fashion faux paus of my youth.
posted by SuperSquirrel at 4:14 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
FTFY. As a college teacher, the kids I see wearing this style the most lately are the posers, who are no more about to go to prison than I am.
Also, it looks like the most uncomfortable style to walk in. Guys have to walk like cowboys in order to keep their pants up. I've seen unintentional trouser drops, I've seen guys running while holding up their pants, and I've seen them drop everything they're carrying AND their pants, because trying to walk like you have giant balls and hold up your pants and carry your stuff was just too much. In some ways it cracks me up, because, really?? why do you think I want to see your boxers?, but it also reminds me of the fashion faux paus of my youth.
posted by SuperSquirrel at 4:14 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
There are a lot of reasons to choose a particular style of dress. "More comfortable" is only one of them. I humbly submit that "Clearly vexes anyone over 30" as another reason.
I think you will probably recall that when you're (say) 12-19 years old, "Adults find it really annoying but they have no legitimate reason to tell me to stop doing it" was pretty awesome.
Combine that with its function as a social signifier ("I wear it because all my friends do, too") and you've got a bulletproof fashion trend on your hands.
posted by ErikaB at 4:34 PM on August 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
I think you will probably recall that when you're (say) 12-19 years old, "Adults find it really annoying but they have no legitimate reason to tell me to stop doing it" was pretty awesome.
Combine that with its function as a social signifier ("I wear it because all my friends do, too") and you've got a bulletproof fashion trend on your hands.
posted by ErikaB at 4:34 PM on August 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Well, if anyone here can actually speak to personal experience regarding comfort, please let me know.
posted by agregoli at 4:40 PM on August 2, 2011
posted by agregoli at 4:40 PM on August 2, 2011
I have always heard the prison explanation re. lack of belts.
Which always led me to wonder: could prisons have made cardboard suspenders stylish on the streets? I certainly think they should have tried.
posted by Clyde Mnestra at 4:49 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
Which always led me to wonder: could prisons have made cardboard suspenders stylish on the streets? I certainly think they should have tried.
posted by Clyde Mnestra at 4:49 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
This wikiHow article ("How to Wear Really Low Baggy Pants Without Losing Them") has lots of insights on how to wear them comfortably.
posted by otherwordlyglow at 4:55 PM on August 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by otherwordlyglow at 4:55 PM on August 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
No personal experience but I've always assumed that the exhibition of the underwear indicates that it is in part an expression of confidence with the self as a sexual being (or mimicking of same), sort of like a woman letting a camisole show.
posted by Morrigan at 5:11 PM on August 2, 2011
posted by Morrigan at 5:11 PM on August 2, 2011
The explanation I've heard is that it's based not prison per se, but on police lockups, where you'd be wearing your regular clothes, but with the belt having been confiscated.
posted by adamrice at 5:28 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by adamrice at 5:28 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
No personal experience but I've always assumed that the exhibition of the underwear indicates that it is in part an expression of confidence with the self as a sexual being (or mimicking of same), sort of like a woman letting a camisole show.
Also in this vein, baggy pants are also a visual metaphor of sexual readiness. The pants are already almost off.
posted by Sticherbeast at 5:30 PM on August 2, 2011
Also in this vein, baggy pants are also a visual metaphor of sexual readiness. The pants are already almost off.
posted by Sticherbeast at 5:30 PM on August 2, 2011
Baggy pants are quite comfortable to wear. (I haven't tried to get low slung pants comfortable, so I can't speak to that.) I think people wear baggy pants because they look awesome. Maybe it's an age thing.
posted by Margalo Epps at 5:59 PM on August 2, 2011
posted by Margalo Epps at 5:59 PM on August 2, 2011
The prison thing as a reason for the style always struck me as overreaching. Prison uniforms aren't the type of pants you wear with a belt anyway. And street clothes are obviously not a prison uniform.
How is this logic supposed to work? You have become so accustomed to wearing too-big clothing that you now prefer it, even on the outside? Why no corresponding trend of the slipper-like shoes? If you're a big guy, wouldn't your prison uniform more likely have been too tight?
I think it's just fashion for the inexplicable who-knows of fashion. It does sound like the kind of explanation that a kid would give to freak out his teacher or parents, though.
posted by desuetude at 6:09 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
How is this logic supposed to work? You have become so accustomed to wearing too-big clothing that you now prefer it, even on the outside? Why no corresponding trend of the slipper-like shoes? If you're a big guy, wouldn't your prison uniform more likely have been too tight?
I think it's just fashion for the inexplicable who-knows of fashion. It does sound like the kind of explanation that a kid would give to freak out his teacher or parents, though.
posted by desuetude at 6:09 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
I don't think it could be comfortable, because I've seen men wearing pants so baggy that they had to hold them up with one hand at all times, leaving them only one hand to do anything else (and posing a serious dilemma when doing things that usually require two hands).
posted by Houstonian at 6:25 PM on August 2, 2011
posted by Houstonian at 6:25 PM on August 2, 2011
Also in this vein, baggy pants are also a visual metaphor of sexual readiness. The pants are already almost off.
Confirmation:
"I wear my pants like this for easy access, baby" -- Eazy-E
posted by chrchr at 6:33 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
Confirmation:
"I wear my pants like this for easy access, baby" -- Eazy-E
posted by chrchr at 6:33 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
I've worked in men's prisons and the lack of belts did not mean that everyone's pants were falling off, so I think the prison explanation is bullshit. I used to discuss this with baggy-pants-wearing delinquent students I taught. We came up with a lot of theories, one was that it was the textile industry that wanted to sell more fabric, another was that it was gay fashion designers who liked looking at cute young butts, and, as someone above mentioned, the police liked the pants because they make it hard to run.
I can't imagine that having all that extra denim fabric between your legs would be very comfortable. If comfort were the main criterion for clothing we'd all be wearing sweats all the time.
posted by mareli at 7:02 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
I can't imagine that having all that extra denim fabric between your legs would be very comfortable. If comfort were the main criterion for clothing we'd all be wearing sweats all the time.
posted by mareli at 7:02 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
If comfort were the main criterion for clothing we'd all be wearing sweats all the time.
That was the college campus of my youth. There were strict rules on how to wear them, too, I guess...I never was into it.
posted by maxwelton at 8:48 PM on August 2, 2011
That was the college campus of my youth. There were strict rules on how to wear them, too, I guess...I never was into it.
posted by maxwelton at 8:48 PM on August 2, 2011
I've worked in men's prisons and the lack of belts did not mean that everyone's pants were falling off, so I think the prison explanation is bullshit.
I was hoping that someone who had worked in prison would chime in to refute that. I thought the same thing, but didn't want to be presumptuous, as I've been inside of exactly one prison for only a couple of hours.
posted by desuetude at 10:04 PM on August 2, 2011
I was hoping that someone who had worked in prison would chime in to refute that. I thought the same thing, but didn't want to be presumptuous, as I've been inside of exactly one prison for only a couple of hours.
posted by desuetude at 10:04 PM on August 2, 2011
So, personal experience and some clarification!
1. It's important to realize that waist and hips are two different things. Most people no longer wear their pants at their waist, but down on their hips. So, that's already a little "low slung" compared to past generations.
2. Then there's baggy pants at the hips. This is pretty comfortable, and, depending on your fabric, can keep you cool in summer and warm in winter. It definitely helps avoid sweaty nuts in hot weather. It's comfy, and you can move around pretty well (see: breakdancers).
Another benefit is that provided the length is decent, it's really the belt that determines the "waist" size of the pants for this style, which makes it pretty easy to get hand-me-downs, or loan amongst friends, or keep wearing the same pants even if you have changes to your waist/belly size.
Can you hide weapons? Sure. Generally, though, it's not ideal for holding weapons - usually your belt is going to be the main thing holding it, unless you have something small and then it's going in the pockets.
3. And then, there's the pants low enough your ass is hanging out, covered only by drawers. This pretty much started happening years after this thing came into style. It usually means your belt is around your thighs, and people can't run fast, and, I can't imagine it's terribly comfortable either. It's definitely not good for hiding weapons.
I had moved out of the fashion by the time this came around, and neither I, nor most of the folks I knew who wore the baggy pant style get it either.
posted by yeloson at 10:09 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
1. It's important to realize that waist and hips are two different things. Most people no longer wear their pants at their waist, but down on their hips. So, that's already a little "low slung" compared to past generations.
2. Then there's baggy pants at the hips. This is pretty comfortable, and, depending on your fabric, can keep you cool in summer and warm in winter. It definitely helps avoid sweaty nuts in hot weather. It's comfy, and you can move around pretty well (see: breakdancers).
Another benefit is that provided the length is decent, it's really the belt that determines the "waist" size of the pants for this style, which makes it pretty easy to get hand-me-downs, or loan amongst friends, or keep wearing the same pants even if you have changes to your waist/belly size.
Can you hide weapons? Sure. Generally, though, it's not ideal for holding weapons - usually your belt is going to be the main thing holding it, unless you have something small and then it's going in the pockets.
3. And then, there's the pants low enough your ass is hanging out, covered only by drawers. This pretty much started happening years after this thing came into style. It usually means your belt is around your thighs, and people can't run fast, and, I can't imagine it's terribly comfortable either. It's definitely not good for hiding weapons.
I had moved out of the fashion by the time this came around, and neither I, nor most of the folks I knew who wore the baggy pant style get it either.
posted by yeloson at 10:09 PM on August 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
Either this question came up here a while back, or I had some other reason to read about this very question, but one explanation was that it had something to do with kids in the inner city having to wear ill-fitting oversized hand-me-downs, and so adolescents would sport the low, baggy pants just as a sort of tribute/reminder of their roots, in a manner of speaking. Of course, over time, it just became a fashionable thing adopted by adolescents in all walks of life.
It made sense, and made me less inclined to ridicule the style. But none of the mentions of this that I can find online are any more conclusive than the prisoner theory.
posted by TheSecretDecoderRing at 10:58 PM on August 2, 2011
It made sense, and made me less inclined to ridicule the style. But none of the mentions of this that I can find online are any more conclusive than the prisoner theory.
posted by TheSecretDecoderRing at 10:58 PM on August 2, 2011
Here are some other insights on baggy pants to consider.
posted by TDIpod at 12:36 AM on August 3, 2011
posted by TDIpod at 12:36 AM on August 3, 2011
While I don't know the true origin of the style, I'd have to disagree with it being the result of ill-fitting oversized hand-me-downs: people have been wearing handing hand-me-downs probably since clothes were invented, and weren't always wearing baggy pants like this --- heck, as someone on the younger end of a large & far from wealthy family, I myself wore multiply-handed-down stuff for most of my childhood: if stuff is that oversized, you wait until it fits to wear it.
posted by easily confused at 3:00 AM on August 3, 2011
posted by easily confused at 3:00 AM on August 3, 2011
The part I want to know is, when the top of the pants is situated below the bottom of the butt, how do they stay on?
posted by hungrytiger at 3:56 AM on August 3, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by hungrytiger at 3:56 AM on August 3, 2011 [1 favorite]
Subs Keep Your Baggy Pants from Falling Down. I always imagined this is what everyone did to keep their baggy pants up. I don't think really all that common but it sure would make sense. I also would have thought that there were more pants with false/double waists where you could wear pants around your real waist and then there'd be a second dropped waist about a foot lower, which would peek out below your super-long t-shirt but I don't think that's done.
posted by otherwordlyglow at 6:00 AM on August 3, 2011
posted by otherwordlyglow at 6:00 AM on August 3, 2011
What schroedinger said. Maybe there was a particular reason way-back-when that explains this trend, but the reason the kids are doing it now is simple (and familiar): people they think are cool do it. Unfortunately.
posted by Rykey at 12:19 PM on August 3, 2011
posted by Rykey at 12:19 PM on August 3, 2011
« Older Not sure how to deal with family drama! | Where can I find examples of great UX and IA... Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
In short: trends.
posted by filthy light thief at 2:59 PM on August 2, 2011