can i be naked with notice?
July 25, 2011 6:00 AM Subscribe
Can you legally get around decency laws if you give advance notice?
I would like to perform a simple dance skyclad ie naked in my own yard, four times a year (solstice and equinox). I live in a rural area but if neighbors look they can see. I don't care if they see but don't want to be arrested for indecent exposure. Can I send a note or otherwise get legal ok to be naked under the sky? I live in WA if it difference it makes
I would like to perform a simple dance skyclad ie naked in my own yard, four times a year (solstice and equinox). I live in a rural area but if neighbors look they can see. I don't care if they see but don't want to be arrested for indecent exposure. Can I send a note or otherwise get legal ok to be naked under the sky? I live in WA if it difference it makes
Normally I'd say just warn the neighbors. But then they'll probably peek.
How pagan-friendly are your neighbors?
Is there anywhere on your property where trees would obscure what you're doing?
Can you dance at night? (Brrr...)
Have you considered planting hedges? This is more or less what hedges are for. If there are hedges in the way, then if the neighbors are watching, it's more or less their fault.
(Cop comes to an old lady's apartment on a complaint. "My neighbors are walking around naked!"
"I can't see anything."
"Stand on the bed! Stand on the bed!"
posted by musofire at 6:06 AM on July 25, 2011 [5 favorites]
How pagan-friendly are your neighbors?
Is there anywhere on your property where trees would obscure what you're doing?
Can you dance at night? (Brrr...)
Have you considered planting hedges? This is more or less what hedges are for. If there are hedges in the way, then if the neighbors are watching, it's more or less their fault.
(Cop comes to an old lady's apartment on a complaint. "My neighbors are walking around naked!"
"I can't see anything."
"Stand on the bed! Stand on the bed!"
posted by musofire at 6:06 AM on July 25, 2011 [5 favorites]
There is much more leeway given to being naked on your own property than in some area that could reasonably considered public. That said, if your neighbors are freakout types [esp freakout types with children] this will be more likely to indicate whether you're likely to have problems. Notifying your neighbors, if you're friendly with them, would likely have the same effect. I assume you've seen the indecent exposure definition in the WA state laws
RCW 9A.88.010, Indecent Exposure. (1) A person is guilty of indecent exposure if he intentionally makes any open and obscene exposure of his person or the person of another knowing that such conduct is likely to cause reasonable affront or alarm.
There's a little more explanation here which says that this sort of thing is usually dealt with differently county by county. Also that refers to public nudity which, if you're in your own backyard, is a different animal. Here's the Seattle police talking about public nudity, if that's helpful.
My IANAL reading of this stuff says that if you're not being obscene [a strictly defined set of things which would not include most, if not all, dancing] and you're not in view of a public street [i.e. children on school buses, bla bla] you're likely okay. If you're not sure you can always call and ask your local police who would be the ones responding to neighbor calls anyhow. Here's the straight dope talking about being naked in your own yard generally. This post on the Dear Esq site seems to imply that setting up a privacy screen is a prudent thing to do [question is about Florida].
posted by jessamyn at 6:21 AM on July 25, 2011 [1 favorite]
RCW 9A.88.010, Indecent Exposure. (1) A person is guilty of indecent exposure if he intentionally makes any open and obscene exposure of his person or the person of another knowing that such conduct is likely to cause reasonable affront or alarm.
There's a little more explanation here which says that this sort of thing is usually dealt with differently county by county. Also that refers to public nudity which, if you're in your own backyard, is a different animal. Here's the Seattle police talking about public nudity, if that's helpful.
My IANAL reading of this stuff says that if you're not being obscene [a strictly defined set of things which would not include most, if not all, dancing] and you're not in view of a public street [i.e. children on school buses, bla bla] you're likely okay. If you're not sure you can always call and ask your local police who would be the ones responding to neighbor calls anyhow. Here's the straight dope talking about being naked in your own yard generally. This post on the Dear Esq site seems to imply that setting up a privacy screen is a prudent thing to do [question is about Florida].
posted by jessamyn at 6:21 AM on July 25, 2011 [1 favorite]
Public indecency generally doesn't mean "one who is naked on his property."
I mean, I guess if you lived in a city and a lot of neighbors could see you strutting your stuff on a balcony, or whatnot, that could be a cause for concern. But one of the benefits of living in a rural area is that there are fewer people around to see what you're doing.
And, really, if the cops in your town are worried about you walking around in the buff, on your property, you should move to a different town. Or get different cops.
posted by dfriedman at 6:27 AM on July 25, 2011
I mean, I guess if you lived in a city and a lot of neighbors could see you strutting your stuff on a balcony, or whatnot, that could be a cause for concern. But one of the benefits of living in a rural area is that there are fewer people around to see what you're doing.
And, really, if the cops in your town are worried about you walking around in the buff, on your property, you should move to a different town. Or get different cops.
posted by dfriedman at 6:27 AM on July 25, 2011
Sorry for screwing up the pronouns in that first sentence....
posted by dfriedman at 6:27 AM on July 25, 2011
posted by dfriedman at 6:27 AM on July 25, 2011
How long is your ritual? If it's less than half an hour long, and you get dressed after, odds are very good that even if cops are called, you'll be dressed again once they arrive. It's easy to say, "Yes, officer, I was dancing in my backyard, but I can't figure out why anyone would think I was naked."
posted by juniperesque at 7:41 AM on July 25, 2011
posted by juniperesque at 7:41 AM on July 25, 2011
It will also depend how well-staffed and well-funded your local police force is. In a rural area, you may be policed by the county sheriff's office? Anyway, with current funding and staffing levels, a lot of police departments are going to be totally uninterested in someone naked in their own backyard who's not actively exposing themselves to children.
I had neighbors who used to naked hottub in their backyard, and have naked hottubbing parties, with no screening and totally visible to neighborhood children (in an urban neighborhood with small lots) as there's an alley behind, who had the cops called on them ALL THE TIME for that and for some noisy domestic dispute situations, and they never got cited. The cops basically figured, hey, they're in their backyard, it's after 8 p.m. so little kids are in bed, and we have shootings and drug deals to respond to. YMMV based on police funding levels and community norms about property and nudity.
I don't know off the top of my head, but I'm sort of curious how, say, naked PETA protests have been handled if any have been litigated -- does the free speech issue override the indecency statutes? (We had a naked PETA protest downtown at noon. They were arrested but not prosecuted since it was unlikely they'd be back, so why waste the money?) I have no idea what the case law is, but I feel like it's not unreasonable to be naked on one's own property for genuine religious purposes. Be an interesting First Amendment issue if it hasn't already been litigated.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 7:49 AM on July 25, 2011
I had neighbors who used to naked hottub in their backyard, and have naked hottubbing parties, with no screening and totally visible to neighborhood children (in an urban neighborhood with small lots) as there's an alley behind, who had the cops called on them ALL THE TIME for that and for some noisy domestic dispute situations, and they never got cited. The cops basically figured, hey, they're in their backyard, it's after 8 p.m. so little kids are in bed, and we have shootings and drug deals to respond to. YMMV based on police funding levels and community norms about property and nudity.
I don't know off the top of my head, but I'm sort of curious how, say, naked PETA protests have been handled if any have been litigated -- does the free speech issue override the indecency statutes? (We had a naked PETA protest downtown at noon. They were arrested but not prosecuted since it was unlikely they'd be back, so why waste the money?) I have no idea what the case law is, but I feel like it's not unreasonable to be naked on one's own property for genuine religious purposes. Be an interesting First Amendment issue if it hasn't already been litigated.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 7:49 AM on July 25, 2011
It strikes me that some kind of fence or hedges would just take care of the problem altogether -- and a one-time expense is probably cheaper and less time-consuming than having to file any paperwork with any local ordinances 4 times a year.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:12 AM on July 25, 2011
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:12 AM on July 25, 2011
juniperesque writes "'Yes, officer, I was dancing in my backyard, but I can't figure out why anyone would think I was naked.'"
A simple photograph is going to neuter this line of defence.
posted by Mitheral at 8:18 AM on July 25, 2011
A simple photograph is going to neuter this line of defence.
posted by Mitheral at 8:18 AM on July 25, 2011
Probably worth taking some precautions. Did you see the story from 2009 about the guy who was arrested for indecent exposure because some busybody saw him naked in his own house through a kitchen window?
posted by Aquaman at 8:19 AM on July 25, 2011
posted by Aquaman at 8:19 AM on July 25, 2011
String up some clothes lines and hang out some sheets. For some reason, cops are less resistant to arresting someone dancing naked with appropriate props.
posted by Ardiril at 8:21 AM on July 25, 2011
posted by Ardiril at 8:21 AM on July 25, 2011
You could move to Oregon. I was baffled by this question as it never occurred to me that it'd be illegal, I mean... you can roller skate down the street naked here and no one can do anything about it except ask nicely that you don some clothes (and you don't have to comply).
posted by togdon at 9:04 AM on July 25, 2011
posted by togdon at 9:04 AM on July 25, 2011
I think the law has less relevance here than the character of your neighbors.
As well, your gender. I think a male dancing naked alone has several times the likelihood of being arrested compared to a woman dancing naked alone, almost no matter where you are in the country.
a lot of police departments are going to be totally uninterested in someone naked in their own backyard who's not actively exposing themselves to children
See, here's the thing. The cops themselves might not care, but if they got a call, they may decide they have to act regardless, even if it's a simple non-criminal ticket.
posted by dhartung at 12:21 PM on July 25, 2011
As well, your gender. I think a male dancing naked alone has several times the likelihood of being arrested compared to a woman dancing naked alone, almost no matter where you are in the country.
a lot of police departments are going to be totally uninterested in someone naked in their own backyard who's not actively exposing themselves to children
See, here's the thing. The cops themselves might not care, but if they got a call, they may decide they have to act regardless, even if it's a simple non-criminal ticket.
posted by dhartung at 12:21 PM on July 25, 2011
"The cops themselves might not care, but if they got a call, they may decide they have to act regardless, even if it's a simple non-criminal ticket."
Right, my point was, if your police force is understaffed and underfunded, they may have better things to do respond to a complaint about nudity.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 1:07 PM on July 25, 2011
Right, my point was, if your police force is understaffed and underfunded, they may have better things to do respond to a complaint about nudity.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 1:07 PM on July 25, 2011
Aquaman: about that guy arrested for being nekkid in his own kitchen: the woman who reported him was, at the time, taking a shortcut RIGHT THROUGH HIS YARD --- but was *she* arrested or charged with trespassing? If I mention that she's considered a neighborhood busybody (whose husband is in local law enforcement), you can probably guess the answer.....
posted by easily confused at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2011
posted by easily confused at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2011
And Matthew McConaughey found out that in Austin, TX you can't play the bongos naked while smoking pot in your own home.
posted by calgirl at 8:37 PM on July 25, 2011
posted by calgirl at 8:37 PM on July 25, 2011
I really can't imagine that the cops are going to give you the ok on this if you tell them ahead of time - you're basically asking them - hey do you mind if I potentially make you a whole lot more work tonight? If some neighbour gets their knickers in a knot and asks you to put some pants on, how do you think it's going to go over if you say, "the cops said it was ok" ?
My brother's a cop, and having heard some of his stories, it's pretty clear that they have to deal with kooky complaints all the time, and they don't like their time being wasted on them any more than anyone else would. They might get a good hearty laugh out of it, though.
(and calgirl, can you blame the cops in that case? bongos are pretty annoying)
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 9:49 PM on July 25, 2011
My brother's a cop, and having heard some of his stories, it's pretty clear that they have to deal with kooky complaints all the time, and they don't like their time being wasted on them any more than anyone else would. They might get a good hearty laugh out of it, though.
(and calgirl, can you blame the cops in that case? bongos are pretty annoying)
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 9:49 PM on July 25, 2011
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Kololo at 6:05 AM on July 25, 2011