12 cabins, 12 vacancies.
May 10, 2005 12:02 PM Subscribe
Would you buy a house in which someone had been murdered?
is this a poll are is there a point to the question?
posted by FlamingBore at 12:07 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by FlamingBore at 12:07 PM on May 10, 2005
I'd consider two things: the neighborhood (is murder relatively common 'round those parts?) and what I think about the energy in the house. New age-y, I know, but it would concern me. Of course, if you believe in that kind of stuff, then you probably know that there are good juju things you can do to cleanse a living space.
posted by Specklet at 12:12 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by Specklet at 12:12 PM on May 10, 2005
A friend of mine bought a house where the previous owner had committed suicide. It was a tough listing in that market, so he ended up getting a good deal on it as a result.
He and his family has lived there for nearly ten years now without any spooky repercussions, so I guess it worked out.
posted by briank at 12:14 PM on May 10, 2005
He and his family has lived there for nearly ten years now without any spooky repercussions, so I guess it worked out.
posted by briank at 12:14 PM on May 10, 2005
Assuming that:
(1) It's a house I might buy otherwise in a neighborhood I'd be happy to live in
(2) There's no legal encumbrance hanging over the house -- no realistic danger of victims suing me, or cops wanting to tear my walls down in 5 years looking for new evidence
(3) You wouldn't know there'd been a murder unless someone told you (no stains, no funny smells, not even a little bit)
(4) The murder wasn't one that was likely to provoke an endless stream of onlookers gawking at the house and stepping on my shrubbery and peeking through the windows at me and Mrs. Xenophobe, or local teens to egg it, or otherwise inconvenience me after the fact,
Sure.
If this is happening to you, you could always have whatever manner of spiritual-type person you happen to subscribe to come in and bless it, or something sort-of equivalent to that. If you're an atheist rationalist, you have no business worrying about ghosts or bad vibrations and should just shout at the blood coursing down the walls GO AWAY YOU'RE NOT REAL I ABJURE AND COMMAND YOU IN THE NAME OF DAWKINS AND SAGAN TO DEPART!
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 12:16 PM on May 10, 2005
(1) It's a house I might buy otherwise in a neighborhood I'd be happy to live in
(2) There's no legal encumbrance hanging over the house -- no realistic danger of victims suing me, or cops wanting to tear my walls down in 5 years looking for new evidence
(3) You wouldn't know there'd been a murder unless someone told you (no stains, no funny smells, not even a little bit)
(4) The murder wasn't one that was likely to provoke an endless stream of onlookers gawking at the house and stepping on my shrubbery and peeking through the windows at me and Mrs. Xenophobe, or local teens to egg it, or otherwise inconvenience me after the fact,
Sure.
If this is happening to you, you could always have whatever manner of spiritual-type person you happen to subscribe to come in and bless it, or something sort-of equivalent to that. If you're an atheist rationalist, you have no business worrying about ghosts or bad vibrations and should just shout at the blood coursing down the walls GO AWAY YOU'RE NOT REAL I ABJURE AND COMMAND YOU IN THE NAME OF DAWKINS AND SAGAN TO DEPART!
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 12:16 PM on May 10, 2005
I lived in a rent house in which the landlord's mother was killed by his cousin. Or so the neighbors told me.
posted by Doohickie at 12:16 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by Doohickie at 12:16 PM on May 10, 2005
I did (sort of). It makes a great conversation piece. The murder didn't actually take place in my building - it was planned here and the victim, perpetrator and "mastermind" were all residents or employed in the building - but I wouldn't have minded if it did. I love telling the story of "Too Handsome To Hang Harry".
Of course, the murder in question took place over 100 years ago...
posted by bonecrusher at 12:18 PM on May 10, 2005
Of course, the murder in question took place over 100 years ago...
posted by bonecrusher at 12:18 PM on May 10, 2005
Until recently I lived across the street from a house where a *very* well-publicized murder took place about thirty years ago. (Where Ira Einhorn killed Holly Maddox, for those who remember.) Although not quite the same, I loved it--there's no better conversation starter, and the neighborhood was quite peaceful and relatively safe, for West Philly. I had a lot of fun living across the street from a local legend, but I'm not sure I would have, say, taken the exact apartment, which is still rented out.
posted by kalimac at 12:22 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by kalimac at 12:22 PM on May 10, 2005
It wouldn't be an incentive, or a deterent. If I did end up buying the joint, I would try and find pictures of the murder scene and make a chalk outline to match.
posted by Jack Karaoke at 12:23 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by Jack Karaoke at 12:23 PM on May 10, 2005
Last house I lived in, a neighbor told me that somebody had been killed there. Spooked me for an hour or two, then I never thought about it again.
I'd say don't buy if you think it will bother you. But me? Sure, if it was a good house.
posted by grateful at 12:26 PM on May 10, 2005
I'd say don't buy if you think it will bother you. But me? Sure, if it was a good house.
posted by grateful at 12:26 PM on May 10, 2005
Sure, especially if it significantly lowered the price of a house I wouldn't otherwise be able to afford. I'm not above profiting off the superstitions of others.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 12:31 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 12:31 PM on May 10, 2005
I lived in an apartment in which a good friend of mine killed himself with a shotgun for years. I bet the current tennants don't know about the work that had to be done on the back hallway, nor would I expect there to be any rent discount considering the area's wacky rental market.
It made for some crappy pillow talk, though. "Hey, baby, if you see a ghost, don't worry. It's just Kev and he likes to watch... Wait, baby! Where you goin?"
posted by robocop is bleeding at 12:34 PM on May 10, 2005
It made for some crappy pillow talk, though. "Hey, baby, if you see a ghost, don't worry. It's just Kev and he likes to watch... Wait, baby! Where you goin?"
posted by robocop is bleeding at 12:34 PM on May 10, 2005
A friend of mine lived in an apartment building where a man had murdered his girlfriend in her bachelor apartment. They could never keep the apartment rented. If you're a superstitious person, it might bother you, but frankly, if it's for the sake of a good deal on a nice house, I think you can overcome that.
posted by orange swan at 12:35 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by orange swan at 12:35 PM on May 10, 2005
Purple drapes! Eeee! Ahem
I've lived in an apartment where someone got murdered. I didn't mind at all, and it turns out that kind of thing is worth Goth Cred. Outside of that, only sensible things (like ROU's list) would sway me one way or another.
posted by boo_radley at 12:35 PM on May 10, 2005
I've lived in an apartment where someone got murdered. I didn't mind at all, and it turns out that kind of thing is worth Goth Cred. Outside of that, only sensible things (like ROU's list) would sway me one way or another.
posted by boo_radley at 12:35 PM on May 10, 2005
Trent Reznor recorded Broken in the house where the Manson Family murdered Sharon Tate. I think he also lived there for a while.
posted by driveler at 12:43 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by driveler at 12:43 PM on May 10, 2005
Yes, I would. With my true-crime fascination, unless it were very recent, it would make for a good story.
kalimac, I read "The Unicorn's Secret." Very creepy guy, Einhorn.
In high school, my friend lived around the corner from a famous St. Paul murder house (the T. Eugene Thompson case, a lawyer hired men to kill his wife but like Rasputin, she kept fighting, and finally collapsed and died outside on the lawn). One night at a slumber party we all walked around past it and of course something freaked us out JUST AT THAT HOUSE and we all shrieked and ran.
posted by GaelFC at 12:44 PM on May 10, 2005
kalimac, I read "The Unicorn's Secret." Very creepy guy, Einhorn.
In high school, my friend lived around the corner from a famous St. Paul murder house (the T. Eugene Thompson case, a lawyer hired men to kill his wife but like Rasputin, she kept fighting, and finally collapsed and died outside on the lawn). One night at a slumber party we all walked around past it and of course something freaked us out JUST AT THAT HOUSE and we all shrieked and ran.
posted by GaelFC at 12:44 PM on May 10, 2005
Probably, but I would avoid buying a house that was bigger on the inside than the outside.
posted by helvetica at 1:03 PM on May 10, 2005 [1 favorite]
posted by helvetica at 1:03 PM on May 10, 2005 [1 favorite]
If we're talking about spooky stuff rather than property values, sure, I'd buy it. There are two logical alternatives: you believe in ghosts/vibes/spooky stuff, or you don't. If you don't, you have nothing to worry about. If you do, then you probably also believe in ways to get rid of said spooky stuff (Praying, exorcisms, burning incense, whatever.) So there's either no problem, or there's a problem that's easily dealt with. And as the posters above have said, it's a great conversation starter.
posted by unreason at 1:11 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by unreason at 1:11 PM on May 10, 2005
If it gets me a discount, why not? Somewhat related, my sister owned a house in Essex County Ontario that went through a mock poltergeist infestation. After involving the police, the phone company and various other agencies it turned out to be the poster child for post-partum abortion across the street. Because of the history she got a great deal on the house. By the time she sold it the story had mostly been forgotten.
posted by substrate at 1:18 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by substrate at 1:18 PM on May 10, 2005
Probably, but I would avoid buying a house that was bigger on the inside than the outside.
Agreed, even if it's only 1/4" bigger.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 1:40 PM on May 10, 2005
Agreed, even if it's only 1/4" bigger.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 1:40 PM on May 10, 2005
Hah! I'm in the middle of that book right now.
And to answer the question: yes.
posted by GeekAnimator at 1:49 PM on May 10, 2005
And to answer the question: yes.
posted by GeekAnimator at 1:49 PM on May 10, 2005
I think there's a fairly good chance of making a profit on a house that has recently played host to a major crime, as long as it has all been cleaned up by the time you get there, and you're not squeamish. The longer the crime is in the past, the less people will remember it and be affected by the 'oooh, murder happened' here vibe when making offers to buy, so if you buy cheap when the crime is recent and hold on to it for awhile, you would probably find that it appreciates better than other similar properties.
I don't think something like that would bother me, unless, as others have said it was such a high profile crime that it attracted lookie-loos.
posted by jacquilynne at 1:54 PM on May 10, 2005
I don't think something like that would bother me, unless, as others have said it was such a high profile crime that it attracted lookie-loos.
posted by jacquilynne at 1:54 PM on May 10, 2005
Depends. Mostly on the stuff ROU brings up, but here's one other practical concern:
Besides the police, looky-loos and egg-wielding teens, is the house of continuing interest to researchers, scholars, journalists, etc.? Is there any chance that the house will someday be declared a historical site? In the future, would I be reluctant to, for example, remodel or tear the place down or whatnot, because of its historical significance?
posted by box at 2:00 PM on May 10, 2005
Besides the police, looky-loos and egg-wielding teens, is the house of continuing interest to researchers, scholars, journalists, etc.? Is there any chance that the house will someday be declared a historical site? In the future, would I be reluctant to, for example, remodel or tear the place down or whatnot, because of its historical significance?
posted by box at 2:00 PM on May 10, 2005
man, no one is going against the grain on this one, and I'm going to have to. Personally, I'd never ever ever buy a house where a violent death occurred. I'm not particularly religious or anything (though I will admit to superstition) but stuff like that just creeps me out.
I can say this: my cousin bought a house with his wife on a regular suburban block. After living there for two years, one of the neighborhood kids let it slip that there had been a murder in the house. My cousin did some investigating and it turns out the kid was telling the truth. There had been a murder and a shootout with the cops that killed the killer, and some kid who was in the house. (long story short)
Even before he knew this, there were all kinds of weird goings on in the house. Voices in rooms where there were no people, lights turning on and off on their own, electronics sort of doing their own thing, etc.
They've stayed in the house and things still happen from time to time, but they just live with it. I would have gotten the heck out of there, like, with a swiftness, but maybe i'm just creeped out easier than most.
I say, if getting a deal on a house is worth it to you, and you're not a worrier, then by all means buy the house; don't think twice about it. But, if its the kind of thing even if nothing happens you're still going to worry about it or have it in the back of your head just remember: there's plenty of houses out there, and I'm sure you can find ONE where no one died violently.
(sorry for the monster post)!
posted by indiebass at 2:32 PM on May 10, 2005
I can say this: my cousin bought a house with his wife on a regular suburban block. After living there for two years, one of the neighborhood kids let it slip that there had been a murder in the house. My cousin did some investigating and it turns out the kid was telling the truth. There had been a murder and a shootout with the cops that killed the killer, and some kid who was in the house. (long story short)
Even before he knew this, there were all kinds of weird goings on in the house. Voices in rooms where there were no people, lights turning on and off on their own, electronics sort of doing their own thing, etc.
They've stayed in the house and things still happen from time to time, but they just live with it. I would have gotten the heck out of there, like, with a swiftness, but maybe i'm just creeped out easier than most.
I say, if getting a deal on a house is worth it to you, and you're not a worrier, then by all means buy the house; don't think twice about it. But, if its the kind of thing even if nothing happens you're still going to worry about it or have it in the back of your head just remember: there's plenty of houses out there, and I'm sure you can find ONE where no one died violently.
(sorry for the monster post)!
posted by indiebass at 2:32 PM on May 10, 2005
Hell, I'd buy it on purpose, and make it well known the murder ocurred there. Maybe I'd even restore the chalk line! (okay, that might be going a bit too far...)
a) If I know any nutballs they'll never come to my house (a good thing).
b) It'll probably keep all the people peddling insane religious rackets away from my house.
c) You can have a really cool set of coffee table books all about your home's history in particular.
d) Some burglars might reconsider ripping off a home where people are more likely to die...
You can't beat that.
posted by shepd at 3:26 PM on May 10, 2005
a) If I know any nutballs they'll never come to my house (a good thing).
b) It'll probably keep all the people peddling insane religious rackets away from my house.
c) You can have a really cool set of coffee table books all about your home's history in particular.
d) Some burglars might reconsider ripping off a home where people are more likely to die...
You can't beat that.
posted by shepd at 3:26 PM on May 10, 2005
It depends on whether I'd be inclined to buy the house anyway. That particular snippet is way down on the list of things I'd worry about when buying a house. The further back the murder was, the less likely it'd be to affect whether I'd buy the house.
Having said that, the house down the street was on the market for over a year despite being reasonably priced, and I know that at least two potential buyers decided they didn't want to buy it only because the previous owner's 13 yo son killed himself there.
posted by jlkr at 3:41 PM on May 10, 2005
Having said that, the house down the street was on the market for over a year despite being reasonably priced, and I know that at least two potential buyers decided they didn't want to buy it only because the previous owner's 13 yo son killed himself there.
posted by jlkr at 3:41 PM on May 10, 2005
Here's a story about the sale of a 'house of murder' that happened late last year. I loved the quote from the real estate franchiser regarding the non-disclosure and possible repercussions for the estate agent - "We don't go and slay them immediately. If they haven't done anything illegal, then we have to look at other issues, like are they damaging the brand?"
posted by tellurian at 4:25 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by tellurian at 4:25 PM on May 10, 2005
Only if it was an adult who did the dying. If I've learned anything from Japanese horror movies and their American remakes, dead children always seek revenge.
posted by gaelenh at 5:04 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by gaelenh at 5:04 PM on May 10, 2005
I think box nailed it--the only real issue for me would be the looky-loo factor.
posted by kimota at 5:10 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by kimota at 5:10 PM on May 10, 2005
Going against the grain with indybass — No, no, no.
(1) There might be a ghostie there; then again, there might now. Either way, the mere possibility of it would make it hard for me to relax. While that might be cool in a "haunted" hotel room, in my own home I think it would start to wear on me after a while.
(2) Supernatural entities aside, I wouldn't be able to stop my overactive imagination. I would picture the bloody crime scene in vivid detail again and again and again. Every time I walked by the spot, I'd think "That's where they found him."
(3) Knowing that something so terrible and heart-rending happened in my hallway or bathroom or kitchen, I would imagine my home as the physical center of emotional pain for the victim's relatives and friends.
To explain my position, perhaps, my father shot himself in the family home when I was a child. My mom and I continued to live there for a while, but it was never exactly comfortable (for obvious reasons). I always wondered how it felt for the people who subsequently bought the house, and being a child decided, it must feel weird. So I've probably got an existing prejudice against living in places associated with violent deaths.
posted by Jaie at 5:58 PM on May 10, 2005
(1) There might be a ghostie there; then again, there might now. Either way, the mere possibility of it would make it hard for me to relax. While that might be cool in a "haunted" hotel room, in my own home I think it would start to wear on me after a while.
(2) Supernatural entities aside, I wouldn't be able to stop my overactive imagination. I would picture the bloody crime scene in vivid detail again and again and again. Every time I walked by the spot, I'd think "That's where they found him."
(3) Knowing that something so terrible and heart-rending happened in my hallway or bathroom or kitchen, I would imagine my home as the physical center of emotional pain for the victim's relatives and friends.
To explain my position, perhaps, my father shot himself in the family home when I was a child. My mom and I continued to live there for a while, but it was never exactly comfortable (for obvious reasons). I always wondered how it felt for the people who subsequently bought the house, and being a child decided, it must feel weird. So I've probably got an existing prejudice against living in places associated with violent deaths.
posted by Jaie at 5:58 PM on May 10, 2005
Sure, why not? I mean, it's not like any of us are stupid enough to believe in ghosts, is it?
posted by Decani at 6:36 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by Decani at 6:36 PM on May 10, 2005
No, probably not. Doesn't seem like a particularly good investment. Future buyers will have the same hesitations you do. Also, take it from me, waking up stuck to the ceiling while mist that smells of blood and damp, rotten wood fills the room is a bad way to start the day.
posted by nixerman at 6:44 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by nixerman at 6:44 PM on May 10, 2005
I would, partly due to the deal I would get because of the disclosure policy (you have to disclose if someone died in a house and it usually lowers the cost). But also, if I really liked the house I would feel I was doing it a favor by loving it again instead of leaving it as is with the bad mojo.
posted by toftk at 7:44 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by toftk at 7:44 PM on May 10, 2005
Side note: They had to demolish the apartment building in Milwaukee where Jeffery Dahlmer lived and did his deeds. Too many nut cases wanted to look is the reason I heard.
I'd not be too bothered apart from the intrusion by curiosity seekers. This disclosure thing is strange to me. But then, I abhor laws based on superstition. Superstition is fine, and can be fun, just don't enforce it at the point of a gun.
posted by Goofyy at 8:23 PM on May 10, 2005
I'd not be too bothered apart from the intrusion by curiosity seekers. This disclosure thing is strange to me. But then, I abhor laws based on superstition. Superstition is fine, and can be fun, just don't enforce it at the point of a gun.
posted by Goofyy at 8:23 PM on May 10, 2005
Murder aside, any building of any age has to have had someone die in it. It's the human condition.
posted by zadcat at 8:45 PM on May 10, 2005
posted by zadcat at 8:45 PM on May 10, 2005
If a child had been murdered in the house then I wouldn't buy it.
Other than that...sure.
posted by hojoki at 2:56 AM on May 11, 2005
Other than that...sure.
posted by hojoki at 2:56 AM on May 11, 2005
hojoki: I'm fascinated. Care to explain the rationale behind that?
posted by Decani at 4:28 AM on May 11, 2005
posted by Decani at 4:28 AM on May 11, 2005
Current house, last owner, suicide in the garage, no problems. Got a good deal on it, it had been on the market forever. I'd buy this one again in a minute.
Previous house: Pretty sure it had a body in the basement, and we all got used to turning off lights we didn't turn on. I didn't know that when I bought it. It had knob & tube wiring, so it could have just been that.
(Someone's going to ask, how can you not notice a body in the basement? Well, there was a corner, like 8' by 12' cut off with cinder blocks and the face was bricked up. That corner was originally supposed to have been a coal bin. The last year I lived there, I chiseled out a couple of bricks and peeked, it was full of lath and plaster, construction debris, all the way to the floor joists. It was over 100 years old then, and some guy who lived there back around WW II walked across the street to the bar and shot and killed some relative. Since it would have been a hideous job to move all that to find out, and I didn't want to know because I was about to sell, I just poked the bricks back in and wandered off.)
posted by deep_cover at 5:50 AM on May 11, 2005
Previous house: Pretty sure it had a body in the basement, and we all got used to turning off lights we didn't turn on. I didn't know that when I bought it. It had knob & tube wiring, so it could have just been that.
(Someone's going to ask, how can you not notice a body in the basement? Well, there was a corner, like 8' by 12' cut off with cinder blocks and the face was bricked up. That corner was originally supposed to have been a coal bin. The last year I lived there, I chiseled out a couple of bricks and peeked, it was full of lath and plaster, construction debris, all the way to the floor joists. It was over 100 years old then, and some guy who lived there back around WW II walked across the street to the bar and shot and killed some relative. Since it would have been a hideous job to move all that to find out, and I didn't want to know because I was about to sell, I just poked the bricks back in and wandered off.)
posted by deep_cover at 5:50 AM on May 11, 2005
"hojoki: I'm fascinated. Care to explain the rationale behind that?"
I'm a Mom.
posted by hojoki at 3:50 AM on May 12, 2005
I'm a Mom.
posted by hojoki at 3:50 AM on May 12, 2005
hojoki: I'm sorry, I don't see how that explains it. Why does your being a mom make a difference?
posted by Decani at 9:34 AM on May 13, 2005
posted by Decani at 9:34 AM on May 13, 2005
I wouldn't feel comfortable, as a Mom, knowingly buying and living in a house in which a child had been murdered.
posted by hojoki at 12:31 PM on May 13, 2005
posted by hojoki at 12:31 PM on May 13, 2005
hojoki... I'm sorry if I seem really stupid here... but why not? What possible difference could past events make to what happens to you and yours in that house? All sorts of bad things must have happened in any house of a reasonable age. Do you consider those when you buy a house? Do you ask for a history? How would you know if it was true if you did?
posted by Decani at 5:09 PM on May 14, 2005
posted by Decani at 5:09 PM on May 14, 2005
You're not stupid, Decani, you just want a logical/rational explanation for my choice and my answer has been insufficiant for you thus far. I'm afraid it will have to remain so, unfortunately, because my choice is based on a feeling, a very strong maternal feeling, and feelings, as I'm sure you're aware, don't often lend themselves to reason. ;)
posted by hojoki at 6:57 AM on May 15, 2005
posted by hojoki at 6:57 AM on May 15, 2005
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by LarryC at 12:07 PM on May 10, 2005