is this as good as it gets?
August 31, 2010 2:51 PM Subscribe
Is this as good as it gets?
I am cohabitating with a woman that I have been dating for about 2 years now. Initially I tried really hard to avoid any relationship with this woman, but after over a year of telling her no, she wore me down, and after realizing i couldn't afford a place to live without a roommate, and that she was pretty much my only option, ended up living with her despite saying no originally (and harshly).
So now we live together, and have for pretty much the entire time we have been dating. We don't tell each other that we love each other. I go through great lengths to keep her happy, which is hard because she is convinced that i will leave at any moment, which my self esteem and self image probably prevent. The one thing that does strike me as that when our relationship seems to almost be "roommate plus" things seem to sail smooth and on rare occasions our sex life seems to be healthier than I would like to admit, in at least one case healthier than a married friend's. However even in that aspect there isn't really any passion. I rely on this relationship for my well being as I cannot afford the rent in the city I live in alone (at the moment I am actually an unemployed full-time student, which wasn't always the case, but it came down to this recently and it was the best decision for me to finish school). I'm not even sure if I am looking for more. I crush on a lot of women i meet through out my day to day, but make no actions because I am not that kind of guy, to the point that I wonder if i weren't in this relationship if i would even be in a relationship at all (which wouldn't bother me).
My ultimate question then, should I just accept this? Accept the fact that I may not have a way out of this and move forward? Does the sex aspect mean that there may be more to it? There is a lot more backstory than I could include here (i think i tried once and it didn't get posted).
I am cohabitating with a woman that I have been dating for about 2 years now. Initially I tried really hard to avoid any relationship with this woman, but after over a year of telling her no, she wore me down, and after realizing i couldn't afford a place to live without a roommate, and that she was pretty much my only option, ended up living with her despite saying no originally (and harshly).
So now we live together, and have for pretty much the entire time we have been dating. We don't tell each other that we love each other. I go through great lengths to keep her happy, which is hard because she is convinced that i will leave at any moment, which my self esteem and self image probably prevent. The one thing that does strike me as that when our relationship seems to almost be "roommate plus" things seem to sail smooth and on rare occasions our sex life seems to be healthier than I would like to admit, in at least one case healthier than a married friend's. However even in that aspect there isn't really any passion. I rely on this relationship for my well being as I cannot afford the rent in the city I live in alone (at the moment I am actually an unemployed full-time student, which wasn't always the case, but it came down to this recently and it was the best decision for me to finish school). I'm not even sure if I am looking for more. I crush on a lot of women i meet through out my day to day, but make no actions because I am not that kind of guy, to the point that I wonder if i weren't in this relationship if i would even be in a relationship at all (which wouldn't bother me).
My ultimate question then, should I just accept this? Accept the fact that I may not have a way out of this and move forward? Does the sex aspect mean that there may be more to it? There is a lot more backstory than I could include here (i think i tried once and it didn't get posted).
You're not the kind of guy to cheat on her, you're the kind of guy who stays with her in a loveless, nebulous, quasi-relationship.
You're using her. Maybe she's using you, I don't know. But please do move forward. If you can't afford the city, then you need to move...or find another roommate who is very clear that you aren't together romantically.
posted by inturnaround at 2:57 PM on August 31, 2010 [21 favorites]
You're using her. Maybe she's using you, I don't know. But please do move forward. If you can't afford the city, then you need to move...or find another roommate who is very clear that you aren't together romantically.
posted by inturnaround at 2:57 PM on August 31, 2010 [21 favorites]
I rely on this relationship for my well being as I cannot afford the rent in the city I live in alone
Believing that is the source of your problems. If she left town tomorrow, somehow, you would find another place to live. Somehow, you'd survive. There are infinite ways to survive and get by, not just this one. By fixating on this relationship as the source of your well-being you are not seeing all the possibilities.
posted by Wordwoman at 3:00 PM on August 31, 2010 [9 favorites]
Believing that is the source of your problems. If she left town tomorrow, somehow, you would find another place to live. Somehow, you'd survive. There are infinite ways to survive and get by, not just this one. By fixating on this relationship as the source of your well-being you are not seeing all the possibilities.
posted by Wordwoman at 3:00 PM on August 31, 2010 [9 favorites]
Please. Give yourself way more credit for what you could do, okay? This looks like a pretty classic codependent relationship. She's taking advantage of your lack of engagement in life, which is super easy because you didn't even want to be here.
As someone said in another thread (albeit one more focused on abuse), you stay in a bad situation until the pain of leaving becomes less than the pain of staying. But it sounds like you're not feeling much of anything, and that's almost worse.
With your self esteem and self image issues adding to this supposed "can't say no" situation, have you been checked out for depression?
There are always ways to save money on housing and not go through this kind of purgatory. Does your school have a housing referral service? Could you take a room in someone's home, or a co-op? Could you live somewhere in exchange for help with personal care or chores? Why was she the only option as a roommate? Keep to yourself and be a generally decent person, and you'd be way ahead of a lot of creepy college roommates I've heard of.
posted by Madamina at 3:01 PM on August 31, 2010
As someone said in another thread (albeit one more focused on abuse), you stay in a bad situation until the pain of leaving becomes less than the pain of staying. But it sounds like you're not feeling much of anything, and that's almost worse.
With your self esteem and self image issues adding to this supposed "can't say no" situation, have you been checked out for depression?
There are always ways to save money on housing and not go through this kind of purgatory. Does your school have a housing referral service? Could you take a room in someone's home, or a co-op? Could you live somewhere in exchange for help with personal care or chores? Why was she the only option as a roommate? Keep to yourself and be a generally decent person, and you'd be way ahead of a lot of creepy college roommates I've heard of.
posted by Madamina at 3:01 PM on August 31, 2010
I am cohabitating with a woman that I have been dating for about 2 years now. Initially I tried really hard to avoid any relationship with this woman, but after over a year of telling her no, she wore me down, and after realizing i couldn't afford a place to live without a roommate, and that she was pretty much my only option, ended up living with her despite saying no originally (and harshly).
I don't understand why you seem to feel such a lack of control over the situation, as if she's a puppeteer guiding your every move, and you're just going along for the ride.
she is convinced that i will leave at any moment, which my self esteem and self image probably prevent.
So you're saying she's "probably" incorrect that you're going to leave -- but only because of low "self esteem and self image"? That is not a good foundation for a relationship. You know that, right?
on rare occasions our sex life seems to be healthier than I would like to admit
Whoa. Why would you not like to admit that the sex is good? I'm not trying to pick on your wording here. That just jumped out at me as a sign that you're profoundly uninterested in making this work on any level. You know, when the sex is bad in a relationship, the situation may or may not be fixable. When the sex is good but at least one person would rather not believe it's good, that would seem to indicate a terminal problem with the relationship.
There is a lot more backstory than I could include here (i think i tried once and it didn't get posted).
That's unfortunate, since it'd be useful for us to have more details. I feel like we're missing some important facts about why you've gotten into this situation ... with this attitude. The whole thing feels rather cryptic.
posted by John Cohen at 3:01 PM on August 31, 2010 [6 favorites]
I don't understand why you seem to feel such a lack of control over the situation, as if she's a puppeteer guiding your every move, and you're just going along for the ride.
she is convinced that i will leave at any moment, which my self esteem and self image probably prevent.
So you're saying she's "probably" incorrect that you're going to leave -- but only because of low "self esteem and self image"? That is not a good foundation for a relationship. You know that, right?
on rare occasions our sex life seems to be healthier than I would like to admit
Whoa. Why would you not like to admit that the sex is good? I'm not trying to pick on your wording here. That just jumped out at me as a sign that you're profoundly uninterested in making this work on any level. You know, when the sex is bad in a relationship, the situation may or may not be fixable. When the sex is good but at least one person would rather not believe it's good, that would seem to indicate a terminal problem with the relationship.
There is a lot more backstory than I could include here (i think i tried once and it didn't get posted).
That's unfortunate, since it'd be useful for us to have more details. I feel like we're missing some important facts about why you've gotten into this situation ... with this attitude. The whole thing feels rather cryptic.
posted by John Cohen at 3:01 PM on August 31, 2010 [6 favorites]
Woops, sorry, I realized right after posting my comment that I forgot to answer your lead question.
No, this is not as good as it gets.
posted by John Cohen at 3:02 PM on August 31, 2010 [1 favorite]
No, this is not as good as it gets.
posted by John Cohen at 3:02 PM on August 31, 2010 [1 favorite]
I suspect you know the answer to this already. This is not as good as it gets because you are living with a woman you do not love and apparently never had feelings in the first place.
The impression I get from your story is that she has feelings from you and you are only indulging her for free rent and possibly sex. If this is the case, I think it's pretty immoral to continue living with her. Take out a loan or mooch of your parents like the rest of your peers.
posted by vanitas at 3:07 PM on August 31, 2010 [7 favorites]
The impression I get from your story is that she has feelings from you and you are only indulging her for free rent and possibly sex. If this is the case, I think it's pretty immoral to continue living with her. Take out a loan or mooch of your parents like the rest of your peers.
posted by vanitas at 3:07 PM on August 31, 2010 [7 favorites]
Typo alert! That should be "had feelings for" and "mooch off your parents".
posted by vanitas at 3:08 PM on August 31, 2010
posted by vanitas at 3:08 PM on August 31, 2010
You sound depressed. Figure out something you actually want in life, instead of dealing with things that you don't especially not want.
posted by mikeh at 3:13 PM on August 31, 2010
posted by mikeh at 3:13 PM on August 31, 2010
It seems like you are using her, rather than her using you.
She pursued you, you pretended to like her, and now you pretend to care about her when you really don't. From her point of view, you are probably in love with her. She doesn't know that it is all a lie, and you are really with her because you can't pay rent somewhere else.
She is going to be devastated when she finds out the truth. It will be worse for her if you the longer you wait.
posted by twblalock at 3:18 PM on August 31, 2010 [4 favorites]
She pursued you, you pretended to like her, and now you pretend to care about her when you really don't. From her point of view, you are probably in love with her. She doesn't know that it is all a lie, and you are really with her because you can't pay rent somewhere else.
She is going to be devastated when she finds out the truth. It will be worse for her if you the longer you wait.
posted by twblalock at 3:18 PM on August 31, 2010 [4 favorites]
No, not even close. A relationship with someone you love and who loves you, who makes you laugh and pisses you off and makes you think, who introduces you to new things and makes the old stuff even more fun, who you admire and who surprises you and who you can't bear to think of ever losing . . . that's when it gets as good as it gets. And it is pretty darn wonderful.
It sounds like the first step for you is finding a new place to live.
posted by bearwife at 3:20 PM on August 31, 2010 [3 favorites]
It sounds like the first step for you is finding a new place to live.
posted by bearwife at 3:20 PM on August 31, 2010 [3 favorites]
Sorry, I'm not buying this.
She "wore you down"? Where were you living? Did she kidnap you and bring you to her house? How did she force you to move in with her, how did she force you to continue being in contact with her so she could wear you down?
You're the guy I lived with 15 years ago. He moved in with me for what was supposed to be three months while he found his feet in the city I lived in. We had been flirting by phone for months and had a light makeout session when we met up once at a friend's party in another city. He quickly became overwhelmed at the difference between the finances of life in a small town in the Southwest and a large city, so he ended up never moving out, despite me actively encouraging him to, making suggestions, offering to help him hunt. I urged him to find friends, he just glommed onto mine. We also started sleeping together. When we'd go out, he'd hold my hand or put his arm around me, but would never admit to being in a relationship. We would fight, I would ask when he was moving out, he would yell "What do you want me to do, live on the sidewalk?"
He finally moved out when he started sleeping with the woman across the hall. At least she had the good grace to move before I found out about it.
Grow up. Take some responsibility for your actions. Get a part time job, find a roommate share, move home with your parents, or at least for fuck's sake start sleeping on the couch. Tell her you are moving out and set a deadline.
posted by micawber at 3:21 PM on August 31, 2010 [24 favorites]
She "wore you down"? Where were you living? Did she kidnap you and bring you to her house? How did she force you to move in with her, how did she force you to continue being in contact with her so she could wear you down?
You're the guy I lived with 15 years ago. He moved in with me for what was supposed to be three months while he found his feet in the city I lived in. We had been flirting by phone for months and had a light makeout session when we met up once at a friend's party in another city. He quickly became overwhelmed at the difference between the finances of life in a small town in the Southwest and a large city, so he ended up never moving out, despite me actively encouraging him to, making suggestions, offering to help him hunt. I urged him to find friends, he just glommed onto mine. We also started sleeping together. When we'd go out, he'd hold my hand or put his arm around me, but would never admit to being in a relationship. We would fight, I would ask when he was moving out, he would yell "What do you want me to do, live on the sidewalk?"
He finally moved out when he started sleeping with the woman across the hall. At least she had the good grace to move before I found out about it.
Grow up. Take some responsibility for your actions. Get a part time job, find a roommate share, move home with your parents, or at least for fuck's sake start sleeping on the couch. Tell her you are moving out and set a deadline.
posted by micawber at 3:21 PM on August 31, 2010 [24 favorites]
You're actually closer to 'as bad as it gets' rather than 'as good as it gets'. Meaning, you sound pretty miserable but don't realize it. Get excited about the prospect of all the awesome laughs, inside jokes, fantastic meals, sexual experiences and adventures you could be having soon. End things responsibly and then go have them.
posted by iamkimiam at 3:21 PM on August 31, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by iamkimiam at 3:21 PM on August 31, 2010 [2 favorites]
No. It could be a lot better. You would probably be happier if you got a platonic roommate and talked to your doctor about what sounds like depression. Really, you could be much happier. The awful part about depression is that it lies to you and tells you you couldn't possibly feel better than you do now, which happens to be pretty crappy.
posted by callmejay at 3:39 PM on August 31, 2010
posted by callmejay at 3:39 PM on August 31, 2010
My ultimate question then, should I just accept this?
No. I mean, you could, but you shouldn't.
Accept the fact that I may not have a way out of this and move forward?
This only works if you add the word "comfortably" in there. Otherwise it is completely wrong. Yeah, getting out of this situation may well be a pain in the ass. You'll have to couch-surf. Or move back in with your parents. Or end up homeless for a bit. Whatever. But you have a way out. It's called "walking out the goddamn door and not coming back." Obviously, that's a gross simplification, but you're not chained to a wall.
Does the sex aspect mean that there may be more to it?
If it hasn't meant anything more so far, it probably just means you've found someone you can have good sex with. I can assure you this happens more than once per lifetime if you try hard enough.
There is a lot more backstory than I could include here (i think i tried once and it didn't get posted).
Type it up and contact a mod to throw it in here. Any and all backstory is insight into your history and your personality and can help us help you.
posted by griphus at 3:41 PM on August 31, 2010
No. I mean, you could, but you shouldn't.
Accept the fact that I may not have a way out of this and move forward?
This only works if you add the word "comfortably" in there. Otherwise it is completely wrong. Yeah, getting out of this situation may well be a pain in the ass. You'll have to couch-surf. Or move back in with your parents. Or end up homeless for a bit. Whatever. But you have a way out. It's called "walking out the goddamn door and not coming back." Obviously, that's a gross simplification, but you're not chained to a wall.
Does the sex aspect mean that there may be more to it?
If it hasn't meant anything more so far, it probably just means you've found someone you can have good sex with. I can assure you this happens more than once per lifetime if you try hard enough.
There is a lot more backstory than I could include here (i think i tried once and it didn't get posted).
Type it up and contact a mod to throw it in here. Any and all backstory is insight into your history and your personality and can help us help you.
posted by griphus at 3:41 PM on August 31, 2010
anonymous: “My ultimate question then, should I just accept this? Accept the fact that I may not have a way out of this and move forward?”
Yes. It sounds like your life is pretty much perfect.
“Initially I tried really hard to avoid any relationship with this woman, but after over a year of telling her no, she wore me down, and after realizing i couldn't afford a place to live without a roommate, and that she was pretty much my only option, ended up living with her despite saying no originally (and harshly).”
You're lucky – most couples' cute stories about how they met are insufferable and drab.
“We don't tell each other that we love each other. I go through great lengths to keep her happy...”
There's saying it, and there's doing it. You're doing one of those things. You're the student; make an educated guess at which one is more important.
“... which is hard because she is convinced that i will leave at any moment, which my self esteem and self image probably prevent... I rely on this relationship for my well being as I cannot afford the rent in the city I live in alone.”
Well, first of all, trust: if you don't think she trusts you, ask her if she does. Talk with her about why. Tell her why she has reason to trust you.
Second, your self esteem, self image, and reliance on this relationship: I guess I'm supposed to infer that you think you have low self esteem, and that's why you can't bring yourself to dump her. I would posit that you're hand-waving here, and you're just saying this to justify the wandering feeling. Everybody has friends with couches. If you need her, it's not just because she gave you a place to stay. It's not always easy to admit you need somebody, but it sounds to me like maybe you do.
“I crush on a lot of women i meet through out my day to day, but make no actions because I am not that kind of guy, to the point that I wonder if i weren't in this relationship if i would even be in a relationship at all (which wouldn't bother me).”
Heh. Everybody crushes, man. And notice that you're just repeating a truism at this point; if only you didn't need to be with her, then you wouldn't need to be with her! But you do. So... think about what you want and need, and accept that and move forward.
“The one thing that does strike me as that when our relationship seems to almost be "roommate plus" things seem to sail smooth and on rare occasions our sex life seems to be healthier than I would like to admit, in at least one case healthier than a married friend's.”
That's damned rare, man. Do what you wish, but very, very few people can say this.
posted by koeselitz at 3:50 PM on August 31, 2010
Yes. It sounds like your life is pretty much perfect.
“Initially I tried really hard to avoid any relationship with this woman, but after over a year of telling her no, she wore me down, and after realizing i couldn't afford a place to live without a roommate, and that she was pretty much my only option, ended up living with her despite saying no originally (and harshly).”
You're lucky – most couples' cute stories about how they met are insufferable and drab.
“We don't tell each other that we love each other. I go through great lengths to keep her happy...”
There's saying it, and there's doing it. You're doing one of those things. You're the student; make an educated guess at which one is more important.
“... which is hard because she is convinced that i will leave at any moment, which my self esteem and self image probably prevent... I rely on this relationship for my well being as I cannot afford the rent in the city I live in alone.”
Well, first of all, trust: if you don't think she trusts you, ask her if she does. Talk with her about why. Tell her why she has reason to trust you.
Second, your self esteem, self image, and reliance on this relationship: I guess I'm supposed to infer that you think you have low self esteem, and that's why you can't bring yourself to dump her. I would posit that you're hand-waving here, and you're just saying this to justify the wandering feeling. Everybody has friends with couches. If you need her, it's not just because she gave you a place to stay. It's not always easy to admit you need somebody, but it sounds to me like maybe you do.
“I crush on a lot of women i meet through out my day to day, but make no actions because I am not that kind of guy, to the point that I wonder if i weren't in this relationship if i would even be in a relationship at all (which wouldn't bother me).”
Heh. Everybody crushes, man. And notice that you're just repeating a truism at this point; if only you didn't need to be with her, then you wouldn't need to be with her! But you do. So... think about what you want and need, and accept that and move forward.
“The one thing that does strike me as that when our relationship seems to almost be "roommate plus" things seem to sail smooth and on rare occasions our sex life seems to be healthier than I would like to admit, in at least one case healthier than a married friend's.”
That's damned rare, man. Do what you wish, but very, very few people can say this.
posted by koeselitz at 3:50 PM on August 31, 2010
I'm guessing you're probably in your early to mid-twenties.
In any case, you are letting your very likely unjustified fear of inadequate rent-paying skills rob you of tremendous fun... and you really, really do not want to look back on this period as The Time You Missed Out On All the Fun You Should Have Been Having.
Fortunately, because you are paying half or at least some of the rent, your next step is simple:
Put a "looking for a roommate" ad up on Craigslist; as it is, you're denying yourself a better life, as well as denying your UnGirlfriend the attention of someone who actually cares about her.
In the worst case, you'll have a slightly smaller living space than the one you have now... yet likely be enjoying guests with whom you have genuine fun.
posted by darth_tedious at 3:55 PM on August 31, 2010 [1 favorite]
In any case, you are letting your very likely unjustified fear of inadequate rent-paying skills rob you of tremendous fun... and you really, really do not want to look back on this period as The Time You Missed Out On All the Fun You Should Have Been Having.
Fortunately, because you are paying half or at least some of the rent, your next step is simple:
Put a "looking for a roommate" ad up on Craigslist; as it is, you're denying yourself a better life, as well as denying your UnGirlfriend the attention of someone who actually cares about her.
In the worst case, you'll have a slightly smaller living space than the one you have now... yet likely be enjoying guests with whom you have genuine fun.
posted by darth_tedious at 3:55 PM on August 31, 2010 [1 favorite]
That's damned rare, man. Do what you wish, but very, very few people can say this.
I was completely unable to parse the sentence to which you are replying, joeselitz. What does he mean? What do you mean?
posted by griphus at 4:07 PM on August 31, 2010
I was completely unable to parse the sentence to which you are replying, joeselitz. What does he mean? What do you mean?
posted by griphus at 4:07 PM on August 31, 2010
Grow up. Stop using her. Find an alternative financial resource or solution that doesn't involve having sex and living with a woman you don't love.
Can't you?
posted by zulo at 4:07 PM on August 31, 2010 [2 favorites]
Can't you?
posted by zulo at 4:07 PM on August 31, 2010 [2 favorites]
You totally know the answer to this, or else you wouldn't have even asked the question. Here's your validation. Break up with her, don't be a jerk about it. It's you, not her. (Really...not one makes anyone do anything, you make your own choices. Not trying to be a jerk but that's what it is.) Make it clear that it's over. Cut off communication, don't answer calls. It will suck for you, and it will really suck for her, but it will suck more for both of you if you stay.
Like others have said, even though you're not into her, there's someone out there who could be into her, and it's unfair of you to keep her from that. It's also unfair to yourself to keep yourself in a situation where you're thinking, "is this IT?"
I was an unemployed full time student when I moved to one of the most expensive cities in the world (into a roommate/share situation). Most of us make it work, you can too. Suck it up.
posted by AlisonM at 4:17 PM on August 31, 2010 [1 favorite]
Like others have said, even though you're not into her, there's someone out there who could be into her, and it's unfair of you to keep her from that. It's also unfair to yourself to keep yourself in a situation where you're thinking, "is this IT?"
I was an unemployed full time student when I moved to one of the most expensive cities in the world (into a roommate/share situation). Most of us make it work, you can too. Suck it up.
posted by AlisonM at 4:17 PM on August 31, 2010 [1 favorite]
gotta pay your dues before you pay the rent
posted by philip-random at 4:18 PM on August 31, 2010
posted by philip-random at 4:18 PM on August 31, 2010
Initially I tried really hard to avoid any relationship with this woman, but after over a year of telling her no, she wore me down, and after realizing i couldn't afford a place to live without a roommate, and that she was pretty much my only option, ended up living with her despite saying no originally (and harshly).
I'm more sympathetic to the OP here. What he's described is a relationship with a Nice Guy, just with the genders swapped. There's a debate (for another time) about whether Nice Guying is gender specific, and a serious question (for the OP only) about whether what he has described is accurate, but the relationship he has described does not involve conditions necessary for uninhibited consent (nor does she seem to accept that 'no' means 'no'). Whether he's using her for rent or she's exploiting his economic insecurity to maintain control is irrelevant to the fact that OP has described a very bad relationship dynamic, unlikely to lead anyone to any lasting happiness.
Save up enough money, quickly, so that you can move in with another roommate. This shouldn't take long if you're realistic about getting out.
Break up with your girlfriend and move out ASAP.
posted by Marty Marx at 4:47 PM on August 31, 2010 [2 favorites]
I'm more sympathetic to the OP here. What he's described is a relationship with a Nice Guy, just with the genders swapped. There's a debate (for another time) about whether Nice Guying is gender specific, and a serious question (for the OP only) about whether what he has described is accurate, but the relationship he has described does not involve conditions necessary for uninhibited consent (nor does she seem to accept that 'no' means 'no'). Whether he's using her for rent or she's exploiting his economic insecurity to maintain control is irrelevant to the fact that OP has described a very bad relationship dynamic, unlikely to lead anyone to any lasting happiness.
Save up enough money, quickly, so that you can move in with another roommate. This shouldn't take long if you're realistic about getting out.
Break up with your girlfriend and move out ASAP.
posted by Marty Marx at 4:47 PM on August 31, 2010 [2 favorites]
Not only is this not as good as it gets, but being single and living with a stranger you met on craigslist is, in fact, better. Act accordingly.
posted by Ragged Richard at 4:48 PM on August 31, 2010
posted by Ragged Richard at 4:48 PM on August 31, 2010
You know it could be better.
But please do not blame your situation on your girlfriend. You made choices all along the line, you just refuse to take responsibility for them.
Her 'wearing you down' was really you fooling around, not making decisions until the only one left to you was moving in with her. That--abdicating responsibility for your own life--was a choice you made, and you are pawning it off on her. It's similar to when someone wants to break up with their SO and so treats the person so badly the SO ends up breaking it off instead. It's a cowardly choice, the path of least resistance.
And until you start taking risks, making decisions and accepting the consequences for them, you probably won't be happy.
Which is too bad, because a good sex life is nothing to sneeze at, and you wouldn't have to 'go to great lengths to keep your girlfriend happy' if you would be clear about your intentions, so she wouldn't constantly worry you were going to leave. Either make a commitment to stay, or set a definite date to go. You'll be doing the both of you a favor.
posted by misha at 4:51 PM on August 31, 2010 [5 favorites]
But please do not blame your situation on your girlfriend. You made choices all along the line, you just refuse to take responsibility for them.
Her 'wearing you down' was really you fooling around, not making decisions until the only one left to you was moving in with her. That--abdicating responsibility for your own life--was a choice you made, and you are pawning it off on her. It's similar to when someone wants to break up with their SO and so treats the person so badly the SO ends up breaking it off instead. It's a cowardly choice, the path of least resistance.
And until you start taking risks, making decisions and accepting the consequences for them, you probably won't be happy.
Which is too bad, because a good sex life is nothing to sneeze at, and you wouldn't have to 'go to great lengths to keep your girlfriend happy' if you would be clear about your intentions, so she wouldn't constantly worry you were going to leave. Either make a commitment to stay, or set a definite date to go. You'll be doing the both of you a favor.
posted by misha at 4:51 PM on August 31, 2010 [5 favorites]
I'm going to be kind of blunt because it sounds like you need it. I'm not being harsh just for the sake of it, though.
Not only are you not in love with this woman, it sounds like you don't even like her, maybe worse than that. She is convinced you're going to leave because on some level she can see you are not invested in the relationship whatsoever.
If as you say you cannot afford rent alone, then find roommates. Actual roommates with whom you are not faking a relationship. Even as an unemployed student, it's likely you qualify for some kind of funding from your school or other help.
You also sound desperately unhappy with yourself and unsure of how to move forward. I am hardly on the MeFi therapy bandwagon, but... find a therapist.
posted by asciident at 5:02 PM on August 31, 2010
Not only are you not in love with this woman, it sounds like you don't even like her, maybe worse than that. She is convinced you're going to leave because on some level she can see you are not invested in the relationship whatsoever.
If as you say you cannot afford rent alone, then find roommates. Actual roommates with whom you are not faking a relationship. Even as an unemployed student, it's likely you qualify for some kind of funding from your school or other help.
You also sound desperately unhappy with yourself and unsure of how to move forward. I am hardly on the MeFi therapy bandwagon, but... find a therapist.
posted by asciident at 5:02 PM on August 31, 2010
This is about as good as it's going to ever get if you continue to NOT TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR OWN CHOICES IN LIFE.
Years ago there was a comedian called Flip Wilson who had a routine called "The Devil Made Me Do It." His Geraldine character had an excuse for everything she did that was self-destructive or wrong - "The Devil Made Me Do It!" she would wail. It wasn't HER fault, it was him over there with the horns and tail.
The devil didn't make you do it. Nor did your live-in "make" you move in with her, nor did you "have to" move in with her because you couldn't afford your own place. You chose to give in to her importuning you, you chose to move in with her rather than, say, move in with roommates or get a second job or whatever. You can't be this passive in the face of the world or you will find yourself unfulfilled and resentful.
Therapy, coaching, self-help books - whatever it takes for you to take responsibility for your own life and your own decisions. Whatever you do with this relationship, if you are in charge of your life rather than its victim, you will feel much better about what you do.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 5:48 PM on August 31, 2010 [8 favorites]
Years ago there was a comedian called Flip Wilson who had a routine called "The Devil Made Me Do It." His Geraldine character had an excuse for everything she did that was self-destructive or wrong - "The Devil Made Me Do It!" she would wail. It wasn't HER fault, it was him over there with the horns and tail.
The devil didn't make you do it. Nor did your live-in "make" you move in with her, nor did you "have to" move in with her because you couldn't afford your own place. You chose to give in to her importuning you, you chose to move in with her rather than, say, move in with roommates or get a second job or whatever. You can't be this passive in the face of the world or you will find yourself unfulfilled and resentful.
Therapy, coaching, self-help books - whatever it takes for you to take responsibility for your own life and your own decisions. Whatever you do with this relationship, if you are in charge of your life rather than its victim, you will feel much better about what you do.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 5:48 PM on August 31, 2010 [8 favorites]
This kind of thing is why you don't settle or "cave in" and date someone you don't even like.
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:10 PM on August 31, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:10 PM on August 31, 2010 [1 favorite]
I've said it before and I'll say it again (and I probably stole it from someone else): You can have the best life you can possibly imagine. Everybody can.
posted by rhizome at 10:06 PM on August 31, 2010
posted by rhizome at 10:06 PM on August 31, 2010
griphus: “I was completely unable to parse the sentence to which you are replying, joeselitz. What does he mean? What do you mean?”
[It's just a small typo. Replace 'as' with 'is' and the sentence makes perfect sense.]
posted by koeselitz at 10:14 PM on August 31, 2010
[It's just a small typo. Replace 'as' with 'is' and the sentence makes perfect sense.]
posted by koeselitz at 10:14 PM on August 31, 2010
Also:
Anonymous, It sounds like you enjoy griping about this a little – and I know I'm the sole voice of dissent here – but it also sounds distinctly like you enjoy this situation a hell of a lot more than you're letting on. You're doing your damnedest to sound like you're completely miserable, but in my eyes you are a failure at being miserable. Come on. You didn't say a single bad thing about her or your life with her in that whole question! In fact, all I can get is that you seem to get along well (it's "smooth sailing") and that you often have a really great sex life. The only negative you seem to be able to come up with is that it was all her idea, and that you were opposed to it at first. Seriously, that's it?
I've met people who were miserable together. They wouldn't shut up about it. They'd talk about how annoying he was, how awful she was, how she'd never stop talking about Lady Gaga, how he'd always ignore her and go off with his friends, how she'd never want to have sex, how he'd never clean up after himself, how she kept using his stuff, how he didn't appreciate her family. Seriously, the things that unhappy, miserable couples complain about are freaking endless.
You? You can't even come up with one of those! I know you say you've left stuff out, but your 'complaining' consisted of 'well, I didn't want to at first, and I'm only here because I need a place to stay... but she's good for my self-esteem, the sex is sometimes great, and we get along fine. It's terrible!'
I get the feeling that you might think you're looking for something more, but you also haven't said what that is. "What if this is all there is?" you ask. Well, what else could there be? You can do just about anything you want to do in the context of a relationship. Seriously.
I really feel like some part of you just asked this question in order to try to find an excuse to let go, accept it, and enjoy it. I know that I probably don't know the whole story, but so far, your 'miserable' act stinks. I think you could use some work on loving each other better, but I also think you should just accept the fact that you already do love each other. Really. The relationship you've described is love, whether you want to accept that or not.
posted by koeselitz at 10:25 PM on August 31, 2010 [2 favorites]
Anonymous, It sounds like you enjoy griping about this a little – and I know I'm the sole voice of dissent here – but it also sounds distinctly like you enjoy this situation a hell of a lot more than you're letting on. You're doing your damnedest to sound like you're completely miserable, but in my eyes you are a failure at being miserable. Come on. You didn't say a single bad thing about her or your life with her in that whole question! In fact, all I can get is that you seem to get along well (it's "smooth sailing") and that you often have a really great sex life. The only negative you seem to be able to come up with is that it was all her idea, and that you were opposed to it at first. Seriously, that's it?
I've met people who were miserable together. They wouldn't shut up about it. They'd talk about how annoying he was, how awful she was, how she'd never stop talking about Lady Gaga, how he'd always ignore her and go off with his friends, how she'd never want to have sex, how he'd never clean up after himself, how she kept using his stuff, how he didn't appreciate her family. Seriously, the things that unhappy, miserable couples complain about are freaking endless.
You? You can't even come up with one of those! I know you say you've left stuff out, but your 'complaining' consisted of 'well, I didn't want to at first, and I'm only here because I need a place to stay... but she's good for my self-esteem, the sex is sometimes great, and we get along fine. It's terrible!'
I get the feeling that you might think you're looking for something more, but you also haven't said what that is. "What if this is all there is?" you ask. Well, what else could there be? You can do just about anything you want to do in the context of a relationship. Seriously.
I really feel like some part of you just asked this question in order to try to find an excuse to let go, accept it, and enjoy it. I know that I probably don't know the whole story, but so far, your 'miserable' act stinks. I think you could use some work on loving each other better, but I also think you should just accept the fact that you already do love each other. Really. The relationship you've described is love, whether you want to accept that or not.
posted by koeselitz at 10:25 PM on August 31, 2010 [2 favorites]
You didn't say a single bad thing about her or your life with her in that whole question! In fact, all I can get is that you seem to get along well (it's "smooth sailing") and that you often have a really great sex life.
But he doesn't have anything good to say about her or his life either.
The only strong points for their relationship is that they don't have conflicts and the sex is, at times, "good." There are many opportunities out there to have good sex, and I think it's worth trying to do it with someone you feel strongly about. Physically good sex + not getting into fights is a good start, but it shouldn't be all there is.
posted by John Cohen at 10:34 PM on August 31, 2010
But he doesn't have anything good to say about her or his life either.
The only strong points for their relationship is that they don't have conflicts and the sex is, at times, "good." There are many opportunities out there to have good sex, and I think it's worth trying to do it with someone you feel strongly about. Physically good sex + not getting into fights is a good start, but it shouldn't be all there is.
posted by John Cohen at 10:34 PM on August 31, 2010
Step one: go find a way to support yourself.
Step two: leave and go support yourself.
You're using her, and you're unhappy as a result, so best to just move on, as no, life isn't just like this.
posted by davejay at 10:52 PM on August 31, 2010
Step two: leave and go support yourself.
You're using her, and you're unhappy as a result, so best to just move on, as no, life isn't just like this.
posted by davejay at 10:52 PM on August 31, 2010
Mod note: From the OP:
To answer some of the questions brought up, we were living together (as roommates) while she was dating someone else about a year before we started dating. After some turbulence in the situation, her best friend insisted that we separate and moved in at this time. A month later her boyfriend dumps her and she is constantly over. I would go out of my way to avoid her and he would let her come over. I would be gone all day, come home and she would be there under the pretense of hanging out with him, but she was really there to see me. (he's gay and i may as well be posting this myself because it's no longer anonymous). It got really bad, to the point that one day when I told her to go home, because she was insisting on still hanging out, even though she was sick and needed rest, she left in tears and the next day(same night?) checked herself in to a local mental hospital on suicide watch.posted by mathowie (staff) at 11:53 PM on August 31, 2010 [1 favorite]
I am already using all of my student loans. My parents can't afford to help me, and to make matters worse, we just moved to a more expensive place.
Finally, none of this is really a secret between us. A year ago I asked my my mom about this via email, and then was having issues with a .docx attachment on my computer and her computer was the one that could read .docx. I unintentionally left my email logged in, and she found that email and read it. She cried for two days about it, and then it just...poof! it went away.
I may be immoral, I may well be using her, but at the same time, this is a lot more complicated than I feel i am allowed to get into, because the full story is about 5 years long with many other characters involved.
Even with your update, I still don't get what's going on. What's her best friend have anything to do with any choices you made? What am I supposed to infer from her night at the mental hospital?
I think you need a therapist because you sound confusing and maybe he/she could get real clarification.
Obviously break up with her. I'm sure breaking a lease for a small amount of money is possible. Or if it is too burdensome right now, quit ruminating over it and tell her you need to move out. Maybe she can get money from her parents and you can pay her back later.
posted by anniecat at 3:23 AM on September 1, 2010
I think you need a therapist because you sound confusing and maybe he/she could get real clarification.
Obviously break up with her. I'm sure breaking a lease for a small amount of money is possible. Or if it is too burdensome right now, quit ruminating over it and tell her you need to move out. Maybe she can get money from her parents and you can pay her back later.
posted by anniecat at 3:23 AM on September 1, 2010
It's really not that complicated, OP. If you want to live with her and continue to pool your finite resources to live together, that's fine...but you have to make it clear to her that you're not together. It's not fair to her to continue the illusion of a relationship. And while she may have read your confession to your mom that this is a sham, it is incumbent upon you to underline the reality that she may be ignoring now.
Just stop lying to her...and to yourself...that this is anything more than it is. Be an adult here.
posted by inturnaround at 4:50 AM on September 1, 2010 [2 favorites]
Just stop lying to her...and to yourself...that this is anything more than it is. Be an adult here.
posted by inturnaround at 4:50 AM on September 1, 2010 [2 favorites]
It got really bad, to the point that one day when I told her to go home, because she was insisting on still hanging out, even though she was sick and needed rest, she left in tears and the next day(same night?) checked herself in to a local mental hospital on suicide watch.
Did your girlfriend ever seek therapy for this? I mean ongoing, at least several months type of therapy. If not, she should have. That is her responsibility (not yours).
She cried for two days about it, and then it just...poof! it went away.
This is not a good sign. It sounds like your girlfriend can very easily funnel uncomfortable feelings/reality into denial. She wants to be in a working, loving, healthy relationship. Part of achieving that objective is avoiding information to the contrary. This is not healthy in any relationship.
Another part of achieving that objective may be to maintain AWESOME sex life. And maybe your sex life is, in fact, awesome, which only makes decision-making worse. But if sex feels more like a [fulfilling] scripted act than an emotional connection, you may want to consider how much of the sex is for you, and not necessarily for both. How honest is your girlfriend about her true feelings? Or are true feelings something you have both come to systematically avoid?
FWIW, I was in a 3.5 year relationship where we rarely said, "I love you." I'm not the type to often say it, and he was a bit demanding for it, so I figured this was a by-product of how we interacted. Push come to shove, when our relationship ended I realized we had a profound inability to speak honestly with each other without repercussion on much deeper issues such as family and sexual attitudes. I cannot say 100% that the lack of "I love you" was concrete evidence for it, but I can't help feeling they're somehow related. Just some food for thought...
It could very well be that the emptiness you're feeling in the middle of a "loving" relationship is something you've both internalized and have been feeding off from each other. In spite of the great lengths you go through to keep her happy, there may be nagging doubts... did she want you for YOU, or more because she needed somebody at that time? It sounds to me like your gut was speaking very truthfully early on in your relationship, FWIW.
mathowie, consider lining yourself up with a therapist. You say you have 5 years of backstory to consider - DO IT. Find a safe place with a safe person to put the whole story on the table. Take your time to sort out what you do like from what you don't, and decide how you want to proceed from there. IMO you're not so much immoral as growing up, just like the rest of us. If it's any consolation, from my circles of friends, your story is not so unique. Good luck!
posted by human ecologist at 6:22 AM on September 1, 2010
Did your girlfriend ever seek therapy for this? I mean ongoing, at least several months type of therapy. If not, she should have. That is her responsibility (not yours).
She cried for two days about it, and then it just...poof! it went away.
This is not a good sign. It sounds like your girlfriend can very easily funnel uncomfortable feelings/reality into denial. She wants to be in a working, loving, healthy relationship. Part of achieving that objective is avoiding information to the contrary. This is not healthy in any relationship.
Another part of achieving that objective may be to maintain AWESOME sex life. And maybe your sex life is, in fact, awesome, which only makes decision-making worse. But if sex feels more like a [fulfilling] scripted act than an emotional connection, you may want to consider how much of the sex is for you, and not necessarily for both. How honest is your girlfriend about her true feelings? Or are true feelings something you have both come to systematically avoid?
FWIW, I was in a 3.5 year relationship where we rarely said, "I love you." I'm not the type to often say it, and he was a bit demanding for it, so I figured this was a by-product of how we interacted. Push come to shove, when our relationship ended I realized we had a profound inability to speak honestly with each other without repercussion on much deeper issues such as family and sexual attitudes. I cannot say 100% that the lack of "I love you" was concrete evidence for it, but I can't help feeling they're somehow related. Just some food for thought...
It could very well be that the emptiness you're feeling in the middle of a "loving" relationship is something you've both internalized and have been feeding off from each other. In spite of the great lengths you go through to keep her happy, there may be nagging doubts... did she want you for YOU, or more because she needed somebody at that time? It sounds to me like your gut was speaking very truthfully early on in your relationship, FWIW.
mathowie, consider lining yourself up with a therapist. You say you have 5 years of backstory to consider - DO IT. Find a safe place with a safe person to put the whole story on the table. Take your time to sort out what you do like from what you don't, and decide how you want to proceed from there. IMO you're not so much immoral as growing up, just like the rest of us. If it's any consolation, from my circles of friends, your story is not so unique. Good luck!
posted by human ecologist at 6:22 AM on September 1, 2010
If you're still in university or college, you CAN find counseling services (paid for by student tuition fees). If you're in Canada, you can also access publicly available government-sponsored counseling services, although their wait times are months longer. Be clear and determined about the type of support you are seeking, and that you CANNOT see how to deal with this without support PERIOD. Be patient until they finally set you up with someone. It can be a long, indifferent process, but if you can tough it out, believe me, it CAN work, and it's better than doing nothing at all.
posted by human ecologist at 6:27 AM on September 1, 2010
posted by human ecologist at 6:27 AM on September 1, 2010
this is a lot more complicated than I feel i am allowed to get into, because the full story is about 5 years long with many other characters involved.
No, it's not complicated.
I'm not sure how a grown adult moves out of an apartment because someone's "best friend" 'insists' on it. What did they do? Did they change the locks on you? Did they box your stuff up and leave it outside the front door?
When you moved, what was allowing her to get into your apartment?
would go out of my way to avoid her and he would let her come over.
Who was letting her come over? Who opened the door and let her in? How did she have a key? What happened when you asked her to leave? Did you ever ask her to leave? Did you call the police, her best friend, her family, campus security?
Or did you just sit there like a lump and not say anything? I don't even care what the reason was, but if someone is in my house and I don't want them there, I am changing locks, I am calling the authorities, I am calling in my friends, I am banging on pots and pans and saying GET OUT. I am calling the landlord that someone has unauthorized access to the apartment and should be considered a trespasser.
Did you do any of these things?
You just moved to a more expensive place? Why? How? Who made you sign the lease? When she decided to move, why did you not just take your things and go somewhere else?
This is not HER fault. This is all your fault. The sooner you stop blaming her, and start doing something to fix the problem, the quicker you will get your life in gear.
I am sorry. I do not want to be harsh, but you are still blaming this on everyone BUT yourself.
posted by micawber at 10:14 AM on September 1, 2010 [2 favorites]
No, it's not complicated.
I'm not sure how a grown adult moves out of an apartment because someone's "best friend" 'insists' on it. What did they do? Did they change the locks on you? Did they box your stuff up and leave it outside the front door?
When you moved, what was allowing her to get into your apartment?
would go out of my way to avoid her and he would let her come over.
Who was letting her come over? Who opened the door and let her in? How did she have a key? What happened when you asked her to leave? Did you ever ask her to leave? Did you call the police, her best friend, her family, campus security?
Or did you just sit there like a lump and not say anything? I don't even care what the reason was, but if someone is in my house and I don't want them there, I am changing locks, I am calling the authorities, I am calling in my friends, I am banging on pots and pans and saying GET OUT. I am calling the landlord that someone has unauthorized access to the apartment and should be considered a trespasser.
Did you do any of these things?
You just moved to a more expensive place? Why? How? Who made you sign the lease? When she decided to move, why did you not just take your things and go somewhere else?
This is not HER fault. This is all your fault. The sooner you stop blaming her, and start doing something to fix the problem, the quicker you will get your life in gear.
I am sorry. I do not want to be harsh, but you are still blaming this on everyone BUT yourself.
posted by micawber at 10:14 AM on September 1, 2010 [2 favorites]
OP, I talk a lot. In over thirty years of not shutting up, ever, there has never been a situation so complex and a communication impasse so severe that it required me to provide five years of backstory and include the entire ensemble cast so that others might thoroughly understand the major issues.
Kiddo, your life is not the individual version of The Guns of August. Geopolitical alliances and transnational forces are not colliding before you while you watch helplessly. The poor old ostrich did not die for nothing. This is way smaller and way more manageable--and that's a good thing. It means you can make choices that will directly affect and improve your situation and well-being. You can fix this. Maybe not all at once, and it's going to take some work, but it's possible.
Right now, you are actively contributing to your own unhappiness. It's not even passive contributing: for example, by signing a lease and then moving into more expensive housing with someone you don't really want to live with or be in a relationship with, you are making a choice that results in you being more unhappy than you need to be. You don't need to frame these problems as as moral/immoral, using your girlfriend/not using her...whatever: maybe you are, maybe you aren't. That's honestly a side issue right now.*
The important part is that since you are contributing directly to a situation that is making you unhappy, you can also stop contributing. You really can. You may have to learn how to do so, and practice those skills, and that's where therapy or counseling would be extremely useful and practical for you. Your school's counseling center would be a good starting point.
*the issue of how your choices affect other people is not, actually, a side issue, but debating it either here or with yourself is an easy distraction that you can dwell on instead of taking steps to change the situation itself.
posted by Uniformitarianism Now! at 4:38 PM on September 1, 2010
Kiddo, your life is not the individual version of The Guns of August. Geopolitical alliances and transnational forces are not colliding before you while you watch helplessly. The poor old ostrich did not die for nothing. This is way smaller and way more manageable--and that's a good thing. It means you can make choices that will directly affect and improve your situation and well-being. You can fix this. Maybe not all at once, and it's going to take some work, but it's possible.
Right now, you are actively contributing to your own unhappiness. It's not even passive contributing: for example, by signing a lease and then moving into more expensive housing with someone you don't really want to live with or be in a relationship with, you are making a choice that results in you being more unhappy than you need to be. You don't need to frame these problems as as moral/immoral, using your girlfriend/not using her...whatever: maybe you are, maybe you aren't. That's honestly a side issue right now.*
The important part is that since you are contributing directly to a situation that is making you unhappy, you can also stop contributing. You really can. You may have to learn how to do so, and practice those skills, and that's where therapy or counseling would be extremely useful and practical for you. Your school's counseling center would be a good starting point.
*the issue of how your choices affect other people is not, actually, a side issue, but debating it either here or with yourself is an easy distraction that you can dwell on instead of taking steps to change the situation itself.
posted by Uniformitarianism Now! at 4:38 PM on September 1, 2010
From a MeFite who would prefer to remain anonymous:
I know you personally and I think this is a toxic relationship. You have more pets than you have space for because you feel too much sympathy for every stray animal that follows you home. The situation with the needy, self-destructive woman that you call your "girlfriend" but feel no attraction to (physical or otherwise -- let's be honest) is very similar. You have sex with her out of duty, to prop up her self-image. It's the same reason you try to convince yourself that you are happy with her.posted by jessamyn at 9:04 PM on September 2, 2010
I think you might possibly have enough money to live on your own. You'll have more when you no longer have to buy all of her food and gas and subsidize her partying and whatnot. Aren't you really just looking for permission to dump her because you feel like your friends (who invariably urge you to end the relationship) are too biased to trust? I hope that the voices here (ignoring the more judgmental and, alas, highly-favorited ones) will help you realize that staying in a loveless relationship and "trying to be happy" is not good for you or her. Please leave.
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:53 PM on August 31, 2010 [5 favorites]