Take a new temp job or stay at long-term job where he's thisclose to being fired?
July 23, 2010 3:11 PM Subscribe
Should my friend stay at a current job where he's been for a while but where all his friends are leaving and he's thisclose to being fired or should he take a new temp job which pays more but offers no benefits and no guarantee of being hired? Asking with friend's permission; he's feeling pretty mixed. He will know if he was offered the other job or not in a few days.
tl;dr *special snowflake* details inside.
My friend Mark has been driving forklifts and doing logistics stuff at X company for four years. At X company every time there is an accident/something dropped/something wrong, a worker gets "points". When someone gets 30 points, they're fired. Points get wiped away one year from the last infraction providing no new infractions. You're ineligible for promotion or bonuses whenever you have points. Mark has 30 points but thinks he hasn't been fired because the company doesn't want to train someone new.
Mark likes what he does and has worked with his coworkers for the past four years but the coworkers are dispersing. Two have been promoted to other departments and two are getting jobs elsewhere. Company X has great benefits but the shift is anywhere from midnight/2/4 AM to 10 AM. Everyone except managers works every weekend and workers are not guaranteed 40 hours a week.
Because of the above circumstances Mark has been job searching. He just had an interview that he thinks went well for a 6 month temp job which pays more and offers 40 hours a week. The new job is second shift, which he prefers. However, there is a possiblity but no guarantee he'd be hired after six months and there are no benefits until he is hired officially. The guy who interviewed Mark said hiring depended on how busy the company would be in six months.
Should Mark stay or should he go?
My friend Mark has been driving forklifts and doing logistics stuff at X company for four years. At X company every time there is an accident/something dropped/something wrong, a worker gets "points". When someone gets 30 points, they're fired. Points get wiped away one year from the last infraction providing no new infractions. You're ineligible for promotion or bonuses whenever you have points. Mark has 30 points but thinks he hasn't been fired because the company doesn't want to train someone new.
Mark likes what he does and has worked with his coworkers for the past four years but the coworkers are dispersing. Two have been promoted to other departments and two are getting jobs elsewhere. Company X has great benefits but the shift is anywhere from midnight/2/4 AM to 10 AM. Everyone except managers works every weekend and workers are not guaranteed 40 hours a week.
Because of the above circumstances Mark has been job searching. He just had an interview that he thinks went well for a 6 month temp job which pays more and offers 40 hours a week. The new job is second shift, which he prefers. However, there is a possiblity but no guarantee he'd be hired after six months and there are no benefits until he is hired officially. The guy who interviewed Mark said hiring depended on how busy the company would be in six months.
Should Mark stay or should he go?
oh, and those doing the hiring and such for the contractor - they will lie like a military recruiter. does he know anyone at the new company? any of the dudes actually working the job he's looking to work? they'll tell you the truth about contract to perm.
posted by nadawi at 3:23 PM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by nadawi at 3:23 PM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Mark's interested in keeping the job (AFAHK) but he doesn't know anyone there. He's working with a staffing agency who referred him to this company. The "staffing lady" said she "knew the HR lady" at the new company. So far the staffing lady seems pretty cool; always returns calls, sets interviews up quickly, but who knows? This is interview number two; Mark's interview at another company went well but per the staffing lady someone else was hired because they were bilingual.
posted by ShadePlant at 3:28 PM on July 23, 2010
posted by ShadePlant at 3:28 PM on July 23, 2010
recruiters absolutely lie, as a matter of course. i work in a business with a high-percentage of contractors hoping to go perm. we're a multinational telecommunications company, i work in a center with more than a hundred people on the floor.
last quarterly meeting we brought up the ratio and were told that what we shoot for as a company is 80% employee / 20% contractor but that what we're actually at currently is 10% employee / 90% contractor simply because they don't have the budget to convert those contractors.
now is not a good time to walk away from benefits-in-hand for the promises of someone who's job is to lie to you.
posted by radiosilents at 3:30 PM on July 23, 2010
last quarterly meeting we brought up the ratio and were told that what we shoot for as a company is 80% employee / 20% contractor but that what we're actually at currently is 10% employee / 90% contractor simply because they don't have the budget to convert those contractors.
now is not a good time to walk away from benefits-in-hand for the promises of someone who's job is to lie to you.
posted by radiosilents at 3:30 PM on July 23, 2010
the staffing agency is always sweet as pie when they're trying to hire you. if your friend gets placed in the job, they get a bucket of money and she probably gets a bonus. it's sort of like saying "the car salesman was really nice!"
and yeah, the staffing lady knows the hr lady because their 2 companies have a contract that's mutually beneficial. staffing agency gets to place staff, thus getting paid - and hr lady gets to put another person on staff that they can "cancel the contract" with at any time and doesn't have to pay things like holiday, 401k and insurance. they make out like bandits in this situation.
i'm not saying staffing agencies are evil or anything. they serve a very good purpose - but if wants this job because he will get hired on in under a year, he should realize that's probably not the case. depending on how big the company is and how big the staffing agency is, you could probably look up their hire to perm record online.
for instance:
kelly services
manpower
adecco
posted by nadawi at 3:38 PM on July 23, 2010
and yeah, the staffing lady knows the hr lady because their 2 companies have a contract that's mutually beneficial. staffing agency gets to place staff, thus getting paid - and hr lady gets to put another person on staff that they can "cancel the contract" with at any time and doesn't have to pay things like holiday, 401k and insurance. they make out like bandits in this situation.
i'm not saying staffing agencies are evil or anything. they serve a very good purpose - but if wants this job because he will get hired on in under a year, he should realize that's probably not the case. depending on how big the company is and how big the staffing agency is, you could probably look up their hire to perm record online.
for instance:
kelly services
manpower
adecco
posted by nadawi at 3:38 PM on July 23, 2010
the staffing agency is always sweet as pie when they're trying to hire you. if your friend gets placed in the job, they get a bucket of money and she probably gets a bonus. it's sort of like saying "the car salesman was really nice!"
True.
i'm not saying staffing agencies are evil or anything.
I am.
Still, I would take the six months gig. If it ends after six months, he should be eligible for unemployment. Whereas if he gets fired for "points" he would probably have to fight for it, at best.
posted by drjimmy11 at 3:46 PM on July 23, 2010
True.
i'm not saying staffing agencies are evil or anything.
I am.
Still, I would take the six months gig. If it ends after six months, he should be eligible for unemployment. Whereas if he gets fired for "points" he would probably have to fight for it, at best.
posted by drjimmy11 at 3:46 PM on July 23, 2010
Let me revise my statement I bit:
He should find out how often people really get fired for "points" - if it really happens or if it's just a scared straight. And if it does, whether the company contests the Unemployment claims.
posted by drjimmy11 at 3:52 PM on July 23, 2010
He should find out how often people really get fired for "points" - if it really happens or if it's just a scared straight. And if it does, whether the company contests the Unemployment claims.
posted by drjimmy11 at 3:52 PM on July 23, 2010
Response by poster: It *does* happen and the company does contest unemployment.
posted by ShadePlant at 3:56 PM on July 23, 2010
posted by ShadePlant at 3:56 PM on July 23, 2010
Still, I would take the six months gig. If it ends after six months, he should be eligible for unemployment. Whereas if he gets fired for "points" he would probably have to fight for it, at best.
Here's what I've heard about employment/temp agencies and unemployment: they rarely pay it. This is hearsay, but from a friend who worked for an unemployment office.
The way it works is that when your six months ends, should you file for unemployment, the temp agency will offer you another job. However, this job might be for a very short term, or during a shift you don't want, or for a lower wage, or lacking some other quality you came to expect in your previous placement. It might have a horrible commute, or some combination of these drawbacks. If you decline this offer, you are no longer eligible for unemployment, because you refused an offer of suitable work without good cause.
This is a good rundown of why temp agencies don't want you to get unemployment after you've worked for them and how they might try to do it.
posted by pullayup at 9:19 PM on July 23, 2010
Here's what I've heard about employment/temp agencies and unemployment: they rarely pay it. This is hearsay, but from a friend who worked for an unemployment office.
The way it works is that when your six months ends, should you file for unemployment, the temp agency will offer you another job. However, this job might be for a very short term, or during a shift you don't want, or for a lower wage, or lacking some other quality you came to expect in your previous placement. It might have a horrible commute, or some combination of these drawbacks. If you decline this offer, you are no longer eligible for unemployment, because you refused an offer of suitable work without good cause.
This is a good rundown of why temp agencies don't want you to get unemployment after you've worked for them and how they might try to do it.
posted by pullayup at 9:19 PM on July 23, 2010
Oops! Rather than "they rarely pay it," I should have said "they frequently contest it," because the temp agency doesn't directly pay your unemployment benefits.
posted by pullayup at 9:21 PM on July 23, 2010
posted by pullayup at 9:21 PM on July 23, 2010
Response by poster: It's Monday in the US and I am hoping more people who might be reading old questions once the work week has started can offer new opinions. The advice re: staffing companies is insightful but Mark is still hoping for some solid "stay or go" opinions... Thanks MeFi!
posted by ShadePlant at 9:20 AM on July 26, 2010
posted by ShadePlant at 9:20 AM on July 26, 2010
Response by poster: Mark was offered the job and he took it; at his current employer they were gonna give people weekends off but cut their hours to part-time so they could hire new people to work the weekends. We'll see how it goes! Thanks MeFi.
posted by ShadePlant at 9:29 AM on July 28, 2010
posted by ShadePlant at 9:29 AM on July 28, 2010
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in IT those contract to perm positions often take years to materialize into full blown employment (for the lucky ones).
posted by nadawi at 3:21 PM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]