How can I deal with these doubts?
July 23, 2010 8:53 AM Subscribe
I have reason to suspect my wife has, and is continuing to cheat on me. What do I do?
First, yes. I read her email. I don't feel good about it, but I did.
My wife has a friend, who used to be her English teacher. My wife used to ask my help in writing emails to him because she wanted the emails to be in 'good' English. He used to visit on business from time to time, and has just gotten new job where he will be coming back to live here full time with his wife and kids.
A couple months ago, on his last visit, my wife went out with him and some other of his old students. A mutual friend of ours got into a fight with my wife because she thought my wife was going to be cheating on me. That friend never said anything directly to me, and I believed what my wife told me, until today.
Last weekend, my wife told me she was going to go out with some friends with work. When I looked at her email, there were several mails from him right before and after that night, some talking about staying over night, and the last from him saying he had her shirt, and the last from my wife expressing happiness about having a reason to see him again.
I went back and looked for mails about the fight with our mutual friend, and there was a mail from my wife telling him that she had told me about what happened, but with "I told a lie" and saying she was afraid our friend told me about what happened. His response was to say that my wife was lucky I didn't kick her out, and that he hoped our friend wouldn't called his wife, since he had a son to think about, and his wife would leave her.
Obviously, by reading her emails, I've violated trust. I will only say that she has acted suspiciously, and had given me reason to doubt in the past as a justification for checking her emails.
I have called the mutual friend, who never really said anything to me about this, but she doesn't remember what happened, since she was pretty drunk. She did recommend that I call the guy (his number was in the emails), so I did. He denied anything ever happening, and was polite and as non-defensive as I guess you can be when an angry husband calls to ask if you've fucked his wife. I don't know whether to believe him or not, but I don't think he was lying. I asked him not to tell her that I called, and he said he wouldn't. I want to ask my wife, too, but I can't really do it without admitting I looked at her email, and I'm pretty sure she would refuse to hear anything I said after that.
What do I do? I feel sick. I'm trembling with anger and sadness and just feeling awful. I love, and want to continue loving my wife. I have chosen to live in a foreign country to be with her, and she is really one of the only reasons I'm still here. I don't want to leave here, as I doubt, at my age, that I could start a decent career back home. I most profoundly do not want to get divorced, but I feel I need to know the truth. If what her friend says is true, she hasn't cheated on my, but continues to be secretive about meeting this guy, especially in light of issues that have come up in the past. Do I confront her? What do I say? How do I do this?
First, yes. I read her email. I don't feel good about it, but I did.
My wife has a friend, who used to be her English teacher. My wife used to ask my help in writing emails to him because she wanted the emails to be in 'good' English. He used to visit on business from time to time, and has just gotten new job where he will be coming back to live here full time with his wife and kids.
A couple months ago, on his last visit, my wife went out with him and some other of his old students. A mutual friend of ours got into a fight with my wife because she thought my wife was going to be cheating on me. That friend never said anything directly to me, and I believed what my wife told me, until today.
Last weekend, my wife told me she was going to go out with some friends with work. When I looked at her email, there were several mails from him right before and after that night, some talking about staying over night, and the last from him saying he had her shirt, and the last from my wife expressing happiness about having a reason to see him again.
I went back and looked for mails about the fight with our mutual friend, and there was a mail from my wife telling him that she had told me about what happened, but with "I told a lie" and saying she was afraid our friend told me about what happened. His response was to say that my wife was lucky I didn't kick her out, and that he hoped our friend wouldn't called his wife, since he had a son to think about, and his wife would leave her.
Obviously, by reading her emails, I've violated trust. I will only say that she has acted suspiciously, and had given me reason to doubt in the past as a justification for checking her emails.
I have called the mutual friend, who never really said anything to me about this, but she doesn't remember what happened, since she was pretty drunk. She did recommend that I call the guy (his number was in the emails), so I did. He denied anything ever happening, and was polite and as non-defensive as I guess you can be when an angry husband calls to ask if you've fucked his wife. I don't know whether to believe him or not, but I don't think he was lying. I asked him not to tell her that I called, and he said he wouldn't. I want to ask my wife, too, but I can't really do it without admitting I looked at her email, and I'm pretty sure she would refuse to hear anything I said after that.
What do I do? I feel sick. I'm trembling with anger and sadness and just feeling awful. I love, and want to continue loving my wife. I have chosen to live in a foreign country to be with her, and she is really one of the only reasons I'm still here. I don't want to leave here, as I doubt, at my age, that I could start a decent career back home. I most profoundly do not want to get divorced, but I feel I need to know the truth. If what her friend says is true, she hasn't cheated on my, but continues to be secretive about meeting this guy, especially in light of issues that have come up in the past. Do I confront her? What do I say? How do I do this?
You had occasion to talk to your wife previously about the possibility of her cheating and she denied it. You now know she is lying and covering up a relationship of some sort with another man. I would give her one more option to tell you the truth without revealing what you now know. Something like, "I'm sorry but I have a bad feeling. If there's anything you want to tell me about our relationship, please tell me now and I promise to work my hardest to hear you out and put our relationship front and center. I love you and want our marriage to work. Is there anything you need to tell me?" Tell her this only if you can say it and mean it.
And see what she says. The bad news is that she has probably gotten a heads up from the other guy and may have a ready lie or fake contrition. Me? I would keep checking the emails, especially after you have this talk, and see what bubbles up. I subscribe to the two strikes and you're out approach. You will have given her two opportunities to be honest with you, one in ignorant good faith, another in informed good faith. If she turns down those opportunities it means the other relationship is the one she is choosing to protect. If you want to work on reconciliation, the Surviving Infidelity forums have some good ideas. Good luck. Remember to breathe.
posted by Yoshimi Battles at 9:22 AM on July 23, 2010 [2 favorites]
And see what she says. The bad news is that she has probably gotten a heads up from the other guy and may have a ready lie or fake contrition. Me? I would keep checking the emails, especially after you have this talk, and see what bubbles up. I subscribe to the two strikes and you're out approach. You will have given her two opportunities to be honest with you, one in ignorant good faith, another in informed good faith. If she turns down those opportunities it means the other relationship is the one she is choosing to protect. If you want to work on reconciliation, the Surviving Infidelity forums have some good ideas. Good luck. Remember to breathe.
posted by Yoshimi Battles at 9:22 AM on July 23, 2010 [2 favorites]
I can't know anything for certain but my instinct tells me the following things:
1. Your wife has probably cheated on you. I am so, so sorry. I truly am. This has got to be incredibly tough. But it's like this: She planned to stay overnight with this person, and left her shirt. That raises some alarms. What raises even more alarms is that she is lying to you about it and the exchange with the mutual friend suggests that she knew she was doing something wrong. Even if she didn't bone this guy, she did something that she knew you wouldn't be okay with, she did it anyway, and she lied to you about it.
2. The answer you got from the mutual friend - that she was drunk and doesn't remember, and that you should talk to the guy - is your friend's way of staying the hell out of this. She remembers exactly what happened, and doesn't want to be in the middle of this any more than she already is. Please respect her wishes on this and don't drag her into any further exchanges on this subject, no matter how much you feel like you need to.
You need to confront your wife, in the most non-confrontational way possible. As is, this is very damaging to you and every day that passes with this burden is hurting you more, and will continue to do so.
This ends the fair-play advice I have for you. The remainder is in slightly more murky moral territory and if you are not comfortable being a little snakey I suggest you stop reading now.
Reading your partner's emails is always wrong. It is never right. The fact that you found out she was up to some secret sneakery doesn't make it right. But the fact that she acted suspiciously makes it closer to justified than not. Yes, you violated trust, but she's lying to you about something. Those are the factors in play. The rest is between you and your conscience. What you did will never be right, but all things considered I believe you'll feel okay about it anyway.
When confronting your wife, I recommend having a sit-down some night very soon. Get on the couch and talk. You guess correctly that you will screw it up if she knows you read her email. So don't tell her. This is what I mean about being snakey: When dealing with a person who is covering something up, it is always to your advantage if they don't know how much you know, or how you came to know it. If you get into specifics, she can start fabricating a cover story. Start this way: Tell her that you know that she was not going out with co-workers last weekend. Ask her what she really did and why she lied to you about it. Tip as little of your hand as possible. If her story doesn't match up with what you already know to be true, then tell her you know that's not true - but gloss over exactly how you know that. You take away a liar's equilibrium and advantage if they don't know what answer you're looking for.
There will probably be responses to this which suggest that the above is in dubious moral territory (to put it lightly), and they wil be right, because it is. The preceding paragraph is your best bet for finding out what really happened. The truth will probably be quite painful but maybe you'll sleep better at night, down the line.
A marriage can survive small secrets and white lies, and indeed some people will say that they are all but necessary. It cannot survive huge secrets. They fester and cause rot. I don't believe that your marriage is sunk, but as long as there are huge secrets and as long as you have no idea what your wife wants, it's not going to get any better. You're involving other people in this as part of a drive to know the truth. Stop that. Talk to your wife about it, as kindly as you can. Don't yell. Give her a chance to explain. Unfortunately, there really isn't very much else you can do.
Good luck, and God bless.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 9:27 AM on July 23, 2010 [15 favorites]
1. Your wife has probably cheated on you. I am so, so sorry. I truly am. This has got to be incredibly tough. But it's like this: She planned to stay overnight with this person, and left her shirt. That raises some alarms. What raises even more alarms is that she is lying to you about it and the exchange with the mutual friend suggests that she knew she was doing something wrong. Even if she didn't bone this guy, she did something that she knew you wouldn't be okay with, she did it anyway, and she lied to you about it.
2. The answer you got from the mutual friend - that she was drunk and doesn't remember, and that you should talk to the guy - is your friend's way of staying the hell out of this. She remembers exactly what happened, and doesn't want to be in the middle of this any more than she already is. Please respect her wishes on this and don't drag her into any further exchanges on this subject, no matter how much you feel like you need to.
You need to confront your wife, in the most non-confrontational way possible. As is, this is very damaging to you and every day that passes with this burden is hurting you more, and will continue to do so.
This ends the fair-play advice I have for you. The remainder is in slightly more murky moral territory and if you are not comfortable being a little snakey I suggest you stop reading now.
Reading your partner's emails is always wrong. It is never right. The fact that you found out she was up to some secret sneakery doesn't make it right. But the fact that she acted suspiciously makes it closer to justified than not. Yes, you violated trust, but she's lying to you about something. Those are the factors in play. The rest is between you and your conscience. What you did will never be right, but all things considered I believe you'll feel okay about it anyway.
When confronting your wife, I recommend having a sit-down some night very soon. Get on the couch and talk. You guess correctly that you will screw it up if she knows you read her email. So don't tell her. This is what I mean about being snakey: When dealing with a person who is covering something up, it is always to your advantage if they don't know how much you know, or how you came to know it. If you get into specifics, she can start fabricating a cover story. Start this way: Tell her that you know that she was not going out with co-workers last weekend. Ask her what she really did and why she lied to you about it. Tip as little of your hand as possible. If her story doesn't match up with what you already know to be true, then tell her you know that's not true - but gloss over exactly how you know that. You take away a liar's equilibrium and advantage if they don't know what answer you're looking for.
There will probably be responses to this which suggest that the above is in dubious moral territory (to put it lightly), and they wil be right, because it is. The preceding paragraph is your best bet for finding out what really happened. The truth will probably be quite painful but maybe you'll sleep better at night, down the line.
A marriage can survive small secrets and white lies, and indeed some people will say that they are all but necessary. It cannot survive huge secrets. They fester and cause rot. I don't believe that your marriage is sunk, but as long as there are huge secrets and as long as you have no idea what your wife wants, it's not going to get any better. You're involving other people in this as part of a drive to know the truth. Stop that. Talk to your wife about it, as kindly as you can. Don't yell. Give her a chance to explain. Unfortunately, there really isn't very much else you can do.
Good luck, and God bless.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 9:27 AM on July 23, 2010 [15 favorites]
Oh, and I know this is a contentious topic here on the green, but I don't think there's anything wrong with looking at a spouse's email if the circumstances warrant it, that is, if the culture and cycle of lying, suspicion and evasion has already started to poison the relationship. Invasion of privacy my ass. Your wife's friend thought she was cheating. You have a gut feeling something's going on. Trust, and verify. A marriage is two people and sometimes one of them has to call the other on his or her bullshit.
posted by Yoshimi Battles at 9:30 AM on July 23, 2010 [20 favorites]
posted by Yoshimi Battles at 9:30 AM on July 23, 2010 [20 favorites]
Trust, and verify.
I often see this phrase bandied about (or "trust, but verify"), but I think it's a misnomer -- when one trusts, one doesn't need to verify. That's the whole point of trusting. It's only when you begin to not trust what the other person is saying that you need to go and verify whether or not they are in fact telling the truth. This is a bit of a derail but I think saying that people should "trust but verify" is sometimes used as an excuse to snoop, and that's not a healthy thing to be doing in a relationship that has no problems.
Now, as for the OP. I don't really feel competent to give you any advice on how to talk about this with your wife, but I will say this -- I don't think that being afraid to return to your home country is a valid reason to stay in an unfaithful relationship. Indeed, it may even be possible that it is this "need" to stay with your wife that encourages her to think that she can be unfaithful and you'll keep crawling back. If infidelity is in fact a dealbreaker for you, you need to be very clear that she understands that.
posted by modernnomad at 9:39 AM on July 23, 2010
I often see this phrase bandied about (or "trust, but verify"), but I think it's a misnomer -- when one trusts, one doesn't need to verify. That's the whole point of trusting. It's only when you begin to not trust what the other person is saying that you need to go and verify whether or not they are in fact telling the truth. This is a bit of a derail but I think saying that people should "trust but verify" is sometimes used as an excuse to snoop, and that's not a healthy thing to be doing in a relationship that has no problems.
Now, as for the OP. I don't really feel competent to give you any advice on how to talk about this with your wife, but I will say this -- I don't think that being afraid to return to your home country is a valid reason to stay in an unfaithful relationship. Indeed, it may even be possible that it is this "need" to stay with your wife that encourages her to think that she can be unfaithful and you'll keep crawling back. If infidelity is in fact a dealbreaker for you, you need to be very clear that she understands that.
posted by modernnomad at 9:39 AM on July 23, 2010
This post (which links to the previous posts) might help you.
There's a lot of hearsay and second-guessing (from the mutual friend) and sneaking around (your wife might be cheating; you're reading her email) - you need to get this all in the open.
First of all, you suspect your wife is cheating, but you don't really know. You also snooped into her email. All of this is just symptomatic of potential problems in your relationship; but I can only speculate. Maybe she's not happy with you. Maybe there are communication problems. But this kind of stuff just doesn't happen for no reason.
If I was in your position (and having the luxury of not feeling terrible, like you are), I would have a check-in with your wife. Just talk to her about your relationship. Tell her the things that you love about her, and ask her if she's happy with how things are going. Make it clear to her, that you are willing to listen to her if she brings up problems, and that you are willing to work them out, whatever they are. And then follow through, no matter how tough those problems might be. But you have to be prepared for the worst. Maybe she'll say "I don't want to be married to you anymore." Or maybe she'll say everything is just fine and dandy, which is also bad. I don't know if and when you should bring up that you snooped and that you talked to the Other Guy. Either way, you have to be prepared for the possibility of a break up and you having to go home. At the same time, it might not happen. My point is, you cannot fixate on "we must stay together." You just have to be prepared for any outcome and trust yourself that you can handle any outcome. And you know, people start over all the time, no matter what their age.
Keep in mind that if she is cheating with a married guy, that being the Other Woman isn't fun either. Sure there's the thrill of doing something taboo, but my opinion is, people who cheat with married people are just selling themselves short. It's not a good situation to be in, 99% of the time. (Yes, it has happened where the married lover left their spouse, but there is never a guarantee it will happen, yet people like to delude themselves and hope against hope that it will happen.) If she ends up having a prolonged affair with this guy, it's very, very unlikely she'll come out on top.
posted by foxjacket at 9:42 AM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
There's a lot of hearsay and second-guessing (from the mutual friend) and sneaking around (your wife might be cheating; you're reading her email) - you need to get this all in the open.
First of all, you suspect your wife is cheating, but you don't really know. You also snooped into her email. All of this is just symptomatic of potential problems in your relationship; but I can only speculate. Maybe she's not happy with you. Maybe there are communication problems. But this kind of stuff just doesn't happen for no reason.
If I was in your position (and having the luxury of not feeling terrible, like you are), I would have a check-in with your wife. Just talk to her about your relationship. Tell her the things that you love about her, and ask her if she's happy with how things are going. Make it clear to her, that you are willing to listen to her if she brings up problems, and that you are willing to work them out, whatever they are. And then follow through, no matter how tough those problems might be. But you have to be prepared for the worst. Maybe she'll say "I don't want to be married to you anymore." Or maybe she'll say everything is just fine and dandy, which is also bad. I don't know if and when you should bring up that you snooped and that you talked to the Other Guy. Either way, you have to be prepared for the possibility of a break up and you having to go home. At the same time, it might not happen. My point is, you cannot fixate on "we must stay together." You just have to be prepared for any outcome and trust yourself that you can handle any outcome. And you know, people start over all the time, no matter what their age.
Keep in mind that if she is cheating with a married guy, that being the Other Woman isn't fun either. Sure there's the thrill of doing something taboo, but my opinion is, people who cheat with married people are just selling themselves short. It's not a good situation to be in, 99% of the time. (Yes, it has happened where the married lover left their spouse, but there is never a guarantee it will happen, yet people like to delude themselves and hope against hope that it will happen.) If she ends up having a prolonged affair with this guy, it's very, very unlikely she'll come out on top.
posted by foxjacket at 9:42 AM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
Make copies of those emails you read. Print them out and forward them to yourself. Do that ASAP, as in stop reading this and do that now.
In this situation, I'd confront her. There would be no game playing or hiding of things or of what I know. Just tell her straight out, I got suspicious and went through you email, this is what I found, what's going on? If she wants to get pissed about going through her email, fine, that's understandable. But then and there, I'd want to know what's going on and what had been going on. How that's handled would determine how things go forward.
But at this point, I think you need to lay all the cards on the table and say "What's up? Do you want to stay married or not?"
posted by new brand day at 9:42 AM on July 23, 2010
In this situation, I'd confront her. There would be no game playing or hiding of things or of what I know. Just tell her straight out, I got suspicious and went through you email, this is what I found, what's going on? If she wants to get pissed about going through her email, fine, that's understandable. But then and there, I'd want to know what's going on and what had been going on. How that's handled would determine how things go forward.
But at this point, I think you need to lay all the cards on the table and say "What's up? Do you want to stay married or not?"
posted by new brand day at 9:42 AM on July 23, 2010
Come to terms with it first either by yourself or with the help of a counselor so you aren't unnecessarily bitter and can act like an adult. Determine what you want to do in the scenarios where she accepts or rejects your assessment and also decide if you want to divorce in either case. Then confront her with what you know and see how she responds so that you can decide rationally if the relationship can be saved or if divorce is the only way out.
posted by JJ86 at 10:28 AM on July 23, 2010
posted by JJ86 at 10:28 AM on July 23, 2010
The guy would have to deny everything in as calm and believable a manner as he could muster because there is a very real chance that you could harm him your wife, if he doesn't.
posted by bonobothegreat at 10:36 AM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by bonobothegreat at 10:36 AM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
I am confused. Why did this guy have your wife's shirt? Dude, there is something not right here. Maybe (doubtful) there is a legitimate explanation, but I would ask my wife for specifics including how this guy had her shirt. I agree with the above poster who said that the "I was too drunk" line is a cover up.
I would open the conversation with telling her you called the guy and he denied everything and you are sorry to have doubted her. Then start asking questions that doubt her.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 10:40 AM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
I would open the conversation with telling her you called the guy and he denied everything and you are sorry to have doubted her. Then start asking questions that doubt her.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 10:40 AM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
You want the truth? Go talk to the other wife. You have names and dates.
What do you do? Take a deep breath, count to a thousand. Make some kind of plan B.
posted by coffeefilter at 10:51 AM on July 23, 2010 [2 favorites]
What do you do? Take a deep breath, count to a thousand. Make some kind of plan B.
posted by coffeefilter at 10:51 AM on July 23, 2010 [2 favorites]
I guarantee you that he probably waited about 3 seconds after hanging up before calling your wife to let her know the jig is up.
You need to print those emails right now, before she deletes them or changes her password. You may need them as evidence later on, should things get really ugly.
posted by hermitosis at 11:16 AM on July 23, 2010 [10 favorites]
You need to print those emails right now, before she deletes them or changes her password. You may need them as evidence later on, should things get really ugly.
posted by hermitosis at 11:16 AM on July 23, 2010 [10 favorites]
i'm sorry for your state of confusion. sometimes being confused is worse than knowing the worst. if you want to continue to be in a relationship with your wife, consider couples therapy to get at the root of the issue. as difficult as it may seem, many times cheating/deception is a symptom of something else...get to that & create a relationship where she doesn't have to feel like she needs to be sneaky. this will help to fortify your relationship albeit a difficult process. stay committed for as long as you can and if it gets to be too much or if wifey won't go to therapy, get therapy for yourself to help you through this. also, if you can & if you really want to stay with wifey, & after therapy...consider an alternative of your relationship where you both can get your needs met & be happy.
posted by UltraD at 11:25 AM on July 23, 2010
posted by UltraD at 11:25 AM on July 23, 2010
My opinion:
I agree with foxjacket, you have strong suspicions but no proof, especially since you said yourself that you do not think the other guy is lying.
You need to confront your wife, specifically to ask her if she wants to still be with you.
Anyways, good luck.
posted by Vindaloo at 11:35 AM on July 23, 2010
I agree with foxjacket, you have strong suspicions but no proof, especially since you said yourself that you do not think the other guy is lying.
You need to confront your wife, specifically to ask her if she wants to still be with you.
Anyways, good luck.
posted by Vindaloo at 11:35 AM on July 23, 2010
Whether she is involoved with someone else or not, she's lying to you and you're reading her emails. Kind of a cliche answer, but both of you need a Marriage and Family Therapist. Even if she's not cheating, the foundation of your relationship is in question given the behavior from the both of you.
Everyone I know who has been to marital counseling has always said, "I wish we would have gone sooner." It doesn't mean your marriage is going to be saved with counseling but good counselor will help both see very clearly if you want to put the time into rebuilding it. Either you put the work in or you leave. Either way, you're not stuck in limbo.
posted by WhiteWhale at 11:53 AM on July 23, 2010
Everyone I know who has been to marital counseling has always said, "I wish we would have gone sooner." It doesn't mean your marriage is going to be saved with counseling but good counselor will help both see very clearly if you want to put the time into rebuilding it. Either you put the work in or you leave. Either way, you're not stuck in limbo.
posted by WhiteWhale at 11:53 AM on July 23, 2010
I am so sorry for the situation that you're in. I can completely relate, and know how incredibly awful it is to go from a state of implicit trust to suspecting everything the person does that's out of the ordinary.
It's a very hard state for the survival of a relationship. Unless the air is cleared, from both angles, and consequently both parties are willing to make hard and painful steps to rebuild lost trust, the foundation of your relationship will be missing a large chunk of what holds it up.
Time alone can heal and fill in this void, but IMO it's rare to see a relationship make it past the throes of these situations based on the passage of months alone.
In my situation, I still don't know whether she did or didn't. I just knew that there was no way I was going to get an satisfactory answer from her that I would believe. Knowing that, my only other option was to gnash my teeth with suspicion when she went out with friends, the store at weird hours, worked late, etc... I didn't want to be that person, and I didn't have the strength to change my views, or to keep trying to get the "truth" out of her, or a lie(?) I could believe. Bottom line, whether or not she was telling the truth, is that I no longer trusted her, with some valid reasons similar to yours, and some internal resentments as well. My thinking of her was distorted, unpleasant, and made me sick with jealousy and suspicion. Suffice to say, the warm glow of love was gone, and shortly after that vanished, I followed.
Obviously, a marriage that you relocated to another country for is a bit more than a SO that I lived with for some time, but the feelings underlying are the same, and I empathize with you so incredibly much (my situation wasn't too long ago.). I truly wish you the best, and hope that you guys can work this out, and that the journey ahead isn't too bumpy.
posted by Debaser626 at 12:25 PM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
It's a very hard state for the survival of a relationship. Unless the air is cleared, from both angles, and consequently both parties are willing to make hard and painful steps to rebuild lost trust, the foundation of your relationship will be missing a large chunk of what holds it up.
Time alone can heal and fill in this void, but IMO it's rare to see a relationship make it past the throes of these situations based on the passage of months alone.
In my situation, I still don't know whether she did or didn't. I just knew that there was no way I was going to get an satisfactory answer from her that I would believe. Knowing that, my only other option was to gnash my teeth with suspicion when she went out with friends, the store at weird hours, worked late, etc... I didn't want to be that person, and I didn't have the strength to change my views, or to keep trying to get the "truth" out of her, or a lie(?) I could believe. Bottom line, whether or not she was telling the truth, is that I no longer trusted her, with some valid reasons similar to yours, and some internal resentments as well. My thinking of her was distorted, unpleasant, and made me sick with jealousy and suspicion. Suffice to say, the warm glow of love was gone, and shortly after that vanished, I followed.
Obviously, a marriage that you relocated to another country for is a bit more than a SO that I lived with for some time, but the feelings underlying are the same, and I empathize with you so incredibly much (my situation wasn't too long ago.). I truly wish you the best, and hope that you guys can work this out, and that the journey ahead isn't too bumpy.
posted by Debaser626 at 12:25 PM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
She did recommend that I call the guy (his number was in the emails), so I did. He denied anything ever happening, and was polite and as non-defensive as I guess you can be when an angry husband calls to ask if you've fucked his wife. I don't know whether to believe him or not, but I don't think he was lying. I asked him not to tell her that I called, and he said he wouldn't.
Woah. I was with you until that. Dude, you're a mess. You've painted yourself into a corner -- you can't go backwards because you can't unknow what you know, and you can't go forward because there's no honesty, and without honesty, there's no intimacy.
You have to tell your wife what you know and let things fall where they may.
Bonus tip: don't drink.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:26 PM on July 23, 2010 [4 favorites]
Woah. I was with you until that. Dude, you're a mess. You've painted yourself into a corner -- you can't go backwards because you can't unknow what you know, and you can't go forward because there's no honesty, and without honesty, there's no intimacy.
You have to tell your wife what you know and let things fall where they may.
Bonus tip: don't drink.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:26 PM on July 23, 2010 [4 favorites]
Your wife already knows you know, because there's no way her friend is going to keep it a secret, regardless of what he told you.
posted by electroboy at 12:45 PM on July 23, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by electroboy at 12:45 PM on July 23, 2010 [2 favorites]
Meh. I'm honest to a fault. Crazy honest. "Do these jeans make my ass look big?" "Yup." honest.
That said, you seem to me to be a smidge of a jealous type, since you've been reading her emails for a while, and you may or may not have made it clear to her that you think she's stepping out. It may or may not be cool that she's sort of seeing him behind your back, but then if you create a condition for her where she has to lie to avoid your condescension, well, she's gonna lie.
I guess what I don't get, and maybe because it's only ever happened to me one time (but in a long distance relationship when I was 21), but I don't get where the communication just stops. If you're scared talk about it. If you're angry, your partner deserves to know. Same w/ vice versa. I guess it's too late now...but...I'd never snoop, I'd just state the cause for my concern and ask.
posted by TomMelee at 12:52 PM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
That said, you seem to me to be a smidge of a jealous type, since you've been reading her emails for a while, and you may or may not have made it clear to her that you think she's stepping out. It may or may not be cool that she's sort of seeing him behind your back, but then if you create a condition for her where she has to lie to avoid your condescension, well, she's gonna lie.
I guess what I don't get, and maybe because it's only ever happened to me one time (but in a long distance relationship when I was 21), but I don't get where the communication just stops. If you're scared talk about it. If you're angry, your partner deserves to know. Same w/ vice versa. I guess it's too late now...but...I'd never snoop, I'd just state the cause for my concern and ask.
posted by TomMelee at 12:52 PM on July 23, 2010 [1 favorite]
I haven't read it, but Dan Savage recommends the book Sex at Dawn. This may offer a different/worthwhile perspective for you and your wife in maintaining a healthy monogamous relationship.
posted by lover at 1:01 PM on July 23, 2010
posted by lover at 1:01 PM on July 23, 2010
>I love, and want to continue loving my wife. I have chosen to live in a foreign country to be with her, and she is really one of the only reasons I'm still here. I don't want to leave here, as I doubt, at my age, that I could start a decent career back home. I most profoundly do not want to get divorced, but I feel I need to know the truth.
The truth is, you already know the truth. Based on what you've read, she cheated on you.
The real question is, What now?
So...
You need to put the emotional concerns aside for a moment, and think about the legal and logistical ones.
1) If you did divorce her, where would you live? Could you continue to live in the same city? You don't seem to have kids-- is there mutual property that is tying you down?
2) If finances and shared property are a concern, you should consult a lawyer before confronting her. Get your ducks in a row before you have a confrontation.
3) If you can bear the idea that she cheated on you and you still want to live with her-- which is a perfectly viable option, in theory-- what new rules do you want in place?
4) Assuming that she did cheat on you, what, for you, would constitute the best possible outcome? What life and living arrangements do want, six months or a year from now?
posted by darth_tedious at 1:10 PM on July 23, 2010
The truth is, you already know the truth. Based on what you've read, she cheated on you.
The real question is, What now?
So...
You need to put the emotional concerns aside for a moment, and think about the legal and logistical ones.
1) If you did divorce her, where would you live? Could you continue to live in the same city? You don't seem to have kids-- is there mutual property that is tying you down?
2) If finances and shared property are a concern, you should consult a lawyer before confronting her. Get your ducks in a row before you have a confrontation.
3) If you can bear the idea that she cheated on you and you still want to live with her-- which is a perfectly viable option, in theory-- what new rules do you want in place?
4) Assuming that she did cheat on you, what, for you, would constitute the best possible outcome? What life and living arrangements do want, six months or a year from now?
posted by darth_tedious at 1:10 PM on July 23, 2010
Everyone I know who has been to marital counseling has always said, "I wish we would have gone sooner." It doesn't mean your marriage is going to be saved with counseling but good counselor will help both see very clearly if you want to put the time into rebuilding it.
I agree -- in my case, our MFT was great but basically helped us understand that the best thing was to get divorced. However, this will only work if the wife is at least somewhat willing to do counseling, and is willing to be honest about what's going on. Otherwise it's pointless. While I did have to drag my wife to counseling, she was (as far as I know) quite honest once we were actually there [no cheating or anything in my situation, however]. If it becomes clear she's cheating but she just won't admit to it at all... well, maybe the MFT could help get her to admit it, but without that it would seem impossible to fix things.
So I do think the first step is to confront her and see what happens. If you feel like this, being quiet isn't going to help -- you'll definitely sabotage any chance at a happy marriage in the future. I'm sure she won't be happy about the emails, but at this point you've got 2 options as I see it: brutal honesty, to rid your relationship of the mutual lies/coverups/lack of trust, or start covering your ass for a divorce (if you're worried about alimony / etc).
posted by wildcrdj at 1:15 PM on July 23, 2010
I agree -- in my case, our MFT was great but basically helped us understand that the best thing was to get divorced. However, this will only work if the wife is at least somewhat willing to do counseling, and is willing to be honest about what's going on. Otherwise it's pointless. While I did have to drag my wife to counseling, she was (as far as I know) quite honest once we were actually there [no cheating or anything in my situation, however]. If it becomes clear she's cheating but she just won't admit to it at all... well, maybe the MFT could help get her to admit it, but without that it would seem impossible to fix things.
So I do think the first step is to confront her and see what happens. If you feel like this, being quiet isn't going to help -- you'll definitely sabotage any chance at a happy marriage in the future. I'm sure she won't be happy about the emails, but at this point you've got 2 options as I see it: brutal honesty, to rid your relationship of the mutual lies/coverups/lack of trust, or start covering your ass for a divorce (if you're worried about alimony / etc).
posted by wildcrdj at 1:15 PM on July 23, 2010
Oh, seconding darth_tedious --- if you're considering divorce, check with a lawyer first if you have any financial concerns (obvious ones would be if you make more money, have assets you care about, etc). Since you don't say the country I'm sure the possible issues vary signficiantly.
posted by wildcrdj at 1:16 PM on July 23, 2010
posted by wildcrdj at 1:16 PM on July 23, 2010
I can't emphasize enough what other people have said above: if you think this might end up in divorce, which certainly seems possible, you need to gather evidence about her (possible) infidelity.
Think of it this way: it's very possible she's been doing this behind your back, so no matter how you might feel about going behind her back as far as gathering evidence and consulting a lawyer, you've basically been put in that situation because of her dishonesty.
If things do work out with you and your wife, and you seem to want them to so I wish you the best, then no harm, no foul.
But if they don't, and you're heading towards a divorce, you'll already have a leg up on her.
posted by elder18 at 2:22 PM on July 23, 2010
Think of it this way: it's very possible she's been doing this behind your back, so no matter how you might feel about going behind her back as far as gathering evidence and consulting a lawyer, you've basically been put in that situation because of her dishonesty.
If things do work out with you and your wife, and you seem to want them to so I wish you the best, then no harm, no foul.
But if they don't, and you're heading towards a divorce, you'll already have a leg up on her.
posted by elder18 at 2:22 PM on July 23, 2010
I am very sorry for you. All I can add to the above is about your wife forgetting her shirt. I know if this happened to me, I would be wondering if my wife intentionally left the shirt with the other man on purpose so the other man would HAVE to see her a second time. Perhaps she thought it was insurance in case he changed his mind and wanted to end the affair after the first rendezvous. He can't do that via email alone if he still has her shirt.
I mean, how in the heck does a person, especially a person who is cheating, "forget" a shirt?
posted by InsertNiftyNameHere at 3:30 AM on July 24, 2010
I mean, how in the heck does a person, especially a person who is cheating, "forget" a shirt?
posted by InsertNiftyNameHere at 3:30 AM on July 24, 2010
This thread is closed to new comments.
The only thinkg we can possibly recommend is that you should talk to your wife. How can you not? You're not going to be able to just forget about it now! Talk to her: just explain the truth, that you were suspicious because you felt there was something more going on; that you should have just talked to her first, but your paranoia got the best of you and [even though you shouldn't have] you checked her email.
Depending on her response and your discussion, that will determine where to go from there. Don't start freaking out about a new life. Take it one step at a time, starting with THE TALK.
Good luck.
posted by Eicats at 9:05 AM on July 23, 2010