I wish she'd DTMF, but she won't.
July 20, 2010 9:38 AM Subscribe
My friend is an abusive relationship. My question is not about how I can help my friend; it's about how I can keep myself sane and still be friends with her.
My friend's boyfriend is controlling, emotionally abusive, and totally manipulative. He broke up with her, but then continued to act like they were still together. It's complete insanity, and for a while I was trying to be a supportive friend, and just listen and try to give advice when asked. Now, they've gotten "back together," because the boyfriend says that he never viewed them as broken up. It's completely insane and it's put a strain on our circle of friends, since no one likes the crazy boyfriend and no one wants to be around him.
I don't want to be around the boyfriend at all, and I don't want to have any more conversations about the situation. I have no illusions that I can convince her of anything, since this has been going on for almost a year and she keeps going back. I'm just looking to maintain my sanity and hopefully the friendship. It's already difficult enough, given her mood swings based on where the relationship is at. I had suggested counseling, and she went, but I don't think was completely honest, and quit and said it wasn't doing anything for her.
What is the best way to handle the situation moving forward? How can I still maintain a friendship with her, but not engage in the drama?
My friend's boyfriend is controlling, emotionally abusive, and totally manipulative. He broke up with her, but then continued to act like they were still together. It's complete insanity, and for a while I was trying to be a supportive friend, and just listen and try to give advice when asked. Now, they've gotten "back together," because the boyfriend says that he never viewed them as broken up. It's completely insane and it's put a strain on our circle of friends, since no one likes the crazy boyfriend and no one wants to be around him.
I don't want to be around the boyfriend at all, and I don't want to have any more conversations about the situation. I have no illusions that I can convince her of anything, since this has been going on for almost a year and she keeps going back. I'm just looking to maintain my sanity and hopefully the friendship. It's already difficult enough, given her mood swings based on where the relationship is at. I had suggested counseling, and she went, but I don't think was completely honest, and quit and said it wasn't doing anything for her.
What is the best way to handle the situation moving forward? How can I still maintain a friendship with her, but not engage in the drama?
I have several friends like this (I don't know why most of my friends are crazy, but...), and the way I handle it is to be straightforward. I actually did this with my older sister, who was in an almost identical situation as your friend. I tell the friend that they know how I feel, that and that I don't want to hear about him any more because she refuses to help herself, and that if she wants to spend time with you, it has to be without the boyfriend.
If she wants to be friends, she will stick around. If not, move onward and upward.
posted by bolognius maximus at 9:44 AM on July 20, 2010 [7 favorites]
If she wants to be friends, she will stick around. If not, move onward and upward.
posted by bolognius maximus at 9:44 AM on July 20, 2010 [7 favorites]
There are lots of FAQ type documents out there about being a supportive friend to someone in a DV-type relationship. Maybe read some of those and see if they apply? At least it will give you some clarity that other people have gone through something similar to what you're experiencing.
And -- can you set boundaries to protect your own, er, stamina to remain friends with her? E.g., "Hey, I can talk about your boyfriend for five minutes, and then we need to change the topic. I can only handle a certain amount of conversation about this topic." Or maybe it's zero minutes.
Anecdote filter -- I was your friend many years ago, I don't know how my friends stood it. But now my life and my inner self are totally different.
posted by ClaudiaCenter at 9:52 AM on July 20, 2010
And -- can you set boundaries to protect your own, er, stamina to remain friends with her? E.g., "Hey, I can talk about your boyfriend for five minutes, and then we need to change the topic. I can only handle a certain amount of conversation about this topic." Or maybe it's zero minutes.
Anecdote filter -- I was your friend many years ago, I don't know how my friends stood it. But now my life and my inner self are totally different.
posted by ClaudiaCenter at 9:52 AM on July 20, 2010
Personally, if I really care about someone, I don't want to give up on them. The best weapon that an abused person has is friends who the abuser hasn't shut out of their life yet, who are sane, and can see the situation for what it is.
It's tough on you, but you may turn out to be the only lifeline she has, when push comes to shove.
Just another perspective, but I think it's an important one to at least consider.
posted by Citrus at 10:07 AM on July 20, 2010 [5 favorites]
It's tough on you, but you may turn out to be the only lifeline she has, when push comes to shove.
Just another perspective, but I think it's an important one to at least consider.
posted by Citrus at 10:07 AM on July 20, 2010 [5 favorites]
This is a really awesome book. It also has ideas on how to support a friend/family member in an abusive relationship. My guess is that if you suggest she reads it, she won't, but give it a shot.
posted by foxjacket at 10:20 AM on July 20, 2010
posted by foxjacket at 10:20 AM on July 20, 2010
I've had friends like this, and I told them I couldn't talk about the situation any more. If they wanted to talk about something else, great, if not, then I needed time apart. It's important for your own well being not to be sucked in to this kind of thing. It just gets increasingly frustrating. I don't agree with Citrus that you need to stick around. You can still communicate that you'll always be there for her, even if you need to pull away for the time being.
posted by sweetkid at 10:21 AM on July 20, 2010
posted by sweetkid at 10:21 AM on July 20, 2010
There was a really wonderful comment by jessamyn, a few years back, about how to be supportive to a friend in an abusive R*. It was in list form, with a lot of really insightful things to say and ways to gently urge a friend to see things for what they are, without being negative or damaging to YOUR relationship with them. Maybe somebody could help me find it (I still don't understand how to search through my favorites by username).
posted by iamkimiam at 10:33 AM on July 20, 2010
posted by iamkimiam at 10:33 AM on July 20, 2010
Consider going to co-dependents anonymous or a similar group to talk about your experiences and feelings as you work through this. You may find perspectives and advice that will help you maintain your boundaries as you maintain this friendship.
posted by jardinier at 10:56 AM on July 20, 2010
posted by jardinier at 10:56 AM on July 20, 2010
Whatever you do, don't make an ultimatum or cut her off, even if they break up again, she hangs out with you to feel better and the next week they are together AGAIN. She will pick him over sanity, guaranteed.
All you can do is tell her that her friendship is valued but that his behaviour isn't. You do NOT have to hang out with him or be around him, that's her decision, not yours. He does not need to figure in your life as anything except your friend's shitty boyfriend.
posted by darlingmagpie at 11:08 AM on July 20, 2010
All you can do is tell her that her friendship is valued but that his behaviour isn't. You do NOT have to hang out with him or be around him, that's her decision, not yours. He does not need to figure in your life as anything except your friend's shitty boyfriend.
posted by darlingmagpie at 11:08 AM on July 20, 2010
Sometimes you just have to let them go. I lost my best friend (best man at my wedding) to the crazy bitch he was/is? dating. I miss the shit out of that guy, but realistically, he chose her and I have to respect his choices.
posted by notsnot at 11:08 AM on July 20, 2010
posted by notsnot at 11:08 AM on July 20, 2010
It's clear that you love your friend, but you might want to start making room in your head for the possibility that you'll have to leave her behind. No one wants to see their friends abused, and it's going to start taking a toll on you at some point, too. Drama will start brewing soon (if it hasn't already), and then you'll be involved in that. Next come late night phone calls or texts, or (god forbid) physical abuse for you to help her with.
I know someone who went through something like this with a friend at work. She ended up loaning the woman a big wad of cash because she said she wanted to get away from the guy, only find that she went right back to him anyway. The loan never got paid back.
posted by Gilbert at 11:29 AM on July 20, 2010
I know someone who went through something like this with a friend at work. She ended up loaning the woman a big wad of cash because she said she wanted to get away from the guy, only find that she went right back to him anyway. The loan never got paid back.
posted by Gilbert at 11:29 AM on July 20, 2010
You ultimately have to do what's best for you but emotionally cutting off your friend is exactly what the boyfriend wants. Part of his goal will be to isolate her from her family and friends. Anyone that can help her get out is in the way of controlling her. If you leave, it's a line to her own sanity that gets cut. That being said, having a friend that constantly goes back to an abusive relationship can be too much for some.
FWIW- if you choose to continue to be a voice of reason with her, get used to her making poor decisions. The average victim goes back to the same abuser 8 times. Unless you study domestic violence/overcontrolling husband syndrome and know people in the thick of it, you'll never understand. Once you do, it makes total sense.
One of the best things you can do for her is to not judge her behavior and remind her that she's not crazy. If she's willing, give her this book
I have worked quite a bit with the abused and their abusers. If you ever want any help, feel free to mail me.
posted by WhiteWhale at 12:25 PM on July 20, 2010 [5 favorites]
FWIW- if you choose to continue to be a voice of reason with her, get used to her making poor decisions. The average victim goes back to the same abuser 8 times. Unless you study domestic violence/overcontrolling husband syndrome and know people in the thick of it, you'll never understand. Once you do, it makes total sense.
One of the best things you can do for her is to not judge her behavior and remind her that she's not crazy. If she's willing, give her this book
I have worked quite a bit with the abused and their abusers. If you ever want any help, feel free to mail me.
posted by WhiteWhale at 12:25 PM on July 20, 2010 [5 favorites]
I've had a friend in an abusive relationship, and I don't know how much advice I have to give you, but I will tell you that you are already handling it better than I did and that you are wise to set limits. The "I'm not willing to talk about your relationship with you anymore" is a good start, and you should be prepared to enforce it by reminding your friend of it and even parting company with her for the day if she doesn't heed the reminders. It's also a good idea to decide what practical help you are prepared to give your friend and to tell her what she can and cannot count on. Definitely do such things as giving her contact information for support services for abused woman and helpful reading material if she's willing.
Another thing to watch out for is the deterioration of your friend's mental state and behaviour. If she can honour your request to not talk about Mr. Horrible with you, and you two can enjoy each other's companionship, that's great, but be prepared for the possibility that she may become more and more distracted and unable to function, and may even start behaving quite badly herself. If she starts doing things like being unable to follow a conversation, fails to show basic courtesy to you, demands or expects all kinds of special treatment or acceptance of her bad behaviours because of her problems, or becomes too angry and/or irrational to be pleasant to be around, you may need to walk away. Which is hard to do, of course, because it can feel like leaving a kitten in a bear trap — but it's not at all like that.
Keep in mind that your friend is a grown woman and that it's up to her to run her own life and make her own decisions, that you deserve to get something out of your friendship too, and that if you aren't able to help her and aren't enjoying her companionship anymore, there's no reason for you to stick around.
posted by orange swan at 12:39 PM on July 20, 2010 [1 favorite]
Another thing to watch out for is the deterioration of your friend's mental state and behaviour. If she can honour your request to not talk about Mr. Horrible with you, and you two can enjoy each other's companionship, that's great, but be prepared for the possibility that she may become more and more distracted and unable to function, and may even start behaving quite badly herself. If she starts doing things like being unable to follow a conversation, fails to show basic courtesy to you, demands or expects all kinds of special treatment or acceptance of her bad behaviours because of her problems, or becomes too angry and/or irrational to be pleasant to be around, you may need to walk away. Which is hard to do, of course, because it can feel like leaving a kitten in a bear trap — but it's not at all like that.
Keep in mind that your friend is a grown woman and that it's up to her to run her own life and make her own decisions, that you deserve to get something out of your friendship too, and that if you aren't able to help her and aren't enjoying her companionship anymore, there's no reason for you to stick around.
posted by orange swan at 12:39 PM on July 20, 2010 [1 favorite]
Most folks know that abusers tend to isolate their partners from their friends and family. Unfortunately, folks who are abused also tend to isolate themselves.
It's probably a good idea for both of you to stop talking about the relationship. Abusive relationships have a way of painting people in a corner when it comes to their friends. Basically the person complains, feels lost, can't leave, they're desperately hurt, they need to know they're not bat-shot-crazy, and that they are not alone. Friends listen, they say DTMFA, they say you're wonderful, you deserve better, they tell you that you are not, in fact, bat-shit-crazy and that you are being abused, we're here for you.
But then then friend keeps on with the relationship, for whatever reason. The overwhelming pull of friends to leave runs smack into the blunt fact that she can't leave. The cognitive dissonance this causes sometimes results in someone either ditching the partner or ditching the friends. Paradoxically, ditching the friends becomes an perverted act of preserving some shred if integrity. They know they need to get out of the relationship and feel ashamed that they don't...so they dispense with reminders that amplify that shame - friends.
Obviously, this is only one possibility of many with loved ones in abusive relationships. If you stay friends, tell her you don't judge her for not leaving the relationship....that you understand how hard it is for her. Tell her that you care for her and that it's painful for you to watch her suffer - all the more so because you're helpless to do anything about it. At the same time, you can tell her that she can come to you if needs anything specific, but that you need to back off on the relationship chatter.
posted by space_cookie at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2010 [3 favorites]
It's probably a good idea for both of you to stop talking about the relationship. Abusive relationships have a way of painting people in a corner when it comes to their friends. Basically the person complains, feels lost, can't leave, they're desperately hurt, they need to know they're not bat-shot-crazy, and that they are not alone. Friends listen, they say DTMFA, they say you're wonderful, you deserve better, they tell you that you are not, in fact, bat-shit-crazy and that you are being abused, we're here for you.
But then then friend keeps on with the relationship, for whatever reason. The overwhelming pull of friends to leave runs smack into the blunt fact that she can't leave. The cognitive dissonance this causes sometimes results in someone either ditching the partner or ditching the friends. Paradoxically, ditching the friends becomes an perverted act of preserving some shred if integrity. They know they need to get out of the relationship and feel ashamed that they don't...so they dispense with reminders that amplify that shame - friends.
Obviously, this is only one possibility of many with loved ones in abusive relationships. If you stay friends, tell her you don't judge her for not leaving the relationship....that you understand how hard it is for her. Tell her that you care for her and that it's painful for you to watch her suffer - all the more so because you're helpless to do anything about it. At the same time, you can tell her that she can come to you if needs anything specific, but that you need to back off on the relationship chatter.
posted by space_cookie at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2010 [3 favorites]
It's tough because it's actually your friend who's letting this continue - yet you want to help her as she's being abused.
Help her, even though you're exasperated. With support from people like friends she might make it past this (and not immediately back with this guy or into another abusive realtionship). But there's a limit. If she (informed by you as she is/will be about what is healthy) continues to see this person, let her know you are done.
This is NOT an ultimatum. It's you not accepting her allowing herself to be abused.
There might be no other way of illustrating to her that she is "accepting" the abuse without her seeing consequenses (such as losing you).
posted by marimeko at 7:16 PM on July 20, 2010
Help her, even though you're exasperated. With support from people like friends she might make it past this (and not immediately back with this guy or into another abusive realtionship). But there's a limit. If she (informed by you as she is/will be about what is healthy) continues to see this person, let her know you are done.
This is NOT an ultimatum. It's you not accepting her allowing herself to be abused.
There might be no other way of illustrating to her that she is "accepting" the abuse without her seeing consequenses (such as losing you).
posted by marimeko at 7:16 PM on July 20, 2010
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posted by ShadePlant at 9:43 AM on July 20, 2010