Am I singing an offensive song to the children?
May 26, 2010 6:00 AM Subscribe
Is this children's song offensive and should I stop singing it at our playgroup?
At a previous playgroup we went to (last year), one of the teachers had been an American camp counsellor in his youth. He taught us this little song.
We've now joined another playgroup.. I'm on the committee and the official singing dancing entertaining mum. I have started to sing it for the children. BabyTaff absolutely bloody loves it so if you all decide it's inappropriate I'll have to change the words or something but will have to keep singing it...at least at home.
(The actions start out with you patting your chest like a drum)
I'm an Indian chief
In my wigwam high (make a steeple with your hands)
Hear my tom tom beat (more chest patting)
See my arrow fly (point fingers like it's an arrow)
I ride my pony every day (giddy up horsey kind of hands)
I ride it fast and far away (more giddy up stuff)
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Aye aye, aye aye aye
(then a stereotypical Native American holler with hand over the mouth)
Please be gentle with me. MrTaff says it's highly offensive and racist. I'm Australian and am not familiar with Native American issues really... but would like to not be offensive. It's such a gorgeous song and the kids LOVE it to bits. Seriously, they love it.
If you all decide it's offensive, I would love some suggestions as to how to change the lyrics as minimally as possible while still keeping it respectful.
Peter, the original teacher who taught us, was a sensitive and educated man... but his camp counsellor days were a long time ago... so the fact that he was taught it in the States may not be relevant, I guess.... but that's where I learned it and started doing it for the kids without thinking about it.
Our audience is largely Australian multicultural and not likely to ever complain. Today I thought I heard an American accent in our crowd and then it occurred to me that I should ask Americans what they thought... I have no idea why I didn't think to ask earlier. I'm really sorry if this is very obvious to all of you. Or if you are all going to tell me I'm bean-plating. I really am not sure what to think... although MrTaff is usually always right in these kind of things (don't tell him I said that) so I've started to worry. Thanks so much kind international Mefites.
At a previous playgroup we went to (last year), one of the teachers had been an American camp counsellor in his youth. He taught us this little song.
We've now joined another playgroup.. I'm on the committee and the official singing dancing entertaining mum. I have started to sing it for the children. BabyTaff absolutely bloody loves it so if you all decide it's inappropriate I'll have to change the words or something but will have to keep singing it...at least at home.
(The actions start out with you patting your chest like a drum)
I'm an Indian chief
In my wigwam high (make a steeple with your hands)
Hear my tom tom beat (more chest patting)
See my arrow fly (point fingers like it's an arrow)
I ride my pony every day (giddy up horsey kind of hands)
I ride it fast and far away (more giddy up stuff)
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Aye aye, aye aye aye
(then a stereotypical Native American holler with hand over the mouth)
Please be gentle with me. MrTaff says it's highly offensive and racist. I'm Australian and am not familiar with Native American issues really... but would like to not be offensive. It's such a gorgeous song and the kids LOVE it to bits. Seriously, they love it.
If you all decide it's offensive, I would love some suggestions as to how to change the lyrics as minimally as possible while still keeping it respectful.
Peter, the original teacher who taught us, was a sensitive and educated man... but his camp counsellor days were a long time ago... so the fact that he was taught it in the States may not be relevant, I guess.... but that's where I learned it and started doing it for the kids without thinking about it.
Our audience is largely Australian multicultural and not likely to ever complain. Today I thought I heard an American accent in our crowd and then it occurred to me that I should ask Americans what they thought... I have no idea why I didn't think to ask earlier. I'm really sorry if this is very obvious to all of you. Or if you are all going to tell me I'm bean-plating. I really am not sure what to think... although MrTaff is usually always right in these kind of things (don't tell him I said that) so I've started to worry. Thanks so much kind international Mefites.
Yeah, that's a song I'd take out of rotation. In the U.S., though supporters of certain baseball teams might disagree, the "war cry" is very offensive. A lot of those old U.S. camp songs are inappropriate.
posted by girlbowler at 6:10 AM on May 26, 2010 [5 favorites]
posted by girlbowler at 6:10 AM on May 26, 2010 [5 favorites]
I don't think it's offensive. Some American Indians did, indeed, have chiefs, live in wigwams, use tom toms for music and communication, shoot things with arrows, and ride ponies.
What's offensive is when grown-ups believe that's all American Indians did, and greet today's American Indians with the one-hand-up-and-say-How! or the stereotypical war whoop, etc. I guess it's the extension of these few facts into an assumption that all people of the group are like this that is offensive.
Just one American's opinion.
posted by Houstonian at 6:10 AM on May 26, 2010
What's offensive is when grown-ups believe that's all American Indians did, and greet today's American Indians with the one-hand-up-and-say-How! or the stereotypical war whoop, etc. I guess it's the extension of these few facts into an assumption that all people of the group are like this that is offensive.
Just one American's opinion.
posted by Houstonian at 6:10 AM on May 26, 2010
If you like the song and the noise, you could always invent alternate lyrics. Maybe something about a very noisy but pretty bird?
posted by amtho at 6:15 AM on May 26, 2010 [5 favorites]
posted by amtho at 6:15 AM on May 26, 2010 [5 favorites]
Yes, this would not fly in any American institution for children concerned with avoiding stereotyping. It contains a lot of shallow stereotypes of Native Americans (generically bundling different cultures by not specifying what group the supposed leader is from, referring to a leader as "chief," playing a "tom tom", living in a "wigwam" which only a small subset of natives lived in, and war-whooping.
I'm not surprised that someone who was a camp counselor even 20 or so years ago would have learned it. I learned stuff like this in kindergarten and I know my brother did in Boy Scouts. It was standard fare at a lot of camps and schools until multiculturalism started to develop in a more pronounced and focused way in the 1980s. I have no doubt that there are still camps and schools in the U.S. where you would find this stuff, but you wouldn't be likely to find it in places which have devoted serious attention to respect for diversity, and it has definitely faded away from standard practice.
However, there's been lots of effort over the last couple of decades to avoid building inaccurate, cartoonish images in kids' heads about the nature and activities of indigenous people. And I would be concerned more with that - not creating inaccurate sterotypes, especially in Australia which has its own issues about the representation of indigenous people - than with directly offending someone because they have an American or Native American background.
I am sure the kids love it - it's got rhthm, hand gestures, playacting, probably a great tune. But there are thousands of kids' songs out there, and plenty of them are interactive with hand gestures. And resources on the web where you can learn them. Since you are concerned about this I would recommend (a) changing the lyrics entirely to be about some other kind of character completely, or (b) just learning more new songs for kids.
posted by Miko at 6:16 AM on May 26, 2010 [15 favorites]
I'm not surprised that someone who was a camp counselor even 20 or so years ago would have learned it. I learned stuff like this in kindergarten and I know my brother did in Boy Scouts. It was standard fare at a lot of camps and schools until multiculturalism started to develop in a more pronounced and focused way in the 1980s. I have no doubt that there are still camps and schools in the U.S. where you would find this stuff, but you wouldn't be likely to find it in places which have devoted serious attention to respect for diversity, and it has definitely faded away from standard practice.
However, there's been lots of effort over the last couple of decades to avoid building inaccurate, cartoonish images in kids' heads about the nature and activities of indigenous people. And I would be concerned more with that - not creating inaccurate sterotypes, especially in Australia which has its own issues about the representation of indigenous people - than with directly offending someone because they have an American or Native American background.
I am sure the kids love it - it's got rhthm, hand gestures, playacting, probably a great tune. But there are thousands of kids' songs out there, and plenty of them are interactive with hand gestures. And resources on the web where you can learn them. Since you are concerned about this I would recommend (a) changing the lyrics entirely to be about some other kind of character completely, or (b) just learning more new songs for kids.
posted by Miko at 6:16 AM on May 26, 2010 [15 favorites]
Best answer: i'm always adapting something to not be offensive, and i think it's wise of you, as i do know some who would be offended. why not make something fun for everyone so that you do'nt have to worry? i don't know the tune but how about something like this:
(The actions start out with you patting your chest like a horse's gallop)
I'm a wild west Cowboy/girl
In my hat ten gallons high (make a steeple/aka hat with your hands)
Hear my pony shoes clomp (more chest patting)
See my arrow fly (point fingers like it's an arrow)
I ride my pony every day (giddy up horsey kind of hands)
I ride it fast and far away (more giddy up stuff)
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Aye aye, aye aye aye
i actually think it's more fun this way. :)
posted by 2003girl at 6:17 AM on May 26, 2010 [20 favorites]
(The actions start out with you patting your chest like a horse's gallop)
I'm a wild west Cowboy/girl
In my hat ten gallons high (make a steeple/aka hat with your hands)
Hear my pony shoes clomp (more chest patting)
See my arrow fly (point fingers like it's an arrow)
I ride my pony every day (giddy up horsey kind of hands)
I ride it fast and far away (more giddy up stuff)
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Aye aye, aye aye aye
i actually think it's more fun this way. :)
posted by 2003girl at 6:17 AM on May 26, 2010 [20 favorites]
excuse me, i mean to sub for arrow, slingshot and have them pretend to pull the slingshot
(or if you're ok with this, have them say 'see my bullets fly,' and have them make a gun with their fingers)
posted by 2003girl at 6:19 AM on May 26, 2010
(or if you're ok with this, have them say 'see my bullets fly,' and have them make a gun with their fingers)
posted by 2003girl at 6:19 AM on May 26, 2010
Best answer: When I was a child I learned that same song from a camp counselor who was also the daughter of one of the leaders of the Passamaquoddy Tribe.
That being said, its probably not something I would teach to a child until they were somewhat older and had the capacity for a fuller understanding of native culture. (Think camp age - 8 or 9).
You could turn it into a cowboy song pretty easily, though:
I'm a lonesome cowboy (tip of the hat, perhaps)
on the big prairie
Hear my spurs a-jingle (shake feet?)
See my lasso fly (lasso motion)
I ride my pony every day (giddy up horsey kind of hands)
I ride it fast and far away (more giddy up stuff)
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Then substitute the stereotypical "Hi yippie ai" should for the war call (which is really the worst part, inho)
posted by anastasiav at 6:20 AM on May 26, 2010 [6 favorites]
That being said, its probably not something I would teach to a child until they were somewhat older and had the capacity for a fuller understanding of native culture. (Think camp age - 8 or 9).
You could turn it into a cowboy song pretty easily, though:
I'm a lonesome cowboy (tip of the hat, perhaps)
on the big prairie
Hear my spurs a-jingle (shake feet?)
See my lasso fly (lasso motion)
I ride my pony every day (giddy up horsey kind of hands)
I ride it fast and far away (more giddy up stuff)
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Then substitute the stereotypical "Hi yippie ai" should for the war call (which is really the worst part, inho)
posted by anastasiav at 6:20 AM on May 26, 2010 [6 favorites]
2003girl, I owe you a beer or something.
posted by anastasiav at 6:21 AM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by anastasiav at 6:21 AM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
I guess it's the extension of these few facts into an assumption that all people of the group are like this that is offensive.
Yeah, this is "conflating" and people from Native communities tend to find this really problematic, because American pop culture has conflated thousands of particular histories and cultures into one standard "Indian" which is nonspecific. It's probably the single major stereotype native people have to deal with.
The war-whooping part is problematic, too, since "Indians on the warpath" is another stereotype that has been put forward in pop culture and politics for over 300 years. The idea that Indians were aggressively warlike helped to serve as a justification for subduing them and pushing them into controlled geographical areas: they were just too dangerous to live side by side with white colonists. Native peoples certainly did go to war from time to time, but the idea of total war with widepsread death, cultural extermination and removal as an end point was not at all usual in the Americas until the colonists brought it. Most native cultures, even those with a war tradition, were able to subsist in adjacency for several thousand years even while engaging in ongoing battles and disputes, through the use of negotiation and trade as well as through occasional forays war.
posted by Miko at 6:22 AM on May 26, 2010 [6 favorites]
Yeah, this is "conflating" and people from Native communities tend to find this really problematic, because American pop culture has conflated thousands of particular histories and cultures into one standard "Indian" which is nonspecific. It's probably the single major stereotype native people have to deal with.
The war-whooping part is problematic, too, since "Indians on the warpath" is another stereotype that has been put forward in pop culture and politics for over 300 years. The idea that Indians were aggressively warlike helped to serve as a justification for subduing them and pushing them into controlled geographical areas: they were just too dangerous to live side by side with white colonists. Native peoples certainly did go to war from time to time, but the idea of total war with widepsread death, cultural extermination and removal as an end point was not at all usual in the Americas until the colonists brought it. Most native cultures, even those with a war tradition, were able to subsist in adjacency for several thousand years even while engaging in ongoing battles and disputes, through the use of negotiation and trade as well as through occasional forays war.
posted by Miko at 6:22 AM on May 26, 2010 [6 favorites]
It's not outright racist, I don't think, and in my youth it would have been perfectly acceptable, because there's nothing denigrating in it. But attitudes in the US, at least, have changed, so that just the expression of the stereotype (even if neutral) can cause offense. Thus, for example, sports teams nicknames like "the Indians" with whoops and tomahawk chops are no longer considered OK.
So, yeah, in the US many people would find it offensive. Even people like me, who can't summon up that emotional response because we grew up taking it for granted, would find it clueless and and tonedeaf.
But, that said, you don't live in the US. You don't have to live by a foreign country's cultural norms. I think padraigin has it right -- if it would be offensive if it were mimicking stereotypes of your own native peoples, then it's no different.
posted by tyllwin at 6:23 AM on May 26, 2010
So, yeah, in the US many people would find it offensive. Even people like me, who can't summon up that emotional response because we grew up taking it for granted, would find it clueless and and tonedeaf.
But, that said, you don't live in the US. You don't have to live by a foreign country's cultural norms. I think padraigin has it right -- if it would be offensive if it were mimicking stereotypes of your own native peoples, then it's no different.
posted by tyllwin at 6:23 AM on May 26, 2010
ha, anastasiav, the cowboy hook makes us twins! i love the lasso, i think between the two of us we have a good thing here:
(The actions start out with you patting your chest like a horse's gallop)
I'm a wild west cowboy/girl
In my hat ten gallons high (make a cowboy hat with your hands and curved fingers)
Hear my pony shoes clomp (more chest patting)
See my lasso fly (make lasso with hands and arms)
I ride my pony every day (giddy up horsey kind of hands)
I ride it fast and far away (more giddy up stuff)
Yeehaw, Yeehaw haw haw
Yeehaw, Yeehaw haw haw
posted by 2003girl at 6:24 AM on May 26, 2010 [4 favorites]
(The actions start out with you patting your chest like a horse's gallop)
I'm a wild west cowboy/girl
In my hat ten gallons high (make a cowboy hat with your hands and curved fingers)
Hear my pony shoes clomp (more chest patting)
See my lasso fly (make lasso with hands and arms)
I ride my pony every day (giddy up horsey kind of hands)
I ride it fast and far away (more giddy up stuff)
Yeehaw, Yeehaw haw haw
Yeehaw, Yeehaw haw haw
posted by 2003girl at 6:24 AM on May 26, 2010 [4 favorites]
Part of why that song is disrespectful (my vote is for yes) is because early American settlers completely decimated the Native population, and practices to this day continue to subjugate them. Now we tend to essentialize the culture we destroyed into songs and mascots (that are largely not reflective of Native cultures) and forget about the rest of the story.
If this happened in the US, parents might complain. One of my closest friends is part Cherokee, and I would wager that she'd pull her child out of such a playgroup.
posted by emilyd22222 at 6:26 AM on May 26, 2010 [10 favorites]
If this happened in the US, parents might complain. One of my closest friends is part Cherokee, and I would wager that she'd pull her child out of such a playgroup.
posted by emilyd22222 at 6:26 AM on May 26, 2010 [10 favorites]
There's a continuum of racism, and this is more on the 'inappropriate' end -- not completely dehumanizing or violent, but an unfair depiction of a people as a whole. Native American sensitivities run hot when it comes to the stereotypical images of Indians that were largely propagated by television and movies in the early 20th century. The University of North Dakota had been called the Fighting Sioux for years; they have spent decades trying to work with Native American groups who find the 'fighting' part an unpleasant callback to the racist view of Indians as warlike, violent monsters, but recently the Fighting Sioux name was removed because the stereotypical view of Indians just couldn't be overcome. The song you're singing more closely resembles the Indians shown in old cowboy movies, the TV show F-Troop, and the Indians in Peter Pan than actual Native Americans, and that strikes a nerve. The Peter Pan one is the most similar to what you're looking at -- it isn't directly negative or cruel, and many do find it racist, but it hasn't been expunged from history like Song of the South has. I would stop singing it if I were you (or, on preview, change it up to be less offensive as others have suggested), because it may make Native Americans uncomfortable, but I do not think anyone would be greatly offended by hearing it.
posted by AzraelBrown at 6:29 AM on May 26, 2010
posted by AzraelBrown at 6:29 AM on May 26, 2010
I sang lots of camp songs like this (including this very song) as a very young child (I'm in my mid-thirties). In fact, at the time, this was our multicultural studies -- get little kids got interested in learning about other cultures in the first place by playing with a very simplistic version of it.
In your defense, while the song is heavy on stereotype and low on accuracy, it contains no pidgin gibberish of the "Indians can't speak English" variety and stops short of any sort of really dreadful insinuations.
That said, times have changed a lot in just a generation or so, and this falls on the side of culturally insensitive now. I'd probably raise an eyebrow at this song being taught now.
2003girl, I was with ya until you started with the bullets. ZOMG. No.
posted by desuetude at 6:29 AM on May 26, 2010
In your defense, while the song is heavy on stereotype and low on accuracy, it contains no pidgin gibberish of the "Indians can't speak English" variety and stops short of any sort of really dreadful insinuations.
That said, times have changed a lot in just a generation or so, and this falls on the side of culturally insensitive now. I'd probably raise an eyebrow at this song being taught now.
2003girl, I was with ya until you started with the bullets. ZOMG. No.
posted by desuetude at 6:29 AM on May 26, 2010
(then a stereotypical Native American holler with hand over the mouth)
As a rule of thumb, anything that involves a stereotypical Native American holler performed by someone who is not a Native American is offensive.
posted by crankylex at 6:34 AM on May 26, 2010
As a rule of thumb, anything that involves a stereotypical Native American holler performed by someone who is not a Native American is offensive.
posted by crankylex at 6:34 AM on May 26, 2010
@2003 girl:
Ok, I'm from Texas, and while I did grow up ridin', ranchin', and ropin', I find your alternate lyrics stereotypical and offensive. Not every cowboy/cowgirl shoots things with a slingshot, or rides ponies, or even wears a ten gallon hat (on the contrary, when I was growing up, I always wore a baseball cap)...
But seriously, folks: you can't say anything nowadays without someone getting offended or screaming "racist".
My five-year old, his heritage being half-Hispanic and half-German will no doubt confront all manner of stereotypical questions and lame jabs when he grows up ("Do you wear a sombrero when you're eating bratwurst", "Are you torn between Corona and Hefeweizen?", "Do you make sauerkraut burritos?", etc, etc, ad infinitum...)
Kids are kids. If it's a nice song, they enjoy singing it, and it's not obscene or vulgar, then what's the harm?
What it COULD lead to, however, is a nice opportunity for an age-appropriate discussion/ history lesson on the proud customs and traditions of Native Americans. I've known more than a few Native Americans in the Army during my career, and to be honest, all have been good-natured and proud to talk about their heritage. And not a single one was offended by the Washington Redskins, the Atlanta Braves, the Kansas City Chiefs, the Florida Seminoles, etc... As a matter of fact, they were proud.
(Hey, I'm a Cowboys fan...)
Bottom line: let children enjoy growing up, and try not to make every situation a multicultral "walking on eggshells" situation.
(I'll get off my soap box now)
posted by Master Gunner at 6:38 AM on May 26, 2010 [3 favorites]
Ok, I'm from Texas, and while I did grow up ridin', ranchin', and ropin', I find your alternate lyrics stereotypical and offensive. Not every cowboy/cowgirl shoots things with a slingshot, or rides ponies, or even wears a ten gallon hat (on the contrary, when I was growing up, I always wore a baseball cap)...
But seriously, folks: you can't say anything nowadays without someone getting offended or screaming "racist".
My five-year old, his heritage being half-Hispanic and half-German will no doubt confront all manner of stereotypical questions and lame jabs when he grows up ("Do you wear a sombrero when you're eating bratwurst", "Are you torn between Corona and Hefeweizen?", "Do you make sauerkraut burritos?", etc, etc, ad infinitum...)
Kids are kids. If it's a nice song, they enjoy singing it, and it's not obscene or vulgar, then what's the harm?
What it COULD lead to, however, is a nice opportunity for an age-appropriate discussion/ history lesson on the proud customs and traditions of Native Americans. I've known more than a few Native Americans in the Army during my career, and to be honest, all have been good-natured and proud to talk about their heritage. And not a single one was offended by the Washington Redskins, the Atlanta Braves, the Kansas City Chiefs, the Florida Seminoles, etc... As a matter of fact, they were proud.
(Hey, I'm a Cowboys fan...)
Bottom line: let children enjoy growing up, and try not to make every situation a multicultral "walking on eggshells" situation.
(I'll get off my soap box now)
posted by Master Gunner at 6:38 AM on May 26, 2010 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Ah, such good thoughts. And a good time of day to post a question for Americans. I hope I didn't imply that I wanted to stop singing if I were likely to offend a potential Native American, or non-Native American audience member.
While I may have heard an American accent today (who knows... could have been Canadian, I can't tell the difference often) it's the spirit of it that bothers me.... even if it is never, ever heard by an non-Native American or Native American. I would hate to perpetuate racial stereotypes with any children ever. I think we can safely say I'll stop it immediately in it's current form.
I really like 2003girl's version so far (no bullets, I promise). It's late in my country, but I would really like to hear more feedback and more suggestions. I'm quite devastated about the war cry holler. That's BabyTaff's favourite part and she just learned to do it today. Can you suggest another alternative? Or is it ok to keep the holler if we make it about 2003girl's funky cowgirl and her hat instead?
posted by taff at 6:41 AM on May 26, 2010
While I may have heard an American accent today (who knows... could have been Canadian, I can't tell the difference often) it's the spirit of it that bothers me.... even if it is never, ever heard by an non-Native American or Native American. I would hate to perpetuate racial stereotypes with any children ever. I think we can safely say I'll stop it immediately in it's current form.
I really like 2003girl's version so far (no bullets, I promise). It's late in my country, but I would really like to hear more feedback and more suggestions. I'm quite devastated about the war cry holler. That's BabyTaff's favourite part and she just learned to do it today. Can you suggest another alternative? Or is it ok to keep the holler if we make it about 2003girl's funky cowgirl and her hat instead?
posted by taff at 6:41 AM on May 26, 2010
Best answer: Nthing that it's not a good idea to cast Native Americans as kind of mythical foreigners to such an impressionable audience. I think it's OK to do with robots, though:
posted by ignignokt at 6:42 AM on May 26, 2010 [12 favorites]
(The actions start out with you moving your arms up and down with your elbows locked.)I hope that's not too drastic of a change for the kids, but if they're familiar with robots, they might take to it.
I'm Robot Number One
In my spaceship high (hand waving to simulate a flying ship)
See my iron legs run (walk stiffly)
See my lasers fly (point fingers like it's an arrow)
I patrol every day (hand over eyes while miming looking around)
On planets far away (more giddy up stuff)
Beep beep, beep beep beep! ("Robot dancing")
Beep beep, beep beep beep!
posted by ignignokt at 6:42 AM on May 26, 2010 [12 favorites]
In any given group of Americans hearing this song, I would predict a three-way split, where some fraction would be offended, a "politically incorrect" faction would scoff at anyone being sensitive to stereotypes and embrace the song and their right to sing it, and a third (maybe the largest) group who would lazily not care one way or the other. (Not coincidentally this resembles the American political scene.)
I do, however, strongly believe that most folks of Native American decent would object to the stereotyping, and for me that is an important factor.
Note, as far as the cowboy/girl version with guns goes, you'd have a similar split with that version too, as some strongly feel that children shouldn't be encouraged to play-act deadly weapons. (I'd be curious if there's a similar gun sensitivity split in Australia.)
posted by aught at 6:43 AM on May 26, 2010
I do, however, strongly believe that most folks of Native American decent would object to the stereotyping, and for me that is an important factor.
Note, as far as the cowboy/girl version with guns goes, you'd have a similar split with that version too, as some strongly feel that children shouldn't be encouraged to play-act deadly weapons. (I'd be curious if there's a similar gun sensitivity split in Australia.)
posted by aught at 6:43 AM on May 26, 2010
Response by poster: Oh aught, about the guns... we do NOT have a gun culture here and any mention of guns would have me removed from playgroup. Quite seriously, I'd be cautioned at the very least.
Funnily enough, I've also been told that singing Barney Google (with the goo goo googly eyes... his wife sues him for divorce etc, etc, etc) is not good because of the divorce thing too!
posted by taff at 6:50 AM on May 26, 2010
Funnily enough, I've also been told that singing Barney Google (with the goo goo googly eyes... his wife sues him for divorce etc, etc, etc) is not good because of the divorce thing too!
posted by taff at 6:50 AM on May 26, 2010
This is a North American folksong about white people not knowing anything about Native culture, and not caring that they don't know.
The thing that might be most offensive is for a white child to grow up remembering this song, and realizing later on that they're innocently nostalgic for something that makes them look ignorant to others.
I bet you could find some excellent children's songs that have the same appeal without the racism. Around my area, for example, there are a lot of Blackfoot language songs. Songs for kids usually have a clever animal for a main character, like a raven or a coyote. I like a Blackfoot lullaby with these (translated) words:
coyote, run over here!
this one does not want to sleep
you bite it!
posted by Sallyfur at 6:55 AM on May 26, 2010 [6 favorites]
The thing that might be most offensive is for a white child to grow up remembering this song, and realizing later on that they're innocently nostalgic for something that makes them look ignorant to others.
I bet you could find some excellent children's songs that have the same appeal without the racism. Around my area, for example, there are a lot of Blackfoot language songs. Songs for kids usually have a clever animal for a main character, like a raven or a coyote. I like a Blackfoot lullaby with these (translated) words:
coyote, run over here!
this one does not want to sleep
you bite it!
posted by Sallyfur at 6:55 AM on May 26, 2010 [6 favorites]
Best answer: I shall propose to you the greatest playgroup song ever, because yes---that song sort of doesn't float with me either.
Sung to the tune of "Father Abraham", a highly secular song:
Mother Gooneybird
Mother Gooneybird
had 7 chicks
and 7 chicks had Mother Gooneybird
and they couldn't fly
and they couldn't swim
all they did was go like THIS:
(Right Arm!) (and then you chickenwing your right arm and you flap it like an idiot while you keep singing the same thing over, next versions:
(Left Arm!)
(Right Leg!)
(Left Leg!)
(Spin Around!)
(Shake your Butt!)
So by the time you're done everyone is giggling, stamping their feet, flapping their chickenwings, and spinning around in circles. Fun cardio plus silly, silly, silly.
And the silliness of the word "Gooneybird!" (also a great name to call K-3rd graders, similar to "meatball") and the actions...oh so much fun. I used to work with a pre-k that had 11 kids represented 8 different languages. The Russian and Ukranian and Iranian and American kids all thought this song was AWESOME. So's the popcorn song, but this song kicks that songs butt.) Also---I've even made highschoolers sing this song...and they think it's fun too. Stupid, but fun.
posted by TomMelee at 7:00 AM on May 26, 2010 [5 favorites]
Sung to the tune of "Father Abraham", a highly secular song:
Mother Gooneybird
Mother Gooneybird
had 7 chicks
and 7 chicks had Mother Gooneybird
and they couldn't fly
and they couldn't swim
all they did was go like THIS:
(Right Arm!) (and then you chickenwing your right arm and you flap it like an idiot while you keep singing the same thing over, next versions:
(Left Arm!)
(Right Leg!)
(Left Leg!)
(Spin Around!)
(Shake your Butt!)
So by the time you're done everyone is giggling, stamping their feet, flapping their chickenwings, and spinning around in circles. Fun cardio plus silly, silly, silly.
And the silliness of the word "Gooneybird!" (also a great name to call K-3rd graders, similar to "meatball") and the actions...oh so much fun. I used to work with a pre-k that had 11 kids represented 8 different languages. The Russian and Ukranian and Iranian and American kids all thought this song was AWESOME. So's the popcorn song, but this song kicks that songs butt.) Also---I've even made highschoolers sing this song...and they think it's fun too. Stupid, but fun.
posted by TomMelee at 7:00 AM on May 26, 2010 [5 favorites]
Take this for what it's worth: I went to a historically Native American college, and there is no way in fucking hell that would have flown with a lot of the students there. Many of them wouldn't have minded or thought twice about it (and the vast majority were okay with sports team names like Braves, Redskins, etc). But the ones who were offended would have been VERY offended, and that is totally their right. It's not oversensitive, and it's not "too PC" (jesus god, the lameness of calling something "too PC")
Native Americans are very marginalized, and many people don't consider Native American racial stereotypes to really count. Let's not perpetuate that bullshit.
posted by Coatlicue at 7:00 AM on May 26, 2010 [13 favorites]
Native Americans are very marginalized, and many people don't consider Native American racial stereotypes to really count. Let's not perpetuate that bullshit.
posted by Coatlicue at 7:00 AM on May 26, 2010 [13 favorites]
I don't know when or why, but at some point people decided it was a good idea to have children sing songs that go, "I'm a [member of a particular race/ethnic group/culture], doing [stereotypical thing for that race/ethnic group/culture], and oh boy is it fun!" They're never (in my experience) mean-spirited or overtly racist; instead they're overly simple and cast members of the group in the song as ever-cheerful stereotypes who lack the complexity of the race/culture of the kids singing the song. I remember learning a song like this about Irish people (which, admittedly, is probably less problematic nowadays than a song about Native Americans, but still, I think the context was "I'm an Irish immigrant, drinking tea on my lunch break from back-breaking manual labor, and oh boy is it fun!").
So, I vote for insensitive or unintentionally offensive, though not overtly racist, but definitely not something I'd want to introduce to kids.
posted by Meg_Murry at 7:05 AM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
So, I vote for insensitive or unintentionally offensive, though not overtly racist, but definitely not something I'd want to introduce to kids.
posted by Meg_Murry at 7:05 AM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
The thing that might be most offensive is for a white child to grow up remembering this song, and realizing later on that they're innocently nostalgic for something that makes them look ignorant to others.
I don't know if it's the *most* offensive thing, but in case it matters to the OP, this describes how I feel about the Indian costumes and conflated rituals I learned in Boy Scouts and Order of the Arrow, which I enjoyed at the time (and naively thought were accurate, and a tribute to Native Americans) and now cringe to remember.
posted by aught at 7:11 AM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
I don't know if it's the *most* offensive thing, but in case it matters to the OP, this describes how I feel about the Indian costumes and conflated rituals I learned in Boy Scouts and Order of the Arrow, which I enjoyed at the time (and naively thought were accurate, and a tribute to Native Americans) and now cringe to remember.
posted by aught at 7:11 AM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Ok, I'm from Texas, and while I did grow up ridin', ranchin', and ropin', I find your alternate lyrics stereotypical and offensive. Not every cowboy/cowgirl shoots things with a slingshot, or rides ponies, or even wears a ten gallon hat (on the contrary, when I was growing up, I always wore a baseball cap)...
There are two differences. One, anybody can be a cowboy/girl - white, black, Native American, German, Hispanic. Cowboy is an occupation that was and is practiced by people of every description. The stereotypes of that occupation are thus not particular to one ethnic group.
Second, stereotypes about cowboys and cowgirls have not been used to disempower, disenfranchise, or relocate them in an intentional government-led effort going back a few hundred years. So those stereotypes don't carry the same sting that stereotypes about Native Americans often do.
I can think of stereotypes about cowboys or cowgirls that cowboys or cowgirls might actually object to. That they're ignorant and uneducated, for instance. That they're drunks. That they're rapists. And so on.
It's not that cowboys are incapable of feeling hurt, it's that what hurts cowboys is probably not saying things like: They ride horses. They use lassos. They herd cows. Those things are true and relatively value-neutral. Even if someone gets the hat wrong, does that offend? Modern cowboys might use pickup trucks and wear baseball hats and t-shirts and use electric prods, but would a cowboy be truly personally hurt by a song that referenced an archetypal, historical cowboy? The Native American song doesn't reference an archetypal, historical Indian - it references something that never existed.
This is a North American folksong about white people not knowing anything about Native culture, and not caring that they don't know.
As an educator, I think this is the most important nugget. Does this song give an accurate portrayal? No, it sets up images of other, equal human beings which don't correspond to reality and which have been used incessantly to justify their marginalization. I don't really think that's a doorway to legitimate cultural inquiry, because unless it's the teaser intro to a serious and informed study of Native American culture (is it ever?) it just contributes to the stereotypes rather than countering them. It's really hard for me to argue that it's a great idea for stereotypes which have a history of being harmful should be carried on to the next generation, presented as entertainment. It's, again, not so much about directly offending someone (though it has that power for some people, it's an individual determination whether to be offended or not), as contributing to a culture that's totally comfortable with making other ethnicities into caricatures, and ignoring individuals or calling them hypersensitive when they do have the dignity and courage to say they're offended.
posted by Miko at 7:18 AM on May 26, 2010 [20 favorites]
There are two differences. One, anybody can be a cowboy/girl - white, black, Native American, German, Hispanic. Cowboy is an occupation that was and is practiced by people of every description. The stereotypes of that occupation are thus not particular to one ethnic group.
Second, stereotypes about cowboys and cowgirls have not been used to disempower, disenfranchise, or relocate them in an intentional government-led effort going back a few hundred years. So those stereotypes don't carry the same sting that stereotypes about Native Americans often do.
I can think of stereotypes about cowboys or cowgirls that cowboys or cowgirls might actually object to. That they're ignorant and uneducated, for instance. That they're drunks. That they're rapists. And so on.
It's not that cowboys are incapable of feeling hurt, it's that what hurts cowboys is probably not saying things like: They ride horses. They use lassos. They herd cows. Those things are true and relatively value-neutral. Even if someone gets the hat wrong, does that offend? Modern cowboys might use pickup trucks and wear baseball hats and t-shirts and use electric prods, but would a cowboy be truly personally hurt by a song that referenced an archetypal, historical cowboy? The Native American song doesn't reference an archetypal, historical Indian - it references something that never existed.
This is a North American folksong about white people not knowing anything about Native culture, and not caring that they don't know.
As an educator, I think this is the most important nugget. Does this song give an accurate portrayal? No, it sets up images of other, equal human beings which don't correspond to reality and which have been used incessantly to justify their marginalization. I don't really think that's a doorway to legitimate cultural inquiry, because unless it's the teaser intro to a serious and informed study of Native American culture (is it ever?) it just contributes to the stereotypes rather than countering them. It's really hard for me to argue that it's a great idea for stereotypes which have a history of being harmful should be carried on to the next generation, presented as entertainment. It's, again, not so much about directly offending someone (though it has that power for some people, it's an individual determination whether to be offended or not), as contributing to a culture that's totally comfortable with making other ethnicities into caricatures, and ignoring individuals or calling them hypersensitive when they do have the dignity and courage to say they're offended.
posted by Miko at 7:18 AM on May 26, 2010 [20 favorites]
If I heard that sung at a playgroup, my jaw would drop to the floor. Yes, play action songs are fun, and it could be borderline, but the war whoop at the end pushes it over the line. The war whoop has been used so much, in so many offensive ways, that I don't think anyone can incorporate it now without it being offensive.
Oh: and wigwams weren't steepled for godssake. So at the very least, get that right.
posted by Eicats at 7:37 AM on May 26, 2010 [2 favorites]
Oh: and wigwams weren't steepled for godssake. So at the very least, get that right.
posted by Eicats at 7:37 AM on May 26, 2010 [2 favorites]
I'm quite devastated about the war cry holler. That's BabyTaff's favourite part and she just learned to do it today. Can you suggest another alternative? Or is it ok to keep the holler if we make it about 2003girl's funky cowgirl and her hat instead?
Cowboys are well known to holler such things as "Yee-haw!" and "Ya-hoo!".
For what it's worth my children (7 and 5) have absolutely no frame of reference for the "indian war whoop", while I (36) would have instantly recognized it as a toddler. You could probably leave it in the song in good conscience but it would be out of context and an adult might recognize that, so perhaps it could be transitioned into a different song or game with no relation to the "cowboys and indians" concept.
posted by padraigin at 7:41 AM on May 26, 2010
Cowboys are well known to holler such things as "Yee-haw!" and "Ya-hoo!".
For what it's worth my children (7 and 5) have absolutely no frame of reference for the "indian war whoop", while I (36) would have instantly recognized it as a toddler. You could probably leave it in the song in good conscience but it would be out of context and an adult might recognize that, so perhaps it could be transitioned into a different song or game with no relation to the "cowboys and indians" concept.
posted by padraigin at 7:41 AM on May 26, 2010
My five-year old, his heritage being half-Hispanic and half-German will no doubt confront all manner of stereotypical questions and lame jabs when he grows up ("Do you wear a sombrero when you're eating bratwurst", "Are you torn between Corona and Hefeweizen?", "Do you make sauerkraut burritos?", etc, etc, ad infinitum...)
Kids are kids. If it's a nice song, they enjoy singing it, and it's not obscene or vulgar, then what's the harm?
What it COULD lead to, however, is a nice opportunity for an age-appropriate discussion/ history lesson on the proud customs and traditions of Native Americans. I've known more than a few Native Americans in the Army during my career, and to be honest, all have been good-natured and proud to talk about their heritage. And not a single one was offended by the Washington Redskins, the Atlanta Braves, the Kansas City Chiefs, the Florida Seminoles, etc... As a matter of fact, they were proud.
Master Gunner, the government of this country didn't ever embark on a campaign to murder and poison the cowboys. I don't think there's an age at which it's too young to reinforce that it's wrong to abuse your power to subjugate weaker people. (Kindergarten version: Be nice, help people, don't hit.)
There's quite a big difference between you having a discussion as an adult with other adult Native Americans versus normalizing this version of a culture to children before they're old enough to know better. As a lot of people have pointed out upthread, a particualrly infuriating thing is that the details of the stereotype are all wrong. Imagine it being popular to characterize German heritage by incessantly yammering on about pierogies and bagpipes.
posted by desuetude at 7:43 AM on May 26, 2010 [6 favorites]
Kids are kids. If it's a nice song, they enjoy singing it, and it's not obscene or vulgar, then what's the harm?
What it COULD lead to, however, is a nice opportunity for an age-appropriate discussion/ history lesson on the proud customs and traditions of Native Americans. I've known more than a few Native Americans in the Army during my career, and to be honest, all have been good-natured and proud to talk about their heritage. And not a single one was offended by the Washington Redskins, the Atlanta Braves, the Kansas City Chiefs, the Florida Seminoles, etc... As a matter of fact, they were proud.
Master Gunner, the government of this country didn't ever embark on a campaign to murder and poison the cowboys. I don't think there's an age at which it's too young to reinforce that it's wrong to abuse your power to subjugate weaker people. (Kindergarten version: Be nice, help people, don't hit.)
There's quite a big difference between you having a discussion as an adult with other adult Native Americans versus normalizing this version of a culture to children before they're old enough to know better. As a lot of people have pointed out upthread, a particualrly infuriating thing is that the details of the stereotype are all wrong. Imagine it being popular to characterize German heritage by incessantly yammering on about pierogies and bagpipes.
posted by desuetude at 7:43 AM on May 26, 2010 [6 favorites]
I do indeed find this song pretty offensive. I am also in Canada, and have heard that aboriginal issues are taken maybe more seriously here than in other countries, e.g. New Zealand and the U.S. ?
posted by maggiemae at 7:44 AM on May 26, 2010
posted by maggiemae at 7:44 AM on May 26, 2010
P.S. I was in the YMCA Indian Maidens as a child. Here's the page from the Y regarding about how they adapted their programs.
It's okay to evolve.
posted by desuetude at 7:47 AM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
It's okay to evolve.
posted by desuetude at 7:47 AM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
This post reminds me of the time I was at the American Museum of Natural History in the Northwest Coast Indian room doing a school assignment, when a couple of drunk tourists burst into the room. Conversation went something like this:
Man (slurring, loud): "What's this?"
Woman: "Oh Native..." (literally stops mid sentence, trails off)
Man: "Aaaaah boo boo boo boo" (hand over mouth, mock dancing)
Just a tangentially related anecdote...
posted by johnnybeggs at 7:48 AM on May 26, 2010
Man (slurring, loud): "What's this?"
Woman: "Oh Native..." (literally stops mid sentence, trails off)
Man: "Aaaaah boo boo boo boo" (hand over mouth, mock dancing)
Just a tangentially related anecdote...
posted by johnnybeggs at 7:48 AM on May 26, 2010
Best answer: Well, I guess I'll pop in late and be the lone Indian voice.
Yes, it could definitely be considered offensive, simply for the stereotyping in it. Not to mention the factual errors (wigwams are domed shelters that are more or less permament, tipis are the conical tents that can be transported). :P
Bottom line: Please don't teach it to the children. It might open up a can of worms.
I like the cowboy variations above.
posted by elsietheeel at 8:35 AM on May 26, 2010
Yes, it could definitely be considered offensive, simply for the stereotyping in it. Not to mention the factual errors (wigwams are domed shelters that are more or less permament, tipis are the conical tents that can be transported). :P
Bottom line: Please don't teach it to the children. It might open up a can of worms.
I like the cowboy variations above.
posted by elsietheeel at 8:35 AM on May 26, 2010
Best answer: I'm only a teensy bit Native American, but I knew a lot of (mostly Crow) natives when I lived in Montana, and they'd definitely find this offensive.
I think "yippee ki yay, yippee ki yo" is a fun alternative to the war cry. Here's an example of it used in a children's song involving cowboys AND robots.
posted by desjardins at 9:28 AM on May 26, 2010
I think "yippee ki yay, yippee ki yo" is a fun alternative to the war cry. Here's an example of it used in a children's song involving cowboys AND robots.
posted by desjardins at 9:28 AM on May 26, 2010
I'm white. My grandmother is also white, but is a Native American historian and anthropologist; I grew up with an awareness of the dialogue about appropriating and stereotyping Native American traditions.
Anyway, the minute I saw those lyrics, I winced. Hard. It's not the fact of it, that it's a song about Native Americans; it's the sheer number of inaccuracies, and the conflation of the traditions of different nations. Imagine a song about "I'm a Chinaman," with their pointy temples and their pointy eyes, working in their rice paddies, and ending up with a "ching chong chingy-chong" kind of thing. That seems to be pretty equivalent to me.
posted by KathrynT at 9:46 AM on May 26, 2010 [5 favorites]
Anyway, the minute I saw those lyrics, I winced. Hard. It's not the fact of it, that it's a song about Native Americans; it's the sheer number of inaccuracies, and the conflation of the traditions of different nations. Imagine a song about "I'm a Chinaman," with their pointy temples and their pointy eyes, working in their rice paddies, and ending up with a "ching chong chingy-chong" kind of thing. That seems to be pretty equivalent to me.
posted by KathrynT at 9:46 AM on May 26, 2010 [5 favorites]
There's lots of other camp songs out there with actions that are fun to do, that don't involve offensive stereotypes. Here's one I learned at Girl Guides years ago:
(sung to the tune of "Sailing, Sailing, Over the Bounding Main")
Swimming, swimming (breaststroke movements)
In a swimming pool (draw a rectangle with both hands, [])
When the days are hot (throw arms wide)
When the days are cool (clasp arms to oneself as if to shiver)
In a swimming pool (rectangle thing again)
Breaststroke, sidestroke, fancy diving too (imitate swiming stroke being mentioned)
Oh, don't you wish you never had anything else to do, but...? (shaking finger back and forth)
Start from the beginning
Once the kids have this basic idea down, then add challenge by removing parts of the song, but not the gestures. So, the kids would mime the first line silently, then chime in with line two. Then mime lines one and two, and chime in on three. And so on. It's a good memory game, and good simple fun.
posted by LN at 10:59 AM on May 26, 2010
(sung to the tune of "Sailing, Sailing, Over the Bounding Main")
Swimming, swimming (breaststroke movements)
In a swimming pool (draw a rectangle with both hands, [])
When the days are hot (throw arms wide)
When the days are cool (clasp arms to oneself as if to shiver)
In a swimming pool (rectangle thing again)
Breaststroke, sidestroke, fancy diving too (imitate swiming stroke being mentioned)
Oh, don't you wish you never had anything else to do, but...? (shaking finger back and forth)
Start from the beginning
Once the kids have this basic idea down, then add challenge by removing parts of the song, but not the gestures. So, the kids would mime the first line silently, then chime in with line two. Then mime lines one and two, and chime in on three. And so on. It's a good memory game, and good simple fun.
posted by LN at 10:59 AM on May 26, 2010
The war whoop has been used so much, in so many offensive ways, that I don't think anyone can incorporate it now without it being offensive.
I agree that the song as you're singing it should go, and the cowboy version offered above is great.
I do wish there were some way we could rescue the "war whoop" noise, removed to some other context, because it's just so fun to do. Maybe it's the robot whoop? The funny bird whoop? The alien whoop? etc.
posted by LobsterMitten at 10:59 AM on May 26, 2010
I agree that the song as you're singing it should go, and the cowboy version offered above is great.
I do wish there were some way we could rescue the "war whoop" noise, removed to some other context, because it's just so fun to do. Maybe it's the robot whoop? The funny bird whoop? The alien whoop? etc.
posted by LobsterMitten at 10:59 AM on May 26, 2010
If I can piggyback a related question: in a music class I took with one of my kids a few years ago, we sang -- well, the teacher sang -- "The Earth is our Mother," which I found cringe-inducing on many levels. (Here's a clip of some kids singing it, for those who are curious.) Am I overreacting, or is this song also a bit clueless and not really appropriate for children?
posted by The corpse in the library at 11:00 AM on May 26, 2010
posted by The corpse in the library at 11:00 AM on May 26, 2010
There must be a bird that makes a sound like that, right? Where's our Mefite birders?
The corpse in the library, isn't that song actually Native American? The motion thing is hokey, though.
posted by desuetude at 11:21 AM on May 26, 2010
The corpse in the library, isn't that song actually Native American? The motion thing is hokey, though.
posted by desuetude at 11:21 AM on May 26, 2010
Sorry, but this would be unbelievably offensive in Canada too, and would be regarded as particularly tasteless and clueless given that it's a very old, outdated and - I would have thought - basically eradicated version of Native American racism (1920s? 1940s?).
I wouldn't know, but aren't there songs similar in spirit/cluelessness about the Maori? You might be able to get a 'feel' for how inappropriate the song is if you had something Australian to compare it with. You're not a bad person! It's very tempting to view the song as harmless, but Western cultural history says it's not.
posted by kitcat at 11:33 AM on May 26, 2010
I wouldn't know, but aren't there songs similar in spirit/cluelessness about the Maori? You might be able to get a 'feel' for how inappropriate the song is if you had something Australian to compare it with. You're not a bad person! It's very tempting to view the song as harmless, but Western cultural history says it's not.
posted by kitcat at 11:33 AM on May 26, 2010
Maori aren't Australian
posted by desjardins at 12:25 PM on May 26, 2010
posted by desjardins at 12:25 PM on May 26, 2010
Stoopid, stoopid, stoopid! [hits head against desk] My apologies to the Maori and to the Australian indigenous groups, both of which I am demonstrably clueless about.
posted by kitcat at 12:48 PM on May 26, 2010
posted by kitcat at 12:48 PM on May 26, 2010
You could make a couple of verses, with different cool things to be, and alternate them depending on what you think that group of kids might go for; or, better, ask the kids "what do YOU want to be?" And have enough verses memorized that chances are you can match one to one of the gleefully squealed replies. You'll get a rep as a brilliant improv person!.
"Oh I'm a Hogwarts student/Sparkly Vampire/Uruk-Hai/Na'vi warrior/fireman/Jedi Knight/Astronaut/Member Of Parliament/Unicorn/Juggalo"...
posted by The otter lady at 12:52 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
"Oh I'm a Hogwarts student/Sparkly Vampire/Uruk-Hai/Na'vi warrior/fireman/Jedi Knight/Astronaut/Member Of Parliament/Unicorn/Juggalo"...
posted by The otter lady at 12:52 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Re; the bird whoop; it sounds a little like a Kookaburra, doesn't it? You're in Australia, right? :)
posted by The otter lady at 12:55 PM on May 26, 2010
posted by The otter lady at 12:55 PM on May 26, 2010
I think there's a time and a place (and an age) for being politically correct. I read with horror recently that schools in UK are banning the song "What shall we do with a drunken sailor?" because it's stereotyping of the worst kind. Oh shit, we're throwing our cultural heritage away - a great old song with a long history - help! But once I thought about it more calmly, yes, it's not such a good idea for kids. They're not ready yet for taking on board the significance of stereotypes and downright inaccuracies.
So yes: drop it from the kids' agenda. But this doesn't mean we should totally lose some of these great old bits of our heritage. Maybe your song, with the historical inaccuracies corrected, might be a good starting point for a discussion with teenagers about Native American history.
posted by aqsakal at 1:20 PM on May 26, 2010 [2 favorites]
So yes: drop it from the kids' agenda. But this doesn't mean we should totally lose some of these great old bits of our heritage. Maybe your song, with the historical inaccuracies corrected, might be a good starting point for a discussion with teenagers about Native American history.
posted by aqsakal at 1:20 PM on May 26, 2010 [2 favorites]
My vote is for offensive and it's best to stop the stereotyping cycle at an early age or they could grow up to be these girls.
posted by MaryDellamorte at 1:51 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by MaryDellamorte at 1:51 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
Oh shit, we're throwing our cultural heritage away - a great old song with a long history - help!
That's a great example! A lot of schools in the U.S. have already stopped teaching this song. However, it's not dead - it lives on heartily in folk festivals, at maritime museums, where I used to work, in concerts, and on the web, of course. As someone with a passion for folklore I hate to see any cultural artifact just disappear - and this stuff won't - but the times and places we consider appropriate do change with the times. Kids may still encounter stuff like that, but the context will make more sense and be more nuanced.
posted by Miko at 1:54 PM on May 26, 2010
That's a great example! A lot of schools in the U.S. have already stopped teaching this song. However, it's not dead - it lives on heartily in folk festivals, at maritime museums, where I used to work, in concerts, and on the web, of course. As someone with a passion for folklore I hate to see any cultural artifact just disappear - and this stuff won't - but the times and places we consider appropriate do change with the times. Kids may still encounter stuff like that, but the context will make more sense and be more nuanced.
posted by Miko at 1:54 PM on May 26, 2010
Best answer: Using the re-worded examples above, here's an Australian potential version with no stereotypes.
I'm an Aussie Jackaroo/Jillaroo (alternate for gender equality)
On my horse up high (rise hands up high above head)
Hear his hoofbeats run (pat chest with tap-tap, tap-tap)
See his tail fly (wave arms behind)
I ride my horse every day
I ride it fast and far away
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Aye aye, aye aye aye
(and then an Australian cooee - make a cylinder with the hands around the mouth and go 'Coo Eee Eee Eee' while moving the hands slightly).
posted by Kerasia at 2:30 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
I'm an Aussie Jackaroo/Jillaroo (alternate for gender equality)
On my horse up high (rise hands up high above head)
Hear his hoofbeats run (pat chest with tap-tap, tap-tap)
See his tail fly (wave arms behind)
I ride my horse every day
I ride it fast and far away
Aye aye, aye aye aye
Aye aye, aye aye aye
(and then an Australian cooee - make a cylinder with the hands around the mouth and go 'Coo Eee Eee Eee' while moving the hands slightly).
posted by Kerasia at 2:30 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
well, I guess I get to be the contrarian again. I see absolutely nothing inherently bad these stanzas of this song. So me where it say American Indians are murdering raping savages, please?
No, it isn't a complete portrait of the cultures of American Aboriginal peoples (they had a cultural and linguistic diversity much, much greater than that of Europe.), but isn't it counterproductive to say that very young children must understand all of that or get no awareness of those people at all? If we end instruction with tomtoms and ponies, we're badly serving an important group, but we aren't instilling the horrid stereotypes. That happens later if we leave a vacuum of honest instruction about the complexities. We begin by teaching children in very simple terms in math, and language, and in cultural anthropology. Very simple understandings can and do lead to misunderstanding and racist stereotypes, but don't cause those things.
Then we have the equally simplistic deceptions of "Cowboys" and the discussion of whether or not they are also dismissive and simplistic. Well, yeah, sorry they are. Because by "cowboy" the implication is these represent all European (or northern European descended) settlers in the North American west. Wyatt Earp, Billy the Kid, Buffalo Bill, et al were not cowboys, and all settlers in the west did not have Kit Carson's/Custer attitudes towards all Indians. That stereotype of all westerners ignorant, racist and murderous is as ill informed as the worst deceptions of the Native Americans.
There were Native American raiders in the west who went on savage rampages, I'm sorry but that is true. Are such actions, by people who are seeing not just there own lives but their cultures and heritages in danger of being destroyed, understandable? Even when it is obviously too late to save anything? Yes, of course it is (imvho). Is it forgivable? No! (not imvho).
Were their horrendous, brutal attacks by technological advanced people who had little excuse but some kind of over blown sense of revenge. Yes, that happened. Is that understandable. Yes, it is, because if we don't admit that we (or at the very least many among us) are all capable of reactions that are very short sighted and selfish and brutal, than we have no hope of avoiding more of those acts (imvho).
That weird Alabama politicians (Alabama?) play on this as some kind of good thing, demonstrates this possibility, doesn't it? And makes it depiction more, not less, reprehensible.
But then of course we have this as well. On both sides some try to use the caricatures, to save the honorable parts of that past.
So, I'll cast one vote for singing this song a lot and often with your little ones. Let them get to know these people (who still hang tightly and precariously on to their pasts). That way they may develop a hunger for knowledge of a very complex subject - not just the NA native's past, but that of all colonized peoples and their sufferings and losses.
posted by Some1 at 3:08 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
No, it isn't a complete portrait of the cultures of American Aboriginal peoples (they had a cultural and linguistic diversity much, much greater than that of Europe.), but isn't it counterproductive to say that very young children must understand all of that or get no awareness of those people at all? If we end instruction with tomtoms and ponies, we're badly serving an important group, but we aren't instilling the horrid stereotypes. That happens later if we leave a vacuum of honest instruction about the complexities. We begin by teaching children in very simple terms in math, and language, and in cultural anthropology. Very simple understandings can and do lead to misunderstanding and racist stereotypes, but don't cause those things.
Then we have the equally simplistic deceptions of "Cowboys" and the discussion of whether or not they are also dismissive and simplistic. Well, yeah, sorry they are. Because by "cowboy" the implication is these represent all European (or northern European descended) settlers in the North American west. Wyatt Earp, Billy the Kid, Buffalo Bill, et al were not cowboys, and all settlers in the west did not have Kit Carson's/Custer attitudes towards all Indians. That stereotype of all westerners ignorant, racist and murderous is as ill informed as the worst deceptions of the Native Americans.
There were Native American raiders in the west who went on savage rampages, I'm sorry but that is true. Are such actions, by people who are seeing not just there own lives but their cultures and heritages in danger of being destroyed, understandable? Even when it is obviously too late to save anything? Yes, of course it is (imvho). Is it forgivable? No! (not imvho).
Were their horrendous, brutal attacks by technological advanced people who had little excuse but some kind of over blown sense of revenge. Yes, that happened. Is that understandable. Yes, it is, because if we don't admit that we (or at the very least many among us) are all capable of reactions that are very short sighted and selfish and brutal, than we have no hope of avoiding more of those acts (imvho).
That weird Alabama politicians (Alabama?) play on this as some kind of good thing, demonstrates this possibility, doesn't it? And makes it depiction more, not less, reprehensible.
But then of course we have this as well. On both sides some try to use the caricatures, to save the honorable parts of that past.
So, I'll cast one vote for singing this song a lot and often with your little ones. Let them get to know these people (who still hang tightly and precariously on to their pasts). That way they may develop a hunger for knowledge of a very complex subject - not just the NA native's past, but that of all colonized peoples and their sufferings and losses.
posted by Some1 at 3:08 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
Some1: There are no people you're getting to know through this song. The people described by the song don't exist except in the ill-informed imaginations of those who slaughtered the people they think they're describing. THAT'S the problem.
posted by KathrynT at 3:30 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by KathrynT at 3:30 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
Because by "cowboy" the implication is these represent all European (or northern European descended) settlers in the North American west.
No. One is European or Native American by birth. One cannot be a cowboy by birth. Cowboy (or cowgirl) is an occupation.
That stereotype of all westerners ignorant, racist and murderous is as ill informed as the worst deceptions of the Native Americans.
I lived in Montana for four years. I wasn't aware that this was a popular stereotype. About Southerners with regards to African Americans, sure. That's a common one. I've never heard that stereotype applied to Westerners. Your Alabama example, despite the horse, clearly references Southerners. Besides, in the suggested cowboy songs, there's no intimation that the cowboys are racist or murderous, whereas in the original Indian song, a war cry is used.
There were Native American raiders in the west who went on savage rampages, I'm sorry but that is true.
Well, there exist also black gangstas and Muslim suicide bombers. We don't generally celebrate those in children's songs.
posted by desjardins at 3:47 PM on May 26, 2010
No. One is European or Native American by birth. One cannot be a cowboy by birth. Cowboy (or cowgirl) is an occupation.
That stereotype of all westerners ignorant, racist and murderous is as ill informed as the worst deceptions of the Native Americans.
I lived in Montana for four years. I wasn't aware that this was a popular stereotype. About Southerners with regards to African Americans, sure. That's a common one. I've never heard that stereotype applied to Westerners. Your Alabama example, despite the horse, clearly references Southerners. Besides, in the suggested cowboy songs, there's no intimation that the cowboys are racist or murderous, whereas in the original Indian song, a war cry is used.
There were Native American raiders in the west who went on savage rampages, I'm sorry but that is true.
Well, there exist also black gangstas and Muslim suicide bombers. We don't generally celebrate those in children's songs.
posted by desjardins at 3:47 PM on May 26, 2010
KathrynT: You didn't get it. That does not matter!! It creates an interest. So what if it isn't an accurate and detailed explanation? It creates an interest in a past, a part of interest that need to be understood. The Native American Powwows do not accurately portray any group either. The little onyx and turquoise bear on my mantle doesn't really have any meaning to any native group, even though I bought it in Tuba City (perhaps I'm evil and racist for even having it, huh?). It doesn't matter. Tony Hillerman's books aren't true depictions of current reality. It doesn't matter. Reading Pooh and James and the Giant Peach don't describe any of the fine and wonderful things present in English Literature. It doesn't matter.
Develop the interest first. Then there are so, so many directions one can go. Yeah, this song has nothing to do with the reality. Yeah, so reading Hesse's Siddhartha is a very poor presentation of Buddhist theology, so what? It has opened the door for many who have studied further.
How many twelve year olds will be able to tell you what is wrong with this song if no five year olds ever sing it?
This is an important and interesting period of history. It has important lessons to teach about actions that are taking place today. I don't want to see it forgotten because it is so complex that people think it can't be introduce until all -- all - the details can be presented at once.
And your calling this a product of ill-informed imaginations ..., shows a lack of information, a lack of understanding of the hopes, ambitions and fears of an equally large group as that you are so set against. It just isn't that easy. It just isn't that easy! This song may well have been written by someone that admired a 'lost people'. Yes, it is simplistic and misguided, but that doesn't mean that it was ever or at all viciously intended. Those people were a bit more complex than you are giving them credit for.
posted by Some1 at 4:13 PM on May 26, 2010
Develop the interest first. Then there are so, so many directions one can go. Yeah, this song has nothing to do with the reality. Yeah, so reading Hesse's Siddhartha is a very poor presentation of Buddhist theology, so what? It has opened the door for many who have studied further.
How many twelve year olds will be able to tell you what is wrong with this song if no five year olds ever sing it?
This is an important and interesting period of history. It has important lessons to teach about actions that are taking place today. I don't want to see it forgotten because it is so complex that people think it can't be introduce until all -- all - the details can be presented at once.
And your calling this a product of ill-informed imaginations ..., shows a lack of information, a lack of understanding of the hopes, ambitions and fears of an equally large group as that you are so set against. It just isn't that easy. It just isn't that easy! This song may well have been written by someone that admired a 'lost people'. Yes, it is simplistic and misguided, but that doesn't mean that it was ever or at all viciously intended. Those people were a bit more complex than you are giving them credit for.
posted by Some1 at 4:13 PM on May 26, 2010
I see absolutely nothing inherently bad these stanzas of this song
There isn't anything really bad in the words; the problem (or at least one of them) is that it deals with the Other by transforming it into a tame caricature - making it cute or quaint. The song reminds me of old-school Disney portrayals of Native Americans like this. Generally, we just don't do this to other races anymore.
That said, I do see Some1's point. But I don't think the song was written by someone in admiration of a 'lost people.' Can anyone find data on the song's origin?
posted by kitcat at 4:26 PM on May 26, 2010
There isn't anything really bad in the words; the problem (or at least one of them) is that it deals with the Other by transforming it into a tame caricature - making it cute or quaint. The song reminds me of old-school Disney portrayals of Native Americans like this. Generally, we just don't do this to other races anymore.
That said, I do see Some1's point. But I don't think the song was written by someone in admiration of a 'lost people.' Can anyone find data on the song's origin?
posted by kitcat at 4:26 PM on May 26, 2010
How many twelve year olds will be able to tell you what is wrong with this song if no five year olds ever sing it?
This is like writing your Women's Studies thesis on "Smurfette Is Not A Career Choice".
posted by Sallyfur at 5:15 PM on May 26, 2010
This is like writing your Women's Studies thesis on "Smurfette Is Not A Career Choice".
posted by Sallyfur at 5:15 PM on May 26, 2010
Oh my goodness NO. I had a college job working with Navajo (Dine) teenagers and I'm thinking of how flabbergasted and hurt they would be if they knew white folks were teaching that song to little kids. SO much money went into outreach programs to encourage these teens to go to college and participate in the broader world, even if they later chose to live back on the reservation, and many were hesitant to do so because of things just like this song. Most of them didn't care about things like sports teams or landmarks being named after tribes, since that is fairly value neutral, but this? No.
It's not just the war whoop, either. That's blatantly offensive, as are the arrows. The tom tom, wigwam, and ponies are just hugely inaccurate for the majority of tribes, and thus offensive in their inaccuracy, stereotyping, and, as much as I hate this word, "othering." (And wigwams are never pointy. No one anywhere has ever lived in a pointy wigwam. If it's pointy, it's a tipi.)
Basically, a song that made fun of fat, stupid, Christian fundamentalist white Americans that bomb abortion clinics with funny hand movements would be less offensive, as we're [white Americans] a majority culture that hasn't had to deal with a genocide pulled off by the same racial and national group that brought you this song (I think it was written in the US, honestly, as I vaguely, vaguely recall it from when I was little). And if that hypothetical song encouraged little kids to learn about us, so much the better, right? It's not like anyone introduced to Americans through the clinic-bombing song would be biased in aaaany way. In fact, we could use it to open a dialogue about inaccuracies!
On a less ranty note - that Gooneybird song is awesome. I had my parents sing it so much during car trips as a toddler, they started calling me Gooneybird. I even had a stuffed one.
posted by wending my way at 5:42 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
It's not just the war whoop, either. That's blatantly offensive, as are the arrows. The tom tom, wigwam, and ponies are just hugely inaccurate for the majority of tribes, and thus offensive in their inaccuracy, stereotyping, and, as much as I hate this word, "othering." (And wigwams are never pointy. No one anywhere has ever lived in a pointy wigwam. If it's pointy, it's a tipi.)
Basically, a song that made fun of fat, stupid, Christian fundamentalist white Americans that bomb abortion clinics with funny hand movements would be less offensive, as we're [white Americans] a majority culture that hasn't had to deal with a genocide pulled off by the same racial and national group that brought you this song (I think it was written in the US, honestly, as I vaguely, vaguely recall it from when I was little). And if that hypothetical song encouraged little kids to learn about us, so much the better, right? It's not like anyone introduced to Americans through the clinic-bombing song would be biased in aaaany way. In fact, we could use it to open a dialogue about inaccuracies!
On a less ranty note - that Gooneybird song is awesome. I had my parents sing it so much during car trips as a toddler, they started calling me Gooneybird. I even had a stuffed one.
posted by wending my way at 5:42 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
isn't it counterproductive to say that very young children must understand all of that or get no awareness of those people at all?
False choice. It's actually possible to teach children about cultures by using authentic cultural material from that culture, and helping them to interact with people from that culture, including their actual music, regalia, beliefs, etc. Of course you need to interest people before you teach them; but you don't need to interest them with dumb, incorrect doggerel, which they will have to unlearn. I just supervised a program in March where five people from different traditional indigenous N. American cultures spent a week doing performances of music, dance, and story (including rap and hip-hop dancing) to kids in grades 3-8 and then to adults with families. I guarantee you, lack of interest was not a problem for a single moment. The kids were fascinated, enjoyed the programs, and absolutely idolized the performers, who were able to give a first-person, grounded, contemporary view of their cultures. There's really no case to be made that we "need" this kind of song in order to interest kids. Kids are interested in music, dance, rhythm, color, and process. It is as easy to use authentic material as fake material. And the kids were given an opportunity to learn about real cultures from cultural practitioners who shared actual elements of their own lives. Far better, educationally, than learning a song whose real purpose is to build hand-eye coordination and cooperation/following/listening skills.
Can anyone find data on the song's origin?
I'm going to make an informed guess: American, between 1890 and 1920, the era of progressive education. The kindergarten movement was starting (and spreading to the US) creating a demand for songs and fingerplays for young kids that did have didactic purpose, however ill conceived by today's standards. It should be noted that the didactic purpose of this kind of song was never to teach about Native Americans, but to teach Lots of books of songs like these were written for school and community-group use. At the same time, the camping movement was getting underway, and the fetishization of all things Native American - well understood or ill understood - was part of American camping right from the start. Early camping programs was designed to take middle- and upper-class white boys and inculcate them in a set of values that was meant to transfer to them the positive qualities identified with the Noble Savage. As a result, camping culture, even today, is rife with survivals of Native-esque fakelore - tribe names for groups of kids or cabins, "council circles," and songs like this. Boy Scouts still uses a lot of Native-inspired iconography and language.
I've never heard this particular song before, but the form and content are certainly reminiscent of dozens of camp songs I do know that use introductions like I'm a Little Hunk of Tin, I'm a Nut, If I Weren't a ...., I'm an Eager Beaver, etc. I never thought about it before, but these songs also have a ton in common with early 20th century cheerleading/fraternity chants and college fight songs: "We are the brothers of...etc" , We are the boys from Old Florida. Given the typical age of camp counselors, it seems likely that the form of these "I'm a " or "We're the" songs could have been adapted directly from those college traditions. My summer camp, in fact, had one that was based on an old fraternity song "We're from Nairobi, Our tribe is a good one, we fight the Watusi, they're seven feet tall".
posted by Miko at 7:03 PM on May 26, 2010 [4 favorites]
False choice. It's actually possible to teach children about cultures by using authentic cultural material from that culture, and helping them to interact with people from that culture, including their actual music, regalia, beliefs, etc. Of course you need to interest people before you teach them; but you don't need to interest them with dumb, incorrect doggerel, which they will have to unlearn. I just supervised a program in March where five people from different traditional indigenous N. American cultures spent a week doing performances of music, dance, and story (including rap and hip-hop dancing) to kids in grades 3-8 and then to adults with families. I guarantee you, lack of interest was not a problem for a single moment. The kids were fascinated, enjoyed the programs, and absolutely idolized the performers, who were able to give a first-person, grounded, contemporary view of their cultures. There's really no case to be made that we "need" this kind of song in order to interest kids. Kids are interested in music, dance, rhythm, color, and process. It is as easy to use authentic material as fake material. And the kids were given an opportunity to learn about real cultures from cultural practitioners who shared actual elements of their own lives. Far better, educationally, than learning a song whose real purpose is to build hand-eye coordination and cooperation/following/listening skills.
Can anyone find data on the song's origin?
I'm going to make an informed guess: American, between 1890 and 1920, the era of progressive education. The kindergarten movement was starting (and spreading to the US) creating a demand for songs and fingerplays for young kids that did have didactic purpose, however ill conceived by today's standards. It should be noted that the didactic purpose of this kind of song was never to teach about Native Americans, but to teach Lots of books of songs like these were written for school and community-group use. At the same time, the camping movement was getting underway, and the fetishization of all things Native American - well understood or ill understood - was part of American camping right from the start. Early camping programs was designed to take middle- and upper-class white boys and inculcate them in a set of values that was meant to transfer to them the positive qualities identified with the Noble Savage. As a result, camping culture, even today, is rife with survivals of Native-esque fakelore - tribe names for groups of kids or cabins, "council circles," and songs like this. Boy Scouts still uses a lot of Native-inspired iconography and language.
I've never heard this particular song before, but the form and content are certainly reminiscent of dozens of camp songs I do know that use introductions like I'm a Little Hunk of Tin, I'm a Nut, If I Weren't a ...., I'm an Eager Beaver, etc. I never thought about it before, but these songs also have a ton in common with early 20th century cheerleading/fraternity chants and college fight songs: "We are the brothers of...etc" , We are the boys from Old Florida. Given the typical age of camp counselors, it seems likely that the form of these "I'm a " or "We're the" songs could have been adapted directly from those college traditions. My summer camp, in fact, had one that was based on an old fraternity song "We're from Nairobi, Our tribe is a good one, we fight the Watusi, they're seven feet tall".
posted by Miko at 7:03 PM on May 26, 2010 [4 favorites]
American, between 1890 and 1920,
REconsidering that and want to bring it to between 1890 and 1950...broader, I know, but fakey Indianization was really prevalent in the 50s too.
posted by Miko at 7:04 PM on May 26, 2010
REconsidering that and want to bring it to between 1890 and 1950...broader, I know, but fakey Indianization was really prevalent in the 50s too.
posted by Miko at 7:04 PM on May 26, 2010
Oh, Miko. I was going to take a stab at the origin of the song, and I had the same sort of thoughts, but you did this waaaaay better than I would have. I think 1950 is a wee bit late -- I was going to say 40s. I was born in the early 70s, and the grownups at camp considered this sort of song to be a really old chestnut from before their time.
It's much harder to do research on these songs, since they're not included in educational materials anymore!
I am so incredibly jealous of all of you who sang "Gooneybird" instead of "Father Abraham," which was a mainstay of my childhood and I hated because it made no sense. WTF do the actions have to do with the words. Grr.
posted by desuetude at 7:34 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
It's much harder to do research on these songs, since they're not included in educational materials anymore!
I am so incredibly jealous of all of you who sang "Gooneybird" instead of "Father Abraham," which was a mainstay of my childhood and I hated because it made no sense. WTF do the actions have to do with the words. Grr.
posted by desuetude at 7:34 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
KathrynT: You didn't get it. That does not matter!! It creates an interest. So what if it isn't an accurate and detailed explanation? It creates an interest in a past, a part of interest that need to be understood.
Why go to the explicit trouble of using an inaccurate and offensive song to create that interest? Why not substitute, say, the Navajo story of Spider Woman, or the Huron story of how maple syrup was invented, or anything else that has a grain of truth in it? Why is this acceptable if my Chinaman example isn't?
posted by KathrynT at 7:50 PM on May 26, 2010
Why go to the explicit trouble of using an inaccurate and offensive song to create that interest? Why not substitute, say, the Navajo story of Spider Woman, or the Huron story of how maple syrup was invented, or anything else that has a grain of truth in it? Why is this acceptable if my Chinaman example isn't?
posted by KathrynT at 7:50 PM on May 26, 2010
I want favorite Miko's response 100 times. I 100% agree. Please stop singing this song. The cowboy alternative is cute.
posted by soupy at 8:09 PM on May 26, 2010
posted by soupy at 8:09 PM on May 26, 2010
Response by poster: I'm not familiar with "Father Abraham"/Gooneybird as a tune, but am going to try and find it on youTube so I can add a new song to my repertoire.
As for the original song... today I tried out my plagiarised version of 2003Girl's and it went over a treat!
"I'm a wild cow-girl
With my hat this high
Hear my horsey trot
Watch my lasso fly
I ride my horsey every day
I ride him fast and far away
Aye, aye, aye aye aye
Aye, aye, aye aye aye
Yippe yi yayayayayayay!
(then we stick our fingers in our mouth and make silly sounds... similar to the holler but with the index finger in the gob.)
"
BabyTaff loves it already and I haven't had too much trouble remembering it.
When I talked to some of the mums of playgroup today at a playdate they were grateful I'd done my investigation and had changed the words... although none of them had realised how bad it was. It was good. It inspired a good conversation about lots of things we sing to our kids that are inappropriate.
posted by taff at 8:40 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
As for the original song... today I tried out my plagiarised version of 2003Girl's and it went over a treat!
"I'm a wild cow-girl
With my hat this high
Hear my horsey trot
Watch my lasso fly
I ride my horsey every day
I ride him fast and far away
Aye, aye, aye aye aye
Aye, aye, aye aye aye
Yippe yi yayayayayayay!
(then we stick our fingers in our mouth and make silly sounds... similar to the holler but with the index finger in the gob.)
"
BabyTaff loves it already and I haven't had too much trouble remembering it.
When I talked to some of the mums of playgroup today at a playdate they were grateful I'd done my investigation and had changed the words... although none of them had realised how bad it was. It was good. It inspired a good conversation about lots of things we sing to our kids that are inappropriate.
posted by taff at 8:40 PM on May 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
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You could imagine a novelty song about Australian aborigines--would it be acceptable, complete with miming and mimicking stereotypes?
posted by padraigin at 6:06 AM on May 26, 2010 [2 favorites]