So, um... what's up with your teeth?
May 11, 2010 5:58 PM Subscribe
I really like this guy and he's interested in me, but he has bad teeth.
I don't normally date much because my work schedule tends toward being a little insane. I haven't ruled it out, it's just that I have trouble meeting people who can deal with my hours. Recently, I met this guy through an activity I'm into and we really hit it off. He's got all of the qualities I'm looking for, is super sweet and good-looking, and all with the bonus of working a similar schedule to mine.
He's been hinting that we should go out sometime, and for the most part I'd love to. The only thing putting me off is that he has some broken and missing teeth along the side of his mouth that are badly discolored. The rest of his teeth are normal. I'm not trying to be mean, but it looks awful.
I understand this sounds extremely shallow, but the thought of kissing someone with half a mouthful of bad teeth is off-putting to say the least. On the other hand, I'd hate to write off a potentially awesome guy because of this one thing. Times are tough and maybe he just doesn't have the money to get them fixed. Or maybe he doesn't realize how obvious it looks.
What should I do? Is there some kind of tactful way to bring this topic up so that I can find out what happened and if he's going to get this taken care of? I mean, I can't really just go up and ask him, "Are you ever planning on getting your grill fixed?" I'd like to get to know the guy better, but I can't seem to get past this one thing.
(We are in our early 30s, if it matters.)
I don't normally date much because my work schedule tends toward being a little insane. I haven't ruled it out, it's just that I have trouble meeting people who can deal with my hours. Recently, I met this guy through an activity I'm into and we really hit it off. He's got all of the qualities I'm looking for, is super sweet and good-looking, and all with the bonus of working a similar schedule to mine.
He's been hinting that we should go out sometime, and for the most part I'd love to. The only thing putting me off is that he has some broken and missing teeth along the side of his mouth that are badly discolored. The rest of his teeth are normal. I'm not trying to be mean, but it looks awful.
I understand this sounds extremely shallow, but the thought of kissing someone with half a mouthful of bad teeth is off-putting to say the least. On the other hand, I'd hate to write off a potentially awesome guy because of this one thing. Times are tough and maybe he just doesn't have the money to get them fixed. Or maybe he doesn't realize how obvious it looks.
What should I do? Is there some kind of tactful way to bring this topic up so that I can find out what happened and if he's going to get this taken care of? I mean, I can't really just go up and ask him, "Are you ever planning on getting your grill fixed?" I'd like to get to know the guy better, but I can't seem to get past this one thing.
(We are in our early 30s, if it matters.)
Previously.
(Yeah, it didn't have the teeth tag.)
posted by griphus at 6:10 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
(Yeah, it didn't have the teeth tag.)
posted by griphus at 6:10 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
Find another guy. Your prejudice over the teeth is going to kill this thing.
posted by caddis at 6:14 PM on May 11, 2010
posted by caddis at 6:14 PM on May 11, 2010
as someone who has terrible teeth (and will be burning a question to talk about fixing them soon) - if it's a deal breaker, walk away. don't presume to know what's going on and for godsake don't try to casually ask him about something that might be a source of great shame for him.
posted by nadawi at 6:15 PM on May 11, 2010 [13 favorites]
posted by nadawi at 6:15 PM on May 11, 2010 [13 favorites]
Is there some kind of tactful way to bring this topic up so that I can find out what happened and if he's going to get this taken care of?
No.
posted by Despondent_Monkey at 6:19 PM on May 11, 2010 [22 favorites]
No.
posted by Despondent_Monkey at 6:19 PM on May 11, 2010 [22 favorites]
I've got a friend who's got pretty bad teeth. He has some sort of defective saliva that doesn't have the normal compliment of antibiotics. He's about the same age as your friend, and is slowly getting them fixed as finances allow - cosmetic dentistry ain't cheap!
So, surely he knows it's a problem, and it's very possible he is dealing with it as best he can.
posted by These Premises Are Alarmed at 6:20 PM on May 11, 2010 [3 favorites]
So, surely he knows it's a problem, and it's very possible he is dealing with it as best he can.
posted by These Premises Are Alarmed at 6:20 PM on May 11, 2010 [3 favorites]
It doesn't really matter what aspect of a person makes them less attractive to you, whether it's teeth, or the way they dress, or the way they organize their flatware- you're not attracted to them and it's okay to look elsewhere.
posted by rachaelfaith at 6:24 PM on May 11, 2010 [6 favorites]
posted by rachaelfaith at 6:24 PM on May 11, 2010 [6 favorites]
Yeah, some things are just a deal breaker... Teeth are important. I know it's just the first date, but think of all the photos you'll take of each other along the way if it works out. (Wedding photos, UGH!) I know it's shallow, but so what? If it bothers you now, it'll bother you forever. And, I don't think it's appropriate to ask him about it now... or perhaps ever.
posted by Lizsterr at 6:37 PM on May 11, 2010
posted by Lizsterr at 6:37 PM on May 11, 2010
He deserves someone who is fundamentally attracted to him. You deserve someone who you are fundamentally attracted to. If you miss him after you move on, apply this to future superficial judgments about people.
posted by thejoshu at 6:39 PM on May 11, 2010 [6 favorites]
posted by thejoshu at 6:39 PM on May 11, 2010 [6 favorites]
You could always gently find out from him why they're messed up. I bet if you knew the story behind them and know that it's not tooth decay because he only brushes with marshmallow Peeps, it might not bother you nearly as much.
posted by theraflu at 6:43 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by theraflu at 6:43 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
I've got terrible teeth. Not discoloured, but as a consequence of being kicked in the face when I was 15 my front teeth look like a nineteenth century cemetery in profile---and that's after extensive dental work.
If I were the bloke you're talking about I wouldn't be insulted by your asking about my teeth. Not at all. I look at them in the mirror every morning and evening when I shave and brush my teeth; it's no more insulting to ask about them than about the cut of my hair or the colour of my skin.
Which is to say: if you know me well enough, it's not insulting or tactless at all.
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 6:46 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
If I were the bloke you're talking about I wouldn't be insulted by your asking about my teeth. Not at all. I look at them in the mirror every morning and evening when I shave and brush my teeth; it's no more insulting to ask about them than about the cut of my hair or the colour of my skin.
Which is to say: if you know me well enough, it's not insulting or tactless at all.
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 6:46 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
I don't know, I can see how it would bother you but I don't see how it could hurt to go out with him once. If by the end of the night you still can't imagine ever kissing him, move on (or maybe put him in the friends category). But you may find his other traits (physical and personality-wise) begin to overshadow this one flaw.
posted by JenMarie at 6:46 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by JenMarie at 6:46 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
I understand this sounds extremely shallow...
Well, what do you want us to do -- tell you it is indeed shallow and you should ignore it so as not to be shallow? You can't just stop caring about this out of some sense of obligation not to care about looks. Face it: you care about looks. Most people do. Whether you want to call that shallow or not doesn't really matter. What matters is what matters to you. So, ignoring it isn't an option; the best you can do is recognize it as a negative but see if there are enough other positive factors to outweigh it.
posted by Jaltcoh at 6:53 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
Well, what do you want us to do -- tell you it is indeed shallow and you should ignore it so as not to be shallow? You can't just stop caring about this out of some sense of obligation not to care about looks. Face it: you care about looks. Most people do. Whether you want to call that shallow or not doesn't really matter. What matters is what matters to you. So, ignoring it isn't an option; the best you can do is recognize it as a negative but see if there are enough other positive factors to outweigh it.
posted by Jaltcoh at 6:53 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
Go out with him. Don't mention his teeth – they may be a sensitive issue for him, and it's not really your business. And if you end up liking him even more, you might find that the teeth really aren't nearly as big an issue as you thought they were.
posted by koeselitz at 7:04 PM on May 11, 2010
posted by koeselitz at 7:04 PM on May 11, 2010
It's not shallow. Literally, it's not shallow. What it is, is subconscious mate selection. You like X, Y, and Z about him; I mean things like the shape of his hands, the sound of his voice, the curve of his eyebrows. You didn't rationally decide to like those things. You just do. It doesn't make you a good person that you like guys with (for example) big stubby hands, or long fine fingers, or whatever; similarly it doesn't make you a bad person that you like straight, white teeth. Whether or not he can fix them. (Same applies to weight, height, race, etc.)
The trick is to remember that he isn't a bad person for having bad teeth. He isn't objectively unattractive, that's a nearly-meaningless concept. He's unattractive to you because your subconscious self, which is at least as intelligent and three times as cunning as your conscious mind, considers this particular feature to be of vital importance. So it flags up "NO" and leaves it up to your conscious self to rationalize it, hence you posting this question.
It's possible that subconscious positive cues can overwhelm the negative one. There might be things about him that you like so much that you can learn to live with the teeth. But this won't be the result of any conscious decision to do so. The best you can do, if you want to pursue a relationship with this man despite your subconscious revulsion for his teeth, is to spend time with him and develop a friendship. You may, probably will, find that the teeth become less of an issue. Or you may not. Your priority order for these things isn't clear to you, let alone to us; and it changes.
It's entirely OK to look elsewhere and it's entirely OK to hang out with him in the hopes, for at least a while, that you'll get over the teeth issue, so long as you're not misleading him in any way. I'll go against the general consensus and say that it would be OK, if he asked, to just outright say "It's your teeth, Joe. You're a great guy, but those teeth of yours are a turnoff for me." Especially since it is, in theory, a problem that can be addressed.
I would say that a sane, sensible, good person who actually liked you would take that statement in the spirit that it's meant. Freak-outs are for whackos and you're better off without them anyway. You haven't told him to fix his teeth; you've stated the truth, which is that it is a problem for you. He can decide for himself if it is worth spending the money and the time (it can take years, if we're talking orthodontics and jaw surgery) to fix his teeth, or whether he should give up on you as a potential partner and look elsewhere himself. Don't forget that he is a rational agent, he is entitled to make his own choices, but in order to do so effectively he needs to know the facts. Not giving a person an honest "no" can be nearly as misleading as giving them a dishonest "yes".
posted by aeschenkarnos at 7:07 PM on May 11, 2010 [9 favorites]
The trick is to remember that he isn't a bad person for having bad teeth. He isn't objectively unattractive, that's a nearly-meaningless concept. He's unattractive to you because your subconscious self, which is at least as intelligent and three times as cunning as your conscious mind, considers this particular feature to be of vital importance. So it flags up "NO" and leaves it up to your conscious self to rationalize it, hence you posting this question.
It's possible that subconscious positive cues can overwhelm the negative one. There might be things about him that you like so much that you can learn to live with the teeth. But this won't be the result of any conscious decision to do so. The best you can do, if you want to pursue a relationship with this man despite your subconscious revulsion for his teeth, is to spend time with him and develop a friendship. You may, probably will, find that the teeth become less of an issue. Or you may not. Your priority order for these things isn't clear to you, let alone to us; and it changes.
It's entirely OK to look elsewhere and it's entirely OK to hang out with him in the hopes, for at least a while, that you'll get over the teeth issue, so long as you're not misleading him in any way. I'll go against the general consensus and say that it would be OK, if he asked, to just outright say "It's your teeth, Joe. You're a great guy, but those teeth of yours are a turnoff for me." Especially since it is, in theory, a problem that can be addressed.
I would say that a sane, sensible, good person who actually liked you would take that statement in the spirit that it's meant. Freak-outs are for whackos and you're better off without them anyway. You haven't told him to fix his teeth; you've stated the truth, which is that it is a problem for you. He can decide for himself if it is worth spending the money and the time (it can take years, if we're talking orthodontics and jaw surgery) to fix his teeth, or whether he should give up on you as a potential partner and look elsewhere himself. Don't forget that he is a rational agent, he is entitled to make his own choices, but in order to do so effectively he needs to know the facts. Not giving a person an honest "no" can be nearly as misleading as giving them a dishonest "yes".
posted by aeschenkarnos at 7:07 PM on May 11, 2010 [9 favorites]
Is there some kind of tactful way to bring this topic up so that I can find out what happened and if he's going to get this taken care of?
No, AND it's none of your business.
posted by kitcat at 7:08 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
No, AND it's none of your business.
posted by kitcat at 7:08 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
(Broken teeth can be fixed with crowning and discolouration can be fixed with coating and/or removing the discoloured enamel. Both are far quicker and cheaper than orthodontics and would probably make a major difference to this guy's look. Also, a moustache and/or beard can help, but suggesting he grow one is approximately the same as suggesting he have dental work, and we don't know if facial hair is on your list of turnoffs too. :D)
posted by aeschenkarnos at 7:11 PM on May 11, 2010
posted by aeschenkarnos at 7:11 PM on May 11, 2010
"It's your teeth, Joe. You're a great guy, but those teeth of yours are a turnoff for me."
Please don't tell him anything like this. As others have said, if his teeth are that abnormal, he knows it's a problem. There are probably monthly, weekly or even daily civil wars going on inside him between the part of him that says "No-one will be attracted to me because of my teeth, I am disgusting" and "I'll get dental work when i have the money, sure, but not everyone cares about my teeth, let's not get too down on ourselves for the time being".
Tell him that he's lovely but you really don't feel that way. Be unambiguous about not being attracted to him but ambiguous about exactly why. Seriously would you be happy if someone told you "it's your nose" or "sorry, but with those breasts..."?
posted by voronoi at 7:26 PM on May 11, 2010 [10 favorites]
Please don't tell him anything like this. As others have said, if his teeth are that abnormal, he knows it's a problem. There are probably monthly, weekly or even daily civil wars going on inside him between the part of him that says "No-one will be attracted to me because of my teeth, I am disgusting" and "I'll get dental work when i have the money, sure, but not everyone cares about my teeth, let's not get too down on ourselves for the time being".
Tell him that he's lovely but you really don't feel that way. Be unambiguous about not being attracted to him but ambiguous about exactly why. Seriously would you be happy if someone told you "it's your nose" or "sorry, but with those breasts..."?
posted by voronoi at 7:26 PM on May 11, 2010 [10 favorites]
I had a broken front tooth for quite some time. I was very self conscious about it, but I would not have minded a direct question. But it's still not really polite because you can't know how sensitive he is about it, or what the cause is. I'm sure he knows exactly how they look.
posted by Nothing at 7:41 PM on May 11, 2010
posted by Nothing at 7:41 PM on May 11, 2010
As a 30-year old currently wearing braces, I can speak with some authority on being an adult with bad teeth! I would not mind if someone, particularly a potential partner, brought up my teeth politely (either now or before I had braces and merely had crooked teeth). Don't see any need to explicitly say you're not attracted to him because of his teeth, but finding out why they look like that, if he has plans to fix them, and even cajoling him to do so light-heartedly (you gotta get those fixed or you're going to scare children and animals!) seems fair game if you two are comfortable around each other.
posted by deadweightloss at 7:47 PM on May 11, 2010
posted by deadweightloss at 7:47 PM on May 11, 2010
voronoi Seriously would you be happy if someone told you "it's your nose" or "sorry, but with those breasts..."?
Yes, yes, a thousand times yes. It's certainty. From certainties come options: seeing the dentist, for example.
It beats all hell out of your idea, which amounts to telling him: "There is something wrong with you. Something terrible, but I will not tell you what it is. I will slowly stop returning your phone calls. I will make excuses to not see you. I will leave you guessing forever whether it was your teeth (which you could have had fixed), your haircut (ditto), your height (not fixable, but at least you know), or the fact that you once made an offhand remark that I took totally out of context and you would have immediately apologized for had you realized for a second that you had offended me. I will therefore deprive us both of a lifelong relationship because I am too afraid that ... something unclear ... would happen if I actually at any time said what I really meant. Because life is just that much better if no-one really knows. Or something."
Why would you assume that he is totally committed to a lifelong project of having bad teeth? That those teeth are so intimately bound up with his ego that to even mention them would horrify him? There's a much better chance that he'd just say "Really?" and go look in a mirror, and then, "Huh, I never realized. I'll go see a dentist."
You're conflating how much his teeth matter to you with how much they matter to him.
posted by aeschenkarnos at 7:56 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
Yes, yes, a thousand times yes. It's certainty. From certainties come options: seeing the dentist, for example.
It beats all hell out of your idea, which amounts to telling him: "There is something wrong with you. Something terrible, but I will not tell you what it is. I will slowly stop returning your phone calls. I will make excuses to not see you. I will leave you guessing forever whether it was your teeth (which you could have had fixed), your haircut (ditto), your height (not fixable, but at least you know), or the fact that you once made an offhand remark that I took totally out of context and you would have immediately apologized for had you realized for a second that you had offended me. I will therefore deprive us both of a lifelong relationship because I am too afraid that ... something unclear ... would happen if I actually at any time said what I really meant. Because life is just that much better if no-one really knows. Or something."
Why would you assume that he is totally committed to a lifelong project of having bad teeth? That those teeth are so intimately bound up with his ego that to even mention them would horrify him? There's a much better chance that he'd just say "Really?" and go look in a mirror, and then, "Huh, I never realized. I'll go see a dentist."
You're conflating how much his teeth matter to you with how much they matter to him.
posted by aeschenkarnos at 7:56 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
There's a much better chance that he'd just say "Really?" and go look in a mirror, and then, "Huh, I never realized. I'll go see a dentist."
really? a much better chance? either you're being hyperbolic or clueless. you think he hasn't noticed "he has some broken and missing teeth along the side of his mouth that are badly discolored. The rest of his teeth are normal. I'm not trying to be mean, but it looks awful."? that seems completely unlikely.
posted by nadawi at 8:08 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
really? a much better chance? either you're being hyperbolic or clueless. you think he hasn't noticed "he has some broken and missing teeth along the side of his mouth that are badly discolored. The rest of his teeth are normal. I'm not trying to be mean, but it looks awful."? that seems completely unlikely.
posted by nadawi at 8:08 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
maybe people who have good teeth or perfect skin don't realize this - but people make it their business all the damn time in hurtful and insulting ways. i've been accosted by pointing children multiple times this year and their parents have done nothing to dissuade them from their rudeness - in fact, when one mom thought i was out of ear shot she said to little cindy-lou "that's why mommy wants you to brush your teeth".
and, yeah, i'm projecting here - but with some of the reactions in this thread and the idea that you, OP, want to go up and suggest he change his mouth so he can be graced with your presence...just let the guy have someone who thinks he's hot and doesn't care about his teeth.
posted by nadawi at 8:12 PM on May 11, 2010 [10 favorites]
and, yeah, i'm projecting here - but with some of the reactions in this thread and the idea that you, OP, want to go up and suggest he change his mouth so he can be graced with your presence...just let the guy have someone who thinks he's hot and doesn't care about his teeth.
posted by nadawi at 8:12 PM on May 11, 2010 [10 favorites]
One of my exes had a bad front tooth he could not afford to fix (no insurance plus super expensive issue). And... well, you don't actually lick a dude's teeth when you kiss. It's generally all lip action. But yeah, people certainly said stuff to me about it behind his back, and he didn't smile with teeth in photos.
I think I must concur that this is perhaps way too awkward to ask someone you don't know that well, because you don't know how they will take honesty. (ex explained on his own) And he probably knows how bad they are but can't afford it these days. Just don't start dating him if it bugs you already.
posted by jenfullmoon at 8:16 PM on May 11, 2010
I think I must concur that this is perhaps way too awkward to ask someone you don't know that well, because you don't know how they will take honesty. (ex explained on his own) And he probably knows how bad they are but can't afford it these days. Just don't start dating him if it bugs you already.
posted by jenfullmoon at 8:16 PM on May 11, 2010
I married a guy with bad teeth. When we met they were awful; chipped and yellow and uneven. (Oy, I'd have hell to pay if he knew I'm writing this...) He was a really heavy smoker and drank 2 pots of coffee a day, did not, uh... have a regular brushing habit, and hadn't seen a dentist in 9 years. Yeah it was a little ick and a turnoff if I dwelled on it. Bad teeth make me cringe and shudder. But. He was also the most brilliant, insightful, tender, creative, funny, generous, loving man I had ever met. So I hedged my bets. We clicked. We wooed. We married. And eventually, we got dental insurance. So the teeth were fixed. And the marriage stayed strong, as we come up now on our 13th anniversary. I adore this guy. What I'm sayin' is.... teeth can be repaired, but a personality can't be changed. I'd say go for it. :-)
posted by cuddles.mcsnuggy at 8:23 PM on May 11, 2010 [22 favorites]
posted by cuddles.mcsnuggy at 8:23 PM on May 11, 2010 [22 favorites]
I don't think anyone else can tell you what's not important in a partner. If it bugs, it bugs.
On the other hand, tooth damage that severe speaks to a serious injury or condition, and there may be a good reason he has not been able to fix them. I'd be inclined to say he probably would prefer to, even if he's a fuck-your-facist-beauty-standards type, because I bet eating and talking are probably more difficult with that much damage. Would you be able to deal with it until the day he can fix it?
Not that it matters, but if it were me, I'd try dating him at least once and see if I still care after that. If he's truly a good fit with you otherwise, I'd think you'd stop being bothered/be fine with waiting till he can get them fixed. If he's not, he's not.
posted by emjaybee at 8:26 PM on May 11, 2010
On the other hand, tooth damage that severe speaks to a serious injury or condition, and there may be a good reason he has not been able to fix them. I'd be inclined to say he probably would prefer to, even if he's a fuck-your-facist-beauty-standards type, because I bet eating and talking are probably more difficult with that much damage. Would you be able to deal with it until the day he can fix it?
Not that it matters, but if it were me, I'd try dating him at least once and see if I still care after that. If he's truly a good fit with you otherwise, I'd think you'd stop being bothered/be fine with waiting till he can get them fixed. If he's not, he's not.
posted by emjaybee at 8:26 PM on May 11, 2010
Fair enough, nadawi. I'm projecting my extreme dislike of not being told things that directly affect me, that I could and would do something about were I even aware that it was a serious issue. As opposed to being aware of the simple existence of the problem. Of course he knows he has bad teeth. What he doesn't know is that she really cares about it (lots of people don't), and she doesn't know whether he really cares about it himself. He may not, which could explain why he has bad teeth.
When I said "much better chance" I meant that, if he were told "you have bad teeth", there is a much better chance of this comment, coming from a woman he finds attractive and wants to spend time with, reminding him of the problem's existence and prompting him to actually go see the dentist, than of him freaking out, bursting into tears, running away, being horribly offended, or whatever the downside is of telling him the truth that you are imagining.
Also, if he knows that it's because of bad teeth, then he knows it's not because he's balding, is a bit pudgy, likes to watch Pokemon cartoons, has a cat, or any of the ten thousand other insecurities and doubts he has about himself that you don't care about or actually like. That gives him a decision to make. Not telling him just denies him that, and achieves nothing insofar as protecting him from the pain of you not liking him. Instead he thinks "she doesn't like me and I don't know why". Personally, that hurts more, again because of the deprivation of the opportunity to fix it. But maybe it is just me.
I'm not advocating you get up and just tell him. If you really like this man, give him a decent chance. See if you can get over the teeth. But if not, and he asks, have the courage and decency to look him in the eye and tell him what you actually think.
posted by aeschenkarnos at 9:10 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
When I said "much better chance" I meant that, if he were told "you have bad teeth", there is a much better chance of this comment, coming from a woman he finds attractive and wants to spend time with, reminding him of the problem's existence and prompting him to actually go see the dentist, than of him freaking out, bursting into tears, running away, being horribly offended, or whatever the downside is of telling him the truth that you are imagining.
Also, if he knows that it's because of bad teeth, then he knows it's not because he's balding, is a bit pudgy, likes to watch Pokemon cartoons, has a cat, or any of the ten thousand other insecurities and doubts he has about himself that you don't care about or actually like. That gives him a decision to make. Not telling him just denies him that, and achieves nothing insofar as protecting him from the pain of you not liking him. Instead he thinks "she doesn't like me and I don't know why". Personally, that hurts more, again because of the deprivation of the opportunity to fix it. But maybe it is just me.
I'm not advocating you get up and just tell him. If you really like this man, give him a decent chance. See if you can get over the teeth. But if not, and he asks, have the courage and decency to look him in the eye and tell him what you actually think.
posted by aeschenkarnos at 9:10 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
Speaking as someone who in a relationship with someone who has bad teeth, I'd recommend going on the date but taking it slow if you find his teeth off-putting. You'd be surprised at how the physical superficialities become irrelevent the more you get to know somebody. If, by, say the third or fourth date, the teeth are still a dealbreaker, then you can still part as friends w/o denying yourself the opportunity of finding someone special.
Also, if you're nervous about kissing him due to his teeth, there's no hard and fast rule that a first date must end in a kiss, especially for people in their 30's. Give him (and yourself) a shot. I'm glad I did that with my SO, because despite her teeth and my initial hang-up about them, I'm in one of the best relationships I've ever had. YMMV, of course, but better to pursue something than regret something, I always say.
posted by KingEdRa at 9:12 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
Also, if you're nervous about kissing him due to his teeth, there's no hard and fast rule that a first date must end in a kiss, especially for people in their 30's. Give him (and yourself) a shot. I'm glad I did that with my SO, because despite her teeth and my initial hang-up about them, I'm in one of the best relationships I've ever had. YMMV, of course, but better to pursue something than regret something, I always say.
posted by KingEdRa at 9:12 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
I once dated a girl with incredibly crooked teeth. Like, holy-fuck-get-thee-to-an-orthodontist-now kinda teeth.
And while her crooked teeth caused zero problems (still a fine smile, awesome kisser, incredible oral sex) ...
... I let her go.
Now, I didn't dump her because of her bad teeth ... but in my young-20-something-idiot brain, it wasn't exactly helping her cause.
It was among the most foolish decisions I ever made. Because, really, in every respect, she was awesome. I can see that now. I had very deliberately shot myself square in the foot.
I ran into her years later. She had found the money to get her teeth fixed. She explained that it really took a lot of work underneath the hood, so to speak. Her smile had gotten 100 percent better.
I imagine the oral sex was still roll-your-eyes-back-into-your-head awesome.
But, see, I could only imagine that last part. Because some other guy was a lot smarter than me.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:18 PM on May 11, 2010 [12 favorites]
And while her crooked teeth caused zero problems (still a fine smile, awesome kisser, incredible oral sex) ...
... I let her go.
Now, I didn't dump her because of her bad teeth ... but in my young-20-something-idiot brain, it wasn't exactly helping her cause.
It was among the most foolish decisions I ever made. Because, really, in every respect, she was awesome. I can see that now. I had very deliberately shot myself square in the foot.
I ran into her years later. She had found the money to get her teeth fixed. She explained that it really took a lot of work underneath the hood, so to speak. Her smile had gotten 100 percent better.
I imagine the oral sex was still roll-your-eyes-back-into-your-head awesome.
But, see, I could only imagine that last part. Because some other guy was a lot smarter than me.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:18 PM on May 11, 2010 [12 favorites]
My dad broke off most of his front teeth when he was 16, when he botched diving into a swimming pool. My grandmother didn't have the money to pay for a dentist and since he was on scholarship through college, he still had broken teeth when he met my mom (24). She was slightly repulsed by his teeth, but they went out and obviously I'm here as a result. It may have been tacky, but she did give him the condition of getting his teeth fixed after they got engaged (following being together for 2 years). So obviously, I'd say try to set aside your feelings about his teeth and see if there is/isn't other reasons to want to date him. I wouldn't be here if my mom hadn't been able to get over how my dad's teeth where when she first met him.
posted by green_flash at 9:46 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by green_flash at 9:46 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
I don't have great teeth. They're not discolored and I take good care of them, but due to a combo of poorness and the shit end of the dental genetic stick, everything's not quite where it belongs, and I do have some adult teeth that haven't come in, so it looks like I'm missing teeth (they're up there, I swear!). It really hurts when people are so cavalier with their snobby statements about teeth. Not all of us had parents that had thousands to spend on braces (would you ever say you wouldn't be attracted to someone who grew up poor?). Also, straight teeth may not have been the same priority for all parents, or maybe the person has a medical problem.
I totally understand that you can't really help what you're attracted to and not attracted to, and that might rule this guy out -- but I just hope you (and a lot of other people) will understand that "bad teeth" can be the result of a lot of different things, not simply poor hygiene. And he could definitely be planning to or even be in the process of getting them fixed. It takes a lot of time, and obviously a lot of money (one tooth implant costs $5,000). I need to get mine fixed one day, but during that whole process I'm going to look even more heinous. Sigh. What will people like you think then?
I think you should at least go out with this guy and see what happens. Maybe after a little while bring it up -- it sounds like maybe guys aren't so sensitive about this, based on some other replies? If you can't bring yourself around to be attracted to him, don't worry; some other girl who can look beyond his teeth will snatch him up.
posted by imalaowai at 9:49 PM on May 11, 2010 [3 favorites]
I totally understand that you can't really help what you're attracted to and not attracted to, and that might rule this guy out -- but I just hope you (and a lot of other people) will understand that "bad teeth" can be the result of a lot of different things, not simply poor hygiene. And he could definitely be planning to or even be in the process of getting them fixed. It takes a lot of time, and obviously a lot of money (one tooth implant costs $5,000). I need to get mine fixed one day, but during that whole process I'm going to look even more heinous. Sigh. What will people like you think then?
I think you should at least go out with this guy and see what happens. Maybe after a little while bring it up -- it sounds like maybe guys aren't so sensitive about this, based on some other replies? If you can't bring yourself around to be attracted to him, don't worry; some other girl who can look beyond his teeth will snatch him up.
posted by imalaowai at 9:49 PM on May 11, 2010 [3 favorites]
I have healthy gums and perfectly nice teeth…except for a highly visible upper front tooth which was knocked out in an accident. Even after thousands of dollars in cosmetic dentistry (i.e. an implant, gum grafting, etc.), things are looking better…but will never be even close to perfect. And I’m somewhat self-conscious about it because I worry I’ll be judged for something which is largely out of my control.
I did some dating while I was still getting my teeth fixed, and didn’t have a hard time meeting women who were interested in me despite my messed up smile. None of them brought it up, but if I liked them and it looked like there might be a second date, then I damn well made it a point to bring it up. Had they mentioned it first I would have been mildly embarrassed, but also grateful for the opportunity to explain. My current girlfriend seems to think I’m okay looking!
I think it’s your business to the extent that the story behind his bad teeth might be an indicator of your compatibility as a couple…the same way any information about health, values, and lifestyle would be. That said, it's important to be attracted to your mate, and if you need to rely completely on “subconscious mate selection", then go for it...and good luck with that.
posted by bennett being thrown at 10:39 PM on May 11, 2010
I did some dating while I was still getting my teeth fixed, and didn’t have a hard time meeting women who were interested in me despite my messed up smile. None of them brought it up, but if I liked them and it looked like there might be a second date, then I damn well made it a point to bring it up. Had they mentioned it first I would have been mildly embarrassed, but also grateful for the opportunity to explain. My current girlfriend seems to think I’m okay looking!
I think it’s your business to the extent that the story behind his bad teeth might be an indicator of your compatibility as a couple…the same way any information about health, values, and lifestyle would be. That said, it's important to be attracted to your mate, and if you need to rely completely on “subconscious mate selection", then go for it...and good luck with that.
posted by bennett being thrown at 10:39 PM on May 11, 2010
Bad teeth here. And I'm in the process of maybe starting to date someone, to the point that I carefully read this question for similarities.
Like bennett, I plan to bring it up myself if she doesn't. I'm diabetic, and I've been through a period of immense family stress, and before that I had only intermittent access to dental insurance. If I'd taken care of myself beforehand, the periodontal wouldn't have been such a problem, but it's pretty much all water under the bridge (pun half intended) at this point. I probably need $5K to $10K of work done, conservatively, and that just isn't something available right now. I'm thinking Mexico.
The fact is I look about as unattractive with my teeth now as I imagined I looked most of my life. For various reasons, I went through multiple personal ordeals, and feel I've cleansed myself of (some) prior depressive and insecure traits to the extent that I'm ready to date again, but wasn't really expecting to pursue anything until I got the work done. Now I've met someone I click with, and damned if I don't regret every moment of my dental and systemic neglect that brought this on. I'm no longer disposed to be sensitive, though. I'm in a city with a lot of unfortunates and really, I have the option of cowering in my room or going about remaking my life ... with bad teeth.
Anyway. I'm not making this about me, I'm trying to stand in for Anon's guy. Maybe he really is ashamed, maybe he's 100% over it, even more than I am -- in Shane MacGowan territory. Mostly, I'm orthodontically stable right now, and I can eat most of what I want, but these practical considerations outweigh anything psychological. If I were him, I'd probably appreciate a tactful, neutral approach to the topic, such as "Can you eat X?" when you're choosing a restaurant. It might open up a discussion, or you can judge by his reaction whether you want to even talk about it -- and through that whether his handling of the issue is in line with what you're looking for in a person.
I think my quarry is OK with it, maybe even has some positive spin on how well I'm handling myself in spite of it, but I really don't know. Maybe she hasn't thought about it nearly as much as I have. Maybe it'll go exactly nowhere. Lord knows I have plenty of other reasons right now someone may not want to choose me.
posted by dhartung at 11:17 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
Like bennett, I plan to bring it up myself if she doesn't. I'm diabetic, and I've been through a period of immense family stress, and before that I had only intermittent access to dental insurance. If I'd taken care of myself beforehand, the periodontal wouldn't have been such a problem, but it's pretty much all water under the bridge (pun half intended) at this point. I probably need $5K to $10K of work done, conservatively, and that just isn't something available right now. I'm thinking Mexico.
The fact is I look about as unattractive with my teeth now as I imagined I looked most of my life. For various reasons, I went through multiple personal ordeals, and feel I've cleansed myself of (some) prior depressive and insecure traits to the extent that I'm ready to date again, but wasn't really expecting to pursue anything until I got the work done. Now I've met someone I click with, and damned if I don't regret every moment of my dental and systemic neglect that brought this on. I'm no longer disposed to be sensitive, though. I'm in a city with a lot of unfortunates and really, I have the option of cowering in my room or going about remaking my life ... with bad teeth.
Anyway. I'm not making this about me, I'm trying to stand in for Anon's guy. Maybe he really is ashamed, maybe he's 100% over it, even more than I am -- in Shane MacGowan territory. Mostly, I'm orthodontically stable right now, and I can eat most of what I want, but these practical considerations outweigh anything psychological. If I were him, I'd probably appreciate a tactful, neutral approach to the topic, such as "Can you eat X?" when you're choosing a restaurant. It might open up a discussion, or you can judge by his reaction whether you want to even talk about it -- and through that whether his handling of the issue is in line with what you're looking for in a person.
I think my quarry is OK with it, maybe even has some positive spin on how well I'm handling myself in spite of it, but I really don't know. Maybe she hasn't thought about it nearly as much as I have. Maybe it'll go exactly nowhere. Lord knows I have plenty of other reasons right now someone may not want to choose me.
posted by dhartung at 11:17 PM on May 11, 2010 [2 favorites]
Why don't you just go out on a casual date or two with him, one where you have a nice dinner and talk and don't fool around, and learn about each other? Maybe he'll volunteer information about his teeth that will reassure you they're temporary, or let you know it's chronic. Maybe after a few dates talking directly to his face, you won't notice so much, or you'll realize for certain that it's a no-go. No matter what, you'll get more useful information than you'll get asking us.
I mean, people still go on a few dates to feel each other out, right? I'm not THAT old-fashioned, am I?
posted by davejay at 11:34 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
I mean, people still go on a few dates to feel each other out, right? I'm not THAT old-fashioned, am I?
posted by davejay at 11:34 PM on May 11, 2010 [1 favorite]
I don't know where you are or where he's from, but have you considered the cultural angle on this? Not all cultures value straight, white teeth as much as North Americans. It may well be that where he's from, bad teeth are not a detriment to attractiveness, or a small enough detriment that it's not worth fixing. No advice on how to bring it up, I'm afraid, but just a counterpoint to all the "he knows and would have done something already if he could."
posted by jetsetlag at 1:02 AM on May 12, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by jetsetlag at 1:02 AM on May 12, 2010 [1 favorite]
It beats all hell out of your idea, which amounts to telling him: "There is something wrong with you. Something terrible, but I will not tell you what it is. I will slowly stop returning your phone calls. I will make excuses to not see you. I will leave you guessing forever whether it was your teeth ....etc.etc.
Sheesh, you do know that's not the only way to break it off with people other than insulting them?
You can be straightforward but kind and say "I'm really sorry, I enjoy your company, but I just don't feel that way about you" without running down a detailed litany of their precise faults. Most adults know that sometimes, inexplicably, no matter how much either party wants it, there's not a physical/sexual attraction, and that sometimes someone just has to say that out loud, because you can't just fake it out of politeness.
Which is probably what I would be inclined to do if I felt the same after several dates. But then I'm single, and maybe that's why!
posted by penguin pie at 8:16 AM on May 12, 2010
Sheesh, you do know that's not the only way to break it off with people other than insulting them?
You can be straightforward but kind and say "I'm really sorry, I enjoy your company, but I just don't feel that way about you" without running down a detailed litany of their precise faults. Most adults know that sometimes, inexplicably, no matter how much either party wants it, there's not a physical/sexual attraction, and that sometimes someone just has to say that out loud, because you can't just fake it out of politeness.
Which is probably what I would be inclined to do if I felt the same after several dates. But then I'm single, and maybe that's why!
posted by penguin pie at 8:16 AM on May 12, 2010
OK, so I don't know how bad these teeth are.
But...
"Is there some kind of tactful way to bring this topic up so that I can find out what happened and if he's going to get this taken care of?"
How would it make you feel if, say, you wore glasses and your boyfriend kept asking you why you weren't getting laser surgery? Or you are overweight, and he keeps asking you why you can't just lose those few pounds and how come you're a bit porky anyway? This is how it's going to sound to him. Because I can bet all the teeth in my mouth that he is extremely, painfully aware of how bad his dental work is.
If it's a real deal-breaker for you, the best thing you can do is to end it now, in the same way you would with any nice guy that you just did't fancy.
posted by mippy at 8:27 AM on May 12, 2010
But...
"Is there some kind of tactful way to bring this topic up so that I can find out what happened and if he's going to get this taken care of?"
How would it make you feel if, say, you wore glasses and your boyfriend kept asking you why you weren't getting laser surgery? Or you are overweight, and he keeps asking you why you can't just lose those few pounds and how come you're a bit porky anyway? This is how it's going to sound to him. Because I can bet all the teeth in my mouth that he is extremely, painfully aware of how bad his dental work is.
If it's a real deal-breaker for you, the best thing you can do is to end it now, in the same way you would with any nice guy that you just did't fancy.
posted by mippy at 8:27 AM on May 12, 2010
Anecdotal: I have this friend, the "always wondered how we never ended up dating" kind of friend. A few years back, she brought up out of the blue that the topic had actually been discussed with her parents -- and they were vehemently opposed to the idea. They liked me just fine, but my never-straightened teeth were an absolute deal-breaker... because only parents who didn't love their children would have not gotten them braces.
So, don't feel too bad... as long as you're not leaping to crazy conclusions about him over it, at least.
(footnote: my friend's rapid divorce from a man deemed acceptable would seem to indicate that choosing mates based on the status of their teeth is a poor predictor of marital success... but I will admit that they probably did accurately assess the state of my family, however crazily they arrived at the conclusion)
posted by Pufferish at 8:28 AM on May 12, 2010 [2 favorites]
So, don't feel too bad... as long as you're not leaping to crazy conclusions about him over it, at least.
(footnote: my friend's rapid divorce from a man deemed acceptable would seem to indicate that choosing mates based on the status of their teeth is a poor predictor of marital success... but I will admit that they probably did accurately assess the state of my family, however crazily they arrived at the conclusion)
posted by Pufferish at 8:28 AM on May 12, 2010 [2 favorites]
Also, jetsetlag has a point. Some people have bad teeth because of money. Some people because of cultural habits. Some people are just terrified of the dentist and it's hard to do the work now that needs doing because they didn't brush enough as a child. It's not really something you can bring up at this point in your acquaintance without it coming off oddly.
posted by mippy at 8:32 AM on May 12, 2010
posted by mippy at 8:32 AM on May 12, 2010
Try going out with him and see if you click. My ex had terrible teeth and people would tell him so or say, "Did you know you have a snaggle tooth?" and he would be like, "NO, I'VE NEVER LOOKED IN A MIRROR." He was okay talking with me about it, but obviously it pissed him off when total strangers would ask dumb questions. He eventually got braces but I wouldn't have cared either way. My teeth standards may be low though; I dated another guy who had "meth teeth" from actually using meth.
posted by ShadePlant at 9:13 AM on May 12, 2010
posted by ShadePlant at 9:13 AM on May 12, 2010
"Bad" teeth here. In quotes because I actually really like my snaggle teeth. They were especially great in the 90s when all the Alternative boys had huge crushes on Jewel— and thought her bad teeth were kind of hot.
I like them because they are unique and quirky. I like them because they come with a great story, like a gnarly scar, that still amuses me to this day. (Bumper car accident at age 9 in South America. Ironic— BUMPER CAR ACCIDENT.) My mother begged me to get braces once in high school and once in collge. Both times I refused, because dang it, I like my snaggles.
I didn't, and still don't, want to live up to someone else's image of "beauty" or "attractiveness," because it's all really subjective anyway. All I can do is look the way I want to look. (That said, I would be really bummed/turned off if somebody told me that they didn't like me because of a physical trait I happen to love.)
How do you know he "doesn't know his teeth are so bad" or "doesn't have the money?" Maybe he likes his weirdo teeth as much as I like mine, and wouldn't change them for the world.
TL;DR: He might think his teeth are great. If you don't like them and can't enjoy what he might think is great about himself, let him find somebody that does.
posted by functionequalsform at 9:13 AM on May 12, 2010 [1 favorite]
I like them because they are unique and quirky. I like them because they come with a great story, like a gnarly scar, that still amuses me to this day. (Bumper car accident at age 9 in South America. Ironic— BUMPER CAR ACCIDENT.) My mother begged me to get braces once in high school and once in collge. Both times I refused, because dang it, I like my snaggles.
I didn't, and still don't, want to live up to someone else's image of "beauty" or "attractiveness," because it's all really subjective anyway. All I can do is look the way I want to look. (That said, I would be really bummed/turned off if somebody told me that they didn't like me because of a physical trait I happen to love.)
How do you know he "doesn't know his teeth are so bad" or "doesn't have the money?" Maybe he likes his weirdo teeth as much as I like mine, and wouldn't change them for the world.
TL;DR: He might think his teeth are great. If you don't like them and can't enjoy what he might think is great about himself, let him find somebody that does.
posted by functionequalsform at 9:13 AM on May 12, 2010 [1 favorite]
This fall, I'm marrying a guy who had a corrupt dentist as a child. Eventually, this dentist found himself in legal trouble for all the suffering he had caused his patients, who were primarily children.
This loser dentist destroyed three of my man's molars. One day, we'll be able to pay to have them fixed, but until then, he's missing a few teeth. He did nothing wrong to cause his teeth to crumble, but he's never had the money to have them cosmetically repaired.
Obviously, his broken teeth aren't important to me. I'm marrying him. I kiss him without hesitation. His mouth is not dirty or gross, and he's very attractive -- he just had bad luck. Not everyone can financially afford to fix dental bad luck, however. It's an astoundingly expensive proposition.
I'm sorry for this guy you like, if he just can't pay to have his teeth fixed right now. Even more sad if it turns out women consider that inability to be a dealbreaker.
My life would be much worse if I'd used dental perfection as a relationship criterion.
posted by Coatlicue at 1:50 PM on May 12, 2010 [1 favorite]
This loser dentist destroyed three of my man's molars. One day, we'll be able to pay to have them fixed, but until then, he's missing a few teeth. He did nothing wrong to cause his teeth to crumble, but he's never had the money to have them cosmetically repaired.
Obviously, his broken teeth aren't important to me. I'm marrying him. I kiss him without hesitation. His mouth is not dirty or gross, and he's very attractive -- he just had bad luck. Not everyone can financially afford to fix dental bad luck, however. It's an astoundingly expensive proposition.
I'm sorry for this guy you like, if he just can't pay to have his teeth fixed right now. Even more sad if it turns out women consider that inability to be a dealbreaker.
My life would be much worse if I'd used dental perfection as a relationship criterion.
posted by Coatlicue at 1:50 PM on May 12, 2010 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Iggley at 6:03 PM on May 11, 2010 [4 favorites]