Endodontist nabbed by feds
February 23, 2010 9:59 PM   Subscribe

I was referred to an endodontist, and while I was filling out forms in the antechamber there this morning prior to my appointment, preparing to go in for a root canal, the office was raided by a dozen or so federal police with a search warrant. I don't plan to return. Is it incumbent upon me to reveal this information on yelp, etc?
posted by goofyfoot to Grab Bag (18 answers total)
 
Incumbent, in what sense. Certainly there is no requirement.

If you have some idea what it was all about it might be useful to post it for the edificaition of others. I mean, if they are filing fradulent claims with Medicare they deserve to lose their customers.

But if you don't know, don't diss.
posted by SLC Mom at 10:02 PM on February 23, 2010 [1 favorite]


I don't know if it is incumbent on you, but it would be a nice thing to let people know about.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 10:02 PM on February 23, 2010


federal police? Who are the federal police?

To me, being raided by police sounds very much negative and potentially hurtful to the business that until I had more facts I would not want to spread part of the story. That whole pesky innocent until proven guilty thing seems to come into this.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 10:09 PM on February 23, 2010 [6 favorites]


Yeah, what JohnnyGunn said. Sounds like you have no idea what happened, so it could have been anything. Maybe there was a criminal getting a root canal, maybe a nurse was wanted on a warrant unbeknownst to the doctor, etc, etc.

Here's what will probably happen:
a) Doctor gets convicted of something and is, therefor, no longer available to see patients. Listing on yelp either flips to - CLOSED or the doctor is no longer part of the practice. Either way, problem solved. Or,
b) Doctor is not convicted and is this proven innocent. You do nothing because nothing wrong happened. The world keeps turning.

Writing a review on yelp is only valuable if based on fact / personal experience. You might not have either of those in this case.
posted by pkingdesign at 10:30 PM on February 23, 2010 [4 favorites]


Perhaps you should hit Google News and look for some articles about this? The FBI raiding the place is, uh, noteworthy, and a few good sources should help you substantiate any Yelp post you make.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 10:47 PM on February 23, 2010


That's sort of a neat story! I can understand why you have the urge to share it, but I think posting about it here (with no real question, let's be honest) should be the extent of it.

As others say, you really don't know what happened, or from what I can tell, who they were after. It would be very unfair to ruin a decent doctor's business because say, a now-fired assistant of his was doing something illegal. Additionally, I don't think it affects whether or not new clients should go to them - if the business was criminal in some way, then the feds should have dealt with and shut it down, if it wasn't, then it says nothing at all about the quality of medical services available.
posted by crabintheocean at 10:49 PM on February 23, 2010


Response by poster: I have no idea what happened, except that he's not able to be an effective dentist while his patients are jettisoned from his waiting room by a dozen feds.
posted by goofyfoot at 10:50 PM on February 23, 2010


he's not able to be an effective dentist while his patients are jettisoned from his waiting room by a dozen feds.

Unless this happens everyday or so at this office, it doesn't really seem like a fair review to post.
posted by puritycontrol at 10:54 PM on February 23, 2010 [2 favorites]


That whole pesky innocent until proven guilty thing seems to come into this.

This. You have no idea what really happened, they might not have even been raiding the right person. And a yelp review mentioning this will most definitely negatively affect their business. As others have said if there was something to it all it will be dealt with by the justice system. You can definitely take your own business away but bad mouthing the clinic online (and even a carefully worded neutral review mentioning this will have that effect for many readers) seems way over the top.

Further example: my nearish neighbours were raided by the armed offenders squad a while ago, executing a search warrant at 6.30 am. Armed offenders squad is a big deal in this country, normal police officers don't carry guns or tear gas and bring dogs and ambulances and dangerous goods fire engines. I have no idea if the people they were looking for were there or what was going on. I do know that those neighbours still live there quietly, politely and happily, with their well looked after house, healthy and tidy looking kids, with no further police visits or hints of trouble. I have no reason to think the raid actually meant anything, a search warrant is just looking for stuff after all which always brings the possibility that they don't find what they're looking for. My doing something to hurt those people because of that one event would be irresponsible and mean, at best.
posted by shelleycat at 10:59 PM on February 23, 2010 [2 favorites]


Response by poster: Thank you all for your input.
posted by goofyfoot at 11:04 PM on February 23, 2010


I should mention that my viewpoint is based on your being kicked out so you didn't really see what happened, plus it being a search warrant. They didn't really nab anyone, just looked for evidence. If they marched him out in handcuffs while reading him his rights then yeah, I'd probably make mention of that in a review.
posted by shelleycat at 11:13 PM on February 23, 2010


Not only the innocent until proven guilty thing (which IMHO should be the first consideration, but anyway..), do you really want to make public comments about some kind of federal law enforcement situation, whatever the situation may be? I'd avoid any involvement whatsoever.
posted by citron at 11:25 PM on February 23, 2010 [1 favorite]


Response by poster: I alerted my referring dentist to the raid, figuring she needs to know. I'll leave it there.
posted by goofyfoot at 12:34 AM on February 24, 2010 [3 favorites]


Since people have no problem with writing about something that happened during an individual visit to a restaurant (OMG there was a cockroach on the wall! My chicken was uncooked! The waitress was rude to me!), I think you can write about being kicked out of the office by a raid. You don't have to imply that the guy was guilty - you can say that you don't know the circumstances - but you can report factually that your visit was cut short by the arrival of men in uniform.
posted by sciencegeek at 4:29 AM on February 24, 2010


I'm not exactly sure what you should do, but "innocent until proven guilty" is a matter of law, not something that is meant to muzzle conversation or investigation. Were we to all take up the notion there would be no whistle-blowing, no lay-person suspicion, and no ability to legitimately act on the appearance of impropriety. As a counterpoint to those who urge you that being raided does not "prove" wrong-doing, keep in mind that not being convicted does not "prove" innocence. Doctors often have the kind of social and financial capital that allows them to cut deals that preserve the illusion of innocence. I understand that broadcasting the raid could have serious consequences, and I would personally be very hesitant about doing that, but I don't think the "innocent until proven guilty" standard is applicable.

What it seems to me you're really asking about is whether this incident, which affected the service you received, warrants a mention on a site that tracks that service. You could choose to treat this the way you might treat something like the power going out in the office, or a horrible smell for which they chose to shut the office down: how did the staff manage your experience of something they might not have had control over? Were they able to communicate with you during the process, and did they do so? Did they call you back regarding the incident? Did they offer an explanation, another appointment, a call from the Endodontist herself? These things can all be communicated in a review of the experience that does not place blame (even if it might be warranted) for the event itself.
posted by OmieWise at 4:55 AM on February 24, 2010 [1 favorite]


Something to consider: there's such a thing as "false light" defamation.

Normally, defamation requires you to communicate something factually false about another person. But true information which is nonetheless not characteristic of that person, or which is true but fails to include important facts, leading to a mischaracterization, can also count as defamation.

As discussed above, you don't have any idea what this was about. This could have been anything from the dentist abusing his prescription authority to a drug dealer who was followed into the office. Without knowing those facts, it doesn't seem right to publish something so potentially damaging to this person's business, even if you don't plan on going back.

That aside, the point of a review is to write about what is as close to an average experience at an establishment as is possible. If something happens which doesn't normally happen--and federal busts fall into that category--the experience is not characteristic, and thus not a good basis for a review.
posted by valkyryn at 5:35 AM on February 24, 2010 [2 favorites]


I have no idea what happened, except that he's not able to be an effective dentist while his patients are jettisoned from his waiting room by a dozen feds.
posted by goofyfoot at 10:50 PM on February 23


I get that you're irritated by the inconvenience, but you don't know the facts of the case. Maybe a an assistant was stealing and selling anesthetic without his knowledge. Maybe someone phoned in a bullship tip. Maybe he's Osama bin Laden. Regardless, the guy's just had his office raided by the Feds which is a little more significant than a Yelp review - if it really makes you feel better, go for it, I guess, but you're insulting our intelligence by framing this as a "should I inform others of this" situation. you're frustrated, inconvenienced, and powerless and you want a way to get it out of your system to regain control after your appointment was cancelled. That's it.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 7:30 AM on February 24, 2010 [2 favorites]


Could be any number of things. Outstanding warrants for crimes unknown. Drug-enforcement agents trying to penetrate the drug-dealin', hog-ridin', leather-clad underworld of Hell's DDSs. Unless you actually saw anything, however, it's all conjecture. Weird shit happens all the time. It's weird, everyone acknowledges it's weird, but that's basically it.

I might make mention of it in passing, like, "by the way, that place you sent me? some weird shit went down, FYI. Might want to find a new place to send people."
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 3:47 PM on February 24, 2010


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