Can this boy be saved?
February 2, 2010 8:33 PM   Subscribe

Can this boy be saved?

I realize that askme might not the the best place for this question but for my own sanity I need to exhaust every option that I can think of.

One of my students is heading down the wrong path. His older brother, who may be somewhat abusive of him in terms of insults and also physical discipline (none of which is likely to meet the state guidelines for abuse that could get lead to DCFS action), is influencing him in terms of his attitude and aspirations and I don't know how to win him back.

My student is in 6th grade. I teach in a low-income African-American neighborhood. Here is what I am seeing:

-he is getting in trouble more and more often, including shoving matches in the washroom and yelling fits at administrators when he gets into trouble.

-he says he doesn't need to be in school and would rather be home "hustling" with his older brother. When asked what this means he says they have been playing dice for money.

-he came to school with GD (gangster disciples, a major gang) written on his hand.

-his mom is pretty checked-out, his older brother seems to be his main influence and supervision.

He hasn't yet gotten into any serious trouble, just suspended from school. But I am worried about the path he is on. It seems like his brother's lifestyle appeals to him in a certain glamorous way and nothing can compete with that, least of all school.

I care a lot about him and don't want to see him in the gang or in prison. In more immediate terms, I think the way his brother treats him is really abhorrent and I would like to ensure he has someone in his life treating him kindly.

What can I do? How can I steer his life in the right direction when I am obviously such a nerd? I don't really believe it is my job to "save" him but I want to help him in any way I can.

In this case, because I feel the stakes are rather high, I would like to ask for only non-speculative replies from people who actually have experience with situations like this.
posted by mai to Human Relations (22 answers total)

This post was deleted for the following reason: -- loup

 
Response by poster: I forgot to add that personality-wise, this boy can be very sweet and also very stubborn and prone to pouting. Adult approval clearly means a lot to him and he is rarely at his worst in front of me, but lately my efforts to talk to him have been met with a lot of stubbornness and a self-defeating attitude.
posted by mai at 8:36 PM on February 2, 2010


What you ask really isn't possible. Sure people here may offer anecdotes of people they know who have turned away from a life of crime after a rough start, but your student isn't an anecdote. so it's all speculation.

The real answer is that it all depends. Depends on what ultimately means more to him. What choices he will make and what choices his family will make for him.
posted by inturnaround at 8:40 PM on February 2, 2010


Do you know whether he is particularly good at or interested in art, or music, or anything like that?
posted by amtho at 8:46 PM on February 2, 2010


It seems like his brother's lifestyle appeals to him in a certain glamorous way and nothing can compete with that, least of all school.

This is all you need to know, really.

Sorry.
posted by dfriedman at 8:47 PM on February 2, 2010 [1 favorite]


If you don't think you can fill the "role model" spot in his life, maybe find someone who can? Big Brothers Big Sisters has a program in Chicago (I assume that's where you teach based on your profile), and they may be able to help. Usually, it's the parent who enrolls the child, but perhaps you could contact them yourself, or maybe you can get the mother to do it.

It's not a panacea, but I know it's helped other kids. Good luck, and may the universe bless you a thousand times for caring.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 8:49 PM on February 2, 2010 [1 favorite]


I think that all you can do is talk to him a lot and try to keep the lines of communication open.

Big brothers are pretty much godlike to a kid that age so you might also try talking to the older brother if you ever meet him and basically let him know of your regard for his kid brother and how you hope he will stay in school and maybe go to college and that he is particularly good at x, y or z. Show him some of this art work or writing or whatever it is that he does well. If the big bro buys into that possibility he can use his influence for good in a major way.
posted by fshgrl at 8:49 PM on February 2, 2010 [3 favorites]


I should add that as his teacher, you're in some ways at a disadvantage in this situation (I guess you know that), which is why BBBS is great. This is exactly what they do - they try to reach kids outside of school by connecting them with people who have made it to adulthood who have a shot at seeming cool enough to trust and emulate.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 8:52 PM on February 2, 2010


My wife used to teach at-risk students in an alternative high school (all of the students had records; some of them had ankle-bracelet monitoring). She knew she couldn't "save" all of them, or even some of them. Her attitude was essentially, "Look, this is literally the end of the line, school-wise. After me, it's prison. Getting them a factory job would be a huge step up for them, in terms of lifelong prospects."

Her approach was to focus on right-this-minute achievable goals and confidence. She was very up front with them about the goals of the curriculum. They're not going to go shazam! and suddenly develop an interest in French literature. But they can learn enough history to pass the GED. And with a GED, you can get that bracelet off, and that's a step up. And with the GED, you can work at Boeing (one of the major blue-collar job opportunities in the area) or whereever, and that'd be another step up.

And that's what she did, day after day. If someone really wanted a leg up, she'd help them, too, but it was always about going from A to B to C, and we'll worry about Q, R and S later...
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 8:52 PM on February 2, 2010 [12 favorites]


On preview, Big Brothers is a GREAT suggestion.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 8:53 PM on February 2, 2010


Help him cultivate a future orientation, find something he wants to do or be. Right now, no one is encouraging him to think about what he wants for himself and his life, and he doesn't know he can be something more than whatever his brother is. But you can help him think about that, by telling him he's smart or that he is great at X, Y, or Z, or just telling him honestly that you think he has the potential to be somebody great but that the stuff he's doing now is going to keep him from being that great somebody. If he respects your opinion as it seems he does, you have the potential to make an impact for him.
posted by so_gracefully at 8:58 PM on February 2, 2010 [2 favorites]


Before a suggestion for help: if you do fail (I'm sure you know this, but it never hurts to remind yourself I find), don't hold yourself responsible. As you know, there's a whole lot of stuff that goes on outside the classroom, and those precious hours you get each day are like a piece of flotsam on the ebb tide sometimes.

This said, what is it about the lifestyle that appeals to him? There's no point talking about 401k/college/etc if he doesn't value it. You could try maybe finding ways/role models to demonstrate how 401k/college/etc can lead to those things he wants. Big brother could be a way to do this, in-class speakers could be another way, fun activities could be another.

To be honest, though, you sound pretty switched on, there may be nothing you can do. Something I always tried to instill in the kids I worked with was the impermanence of life. Let them know that, if they chose a certain path, felt a certain way, did a certain thing, it was never too late for them to change. Kids often find themselves in a world where people are very quick to define who they are or what they should do; in my happier moments I like to think that, sometimes, - if I gave kids anything - it was a tiny ember of agency, quietly glinting deep inside; the knowledge that someone believed they were capable of attention, change, power. Deserving of it, a secret that the world wasn't necessarily so. I don't know if I ever did - I know I definitely didn't a lot of the time, but I hope. And frankly, I think sometimes hope is the best thing you can give a kid.
posted by smoke at 9:26 PM on February 2, 2010 [1 favorite]


Big Brothers / Big Sisters is a great suggestion - and it may work, but in my experience it tends to work more when there's NO role model, not when there's a poor one (as, from your description, this boy's big brother seems to me).

I think the poster who asked if you can talk to the big brother may be more on the mark. If you do any kind of community thing where kids show off their work, do you think you can convince the kid to invite his brother, and have him show? I know it's always a shot in the dark trying to get family members to show up for things. But if there's any way to pump up the brother - "hey, I know how much he looks up to you, and I'm worried about him - can you talk to him, help him stay on the right path? I know he'll respect what you say. And if there's anything you can think of that I can do to help your little brother, let me know." Even if he's a bad sort, make him your ally rather than your enemy.

As an aside (speaking as one who taught in urban schools for 14 years, and who cares about students to the very depths of my soul) - work hard for them, and care about them, and never give up on them ... but don't hinge your sanity on whether you can save them. The forces swirling outside of your classroom are too powerful, and if you place the responsibility for 'saving' them on your own shoulders, you will feel as though you have failed and you'll crumple when you lose one of them to violence or drugs or prison - even if you've helped countless others.

(That may come off as patronizing, and you may already know that - it's not my intent to offend, but to say that the world is in desperate need of people like you doing the work that you do, and in my experience that perspective of helping to the best of your ability without trying to take responsibility for 'saving' kids is necessary for being able to sustain that work over the long term.)
posted by Chanther at 9:34 PM on February 2, 2010 [4 favorites]


My wife teaches and is now a social worker in an inner city high school. THis issue comes up a lot. She has tried several approaches. THe one that worked the best was to talk to the bad influence, in this case his older brother. Tell his older brother that you have no intention of trying to change him, his way of life or to rat/narc on him, but you want to help his brother avoid the same trap. Ask the brother to tell his little bro, your student, to do as I say not as I do. His brother sounds like the only one who can prevent this. Three of the four times my wife did this, the brother was appreciative, protective and willing to help. They knew they were heading down the wrong path and wanted to help their siblings avoid it. THey simply did not know how or could not lead by example. Once given another path, they gladly helped. The fourth one simply replied, "Fuck off lady" and walked away.

The other approaches she has used with much less success is keeping the kid after school to spend time talking and doing work with him. The more they were at school and off the streets, the less time they had to get going down the wrong path. These failed because ultimately, the people with more face time and more influence won out. Also, she tried the scared straight method of showing them what your life will look like if you go down this path including jail and death, but that seemed to just worry the kids, not change their behavior.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 9:35 PM on February 2, 2010 [3 favorites]


One of my close friends in highschool, Pete, would probably have been classified as a somewhat "at-risk" kid. He was from a lower socioeconomic class than most kids at our school, and while he rarely talked about his family situation, what I could glean was that there were some bad role models close at hand. Pete was tremendously funny and athletic- but too unreliable, lazy, and broke to be on any teams, and his humor, which among his friends was renowned for absolutely lightning wit, mostly took the form of cutting up in class from a teacher's perspective, and therefore was usually punished by authority figures. Plus he was dyslexic. From a teacher's perspective he was basically 100% pain in the ass, and his wonderful personality was almost never seen by anyone in authority.

As his much nerdier, more middle class friend, I could see he was brimming with charm and potential, but understandably, he hated school. Except that we had one class he would never skip and he always spoke highly of the teacher. One day I asked him why he liked Mr. Green so much, and Pete said, "In all fourteen years I've been in school- from kindergarten to grade 12- Mr. Green is the only teacher who has ever, ever, told me I'm smart. I know it's not true but I love that guy." I couldn't believe it- how could NO teacher have ever noticed how snappily funny Pete was? Sure, his essays were sub-par, but his mind was like a razor; how could over a decade of teachers have missed that?

What I'm getting at is that this kid may never have been actively LIKED by any of his teachers before you. And that makes such a huge difference in a child's self-esteem. So my advice to you is to LIKE him. Like the shit out of him and do it as publicly as you can.

Praise his work whenever it's at all deserving, praise him to other teachers, and find subtle ways to praise him in front of other students that won't make other kids tease him, and yet still slightly raise his status among his peers (So, you know, things like "Ah, good question, Pete." is better than "Hey Pete, read your essay aloud to the class!").

Especially lavish praise about him behind his back to other teachers- if one teacher points out the good in a kid to another teacher, the second teacher's new perspective on that kid can really turn the kid's experience around. If you casually tell the Principal how much you like this kid's mind, the Principal is less likely to suspend the kid next time he does something borderline, etc, and it all ripples from there. So basically what you're doing- noticing the good in this kid- is amazing, and my advice to you is to do your very best to make sure other people- especially authority figures- notice the good in him as well. Good luck!
posted by pseudostrabismus at 10:54 PM on February 2, 2010 [23 favorites]


You know what sucks? Watching people desperately seeking approval from big brothers who treat them like shit on their shoes.

You know what sucks even more? The fact that there is absolutely diddly squat that you can do to make that approval less desirable.

In particular, if you criticize big brother in little brother's presence, or in some way that lets little brother find out that that's what you've been doing, you automatically get cast as a tribal enemy and your opinion will be disregarded; little brother might well end up actively seeking your disapproval. Little brothers are fiercely protective of their big brothers' reputations. It's a clan thing, it's a worship thing, it's a beautiful thing, it sucks!

The absolute best you can do is make yourself available as and when little brother needs you, and arrange for him to notice other people looking up to you so that he gets the idea that your approval might also be something worth seeking. That way, when big brother finally does exceed little brother's almost superhuman capacity to absorb and/or deny and disregard abuse - and he will! - little brother will have somebody solid to lean on while he puts his busted world back together.
posted by flabdablet at 11:17 PM on February 2, 2010 [1 favorite]


Also, pseudostrabismus's point is right on the money.
posted by flabdablet at 11:19 PM on February 2, 2010


I feel terrible for saying this because it is incredibly presumptuous, but it sounds like he lacks a strong male role model and his brother is the only thing filling the void.

The goal you have set for yourself of "saving" this boy is pretty lofty and there really is no easy answer. But, if I were in your shoes, this is what I would try... I would find some male teacher (who doesn't have your boy for class) that you think seems "cool" or "tough" in the way the kid seems to value. Maybe see if that guy would be willing to strike up a little familiarity with the at-risk kid and just provide a different model of manhood. Maybe even just some gentle ribbing, etc could get the kid to think outside of the box of his home life.

Good luck! Your heart is certainly in the right place!
posted by muscat at 1:14 AM on February 3, 2010


Can you talk to the older brother? If he looks up to the brother perhaps the brother can be the one to get him to stay in school.
posted by PenDevil at 2:10 AM on February 3, 2010


Yeah, it's probably out of your control or authority but I'd try and talk to the brother as well. Basically, I'd approach it like this: "Big brother-man, I'm not questioning your decisions or what you do. I don't care. But both you and I know that your little brother doesn't have the same strength that you have. And if he goes down your path, he'll won't make it."

If the big bro doesn't want his little brother to be following in his footsteps, he'll be on his bother's ass to shape up in school.

It's a real long-shot, and in all honestly, unlikely to work.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 5:50 AM on February 3, 2010 [1 favorite]


I've worked directly with kids like this inside the Philadelphia public school system but the reason the kids were working with me as their social worker was because they had child welfare involvement in the home and had wrap around services as a result. So without child welfare involvement to trigger that intervention the question is how otherwise to get this kid a social worker? Does your school have social workers on staff? I know that the schools I worked in had maybe like one for 1500 kids so that might not be terribly helpful even if you do.

Despite the good intentions of everyone contributing here the fact is you need someone who does exactly this kind of work in Chicago and knows the local landscape there to provide you with clear directions on how to access a greater level of services for this kid. I would recommend parsing the faculty pages at Chicago's School of Social Service Administration and see if you can't connect with a professor there who has some expertise in youth services. Don't hesitate to contact a social worker or social work professor you don't know. If they get an email from a public school teacher asking for help they will jump to answer it.
posted by The Straightener at 8:18 AM on February 3, 2010


Response by poster: Thanks for all the responses above, especially the hopeful ones.

Re: "saving" kids, I know it's not possible to really save someone - he has to make his own choices in life - and I usually don't think of it that way, I was just feeling melodramatic when I wrote this question. Thank you all for bringing me back to earth.

What your responses remind me is that there are many helpful things I am already doing for this child - I do like him and praise him for his good work, and I try to listen at least as much as I talk to him. I will try to keep doing these things as much as I can.

The descriptions that some have written above of friends or struggling kids don't apply to this boy - he isn't a great reader but he is strong in math, and he is a good student in terms of completing his assignments and focusing in class. I know that by being at our school, which is a pretty calm and focused place, he has the opportunity to succeed academically if he can stick with it.

He did see the social worker at his old school - I will try to get her to check in with him again.

I like the advice of talking to the brother and I will try to gather my courage to do it.
posted by mai at 9:27 AM on February 3, 2010


Why don't you call the brother at home first and see if he would be willing to meet with you and his younger brother at school? If you decide to go into the community to approach the brother directly I would recommend you bring another staff member along with you. This is a totally standard safety precaution that all social workers doing field work generally adhere to, especially if it's a first time encounter in a neighborhood you aren't familiar with.

If you want any more direction on how to approach that type of encounter you can contact me.
posted by The Straightener at 12:44 PM on February 3, 2010


« Older Acceptable use of recent historical figures in...   |   Academic citations in a visual arrangement Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.