How to deal with a new annoying neighbor?
January 13, 2010 9:11 AM   Subscribe

It's always been a quiet apartment building, but now we have a new downstairs neighbor that makes noise until 5AM and makes the common-use hallway smell like marijuana and cigarettes.

We're no stranger to occasional partying, but this near-constant annoyance has us particularly troubled because we have regular visits from a 12 year-old, and various toddlers. It's always been quiet here, but now it's not in the two days since he's moved in.

Other details: This is in Massachusetts and our lease specifically prohibits smoking. It's a 6-unit building, but we're closest to the offenders. It's possible they're not bothering anyone but us.

We'd like the noise and the smoking and marijuana smell to stop immediately. How should we approach this? Should we call the landlord? Police? Approach them directly? In general, I'm not thrilled about confrontations, but want to approach this situation in the most respectful and effective way possible.
posted by anonymous to Grab Bag (24 answers total) 3 users marked this as a favorite
 
"Hey guys, welcome to the building. We have kids and the smoke bothers them. Would you mind stepping out of the building when you go for a smoke? Awesome, thanks!!"
posted by aeighty at 9:17 AM on January 13, 2010


If it's only been two days, you may not be seeing a regular pattern yet. I feel for you -- TRUST me -- but this may even just be part of him adjusting to the new building (as in, "oh, the walls here are thinner than I'm used to").

Part of what may help with the adjusting is for you to politely approach him directly and say, "hey, um, maybe you didn't know it but sound carries a LOT in this building, and we could hear you all night, could you maybe just be a bit more conscious of that in the future? Thanks."

This happened in an old building I lived in ALL the time -- the walls were tissue-thin, and any time we had a new person move in they weren't used to it, so they'd conduct themselves in what they were used to and it usually took a couple of polite heads-up discussions from everyone around them for them to go, "wow, I had no idea. Sorry about that." and they'd quiet down. I think only on two occasions over twelve years (and dozens of new tenants) did people ignore the first polite initial approach; and one of those two only took a second reminder, and he reacted with a hand-slappy "holy shit, I forgot, yeah, sorry". (The second was this woman who played weird French techno with heavy bass, and would ignore a lot of requests to at LEAST turn down the bloody woofer, and so a couple of us went the immature route and blasted things like MAN OF CONSTANT SORROW with the speakers nestled up directly against the wall. But she was demonstratably an anomaly.)

The polite direct approach may be all you need, because if it's just been two days they simply may not be aware of how loud they're being.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:19 AM on January 13, 2010


If I were you, I'd probably skip going to the new tenant directly and talk to the landlord (assuming the landlord responds to complaints in a timely manner). The landlord carries more weight than you, and will be more likely to keep his cool when confronting the new tenant (he's not the one being woken up at night!). I'd probably describe the problem as "noise and the smell of smoke" since these are probably issues the landlord's dealt with before.

Since this is MA, calling the cops won't be the end of the world for this guy (unless he's a big-time dealer or on probation)-- he'll get yelled at and fined $100. Take that as you will.
posted by oinopaponton at 9:22 AM on January 13, 2010


...but now it's not in the two days since he's moved in.

I'm not sure how you can distinguish between occasional partying, constant partying and someone perhaps just having one-time house-warming parties - in the span of two days.

If it keeps up though, I'd contact the landlord politely and mention new noise and smoke issues in the building.
posted by vacapinta at 9:33 AM on January 13, 2010 [1 favorite]


I wouldn't go directly to the landlord. You say it's been two days -- I would go down, introduce yourself, ask if there's anything that YOU should be aware of (i.e. walking in your apartment with shoes after a certain hour, etc), and then mention the things you hope your new neighbor will be respectful of (i.e. not smoking indoors, no noise after x hour, etc). Your new neighbor may just have no clue about the disturbance to you, and is assuming all's fine since nobody's said anything. It can be a mighty shock (and a major frustration) to hear about complaints via the landlord instead of your new neighbor, and this new neighbor might wind up resenting you rather than wanting to respect the things you're asking for.

Of course, if new neighbor completely acts like an asshole and doesn't respect your requests, you can feel free to complain to the landlord, and THEN if no action is taken call the police. But bypassing new neighbor without giving him (or her) the chance to be a good neighbor is very un-neighborly, in my opinion. You might needlessly be setting up a contentious relationship between your new neighbor and the landlord or even the police.

I totally hear you on the not liking confrontation, but if your new neighbor is a good neighbor, it won't be one at all. You do risk them being a jerk, which will be unpleasant, but that's what your landlord is for -- if they suck at this part. Communicating with your neighbors about expectations is part of happy apartment living. The added bonus is that you can complain to the landlord without a whit of guilt or concern, because you took the high road and were as neighborly as possible.

Think about it from the other perspective. Let's say a new neighbor moves in below you, and then two days after, you get a phone call from the landlord saying that there's been "a complaint" about your loud stepping after midnight. You look back and realize that you came home from work and started tidying up two nights in a row, and had neglected to take off your shoes. Do you think "oh, I'll take care of that going forward?" -- Probably not. You'd think "WHAT KIND OF DOUCHEBAG NEW NEIGHBOR COMPLAINS TO THE LANDLORD BEFORE INTRODUCING THEMSELVES AND ASKING NICELY FOR ME TO BE QUIET? THE SMOKY MCLOUDERTON ONE DOWNSTAIRS, THAT'S WHO!" and then you silently hate them forever.
posted by pazazygeek at 9:59 AM on January 13, 2010 [4 favorites]


Two days isn't long enough to have an accurate idea of the situation in my opinion. Most people celebrate a new abode for a while and assume a more normal schedule and partying rotation after a little while. I understand you're worried about your friends' visiting children, but adults tend to worry too much about stuff like that. If they are old enough to know what pot and cigarettes smell like then they are old enough to have a talk with their parents about the ramifications of such things. The exposure to smoke as they enter and leave your apartment is not enough to be detrimental to their health.

I think it is horrible advice to go straight to your landlord. Talk to your neighbor first in a friendly way. She/He/They might not even be aware the smell is escaping or that her/his/their noise is bothering you. Better to make a friend than an enemy when it comes to your neighbors. If a neighbor called the landlord or police on me without talking to me first I would see it as a personal attack for sure. You didn't provide any details about who your neighbors are, so I'm assuming you haven't met them yet. Being a good neighbor involves more than not doing things like partying late into the night... it also consists of things like discussing problems before you call authorities.

You also have to understand that you are living semi-communally when living in an apartment building. It doesn't matter if it has been quiet for years because apartment living evolves with the coming and going of tenants and landlords. There are housing options that involve a higher level of privacy, but choosing to live in a building with five other tenants is not one of them. Go introduce yourself to your neighbors, you might find that they are amenable to changing their behaviors for your benefit. I think it is unreasonable to prejudge them without any contact and consider calling the police on people without expressing your disapproval to them first. If you do that you're being as bad or worse of a neighbor than they are in my opinion.
posted by Gainesvillain at 9:59 AM on January 13, 2010


Also, I'm not sure about how things work with your lease, but here in Florida I've been in a smoke-free apartment building where you weren't allowed to smoke in communal areas and yet tenants were allowed to smoke in their own living spaces. If that is the case then it would be the fault of your landlord for not properly sealing the apartments and half of the things you're mad at your new neighbors about are not even their fault or responsibility.
posted by Gainesvillain at 10:03 AM on January 13, 2010


going with pazazygeek here. try to contact your neighbor and go about it in a friendly "hi, i'm your neighbor anon: welcome. by the way, about the noise and smoking..." if he's not reponsive, then i would pass the situation up to your landlord, who your neighbor will more readily listen to due to your landlord being a landlord and all.

i had the same situation where i moved into a new apartment building last month - although it was also owned by the same people whose other apartment i lived in last year. my bedroom was right against my neighbor's living room. at night i could hear him with the tv on or talking on the phone using SPEAKERPHONE. he also has a deep voice so it travelled my ways easily.

the first time it happened after quiet hours - the landlord rents mostly to students so they have a strict 10pm-8am quiet policy - i went over and knocked on his door. the tv went silent immediately although he never came to the door to speak to me.

about a month later this happened again, but this time he actually talked to me...through the door. however, 5 minutes later he started talking on the SPEAKERPHONE. i gave up at that point and went over to my boyfriend's next door. since both times he refused to open the door to talk to me, this indicated that the situation was out of my hands and now the landlord's problem to deal with. additionally, being a female i didn't feel too comfortable trying to press the issue with my neighbor.

i called my landlord the next day, and she was very sympathetic, especially when i reminded her that i had continued my renting with them because of their quiet hours policy. because i pay on time and generally am not a nuisance, she was really responsive to my request to talk to my neighbor about the noise. since then, i have not heard a peep from him after 10pm.

yesterday i picked up some packages from the rental office and my landlord was there. she said that my neighbor had been super apologetic and she thought that he hadn't meant to be maliciously noisy. it doesn't matter what his intentions were; to me, his not talking to me face-to-face was enough for me to avoid dealing with him. i am not a mind reader so to ensure my safety i felt it was best to take the situation to my landlord.
posted by mlo at 10:23 AM on January 13, 2010


Yeah, two days? And you haven't even talked to them yet? They're flaunting the rules, and being inconsiderate, but sitting and stewing over it, or taking it to official channels right now, is not going to help you or them. Dealing with it in an appropriate way is going to be much more constructive for both of you. It's very unlikely that they want to cause any trouble for you, because firstly, most people are basically considerate even if they're sometimes unthinking, and because they surely know full well that you could cause trouble for them if you want to. So don't rush to the landlord, and especially not the police, when you have no idea whether it's necessary.

So what should you do instead? Let them know that they're bothering people, and how they're bothering people, and why it's rankling so much with you in particular (the children issue). The best way to do this is probably with a note. Be clear about what the problems are, but be polite, and indeed friendly and non-judgemental. Maybe you feel that you shouldn't have to play nice when it's them causing the problem, but consider that a) you've probably (understandably) made assumptions about their attitude that may well be unfounded and b) in any case, being passive-aggressive is just going to make them more likely to reject your concerns, which at the very least is going to cause you the hassle of going through official channels when it wouldn't otherwise have been needed.

Give them a way to contact you back, preferably several different ways (in person, phone, letterbox), so they can do it in the way they're most comfortable with. This will help ensure things stay amicable, because you're easing the awkwardness of making an apology.

IF they don't respond, I'd still encourage you not to rush to the landlord/police. Just send a second note making it clear that you're willing to do that if necessary. Unless they really are stupid, then even if they are deliberately ignoring you, this will make them pay attention. It's not like they don't know marijuana is illegal, so appeal to their self-preservation. But again, for best results, do this in a neutral, reasonable way. You don't want to have to do this, but their behaviour just isn't going to work in a building full of other people, so please follow the building rules so that we can forget this whole thing. Something like that.

Then, in the unlikely event you still have problems, feel free to escalate it. Just be aware that rushing straight to that option is going to cause unnecessary hassle to you, and besides -- they're almost certainly just partying because they moved into a new place. Do you really want to potentially send people to jail just because you find that inconvenient?
posted by Drexen at 10:27 AM on January 13, 2010


Eh, this person:

1) broke the terms of the lease by smoking or allowing guests to smoke,
2) kept you up until 5 am on at least one weeknight (unless this question's been in the Anonymous Askme pipeline for days and days),
and 3) worst of all, threw two huge consecutive parties without leaving out notes with contact information or going around door-to-door.

I'm young and I party, but I NEVER host an event that has the potential to be loud without notifying the other people in my building first. This is all basic courtesy, and if the tenet is unaware of how to act decently as a renter, it's not the OP's responsibility to teach him. This is one of those situations in life where I think it's probably OK to act like an asshole.
posted by oinopaponton at 10:45 AM on January 13, 2010


Go to the landlord. This isn't just a new tenant who doesn't know the walls are thin. They're smoking in a building they know to be smoke-free and, while standards of what constitutes "late" vary, being loud until 5 am is not cool and they know that too.
posted by spaltavian at 11:03 AM on January 13, 2010 [1 favorite]


This is one of those situations in life where I think it's probably OK to act like an asshole.

Two wrongs don't make a right.
posted by Drexen at 11:04 AM on January 13, 2010


Talking to the landlord is not wrong. Some people don't learn their actions have consequences until faced with those consequences. And there's absolutely no chance that this guy would go to jail over this, are you serious? Like I said above, in Massachusetts, where marijuana is decriminalized, unless he has an obscene amount of weed sitting around, the worst he'll get is a $100 fine and a bruised ego.
posted by oinopaponton at 11:15 AM on January 13, 2010


in Massachusetts, where marijuana is decriminalized...

Fair enough, I guess, but if we're talking to landlords and police then we could still be talking about potentially relatively serious consequences, for something that could be solved much more amenably. In any case:

Some people don't learn their actions have consequences until faced with those consequences.

The OP doesn't know whether or not this is true yet. I think it behooves any reasonable non-asshole to find out. Yes, it involves a slight amount of inconvenience, but it's likely to be trivial and certainly no worse than the hassle of taking things to higher channels.
posted by Drexen at 11:23 AM on January 13, 2010


You need to nip this in the bud before a precedent gets set. I would have gone down there on the first night and said "Hey buddy, I'm Jason. What kind of tweed are you smoking down here?" [ Proceed with blank stare ] "Listen, can the building expect the music and partying to continue after tonight? [ Regardless of answer, just say 'Ok' ]. "By the way, this is a tobacco free building so for the sake of your lease, you better smoke outside. I am not sure what the lease specifically says about taking massive bong rips of Purple Kush, but if I were you, I would get blazed up outside. Cool? Have a good night."

If it continues, escalate.
posted by jasondigitized at 11:28 AM on January 13, 2010


And by the way, this is only a problem if the guy is an asshole. If he is not an asshole, he will comply. If he is an asshole, the only way to deal with him is head on at first. Any other approach before a face-to-face will prompt even bigger asshole behavior.
posted by jasondigitized at 11:33 AM on January 13, 2010 [1 favorite]


Sorry for my tone in my last comment, Drexen-- as someone who's dealt with some neighbors whose first priority was partying all night every night, the loud parties with no warning are a huge red flag to me that the guy doesn't care at all if he wakes up his neighbors, and will ignore any polite requests to tone it down. I may be wrong and the tenant might just be very confused about how you act in public, but I think the OP has to choose between dealing with this quickly and dealing with this nicely.
posted by oinopaponton at 11:42 AM on January 13, 2010


actually, I think going to meet the new tenant in person has the advantage of being both quick and as friendly as possible.
posted by jacalata at 1:25 PM on January 13, 2010


Having recently been a young person in an apartment with thin walls:

1. They probably don't realize what they're doing (and are used to dorm-type living situations with thick walls where they could be as loud as they wanted).
2. They probably want to be good neighbors.
3. Asking them nicely to cut it out once or twice will probably make them stop.
4. Going to the landlord without speaking to them first will make them resent you.

Seriously: ask first, then go to the landlord if their bad behavior continues. The fact that they're behaving poorly is no indication that they don't care about being good neighbors, but that they have no idea their behavior is bothering people.
posted by kdar at 1:31 PM on January 13, 2010


Whatever you do, don't leave a note. Go introduce yourself, welcome him to the building, then ask if he's scheduled any other parties for the week, since you need to catch up on sleep from the last couple of nights and you could use a break. His response should give you enough information to decide what (if anything) to do next, and he'll know in no uncertain terms that he's living near someone who's confident enough to confront problems directly (and that loud parties are a problem.)

Just make sure you don't capitulate on it being a problem; don't say "it's no big deal" or the like.
posted by davejay at 2:02 PM on January 13, 2010


Oh, one more thing: this is why it's important to introduce yourselves to new neighbors while they're moving in, before they cause trouble -- so your first interaction doesn't come with a healthy dose of "...and here's what you're doing wrong."
posted by davejay at 2:03 PM on January 13, 2010


follow-up from the OP
We spoke to him nicely once, and he shrugged it off saying that he's not doing anything wrong but he did politely agree to try to be quieter. He didn't quiet down at all, in fact it got worse. Last night, he was still being just as loud, so we went to talk to him again. After a minute it was obvious that he didn't care at all, we told him on no uncertain terms that quiet is essential and then walked away. He did quiet down considerably.

This morning: We wake up to our TIRES SLASHED.

Calling police now. We don't feel safe at home. Not sure how to regain a sense of peace.
posted by jessamyn at 7:46 AM on January 14, 2010


...holy crap.
posted by scrump at 9:54 AM on January 14, 2010


That really sucks, sorry about that OP. To my mind, this is why you go to the landlord. Then they don't know who to direct their anger at. Now you're a target.

Make sure you keep the landlord in the loop.
posted by spaltavian at 5:45 PM on January 14, 2010


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