Tranny Dating

January 20, 2005 2:44 PM

[TrannyDatingFilter] I am a relatively well adjusted pre-op male-to-female transsexual who has been living as a female since I was a teenager (almost a decade). I put myself through school on my own, gotten a very good job, and have a small group of close friends. I don't advertise what I am - I don't think that I should have to and I pass well enough that people have rarely clocked me. As of late I've been feeling very lonely. I would really love having a boyfriend and eventually a husband and children. I've never dated a man before and I'm wondering how realistic it is for me to find one who isn't interested in me only for my "defect". I've met tranny chasers before and I want nothing to do with them. I don't want to be someones fetish object. I'm kind, sensitive, (mostly!) intelligent, and not a complete eyesore. Is it reasonable for me to think there's a regular guy out there for me? Someone who can love me despite my past? If you're a guy, under what circumstances (if any) could you accept someone like me as a partner? I don't believe my transsexualism defines me - can someone in the role of potential partner be expected to see anything else? You get the idea. I've had this discussion with other transsexuals but I'm interested in the non-transsexual perspective.
posted by anonymous to human relations (23 comments total)

As a biomale, I wouldn't have any problems with dating a tranny at all.

Most of my transgendered friends manage to find people that love and respect them for who they are, regardless of how well they pass, so I know it's perfectly reasonable to think that there's someone out there for you, too.
posted by cmonkey at 2:58 PM on January 20, 2005

Love transcends all. However.
I think honesty would be key if you're hoping to enter a relationship with anyone. Yes, your tranniness will be front and center for some time, but if the relationship is a good one, it will be less of an issue over time, as your partner gets to know the person behind the identity.

How easy it will be to find that special someone is anyone's guess; it takes forever for a lot of normal (not that you're not -- you know what I mean) people to find someone with whom to share their lives.
posted by me3dia at 3:00 PM on January 20, 2005

(I respect your decision, think you're much braver than I and believe you deserve happiness. My response is based on my personal feelings and is not meant to be disrespectful)

> If you're a guy, under what circumstances (if any) could you accept someone like me as a partner?

There are no circumstances under which I would be able to accept a transexual as a partner. If by "regular guy" you mean the typical straight man you see on TV, I would say most guys would feel icky about being with someone who used to be a man. No guy I know would ever admit to his buddies he was dating a transexual.

Obviously, I don't know how every guy feels. There's probably a guy out there for you. Maybe someone bisexual or not completely turned off to the idea of man?
posted by null terminated at 3:07 PM on January 20, 2005

I don't know. I'm a breeder male also, and in my sort-of young life I have learned (mostly) a pretty valuable lesson when it comes to relationships: that physical appearance (or origin) is not nearly as important as people think. I've dated women based on their appearance, and some of them turned out to be complete nightmares. Bottom line it's the person inside that makes a difference.

As for dating a post-op? I have to admit that's something I probably wouldn't do. Then again, I've surprised myself in the past. I'm sure your guy is out there, but the field is narrower, I'm sure. For example, some guys who want a family--which is what you sound like you want--maybe don't feel comfortable with adoption.

Just remember it ain't easy for anyone!
posted by zardoz at 3:10 PM on January 20, 2005

me3dia said what I was thinking. Your tranniness is unusual enough that it's likely to be something that will take some getting used to, no matter how much chemistry, open-mindedness and love there is. All of us have aspects which take some time for people to get used to, being transgendered is no different, it just may be a bigger deal for a while.

I'd say that it's definitely reasonable to think that there's someone out there who can love you for who you are, I think you just might have to be prepared to accept that it might take a while for the regular guy of your dreams to work things through in his own mind. Someone worth your time will be someone who can get past your being transsexual, and someone worth your time will also be someone you'll be prepared to wait for.

I'll also point out that someone who happens to find himself attracted to transsexuals is not necessarily a "tranny chaser" in the sense I think you mean it, nor are they necessarily someone only interested in you for your "defect" (which, as you know, it isn't, you are who you are) - the fact that they might see your transsexuality as a clear plus (rather than a minus or a neutral) shouldn't mean that they're not also capable of loving you for your whole self (after all, your transsexuality is part of who you are), anymore than someone who is heterosexual or homosexual loves someone only for their gender (if you see what I mean). I'd respectfully suggest that you keep your mind as open as you'd like a prospective beau to keep his.
posted by biscotti at 3:17 PM on January 20, 2005

Living a life true to yourself is only part of the equation. You've mastered that. Finding someone else that can live a similar life is the hard part now.

Transexualism is a difficult pill to swallow for a lot of reasons. The key is to remember is that none of those reasons have anything to do with you.

If you've been asked out by men, accept. Go on a couple of dates. Don't let anything physical happen until you are in a frame of mind and space that you can be honest with that man. You wouldn't want to risk violence by a less evolved man because he felt you "tricked" him into kissing you.

Being a lesbian I don't fit your requested responder profile, but I've been living in Albuquerque for a few years and we have a rather large, dynamic transgendered community and I can vouch for the fact that there is some one for everyone.

I know a few 1/2 trans couples and all of them resulted from friendships that developed into something more.

Best of luck to you. If you have any interest in conversing about this, please email me, it's in the profile. I promise to keep your identity anonymous.
posted by FlamingBore at 3:21 PM on January 20, 2005

I think the "pre-op" might be more of an issue than the "tranny" for some men. And zardoz is right--I can tell you as a biofemale that it isn't easy for anyone...but you do deserve a loving partner as much as anyone else. I recently saw a documentary on female-to-male post-ops (though most of them mentioned they did not have phalloplasty surgeries done), and many of them had found loving, biofemale partners. They all were middleaged, however--would it help to date older men who are potentially less focused on the "having my babies" issue? Also, why not find yourself a transman, who would have a deep understanding for that part of who you are? Are there dating services/sites for transsexuals of the opposite gender?
posted by availablelight at 3:23 PM on January 20, 2005

Yup - I don't think I'd date a pre-op. I mean, I might... but I don't think I'd take it very far. If you were post-op and convincing - and were honest with me from fairly early on - it might be a possibility, assuming I was attracted to you.
posted by skylar at 3:33 PM on January 20, 2005

If you're a guy, under what circumstances (if any) could you accept someone like me as a partner?

Assuming post op... I would want to know about it up front, and for you not to think of it as a "defect." I would also want to know what your thoughts are about commitment and kids. And if all that was worked out well, and if the sex was really great, the only things left would be the perceptions of outsiders. I can generally withstand the judgments (silent or spoken) of my family and friends, but again, I'd need to know that you were okay with yourself and ready to stand proud as well. The extreme opposite case is where you lie to me about it at the beginning. I would consider that a dealbreaker once I found out about it.

Maybe this is off-subject, but I wouldn't recommend downplaying it. I can understand you don't want it to overwhelm consideration of all your qualities. And I don't have experience with tranny-chasers. But I'd say: if you got it, flaunt it. And if someone is really into what you've got, make the most of it. All of us have to do that to some degree. Accept and love who you are, play your unique qualities to your advantage.
posted by scarabic at 3:37 PM on January 20, 2005

i think biscotti makes some great points about "tranny chasers"...that fear, if taken too far, will result in you rejecting anyone who enjoys your physical makeup. what if i, as a bio-female, rejected men who got off on my bio-femalehood? i wouldn't get far. i don't know, anon, if you're taking it to that extreme, but your link broadly defines "tranny chasers" as "a person who pursues transgendered people for sexual relationships," which technically means you're not interested in anyone who might be interested in you. remember that it's only considered a "fetish" if being sexually interested in transsexuals is somehow subversive or weird.

also, i would guess that many men who identify themselves as heterosexuals like female genitalia, and men who identify themselves as homosexuals like male appearances, so your potential dating pool is limited to people with flexible tastes. our society is uncomfortable with fluid ideas of sexuality, and many men are freaked out by anything that seems homosexual, so that's a pretty small group...especially if you eliminate anyone who really likes transsexuals. i'm not saying it's impossible, but heteros with huge dating pools still have trouble finding mates, so i'm not surprised you're having trouble.

i would recommend spending time in a place that's pretty progressive (e.g. san francisco, where you'll find other like-minded souls) and being as patient as possible. i wish you the best of luck!
posted by equipoise at 3:46 PM on January 20, 2005

I couldn't do it, myself. Not icky so much; just doesn't feel right to me somehow.

Then again, I haven't found the right woman yet, either. It really isn't easy for anyone.
posted by ikkyu2 at 4:46 PM on January 20, 2005

I can imagine it'd be a lot easier for a biomale to wrap his head around the fact that his One True Love is a post-op female, than for him to wrap his head around that she still has a penis. In the end the physical package doesn't count as much as the person inside, but it really would be a heck of a mental hurdle for most.

That said, I truly believe there's someone for everyone. It's just a matter of time, networking, and luck.
posted by five fresh fish at 4:50 PM on January 20, 2005

For me, it's a matter of presentation. For example, after seeing The Crying Game, I have a hard time thinking of Jaye Davidson as anything other than female, even after seeing him in Stargate. If a transexual projects a particular orientation, that's what I react to. All other things being equal (personality, values, responsiblity), I wouldn't mind going out with a transexual.
posted by SPrintF at 6:37 PM on January 20, 2005

I personally wouldn't have a problem dating a tranny. Though 95% of my dating life has been with biofemmes, there were a couple of flings with a couple of beautiful pre-ops. These were only flings as we didn't have much in common beyond the sex and the fact I'd go shoe shopping with them.

I think personals would be a good idea. You could mention your status and include a photo so there would be no awkwardness on the first date. And I think you could easily weed out those who are interested only in the sex or the 'naughtiness' of it all.
posted by pandaharma at 6:39 PM on January 20, 2005

Hmmm. In my 20s, I'm afraid I would have rejected this idea out of hand. Now that I'm older and have seen more of life, I wouldn't. null terminated might have a point too. I'm on the heterosexual end of bisexual, but I don't have any prejudices or weird feelings about sleeping with men, so whether you still have a penis or not isn't really that important. However, I imagine you want a man who accepts you on your terms.

I think a requirement for children of their own might be a show-stopper for a lot of men though.

Personally, I think that slightly older, chilled, men who either do not want children or already have them from a previous relationship might be a better bet.

Maybe you need to think about what you would want in boyfriend (lesser commitment, relieves the loneliness) vs a long-term partner. You don't have to be totally alone just because Mr Right hasn't turned up. Mr Kind iof OK might still want to go to the movies.

under what circumstances (if any) could you accept someone like me as a partner?

Under the same circumstances as I would accept anyone else: reciprocated love, a shared vision of a future together, and an acceptance of my own chequered past.

I think you're entitled to demand the same.

I also think that you sound like someone who really needs a mentor - someone like you, but older who you can turn to for a sort of road map. I mean, I can tell you the route to my heart (if you can follow it) but it's still just me, you know - and it sounds like you need more of an overview at this point.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 6:48 PM on January 20, 2005

Look for bisexual men.

I, myself, would have no problem dating a transsexual.
posted by nixerman at 7:13 PM on January 20, 2005

Just to suppliment anon's point about chasers: I once dated a man who was chubby (fat!). I'm not grossed out by fat when a man is also clean and a gentleman. I am not turned on by fat. BUT there are gay men called "chubby chasers" who are especially fond of girth. I didn't think it was healthy for a chubby man to get in to the whole thing with these chasers, as the chasers were too focused on the fatness of it all (indeed, some will feed their chub to death!). To me, this is demeaning.

As for your question, I'm a gay man, so not qualified to answer. But I think you should be dating one way or the other, and be up-front about who you are. Dating is a game that takes practice.
posted by Goofyy at 9:58 PM on January 20, 2005

Two things:

1. I concur that "tranny chasers" shouldn't necessarily be ruled out. Maybe it's just a completely different ballgame for you, but I can tell you that in the bdsm community, it's considered entirely proper and normal to seek relationships with people who have corresponding sexual proclivities. Sadists hope to meet masochists, dominants like submissives, and so on. I've seen many, many close, long-term, beautifully ordinary relationships develop between spanker and spankee or tie-er and tie-ee. I don't see any reason why such a relationship can't blossom between you and someone who is attracted to transsexuals. Remember: that proclivity is part of their sexuality/gender-idenitity in the same way that your transgenderism is a part of yours.

However, I certainly have met the folks who are only interested in satisfying their particular kinks. They treat gatherings like singles bars. They're shallow and arrogant; not interested in getting to know people or forming friendships. If it's that type of person you're looking to avoid then, yeah, I hear ya. People like that who manage to worm their way into the bdsm community generally find themselves pretty quickly frozen out. Perhaps there is a TG community near you that could provide a similar service?

2. My last gf was a biological female who'd always wanted to be male. "Gender issues" (as she called them) were a major part of her life. Right before we broke up, she said to me, "I became a girl for you." And it's true; to me, she was a girl. To a lot of people who knew her, she was a dyke with a crew cut. To other people, she was other things.

I guess I'm just trying to say that, in my experience, gender identity is rather difficult to pin down and it depends a lot on who's doing the pinning. To one guy, you may be a tranny. To another, you might be a girl. And so on.

Not sure if that answers your question, but I'm rather glad you gave me a chance to post on this subject. Thanks, Anon.
posted by Clay201 at 10:12 PM on January 20, 2005

Reverse the question- how long would you want to be in a relationship where the other person had confusion about something so defining about you? It's the elephant in the room, no intimacy can exist until it's well flogged out. So to speak.

Speaking as a straight male who considers even that mustache some Latinia ladies get a dealbreaker, it'd take a hell of a personality mesh for me to date a transexual... but if it really worked I'd get past it. Good company is good company.
posted by dong_resin at 11:24 PM on January 20, 2005

You sound like a possible potential match for my ex-boyfriend. He's a biological male who has considered getting a sex-change operation but who decided in the end that he would prefer to remain a man. He's looking for a partner and is interested in kind, sensitive, intelligent women, as you describe yourself. If she just happened to be a transsexual, that, for him, would be a plus. But he's not a tranny-chaser - he dated me, and I'm a biofemale.

If you'd be interested, and YOU'RE not freaked out by HIS gender issues, I can probably put you in touch with him. He lives in Europe - maybe you're over here too? My email is in my profile.
posted by hazyjane at 3:01 AM on January 21, 2005

The bi-guy thing is a good point, we inherently tend to care a lot less about what a person is shaped like and more about who they are. Just hang in there and don't lose heart, you'll find your guy, he's looking for you too!
posted by spaghetti at 9:36 AM on January 21, 2005

Bah. I'm bi, and that whole "we look at the person, not the gender" thing gets on my nerves. Everyone looks at individuals, and everyone has a set of preferences that excludes certain individuals because of, among other things, the way they're shaped.

But I agree -- when you're attracted to members of both genders, you're more likely to be open to being attracted to a transperson. There are plenty of us out there; we just tend to be harder to distinguish from gay or straight guys (there's no established established bi-dar protocols, really).
posted by Tlogmer at 10:48 AM on January 21, 2005

I've been looking for a way to say what I think without making it seem too corny, but there probably isn't one.
as tired as it sounds -- love is the answer. I'm convinced that thinking too much about the "tranny-chasing" part doesn't help you, as others pointed out already.
I am desperately, boringly straight and I have only fallen in love -- or in lust -- with members of the opposite biological sex in my life, but that's just me. I probably am narrow that way, I don't know. my point is, you worry about being a "fetish object" -- it's a confusing and dangerous thought imo. desire leaves me so smitten and rapturous that it can sometimes be obsessive -- the intense pleasure of not only the company of the person I love but the undescribable feeling of her skin, of her hair on my fingertips. the joy of looking her in the eyes and watching her laugh, the way I think about her when she's not here, the little memories of sounds and smells and touch -- where does the attraction end and the festishism starts? I don't know, they're probably mixed, for all of us.

when in the future you find somebody so attracted by you and smitten by you, don't worry. just don't. love is something you fall in, after all.
posted by matteo at 11:23 AM on January 21, 2005