Looking for a canvas printer, if its a good idea!

October 26, 2009 9:14 AM

I'm looking for a good (but lower end of the market) inkjet or giclee printer to print my artwork onto between A2 and A0 size canvas. Has anyone any experience of buying their own large printer as opposed to getting it done at a professional printers. And what is the difference between inkjet and giclee?

I'm also curious as to the running costs because I know how expensive the cartridges are for my cheap a4 printer. Is there much tolerance for using different (read cheaper) canvases inks/pigments/dyes? Are there any good online info resources you could recommend? Or is this just mad because I blatantly have no idea what I'm on about?

posted by jcwilliams to technology (6 comments total)

And what is the difference between inkjet and giclee?

An old rule of thumb: if you call it by a French name, you can charge more money for it. This is true of the printer makers, and also the fine artists who feel guilty charging someone $4,000 for what is actually an inkjet printout, even if the ink did cost them about $50.

High-end inkjets, like those commercial print shops use today and we'll all have in our houses in a few years, are more often called giclée printers. I say this because the sorts of printers I have bought lately, these multifunction inkjet wondertoys that cost $99 and die in a year or two... these were once $10,000 professional devices.

And I believe messing with the inks used in any such printer will make the warranty curl up and scream: the big boys want to squeeze you for ink costs, the same as the low-end print manufacturers.
posted by rokusan at 9:26 AM on October 26

Not sure what those paper sizes are, but Epson and HP both make professional quality printers that print on 13x19 paper. I have the HP B9180 which would have recommended whole heartedly a few months ago, but I'm now going on my 4th printer, haven't had it out of the box. #1 died, they sent me #2 and #3 which were both DOA. That said it's a relatively easy printer to work with, and I have high hopes for #4. The first one lasted me about a year.

Point is, if you buy one of these things, definitely buy the extended warranty. Definitely.

Print quality is super sweet when it's working. You can buy Hefger ink for this printer, which is super cheap. It can use most any kind of paper, which also keeps costs down. Epson Premium Presentation Paper is cheap and good.

I wouldn't not buy this printer because of what I said. Just definitely get the extended warranty. I think you could have the same experience with Epson.
posted by sully75 at 10:12 AM on October 26

The term "giclee" really doesn't mean anything. The term has kind of fallen out of favor with most artists and galleries because it became a catch-all for all kinds of digital prints (both good and bad ones) and people got tired of playing the materials lottery. It has been replaced with "carbon pigment print" which refers to the higher end, archival, carbon based inks that most inkjets use now.

I use an Epson R1800 for printing photos, and it does an amazing job, just as good or better than the pro labs I also use for printing. To get the best results out of any printer at home you need to have custom ICC profiles made for the papers you use.

I use a continuous ink system with bulk inks for my R1800 and there are just as good as the stock ones after having custom profiles made. It does save a significant amount of money, and I spend a lot less time running cleaning cycles.

Epson Premium Presentation Paper is cheap and good.

You should try some more papers, because the Presentation Paper is the worst one Epson makes, and none of the Epson papers are very good to begin with. You can buy sample packs of papers from Inkjetart.com so you can try things without having to commit to a whole box.
posted by bradbane at 11:13 AM on October 26

Presentation Paper is the worst one Epson makes

Huh. Well...maybe we are talking about something different because I know a lot of professional printers who use that as their proofing paper. Who don't use Epson printers but use profiles because it is...cheap and good. I've never heard anyone globally diss all Epson papers before. Their Watercolor paper is weird but awesome to print photographs on too. I'm a paper snob so I'm a bit confused by this.
posted by sully75 at 11:29 AM on October 26

I custom profiled and printed a bunch of tests on 90-something different inkjet papers and then did blind tests to see which I preferred (I was a printmaker in a past life, I'm anal) and the Epsons were always at the bottom. Like not even close to as good as pretty much every other paper out there. The only thing the Presentation Paper has going for it is that it's cheap, I would never use that for printing photos or artwork.

My favorite paper is Ilford's Smooth Pearl. Everything Hahnemuehle makes is amazing (although expensive). Most of the papers Moab makes are pretty great too. Try some sample packs from Inkjetart and I think you'll see what I mean... the Epson papers are nothing special.
posted by bradbane at 12:16 PM on October 26 [1 favorite has favorites]

The Canon iPF-series is fantastic and produces really great output. I picked up a 44" iPF-8000 a couple years ago for $4,995 and it has paid for itself many times over. (The newer models are the iPF-8100 and 9100). The iPF series uses a 12-color Lucia ink set (Cyan, Photo Cyan, Yellow, Magenta, Photo Magenta, Gray, Photo Gray, Red, Green, Blue, Black, Photo Black), they are all pigment-based aqueous inks. They are UV-resistant, but not waterproof. These are art and photo printers, not outdoor signage printers. I have A0-sized posters hanging in my storefront windows that have been up for a year in the sun with no noticeable fading. I've been thinking about picking up a iPF-9100 (60"), as we are getting more requests for even larger prints that our 44" 8000 cannot handle.

Canon also provides a plugin for Photoshop (now works with up to CS4) for direct output to the printer, which allows for a much wider gamut. We have several local photographers that use us for large-format work. We use a variety of media from Sihl and Magiclee, from photo papers to watercolor/fine art papers to canvas to vinyl and poly films. Whatever you do, don't skimp on the inks. Always stick with OEM inks, both for consistent color and to save a costly printhead replacement. The biggest flaw with generic inks is the pigments aren't as fine and as uniform as OEM, and the larger particles will clog up the printheads. Make sure you accurately profile all your media, and you will not be disappointed.

We have run our iPF-8000 hard for just over two years. It has 475,000 SF on it and it is still just as precise as it was on day one. The built-in job accounting has a very accurate (I called Canon tech support and really dug deep for a concrete answer) meter of exactly how much ink was used in each job. This is handy for evaluating your costs and thereby developing a sell price for prints. While the ink tanks may seem expensive (the 330mL tanks cost me $165.00 each, therefore a full set of inks runs $1,980.00) the cost-per-mL vs. a small consumer-grade model is about 1/6 to 1/10 the price. You're buying in bulk, and the inks really do last a long, long time. Most of our A1-sized photographic prints use a total of between 2~6mL of ink.

Ok, end of the huge wall-o-text. Please feel free to MeMail me with questions about these printers or anything related to them (media selection, maintenance, etc.), or about wide-format printing in general. I love to talk shop. :)
posted by xedrik at 2:12 PM on October 26 [1 favorite has favorites]