The Monopolizer
October 21, 2009 7:25 PM Subscribe
Remember those classes in college/university where one person would monopolize the entire lesson? I am that person, please help me stop!
I went back into education a few years ago as an older student, and from the beginning was pretty dominant in the classroom. I wasn't really aware of doing it at first, but even though I've now started to understand what I am doing, I don't know how to stop myself. I get carried away with the discussion, and try to respond to questions or raise points as much as possible, and am seemingly incapable of letting things go if I think I know better.
I view myself as reasonably intelligent, so I assume that I must know as much or more than others, and my contributions are thus valuable. But I'm increasingly aware that I may be damaging the education and confidence of others by my actions, and letting everybody have a chance to speak is part of my duty as a good student. I'm also aware that, frankly, I could well be more ranty and outright wrong than I think I am, and totally overestimate my knowledge. I do want to participate in classroom discussions, but do so in a way which is constructive, aware of my limits, and pleasant for others. I don't want to be the monopolizer - the person who doesn't know when to STFU and listen.
So how do I stop myself from being that person? I find it hard to remember not to monopolize a discussion when it's happening, but I feel quite guilty immediately afterwards. It's the heat of the discussion which gets me, and would like help or advice that can stop me from continuing in this way, especially tricks that can be used when I'm in class and tempted to speak.
(Extra info: female, late 20s, class groups of about 10-15 people, other students are normally 19-20 and evenly mixed by sex and ability.)
I went back into education a few years ago as an older student, and from the beginning was pretty dominant in the classroom. I wasn't really aware of doing it at first, but even though I've now started to understand what I am doing, I don't know how to stop myself. I get carried away with the discussion, and try to respond to questions or raise points as much as possible, and am seemingly incapable of letting things go if I think I know better.
I view myself as reasonably intelligent, so I assume that I must know as much or more than others, and my contributions are thus valuable. But I'm increasingly aware that I may be damaging the education and confidence of others by my actions, and letting everybody have a chance to speak is part of my duty as a good student. I'm also aware that, frankly, I could well be more ranty and outright wrong than I think I am, and totally overestimate my knowledge. I do want to participate in classroom discussions, but do so in a way which is constructive, aware of my limits, and pleasant for others. I don't want to be the monopolizer - the person who doesn't know when to STFU and listen.
So how do I stop myself from being that person? I find it hard to remember not to monopolize a discussion when it's happening, but I feel quite guilty immediately afterwards. It's the heat of the discussion which gets me, and would like help or advice that can stop me from continuing in this way, especially tricks that can be used when I'm in class and tempted to speak.
(Extra info: female, late 20s, class groups of about 10-15 people, other students are normally 19-20 and evenly mixed by sex and ability.)
I've heard of situations where a professor gives an... overly chatty student 2 (or a similar number of) tickets at the beginning of every class. Every time the student speaks, the professor gets to take 1 ticket. Thus, when there are no tickets left, the student is no longer allowed to speak.
Give yourself these tickets, and turn them in to yourself. They can even be pretend tickets. Just decide, ahead of time, how many times you're allowed to talk and it will limit you to your best/most important things to say.
posted by brainmouse at 7:35 PM on October 21, 2009
Give yourself these tickets, and turn them in to yourself. They can even be pretend tickets. Just decide, ahead of time, how many times you're allowed to talk and it will limit you to your best/most important things to say.
posted by brainmouse at 7:35 PM on October 21, 2009
If it makes you feel better, wanting to or not, I am often that person in certain classes of mine. No tips on how to solve it other than what I do -- limit myself to no more x number of comments per class, depending of the length and structure of the class. Or in some classes, I wait at least 30 seconds before raising my hand for a question. This gives other people a chance to chime in if they want to, although despite this I am often the only participant.
I don't know about you, but I feel compelled to raise my hand if I know anything at all about the topic. Why I am this way I do not know, and I often have the same worries as you. Best of luck!
posted by BusyBusyBusy at 7:35 PM on October 21, 2009
I don't know about you, but I feel compelled to raise my hand if I know anything at all about the topic. Why I am this way I do not know, and I often have the same worries as you. Best of luck!
posted by BusyBusyBusy at 7:35 PM on October 21, 2009
Do your classes have online forums (i.e., Blackboard)? You could always post points of discussion and/or questions to these forums.
Alternatively, limit yourself to one or two points per class. If you know that you are only going to allow yourself to speak twice in a class, you might find that you are "saving yourself" for something good.
Or, tell your professor(s) your concern. S/he should be facilitating the discussion and should find a way to involve the other students.
posted by AlliKat75 at 7:37 PM on October 21, 2009
Alternatively, limit yourself to one or two points per class. If you know that you are only going to allow yourself to speak twice in a class, you might find that you are "saving yourself" for something good.
Or, tell your professor(s) your concern. S/he should be facilitating the discussion and should find a way to involve the other students.
posted by AlliKat75 at 7:37 PM on October 21, 2009
First, I would talk to the professor during office hours and ask her what she thinks. Heck, she may appreciate it.
Then, assuming she says that she loves your contribution, but would you mind cutting back, I would write my responses down when you are tempted to say them. Read them back to yourself and then decide if it is truly value added or just talk to show you know.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 7:45 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
Then, assuming she says that she loves your contribution, but would you mind cutting back, I would write my responses down when you are tempted to say them. Read them back to yourself and then decide if it is truly value added or just talk to show you know.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 7:45 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
I view myself as reasonably intelligent, so I assume that I must know as much or more than others, and my contributions are thus valuable.
See, this, here...gigantic red flag in my book. What I hear is "I'm smart and need to prove it to others." I get it; I've done it before, and it's empowering to steer conversations. I do it at work now, on occasion...
For me, the best way to kick it is to use your own silence as the goal. It's empowering to lead a conversation, to guide people's thoughts, and contribute meaningfully. But it's equally important (and empowering) to listen to others, to understand different viewpoints, and to learn...from others - and to remain silent the entire time.
So what I end up doing is silencing myself. It's a game I play, to prove that I can still control my voice. And it works well, but it's difficult to monitor. The amount of self-awareness to monitor every word that you could say, but don't, in a given 30 minute discussion, is huge, and it's hard work (which only adds to my pleasure should I achieve success in my silence).
Make silence your goal, and once you master it, you'll make much better decisions about when you should actually speak up.
posted by SeizeTheDay at 7:47 PM on October 21, 2009 [5 favorites]
See, this, here...gigantic red flag in my book. What I hear is "I'm smart and need to prove it to others." I get it; I've done it before, and it's empowering to steer conversations. I do it at work now, on occasion...
For me, the best way to kick it is to use your own silence as the goal. It's empowering to lead a conversation, to guide people's thoughts, and contribute meaningfully. But it's equally important (and empowering) to listen to others, to understand different viewpoints, and to learn...from others - and to remain silent the entire time.
So what I end up doing is silencing myself. It's a game I play, to prove that I can still control my voice. And it works well, but it's difficult to monitor. The amount of self-awareness to monitor every word that you could say, but don't, in a given 30 minute discussion, is huge, and it's hard work (which only adds to my pleasure should I achieve success in my silence).
Make silence your goal, and once you master it, you'll make much better decisions about when you should actually speak up.
posted by SeizeTheDay at 7:47 PM on October 21, 2009 [5 favorites]
having attended (and taught) college classes for the past few years, here are a few of my observations:
1) the older students are generally more likely to answer a question or give an opinion in class.
2) students can be really awkward!!! it's amazing how many times i've asked my students a very simple and direct question, and gotten the deer-in-the-headlights look.
3) most good profs will find a way to shut you up if they want to.
so, here's my advice. ask yourself what the class dynamic would be like were you not so talkative. if it would be awkward, forced discussion among your classmates (maybe you could try not talking one day and experiment), then your prof (and maybe your classmates) are probably happy that you're speaking up.
if there is a lively discussion between other students, then you might want to consider what you might learn from them. remember that other students' perspectives on a topic might bolster your ideas about something, or give a much needed contradictory point to your argument.
basically, you may want to ask yourself what you can learn from your peers, and try to have the opinion that they could be teaching you as much (if not more) as your prof.
posted by chicago2penn at 7:48 PM on October 21, 2009 [2 favorites]
1) the older students are generally more likely to answer a question or give an opinion in class.
2) students can be really awkward!!! it's amazing how many times i've asked my students a very simple and direct question, and gotten the deer-in-the-headlights look.
3) most good profs will find a way to shut you up if they want to.
so, here's my advice. ask yourself what the class dynamic would be like were you not so talkative. if it would be awkward, forced discussion among your classmates (maybe you could try not talking one day and experiment), then your prof (and maybe your classmates) are probably happy that you're speaking up.
if there is a lively discussion between other students, then you might want to consider what you might learn from them. remember that other students' perspectives on a topic might bolster your ideas about something, or give a much needed contradictory point to your argument.
basically, you may want to ask yourself what you can learn from your peers, and try to have the opinion that they could be teaching you as much (if not more) as your prof.
posted by chicago2penn at 7:48 PM on October 21, 2009 [2 favorites]
Though if it's one of those classes where every question the professor asks is followed by 45 seconds of silence because no one wants to be the one to sound stupid if they're wrong (followed by a rephrasing of the question, followed by another 45 seconds, &c), then by all means speak up and keep the class moving.
posted by Limiter at 7:51 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by Limiter at 7:51 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
I've always been that person. Always. But, I figure if someone else wants to talk, they'll talk. And if the teacher thinks I'm wasting time, they'll shut me down or direct the discussion along whatever path is best for the class. I always assumed that if someone else in the class was smarter than me and could tell me that I didn't know what I was talking about, they would (and have in the past). I also always assumed that if I had a legitimate question about something, chances are someone else had the same question. I've been told by some of my peers that I frequently ask the questions that they're thinking.
Showing up for class is good for two things: Hands on training or discussion. If you go to class and don't participate, then you're wasting your time. As far as I'm concerned, being able to discuss the material is critical to my processing of it. I don't feel as though I've learned something fully until I can repeat it back in my own words.
I think you may be feeling insecure about being the old kid in class. Just keep talking. Being older, you have a confidence and vocabulary that most of those 20 year olds might not. For all you know, you're an asset to that class. If you think you're drowning out the conversation during class, get to know a couple other students and strike up a little conversation with them after class. Find out what they like, what they think, and then make a point to mention something that you talked about with them the next time they speak up in class. Then, maybe they'll feel empowered to jump into the conversation. You don't have to stop talking, but find ways to let the whole class know that they're included, too.
Though if it's one of those classes where every question the professor asks is followed by 45 seconds of silence because no one wants to be the one to sound stupid if they're wrong (followed by a rephrasing of the question, followed by another 45 seconds, &c), then by all means speak up and keep the class moving.
Y'know, every time I thought I was too chatty and tried to shut up, this happened. I could never stay quiet for long.
posted by Jon-o at 7:54 PM on October 21, 2009
Showing up for class is good for two things: Hands on training or discussion. If you go to class and don't participate, then you're wasting your time. As far as I'm concerned, being able to discuss the material is critical to my processing of it. I don't feel as though I've learned something fully until I can repeat it back in my own words.
I think you may be feeling insecure about being the old kid in class. Just keep talking. Being older, you have a confidence and vocabulary that most of those 20 year olds might not. For all you know, you're an asset to that class. If you think you're drowning out the conversation during class, get to know a couple other students and strike up a little conversation with them after class. Find out what they like, what they think, and then make a point to mention something that you talked about with them the next time they speak up in class. Then, maybe they'll feel empowered to jump into the conversation. You don't have to stop talking, but find ways to let the whole class know that they're included, too.
Though if it's one of those classes where every question the professor asks is followed by 45 seconds of silence because no one wants to be the one to sound stupid if they're wrong (followed by a rephrasing of the question, followed by another 45 seconds, &c), then by all means speak up and keep the class moving.
Y'know, every time I thought I was too chatty and tried to shut up, this happened. I could never stay quiet for long.
posted by Jon-o at 7:54 PM on October 21, 2009
From a professor's perspective, I wish students like this would take a moment to write down the gist of their thought before blurting it out. Oftentimes chatty students take a while to get to their point because they talk their way into their idea instead of letting the thought form in their mind first. So what could have been said in 10 seconds now takes a minute as you take time to formulate your thought out loud. To combat that, I think taking the time to write down a few words and make sure they are an actual contribution to the discussion (rather than you just showing off your knowledge) will slow you down enough to let others talk some.
Also, if you can also refer to another student's point when making your own, that shows you're actually listening to your classmates rather than just listening to yourself talk. Bonus points if you figure out how to get another classmate involved with a question. For example, saying something like, "Josh, I think that point you made earlier was really interesting because it clarifies idea X. Do you think that also applies to situation Y?" may help you get others involved (or they may resent you for taking over the professor's job--very much depends on the classroom dynamic).
If no one else is ever talking in class whether you say anything or not, your professor may appreciate your contributions more. But at this point in the semester, your classmates probably expect you to speak and it may take some work from your professor to get other students to fill that void if you stop talking, so it wouldn't hurt to mention to your prof that you're going to try to talk less, just so they know there's nothing else wrong.
posted by BlooPen at 7:58 PM on October 21, 2009 [12 favorites]
Also, if you can also refer to another student's point when making your own, that shows you're actually listening to your classmates rather than just listening to yourself talk. Bonus points if you figure out how to get another classmate involved with a question. For example, saying something like, "Josh, I think that point you made earlier was really interesting because it clarifies idea X. Do you think that also applies to situation Y?" may help you get others involved (or they may resent you for taking over the professor's job--very much depends on the classroom dynamic).
If no one else is ever talking in class whether you say anything or not, your professor may appreciate your contributions more. But at this point in the semester, your classmates probably expect you to speak and it may take some work from your professor to get other students to fill that void if you stop talking, so it wouldn't hurt to mention to your prof that you're going to try to talk less, just so they know there's nothing else wrong.
posted by BlooPen at 7:58 PM on October 21, 2009 [12 favorites]
My advice kind of assumes there's a certain adversarial nature to these contributions (i.e. that you are debating things with the prof or other students, not just being the first to answer every question the prof asks).
A political science degree taught me a lot about this, particularly since I held minority views on many issues in most of my classes. I could get pretty worked up on some topics. In the beginning, I just HAD to defend my position against the benighted horde!
Then I realized: no, I didn't.
Not in the classroom, anyway. You're not really going to accomplish much there except to be seen as a show-off. Even in seminar classes specifically devoted to discussion, I never found it necessary to get into an extended one-on-one debate with the professor or other students. (Also, remember that there's a high chance you're wrong on at least some of the things you currently have strong opinions about, and how embarrassing would it be to later find out that you were entirely wrong about that point you were arguing so stridently?)
Instead, a good technique is to take a Socratic attitude. Lob a few well-timed piercing questions or intriguing ideas occasionally to spark debate, then listen to other people's responses. You don't have to respond to their comments immediately if you think they're wrong. Let it go (for now). But note the people who have the most thoughtful responses.
As you're leaving class, you can always approach with a "That was a pretty interesting debate on [controversial subject]. Think we can round up a few people interested in meeting later for a drink and discussing this some more?" (In smaller classes you'd probably want to invite everyone -- no need to get cliquey).
I found that most people responded well to an opportunity to continue a discussion outside the classroom, especially if beer was involved. After hours of discussion we'd usually realize we had a lot more in common than we would have thought if we had gotten into some silly back-and-forth point-scoring verbal brawl in front of the entire classroom, where our natural human desire to not want to publicly back down from strongly-argued things would be in overdrive. Plus, this way you can make friends with some great people, not all of whom agree with you on everything.
And, of course, beer. Win-win-win.
posted by fhangler at 7:58 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
A political science degree taught me a lot about this, particularly since I held minority views on many issues in most of my classes. I could get pretty worked up on some topics. In the beginning, I just HAD to defend my position against the benighted horde!
Then I realized: no, I didn't.
Not in the classroom, anyway. You're not really going to accomplish much there except to be seen as a show-off. Even in seminar classes specifically devoted to discussion, I never found it necessary to get into an extended one-on-one debate with the professor or other students. (Also, remember that there's a high chance you're wrong on at least some of the things you currently have strong opinions about, and how embarrassing would it be to later find out that you were entirely wrong about that point you were arguing so stridently?)
Instead, a good technique is to take a Socratic attitude. Lob a few well-timed piercing questions or intriguing ideas occasionally to spark debate, then listen to other people's responses. You don't have to respond to their comments immediately if you think they're wrong. Let it go (for now). But note the people who have the most thoughtful responses.
As you're leaving class, you can always approach with a "That was a pretty interesting debate on [controversial subject]. Think we can round up a few people interested in meeting later for a drink and discussing this some more?" (In smaller classes you'd probably want to invite everyone -- no need to get cliquey).
I found that most people responded well to an opportunity to continue a discussion outside the classroom, especially if beer was involved. After hours of discussion we'd usually realize we had a lot more in common than we would have thought if we had gotten into some silly back-and-forth point-scoring verbal brawl in front of the entire classroom, where our natural human desire to not want to publicly back down from strongly-argued things would be in overdrive. Plus, this way you can make friends with some great people, not all of whom agree with you on everything.
And, of course, beer. Win-win-win.
posted by fhangler at 7:58 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
I'm generally the quiet one in a class, and from my observations, unless the prof actually asks you to stop talking, they probably appreciate it. I know there were many classes where, other than the two to three people who talked a lot, the class was mostly silent. Thus, those few people actually helped move the discussion along and made the class feel less awkward.
Also, you could look around you and figure out if any others want to speak. In those instances, maybe you could just keep your thoughts to yourself and let them voice theirs. But if no one else is volunteering to do the job, just go ahead and say something. No one will consider you too talkative if you're filling in during the awkward gaps.
posted by movicont at 8:05 PM on October 21, 2009
Also, you could look around you and figure out if any others want to speak. In those instances, maybe you could just keep your thoughts to yourself and let them voice theirs. But if no one else is volunteering to do the job, just go ahead and say something. No one will consider you too talkative if you're filling in during the awkward gaps.
posted by movicont at 8:05 PM on October 21, 2009
A good prof should be acting as a facilitator, trying to create space for the quieter students to speak, and not letting the 'overly enthusiastic' ones dominate the conversation. If your prof isn't doing that, it might help to talk to them and they might start assisting you in dropping it a notch. That way too they won't wonder why you've suddenly stopped talking.
Btw, I think it's totally awesome that you realize this about yourself and are trying to adjust it!
posted by snailparade at 8:07 PM on October 21, 2009
Btw, I think it's totally awesome that you realize this about yourself and are trying to adjust it!
posted by snailparade at 8:07 PM on October 21, 2009
I view myself as reasonably intelligent, so I assume that I must know as much or more than others, and my contributions are thus valuable.
Valuable for whom? The opportunity to think and to speak - even if it happens more slowly for others than for you - is valuable to your fellow students. That silence, in fact, is the sound of them thinking and learning. By considering your own view the most valuable and blurting it out, you may actually be stealing value from others, not creating it for them. If your point of view is really that evolved, just sit with it and know it. Be patient with others.
If you are really at a level so far beyond the students in your class, perhaps you should be talking to your professors about a private tutorial rather than a seminar class.
But if the class material is information you need to know or to consider, then follow the limited-contribution rule. I know it's frustatring to be the dominant one in class, but you will make sure you have your opportunity to speak. Don't rob others of their opportunity, even if they don't take it. It's the instructor's job to draw out the quiet folk, and their job to get involved in discussion. Once you have contributed your limited number of times, let others have a chance. Who are you trying to impress, anyway?
posted by Miko at 8:10 PM on October 21, 2009 [6 favorites]
Valuable for whom? The opportunity to think and to speak - even if it happens more slowly for others than for you - is valuable to your fellow students. That silence, in fact, is the sound of them thinking and learning. By considering your own view the most valuable and blurting it out, you may actually be stealing value from others, not creating it for them. If your point of view is really that evolved, just sit with it and know it. Be patient with others.
If you are really at a level so far beyond the students in your class, perhaps you should be talking to your professors about a private tutorial rather than a seminar class.
But if the class material is information you need to know or to consider, then follow the limited-contribution rule. I know it's frustatring to be the dominant one in class, but you will make sure you have your opportunity to speak. Don't rob others of their opportunity, even if they don't take it. It's the instructor's job to draw out the quiet folk, and their job to get involved in discussion. Once you have contributed your limited number of times, let others have a chance. Who are you trying to impress, anyway?
posted by Miko at 8:10 PM on October 21, 2009 [6 favorites]
I think you may be feeling insecure about being the old kid in class. Just keep talking. Being older, you have a confidence and vocabulary that most of those 20 year olds might not. For all you know, you're an asset to that class.
I have to disagree here. I was in college not too, terribly long ago and the older students who thought they knew more than everyone else generally annoyed the class and often the professor. They would take the know-it-all attitude with their classmates and even the professor, treating them like a peer instead of the instructor. The thing is, you're all in the same class. If your experience was vastly greater and better than theirs, you most likely wouldn't need to be in that class.
Though if it's one of those classes where every question the professor asks is followed by 45 seconds of silence because no one wants to be the one to sound stupid if they're wrong (followed by a rephrasing of the question, followed by another 45 seconds, &c), then by all means speak up and keep the class moving.
Did you ever think that maybe the other students don't bother thinking of answers because they know they can count on the class gunners (can't think of a better word for them at the moment) to always be ready to answer? You're all there to learn, so make sure others get the chance to learn by interacting. While you're not directly for responsible for this, always answering lets the 20-year-olds get lazy because they never even have to be ready to answer a question.
Fiasco de Gama's idea is brilliant.
posted by ishotjr at 8:13 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
I have to disagree here. I was in college not too, terribly long ago and the older students who thought they knew more than everyone else generally annoyed the class and often the professor. They would take the know-it-all attitude with their classmates and even the professor, treating them like a peer instead of the instructor. The thing is, you're all in the same class. If your experience was vastly greater and better than theirs, you most likely wouldn't need to be in that class.
Though if it's one of those classes where every question the professor asks is followed by 45 seconds of silence because no one wants to be the one to sound stupid if they're wrong (followed by a rephrasing of the question, followed by another 45 seconds, &c), then by all means speak up and keep the class moving.
Did you ever think that maybe the other students don't bother thinking of answers because they know they can count on the class gunners (can't think of a better word for them at the moment) to always be ready to answer? You're all there to learn, so make sure others get the chance to learn by interacting. While you're not directly for responsible for this, always answering lets the 20-year-olds get lazy because they never even have to be ready to answer a question.
Fiasco de Gama's idea is brilliant.
posted by ishotjr at 8:13 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
Here's the thing… nobody cares how smart you are. Seriously, nobody cares.
posted by mpls2 at 8:25 PM on October 21, 2009 [11 favorites]
posted by mpls2 at 8:25 PM on October 21, 2009 [11 favorites]
I am you! And it is tough. And I think it stems equally from enthusiasm and insecurity. And it's good that you are aware - good for you!
First and foremost, write whatever you were going to say down on paper. Look at it. That way you will remember it and can decide if it is really worth sharing and you won't feel that panicky MUST SAY THIS NOW feeling.
Secondly, you must count. I have to count to 20 before I even get close to saying something, and then spend another 20 seconds thinking about whether or not what I have to say is really going to make a huge difference, and then count another 20 thinking about if this will really change peoples' lives and then a minute has gone by and the class has moved on to something else or someone else has said what I was going to say and said it better. Be sure to weigh all your options before diving in.
And good for you, once again, for being aware. Awareness is a good chunk of the battle; now it's about changing those habits.
Good luck!
posted by cachondeo45 at 8:41 PM on October 21, 2009
First and foremost, write whatever you were going to say down on paper. Look at it. That way you will remember it and can decide if it is really worth sharing and you won't feel that panicky MUST SAY THIS NOW feeling.
Secondly, you must count. I have to count to 20 before I even get close to saying something, and then spend another 20 seconds thinking about whether or not what I have to say is really going to make a huge difference, and then count another 20 thinking about if this will really change peoples' lives and then a minute has gone by and the class has moved on to something else or someone else has said what I was going to say and said it better. Be sure to weigh all your options before diving in.
And good for you, once again, for being aware. Awareness is a good chunk of the battle; now it's about changing those habits.
Good luck!
posted by cachondeo45 at 8:41 PM on October 21, 2009
I totally agree with Flasco de Gama's jelly bean strategy, except swap jelly beans for morsels of something you hate, and only bring one.
Next time you raise your hand, someone like me will be in the back with their palm to their face. Professors and TA's are available during office hours for chats an personal attention.
Thanks in advance.
posted by clearly at 8:47 PM on October 21, 2009 [2 favorites]
Next time you raise your hand, someone like me will be in the back with their palm to their face. Professors and TA's are available during office hours for chats an personal attention.
Thanks in advance.
posted by clearly at 8:47 PM on October 21, 2009 [2 favorites]
Man, I do this too, so I don't have a lot of advice. But I know I do it more when I sit towards the front of the class. Sitting as far back as you can - even if it's only a row or two - should help.
posted by Solon and Thanks at 8:54 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by Solon and Thanks at 8:54 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
I get carried away with the discussion, and try to respond to questions or raise points as much as possible, and am seemingly incapable of letting things go if I think I know better.
I used to do this, too. I finally realized that by taking up more class time than was reasonable, I was preventing myself from hearing other students' valuable input. That is, I was interfering with my own learning process by monopolizing the time allotted for discussion. Listening to other people, especially intelligent people who have a different perspective on the same material, is a great way to learn and to stretch your own understanding of the subject at hand.
I think the three-times suggestion made above is valuable, at least while you're learning to control your impulse to talk. Around the time I started college (in my thirties), a good friend who is a long-time academic and an astute observer of group dynamics advised me: "There's usually at least one monopolizer in the room. I've noticed that in any meeting, one gets three chances to talk: you can make three separate points. After that, you're just a loudmouth, and no one is listening; they're just waiting for you to stop talking."
This isn't a gameshow; you don't get bonus points for ringing in first. Wait to see if someone else will bring up the question or comment that's floating through your mind. If the discussion appears to be moving on without the introduction of your Very Important Point, do a quick assessment: is it really so very important? If it is, it's worth using up one of your three chances. If not, well, the discussion is better without it.
I ask myself a few brief questions before I introduce a new element into a busy class discussion:
- Is this salient to this conversation? If it's tangential, if it's related but not pressing, if it's interesting to me but probably not to my classmates, I shut up.
- Is this something I should discuss with the prof during office hours? If it's relevant to my own research, to my paper, or to my interests, but not to the general coursework, I don't raise it in class.
- Is this a conversation to have in the online discussion forum? Save it for Blackboard.
- Am I bringing this up because it makes me look like a smartypants? Yeah, that's embarrassing for everyone.
The advice above to build upon classmates remarks (and to distinguish between building on their remarks and dissecting their remarks) is a wise one, too; it is the difference between "talking in class" and "having a discussion."
I recognize the hilarious irony that I saw this question and was all excited to answer it. Ooooh, I know! Pick me, pick me!
posted by Elsa at 9:03 PM on October 21, 2009 [3 favorites]
I used to do this, too. I finally realized that by taking up more class time than was reasonable, I was preventing myself from hearing other students' valuable input. That is, I was interfering with my own learning process by monopolizing the time allotted for discussion. Listening to other people, especially intelligent people who have a different perspective on the same material, is a great way to learn and to stretch your own understanding of the subject at hand.
I think the three-times suggestion made above is valuable, at least while you're learning to control your impulse to talk. Around the time I started college (in my thirties), a good friend who is a long-time academic and an astute observer of group dynamics advised me: "There's usually at least one monopolizer in the room. I've noticed that in any meeting, one gets three chances to talk: you can make three separate points. After that, you're just a loudmouth, and no one is listening; they're just waiting for you to stop talking."
This isn't a gameshow; you don't get bonus points for ringing in first. Wait to see if someone else will bring up the question or comment that's floating through your mind. If the discussion appears to be moving on without the introduction of your Very Important Point, do a quick assessment: is it really so very important? If it is, it's worth using up one of your three chances. If not, well, the discussion is better without it.
I ask myself a few brief questions before I introduce a new element into a busy class discussion:
- Is this salient to this conversation? If it's tangential, if it's related but not pressing, if it's interesting to me but probably not to my classmates, I shut up.
- Is this something I should discuss with the prof during office hours? If it's relevant to my own research, to my paper, or to my interests, but not to the general coursework, I don't raise it in class.
- Is this a conversation to have in the online discussion forum? Save it for Blackboard.
- Am I bringing this up because it makes me look like a smartypants? Yeah, that's embarrassing for everyone.
The advice above to build upon classmates remarks (and to distinguish between building on their remarks and dissecting their remarks) is a wise one, too; it is the difference between "talking in class" and "having a discussion."
I recognize the hilarious irony that I saw this question and was all excited to answer it. Ooooh, I know! Pick me, pick me!
posted by Elsa at 9:03 PM on October 21, 2009 [3 favorites]
Are you me? Seriously, I could have written your post. And I've been working on this problem for years. Some things that I've found that help:
1. I imagine the type of student I want to be. She's confident and speaks up in class...BUT only maybe once per session, and the things she says are wicked smart. You know that whole stereotype of the person who doesn't say much, but when she does, it's worth listening to? Work on being that person.
2. If you said something less than wonderful, or something that really didn't add much to the class, just stop. Don't try to think of things you could say to redeem yourself or to impress others. You're done, better luck tomorrow.
3. Start to question why you're speaking up. What are you trying to show people? What are you trying to accomplish? What is your underlying motivation for speaking? Is it really necessary? Is there another way?
4. Put a small compact mirror on your desk. If you decide to say something, open the mirror before you speak. Now do you really want/need to say it?
5. Make a mini-game out of the whole experience. Reward yourself for class sessions where you're proud of the way you participated (or didn't participate).
6. Instead of saying your thing, write it down. Review it later, and expand on it. You'll learn more and feel better.
7. Listen to others. Remind yourself that when you are talking, you are not listening.
I try to remind myself of the following quote (it surprisingly applies to so many situations I find): "Don't be humble, you're not that great." Seriously, nobody cares. You'll be fine, even if you never shut up. So will everybody else.
If it makes you feel any better, I have anxiety about posting this. I'm sitting here asking myself, "Do I *really* need to speak up here?!" Fortunately, it's MeFi and all voices welcome. Phew!
posted by iamkimiam at 9:13 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
1. I imagine the type of student I want to be. She's confident and speaks up in class...BUT only maybe once per session, and the things she says are wicked smart. You know that whole stereotype of the person who doesn't say much, but when she does, it's worth listening to? Work on being that person.
2. If you said something less than wonderful, or something that really didn't add much to the class, just stop. Don't try to think of things you could say to redeem yourself or to impress others. You're done, better luck tomorrow.
3. Start to question why you're speaking up. What are you trying to show people? What are you trying to accomplish? What is your underlying motivation for speaking? Is it really necessary? Is there another way?
4. Put a small compact mirror on your desk. If you decide to say something, open the mirror before you speak. Now do you really want/need to say it?
5. Make a mini-game out of the whole experience. Reward yourself for class sessions where you're proud of the way you participated (or didn't participate).
6. Instead of saying your thing, write it down. Review it later, and expand on it. You'll learn more and feel better.
7. Listen to others. Remind yourself that when you are talking, you are not listening.
I try to remind myself of the following quote (it surprisingly applies to so many situations I find): "Don't be humble, you're not that great." Seriously, nobody cares. You'll be fine, even if you never shut up. So will everybody else.
If it makes you feel any better, I have anxiety about posting this. I'm sitting here asking myself, "Do I *really* need to speak up here?!" Fortunately, it's MeFi and all voices welcome. Phew!
posted by iamkimiam at 9:13 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
I like Fiasco de Gama's jelly bean idea, and also the suggestion about referencing the points made by other students to bring other viewpoints into the discussion. I'm less proud to admit that a part of me was kind of impressed --Hey, there's a switch!--when I read the OP was female. Those discussion-monopolizing, eyeroll-inducing know-it-alls of my college recollections were most usually, relentlessly, male.
posted by applemeat at 9:14 PM on October 21, 2009
posted by applemeat at 9:14 PM on October 21, 2009
There was another question like this and I gave a pretty similar answer.
1) Count to five (ten night be better), anytime the instructor asks a question. Don't be the first to answer.
2) Every time you interact? You need to let four other people do so before you open your mouth again.
Struggling because you have 'great thoughts?' You're either trying to impress the professor, feeling inadequate around 'these kids', or trying to show your age gives you ability.
It does, it's called wisdom. You've already made a bunch of mistakes and learned from them. Pick this one up. There are times and places to dominate; the classroom isn't one of them.
If you're dying in class to 'be involved' - jot down the key concepts of your thoughts and visit the prof later during office hours.
I'm not saying 'don't be involved' - merely giving you a distribution system to share learning with other - every person in your class with have at least one insight or POV that you don't - by pulling back (and seeing the value in pulling back), you'll learn more.
posted by filmgeek at 9:32 PM on October 21, 2009
1) Count to five (ten night be better), anytime the instructor asks a question. Don't be the first to answer.
2) Every time you interact? You need to let four other people do so before you open your mouth again.
Struggling because you have 'great thoughts?' You're either trying to impress the professor, feeling inadequate around 'these kids', or trying to show your age gives you ability.
It does, it's called wisdom. You've already made a bunch of mistakes and learned from them. Pick this one up. There are times and places to dominate; the classroom isn't one of them.
If you're dying in class to 'be involved' - jot down the key concepts of your thoughts and visit the prof later during office hours.
I'm not saying 'don't be involved' - merely giving you a distribution system to share learning with other - every person in your class with have at least one insight or POV that you don't - by pulling back (and seeing the value in pulling back), you'll learn more.
posted by filmgeek at 9:32 PM on October 21, 2009
I'm impressed by how self-aware you are.
I like the idea of visiting your professor(s) during office hours and asking what s/he thinks. If it's annoying to the students, odds are it's annoying to the professor. If not, great. If so, they'll probably be impressed that you're aware and wanting to work on it and can help you come up with a plan of action- maybe a code between the two of you that if the prof moves subtly to X side of the classroom, or crosses his/her arms across their chest while you're speaking, you've crossed the line from helpful into obnoxious.
If that's not an idea that works for you, maybe you can make or enlist a friend in each of your classes for this job. I know someone who tends to dominate discussions/arguments at dinner/between friends in a way that a lot of people find really unpleasant and aggressive. He and his wife reached an agreement where he trusts her to just unobtrusively put her hand on his knee when he's doing it, and he'll immediately wrap it up. It's subtle and almost inspiring to watch.
posted by charmedimsure at 9:34 PM on October 21, 2009
I like the idea of visiting your professor(s) during office hours and asking what s/he thinks. If it's annoying to the students, odds are it's annoying to the professor. If not, great. If so, they'll probably be impressed that you're aware and wanting to work on it and can help you come up with a plan of action- maybe a code between the two of you that if the prof moves subtly to X side of the classroom, or crosses his/her arms across their chest while you're speaking, you've crossed the line from helpful into obnoxious.
If that's not an idea that works for you, maybe you can make or enlist a friend in each of your classes for this job. I know someone who tends to dominate discussions/arguments at dinner/between friends in a way that a lot of people find really unpleasant and aggressive. He and his wife reached an agreement where he trusts her to just unobtrusively put her hand on his knee when he's doing it, and he'll immediately wrap it up. It's subtle and almost inspiring to watch.
posted by charmedimsure at 9:34 PM on October 21, 2009
I'm a think-before-speak person by nature, who spends a lot of time being run over by motor-mouths. I don't mind enthusiastic participators. What I do mind are:
1) Interrupting when I'm talking.
2) "Me too" + personal anecdote. Unless it really illustrates something that's being missed. This isn't sea story telling time.
3) Fixating on a minor misstatement by someone else not really central to the point, instead of what they meant. Drives me absolutely up the wall. Not all factual errors need correcting right away, if at all.
4) Not letting the prof get through the material in the time allotted. If your profs are always running out of time at the end, cut down on the chatter until the main presentation is over.
As long as you're not doing those things, it seems to me you're making the time go by a little less painfully.
If you do really think you need to cut it back some, make yourself a rule. You cannot talk unless: you are asked a question (obviously) or, five seconds go by after a general question with no takers, or, you are asking a question directly related to the material (tangents go in office hours).
posted by ctmf at 9:47 PM on October 21, 2009 [4 favorites]
1) Interrupting when I'm talking.
2) "Me too" + personal anecdote. Unless it really illustrates something that's being missed. This isn't sea story telling time.
3) Fixating on a minor misstatement by someone else not really central to the point, instead of what they meant. Drives me absolutely up the wall. Not all factual errors need correcting right away, if at all.
4) Not letting the prof get through the material in the time allotted. If your profs are always running out of time at the end, cut down on the chatter until the main presentation is over.
As long as you're not doing those things, it seems to me you're making the time go by a little less painfully.
If you do really think you need to cut it back some, make yourself a rule. You cannot talk unless: you are asked a question (obviously) or, five seconds go by after a general question with no takers, or, you are asking a question directly related to the material (tangents go in office hours).
posted by ctmf at 9:47 PM on October 21, 2009 [4 favorites]
Another suggestion (there have been a lot of good ones): try to match your contributions to those of another student who participates appropriately - if they've only offered three comments/questions, you only get three. Also, watch your classmates reactions to your comments - do they seem pleased and supportive, or do they roll their eyes or blank out when you contribute? Try to limit your participation to a level that your peers show you - through body language - is appropriate.
I am occasionally the over-talker, but not often - I try really hard to rein it in when I notice it (especially because I am supremely intolerant of this rudeness in others).
posted by Bergamot at 9:54 PM on October 21, 2009
I am occasionally the over-talker, but not often - I try really hard to rein it in when I notice it (especially because I am supremely intolerant of this rudeness in others).
posted by Bergamot at 9:54 PM on October 21, 2009
Oh, I should add the biggest I'm-going-to-stab-you-in-the-face move of all: asking a question you already know the answer to, "for everyone else's benefit."
Also, unrelated to the above, I don't like the rationalization that "chances are, someone else had the same question." That may be true, but if they really cared about that, they would learn to ask themselves. Also, that's something that people will sometimes say to make polite small talk when they don't mean it.
posted by ctmf at 9:57 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
Also, unrelated to the above, I don't like the rationalization that "chances are, someone else had the same question." That may be true, but if they really cared about that, they would learn to ask themselves. Also, that's something that people will sometimes say to make polite small talk when they don't mean it.
posted by ctmf at 9:57 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
(I just posted this at another site.)
So shut up already.
At first, the silence will be deafening, as the professor asks a question and everyone looks at you thinking "Here goes ol' motormouth again. I wonder who is on Dancing With the Stars tonight . . . " The professor will be looking at you as well for you have also trained her that yours is the first and loudest voice in the room. And you will have a point to make, oh yes you will, welling up inside and bursting to get out. The room is in darkness and you are the bringer of light! You must hold forth.
Just shut up.
Classroom silence is not a bad thing. Silence gives people a chance to think. Silence makes people uncomfortable. Tension builds. Eventually someone will speak. Don't let it be you. After that person makes her point, the class will again look to you to reinforce or rebut it. Shouldn't you speak now? She misinterpreted chapter 3, and you have such a clever connection ot offer to something you read in another class!
Shut up.
Say nothing.
The other students will eventually take up the slack. Some of them have been doing the reading and are in fact smarter than you. You will learn more from hearing them than you ever did listening to your own dulcet tones. Others were slackers, hiding their ignorance behind your voluble cover. Remove their cover and watch them scurry to the readings. In a week or two they will be coming to class better prepared.
So shut up already. You can do it.
posted by LarryC at 10:03 PM on October 21, 2009 [4 favorites]
So shut up already.
At first, the silence will be deafening, as the professor asks a question and everyone looks at you thinking "Here goes ol' motormouth again. I wonder who is on Dancing With the Stars tonight . . . " The professor will be looking at you as well for you have also trained her that yours is the first and loudest voice in the room. And you will have a point to make, oh yes you will, welling up inside and bursting to get out. The room is in darkness and you are the bringer of light! You must hold forth.
Just shut up.
Classroom silence is not a bad thing. Silence gives people a chance to think. Silence makes people uncomfortable. Tension builds. Eventually someone will speak. Don't let it be you. After that person makes her point, the class will again look to you to reinforce or rebut it. Shouldn't you speak now? She misinterpreted chapter 3, and you have such a clever connection ot offer to something you read in another class!
Shut up.
Say nothing.
The other students will eventually take up the slack. Some of them have been doing the reading and are in fact smarter than you. You will learn more from hearing them than you ever did listening to your own dulcet tones. Others were slackers, hiding their ignorance behind your voluble cover. Remove their cover and watch them scurry to the readings. In a week or two they will be coming to class better prepared.
So shut up already. You can do it.
posted by LarryC at 10:03 PM on October 21, 2009 [4 favorites]
I had to stop favoriting because I realized I was starting to favorite every response. I love this thread -- everyone is being super helpful. Go AskMe!
posted by hapax_legomenon at 10:09 PM on October 21, 2009
posted by hapax_legomenon at 10:09 PM on October 21, 2009
I do this too. It is embarrassing. What I do is:
1. sit in the BACK of the class
2. put your finger in front of you lips, like you are shushing someone.
3. chew a big wad of gum
4. remind yourself to STFU by writing it down where you can see it
I think this is an impulse control issue and has nothing to do with being a jerk.
posted by fifilaru at 10:37 PM on October 21, 2009
1. sit in the BACK of the class
2. put your finger in front of you lips, like you are shushing someone.
3. chew a big wad of gum
4. remind yourself to STFU by writing it down where you can see it
I think this is an impulse control issue and has nothing to do with being a jerk.
posted by fifilaru at 10:37 PM on October 21, 2009
JonO: I've always been that person. Always. But, I figure if someone else wants to talk, they'll talk. And if the teacher thinks I'm wasting time, they'll shut me down or direct the discussion along whatever path is best for the class. I always assumed that if someone else in the class was smarter than me and could tell me that I didn't know what I was talking about, they would (and have in the past). I also always assumed that if I had a legitimate question about something, chances are someone else had the same question. I've been told by some of my peers that I frequently ask the questions that they're thinking.
And I've always been the guy sitting behind you, wishing you'd stop treating the class like a conversation between you and the prof. The fact that no one is competing with you for airtime doesn't mean your overlong contributions are welcome.
Yes, most students aren't interested in discussing it themselves--either they're shy, they don't think they have anything to contribute, or someone else says it for them. But some were like me, who went to class to listen. I assumed that the prof knew more than I did, and when some older student would take the entire class with them on a tangent they found fascinating, I always felt like my valuable class time was being wasted by someone trying to show off or engage the professor personally.
Here's a useful heuristic for the OP: When you talk in class, are you asking questions or telling people what you think? If you're asking questions, and generally trying to clarify what the prof is saying, that's good, that drives discussion usefully without trying to preempt the prof. If you're just sharing your thoughts, or thinking out loud, or trying to play off the professor, that's taking up class time to get your fix of lecturing. You're there to learn, not teach, and you're likely not teaching as well as you think you are. Before you say something, ask yourself is what you want to say is going to help you or the class.
posted by fatbird at 10:55 PM on October 21, 2009 [6 favorites]
And I've always been the guy sitting behind you, wishing you'd stop treating the class like a conversation between you and the prof. The fact that no one is competing with you for airtime doesn't mean your overlong contributions are welcome.
Yes, most students aren't interested in discussing it themselves--either they're shy, they don't think they have anything to contribute, or someone else says it for them. But some were like me, who went to class to listen. I assumed that the prof knew more than I did, and when some older student would take the entire class with them on a tangent they found fascinating, I always felt like my valuable class time was being wasted by someone trying to show off or engage the professor personally.
Here's a useful heuristic for the OP: When you talk in class, are you asking questions or telling people what you think? If you're asking questions, and generally trying to clarify what the prof is saying, that's good, that drives discussion usefully without trying to preempt the prof. If you're just sharing your thoughts, or thinking out loud, or trying to play off the professor, that's taking up class time to get your fix of lecturing. You're there to learn, not teach, and you're likely not teaching as well as you think you are. Before you say something, ask yourself is what you want to say is going to help you or the class.
posted by fatbird at 10:55 PM on October 21, 2009 [6 favorites]
Another thing: If you're talking because you think you're helping the other students by asking questions they want to ask, you're actually helping them to sit back and passively absorb the class. You're enabling them to not particpate. You're giving them an excuse to be silent by taking away their opportunities to participate.
posted by fatbird at 10:57 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by fatbird at 10:57 PM on October 21, 2009 [1 favorite]
I have some of this tendency to get caught up in the heat of discussion, and the only thing I've been able to do is just shut my mouth. Sometimes I clearly haven't fully made my point; sometimes everyone totally misunderstands what I was getting at; sometimes half the class is arguing over a stupid question that was answered in the first page of the assigned reading. Over the years I've developed a certain sense for "I'm getting carried away with this" and I just. shut. my. mouth. Usually it's very difficult, because I'm not letting out any of the excitement or energy I have, and I get tense about it or feel like I'm being incredibly rude for cutting off the conversation mid-paragraph, but no one else can really tell that I'm cutting off mid-paragraph and not just reaching the end of my thought. But it's a matter of staying calm, and forcing myself to get calm, and not letting myself get too excited when I talk. When I get excited I tend to bulldoze all over everyone else's ideas.
As for how you get the ability to say, "Shut up, self." and forcibly calm down, I can only suggest practice (I like the three-jelly-bean method or trying to stay quiet through the first half of the class - do warn the prof though).
posted by Lady Li at 12:15 AM on October 22, 2009
As for how you get the ability to say, "Shut up, self." and forcibly calm down, I can only suggest practice (I like the three-jelly-bean method or trying to stay quiet through the first half of the class - do warn the prof though).
posted by Lady Li at 12:15 AM on October 22, 2009
Are you sitting near the front of the room? Try sitting at the back. Sometimes I have a tendency to talk too much in class if I can't see my classmates- I start to feel like the class is a private discussion between me & the teacher. Sitting at the back means I can see my classmates and provides a constant visual reminder that they deserve class time too.
posted by twistofrhyme at 1:00 AM on October 22, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by twistofrhyme at 1:00 AM on October 22, 2009 [1 favorite]
Thirding (I think), if you normally sit in the front of the class, sit in the back. You can *see* if other students are preparing to respond, which is a great help in reminding one to shut up, and not talk over them. When you sit up front, it is easy to fall into the feeling that you and the prof are having a conversation.
The jelly bean idea is brilliant.
posted by faineant at 1:05 AM on October 22, 2009
The jelly bean idea is brilliant.
posted by faineant at 1:05 AM on October 22, 2009
That will teach me to not preview. IOW, what twistofrhyme said.
posted by faineant at 1:07 AM on October 22, 2009
posted by faineant at 1:07 AM on October 22, 2009
A variant on the "jelly beans" idea above: every time you speak, don't speak again until a certain number of other people have said something. The discipline of keeping track of this might be enough to control your need to respond to every point.
posted by Jabberwocky at 1:32 AM on October 22, 2009
posted by Jabberwocky at 1:32 AM on October 22, 2009
this is said in love:
when I was in college, me and my friends used to MAKE FUN of people like you - classmates who have that need to TALK TALK TALK TALK TALK TALK TALK TALK -- BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH - YAPPITY-YAP-YAP-YAP-YAP-YACKITY-YAP.
While comments/answers are certainly welcomed, students pay to hear the teacher, not YOU. and you know what? it doesn't end at school, people at work do it too! please stop being so selfish/self-centered.
(does that help stop you?)
also, think: Tracy Flick in "Election"
posted by mrmarley at 4:14 AM on October 22, 2009
when I was in college, me and my friends used to MAKE FUN of people like you - classmates who have that need to TALK TALK TALK TALK TALK TALK TALK TALK -- BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH - YAPPITY-YAP-YAP-YAP-YAP-YACKITY-YAP.
While comments/answers are certainly welcomed, students pay to hear the teacher, not YOU. and you know what? it doesn't end at school, people at work do it too! please stop being so selfish/self-centered.
(does that help stop you?)
also, think: Tracy Flick in "Election"
posted by mrmarley at 4:14 AM on October 22, 2009
students can be really awkward!!! it's amazing how many times i've asked my students a very simple and direct question, and gotten the deer-in-the-headlights look. It makes us uncomfortable to have a professor ask us a question that obvious. That's why no one is answering. I had an upper level math professor who used to pause in the middle of working formulae waiting for someone to call out the next step (so 3x + 4x = ... anyone?) It was humiliating for everyone.
posted by telegraph at 5:20 AM on October 22, 2009
posted by telegraph at 5:20 AM on October 22, 2009
I tend to be like this too, and will be taking some of the suggestions to heart, not just in the classroom but in meetings and social events.
I wouldn't necessarily agree that your contributions are automatically unwelcome and boring, though. I'm an older student in a degree program, and I've been working in the field for several years, so I legitimately know more than most of my classmates (who are getting their degrees in order to get internships) and in more than a few situations, more than my professors (in terms of how things are currently being done). Several of my classmates and some of my professors have thanked me for my contributions and one professor frequently calls me out in class to provide my input. This was after I thought maybe I was talking too much and tried to pull back. Now I only comment when I'm called to do so, which still happens a few times each class. Pull back and see whether people look to you to comment or rush to fill in the space that you used to, and you'll know which side of that fence you were on.
posted by peanut_mcgillicuty at 6:20 AM on October 22, 2009
I wouldn't necessarily agree that your contributions are automatically unwelcome and boring, though. I'm an older student in a degree program, and I've been working in the field for several years, so I legitimately know more than most of my classmates (who are getting their degrees in order to get internships) and in more than a few situations, more than my professors (in terms of how things are currently being done). Several of my classmates and some of my professors have thanked me for my contributions and one professor frequently calls me out in class to provide my input. This was after I thought maybe I was talking too much and tried to pull back. Now I only comment when I'm called to do so, which still happens a few times each class. Pull back and see whether people look to you to comment or rush to fill in the space that you used to, and you'll know which side of that fence you were on.
posted by peanut_mcgillicuty at 6:20 AM on October 22, 2009
You're in a difficult spot. More likely than not, you're in classes where very few people even want to talk, much less make a substantive contribution. I've been in classes where, if I didn't talk, no one would talk, and the room would also be full of awkward silences. Your professors may also be enabling you by picking you out for special treatment, demanding you repeat what you said a little louder, etc.
My simple method: Just ask questions. Don't allow yourself to make statements. If you do that, you'll talk only when it absolutely advances your doing well in the class. Beware attempts to make statements into questions.
posted by l33tpolicywonk at 6:22 AM on October 22, 2009
My simple method: Just ask questions. Don't allow yourself to make statements. If you do that, you'll talk only when it absolutely advances your doing well in the class. Beware attempts to make statements into questions.
posted by l33tpolicywonk at 6:22 AM on October 22, 2009
I just wanted to thank you for being aware of this. I wish more people were aware of this and recognized that it might be a problem.
posted by quirks at 7:00 AM on October 22, 2009
posted by quirks at 7:00 AM on October 22, 2009
A few years ago I took a basic college course (Bio 101). I was about 28 at the time. I was the oldest student in there. I had two children and felt like I'd had so much life experience beyond the 18, 19, 20, and 21 year-olds in that class. I was almost smug about it. Here were all of these "kids" just getting started in life. What did they know?
And then a most beautiful put together girl walked in to the class and I thought, "what does she know?" She hasn't been chases kids around all day, changing diapers, trying to figure out a one-income budget, dealing with marriage stresses. Perhaps it was some insecurities or jealousies on my part that I felt the contempt I did for her. It looked like her life was easy. She could nonchalantly walk into class, looking great, when I was still wearing the shirt that had baby drool on it with my hair slapped back in to sloppy pony tail.
What does she know? She doesn't know about life . . . I have more experience than she . . .
And then after class . . . I was packing up my back pack, most of the students had left. It was just this girl and myself. The girl approached the professor and I overheard her conversation with the professor - she wanted to explain to her that she had cancer. CANCER. She was barely 21, IF THAT. She wanted to let the prof. know that she would do her best at coming to class, but that there was an upcoming surgery - A HYSTERECTOMY. But, she'd still do her work.
I was so humbled. WHAT DID I KNOW?? I knew nothing of life. I knew nothing of death. And this young soul was dealing with it all.
She was unable to finish the class. I don't know how she fared or how she's doing.
SHE, this young kid, TAUGHT me.
I view myself as reasonably intelligent, so I assume that I must know as much or more than others, and my contributions are thus valuable.
Your contributions are valuable, but give others a chance to put their spin on things. And, be humble, you may not know more than others. Let yourself learn through their experiences and their perspectives. Not only are you cheating them for not allowing them their voice, but you are cheating yourself of learning about other people, their thoughts and their experiences.
posted by Sassyfras at 8:04 AM on October 22, 2009 [1 favorite]
And then a most beautiful put together girl walked in to the class and I thought, "what does she know?" She hasn't been chases kids around all day, changing diapers, trying to figure out a one-income budget, dealing with marriage stresses. Perhaps it was some insecurities or jealousies on my part that I felt the contempt I did for her. It looked like her life was easy. She could nonchalantly walk into class, looking great, when I was still wearing the shirt that had baby drool on it with my hair slapped back in to sloppy pony tail.
What does she know? She doesn't know about life . . . I have more experience than she . . .
And then after class . . . I was packing up my back pack, most of the students had left. It was just this girl and myself. The girl approached the professor and I overheard her conversation with the professor - she wanted to explain to her that she had cancer. CANCER. She was barely 21, IF THAT. She wanted to let the prof. know that she would do her best at coming to class, but that there was an upcoming surgery - A HYSTERECTOMY. But, she'd still do her work.
I was so humbled. WHAT DID I KNOW?? I knew nothing of life. I knew nothing of death. And this young soul was dealing with it all.
She was unable to finish the class. I don't know how she fared or how she's doing.
SHE, this young kid, TAUGHT me.
I view myself as reasonably intelligent, so I assume that I must know as much or more than others, and my contributions are thus valuable.
Your contributions are valuable, but give others a chance to put their spin on things. And, be humble, you may not know more than others. Let yourself learn through their experiences and their perspectives. Not only are you cheating them for not allowing them their voice, but you are cheating yourself of learning about other people, their thoughts and their experiences.
posted by Sassyfras at 8:04 AM on October 22, 2009 [1 favorite]
I'm probably going to be the dissenting opinion, here, but unless you have confirmation from the professor that your involvement is unwelcome, I'd simply say that you should limit yourself to a level of interaction that makes you comfortable and let the other students fend for themselves. They are adults, they have the exact same options for class participation you have.
I'm an older student too, though I feel that is entirely tangential to my character, and yes, I am that guy. Well, gal. Most of the classes I attend are seminars, which means that class involvement is not only encouraged but expected. This advice does not apply to lecture classes, obviously, as you're there to be lectured to, not to discuss the topic.
My personal policy is to make at least three, well-thought out points per 2 1/2 hour class. That's the bare minimum. Then, when the professor asks a question, or asks someone for their opinion, I let at least thirty seconds go by before raising my hand to answer. I do not interrupt, I do not talk over, I respond to other student's points in a reasoned manner even if I disagree, which is not often. I seem to nonetheless have friendly relationships with my classmates.
It is the professor's job to moderate and, if you're being obnoxious, they really should pull you aside and tell you that. Just ask them what they think during office hours if you're concerned. I've maintained great relationships with all my former professors, who tend to go out of the way to get me to take more classes/have coffee/help write research papers/stop by during office hours for a chat with them. It appears that they find my contributions valuable and do not apparently feel that I monopolize the conversation.
Confirm with your professor that your behavior is not a problem, make sure your comments reflect that you're commenting because you feel that what you have to say is valuable, not better or more correct, and, in my opinion, you should be fine.
posted by lydhre at 8:11 AM on October 22, 2009
I'm an older student too, though I feel that is entirely tangential to my character, and yes, I am that guy. Well, gal. Most of the classes I attend are seminars, which means that class involvement is not only encouraged but expected. This advice does not apply to lecture classes, obviously, as you're there to be lectured to, not to discuss the topic.
My personal policy is to make at least three, well-thought out points per 2 1/2 hour class. That's the bare minimum. Then, when the professor asks a question, or asks someone for their opinion, I let at least thirty seconds go by before raising my hand to answer. I do not interrupt, I do not talk over, I respond to other student's points in a reasoned manner even if I disagree, which is not often. I seem to nonetheless have friendly relationships with my classmates.
It is the professor's job to moderate and, if you're being obnoxious, they really should pull you aside and tell you that. Just ask them what they think during office hours if you're concerned. I've maintained great relationships with all my former professors, who tend to go out of the way to get me to take more classes/have coffee/help write research papers/stop by during office hours for a chat with them. It appears that they find my contributions valuable and do not apparently feel that I monopolize the conversation.
Confirm with your professor that your behavior is not a problem, make sure your comments reflect that you're commenting because you feel that what you have to say is valuable, not better or more correct, and, in my opinion, you should be fine.
posted by lydhre at 8:11 AM on October 22, 2009
Nth'ing the jelly bean ideas, or some other way of rationing your comments as Lydhre does. Recognize that silence gives the other people a chance , and that other people may have valuable contributions as well. You are not the only pebble on the beach, as they say.
Lydhre: it sounds like this balance is exactly what the OP is striving for. I don't think you are dissenting at all.
posted by SLC Mom at 9:50 AM on October 22, 2009
Lydhre: it sounds like this balance is exactly what the OP is striving for. I don't think you are dissenting at all.
posted by SLC Mom at 9:50 AM on October 22, 2009
I'm less proud to admit that a part of me was kind of impressed --Hey, there's a switch!--when I read the OP was female. Those discussion-monopolizing, eyeroll-inducing know-it-alls of my college recollections were most usually, relentlessly, male.
Taking a mental inventory of the classmates like that I've had, I find them to be about equal.
Since you seem to be doing this in all of your classes and not, say, just one that fits your specialty or something, I'd concur that you're being annoying and that you should curtail things.
This isn't so much a trick or reminder as an exercise: I don't talk especially much in general or in most classes, but I once decided that I said too many unnecessary things. Restating the obvious, things no one cares about. Whatever. So, I took a vow of silence. Initially it was for a week, but after a week it didn't seem like enough, so I went to two. If I slipped up I'd slap myself. Hard. If for some reason that was not feasible I'd bite my thumb. Hard. I'd say I slipped up six or seven times total.
Anyway, it worked. I gained a lot of perspective on what is worth saying and the value of words. If something is important enough to say, you've got to physically convey it somehow. If it's really important you have to write it. In general you don't lose nearly as much communication power as you'd think.
I don't know if this is your kind of thing, but I'd think that it would show you a lot and probably help directly with this problem.
posted by cmoj at 10:31 AM on October 22, 2009
Taking a mental inventory of the classmates like that I've had, I find them to be about equal.
Since you seem to be doing this in all of your classes and not, say, just one that fits your specialty or something, I'd concur that you're being annoying and that you should curtail things.
This isn't so much a trick or reminder as an exercise: I don't talk especially much in general or in most classes, but I once decided that I said too many unnecessary things. Restating the obvious, things no one cares about. Whatever. So, I took a vow of silence. Initially it was for a week, but after a week it didn't seem like enough, so I went to two. If I slipped up I'd slap myself. Hard. If for some reason that was not feasible I'd bite my thumb. Hard. I'd say I slipped up six or seven times total.
Anyway, it worked. I gained a lot of perspective on what is worth saying and the value of words. If something is important enough to say, you've got to physically convey it somehow. If it's really important you have to write it. In general you don't lose nearly as much communication power as you'd think.
I don't know if this is your kind of thing, but I'd think that it would show you a lot and probably help directly with this problem.
posted by cmoj at 10:31 AM on October 22, 2009
Ask the professor if you are contributing or if they'd prefer you were less active.
Compress your contributions down to two or fewer sentences.
Don't always be the first person to speak.
Actively engage with others' contributions without speaking.
posted by winna at 10:56 AM on October 22, 2009
Compress your contributions down to two or fewer sentences.
Don't always be the first person to speak.
Actively engage with others' contributions without speaking.
posted by winna at 10:56 AM on October 22, 2009
At Trampoline Hall, a silly lecture series in Toronto, the host always gives us the following guideline for the question period:
When you are about to raise your hand, look inside yourself to determine if you have a good question. If you are envisioning yourself asking the question and a hush falling over the room and light shining down on you from the heavens and other people turning around to get a glimpse of who it could be that has shared such wisdom with us all, and everyone bursting into spontaneous applause and marvelling at your genius and completely changing their opinion to agree with you fully, this is the sign of a Bad Question.
If, on the other hand, you are brimming with curiosity and openness and eager to learn from the lecturer or someone else in the audience, this is the sign of a Good Question.
posted by heatherann at 11:13 AM on October 22, 2009 [1 favorite]
When you are about to raise your hand, look inside yourself to determine if you have a good question. If you are envisioning yourself asking the question and a hush falling over the room and light shining down on you from the heavens and other people turning around to get a glimpse of who it could be that has shared such wisdom with us all, and everyone bursting into spontaneous applause and marvelling at your genius and completely changing their opinion to agree with you fully, this is the sign of a Bad Question.
If, on the other hand, you are brimming with curiosity and openness and eager to learn from the lecturer or someone else in the audience, this is the sign of a Good Question.
posted by heatherann at 11:13 AM on October 22, 2009 [1 favorite]
Were you a fairly reserved student when you were younger (18,19, 20)? I'm a few years out of undergrad and find myself in a similar position--taking a class with mostly 18-year-olds and feeling like I'm talking a lot. I think a large part of it is simply the difference between my present, confident self and my shy, 18-year-old self (who resembled a lot of my current classmates).
There's a comment or two upthread that says, in effect "We quiet students don't speak up because you talkative students talk too much." That is just foolish. All of the students in the class are equally entitled to contribute, and your doing so with confidence doesn't harm anyone. Talk to the prof if you're especially concerned, but unless you're actually interrupting people or are somehow coercing the prof into calling on you alone during class, it's not your problem if other people are shy.
posted by Meg_Murry at 11:21 AM on October 22, 2009
There's a comment or two upthread that says, in effect "We quiet students don't speak up because you talkative students talk too much." That is just foolish. All of the students in the class are equally entitled to contribute, and your doing so with confidence doesn't harm anyone. Talk to the prof if you're especially concerned, but unless you're actually interrupting people or are somehow coercing the prof into calling on you alone during class, it's not your problem if other people are shy.
posted by Meg_Murry at 11:21 AM on October 22, 2009
nthing what most everyone said above. Here's a nice passive-aggressive way of dealing with your own discomfort.
Revel in the silence. Take pleasure it, knowing that it is you who have help create the painful awkwardness that makes everyone in the room squirm. If you need to, lay your head down on the desk. It will make others wonder what in the world is going on.
You might even be asked if you are okay, or the prof might even come down on you for "not paying attention". Tell everyone you are not comfortable being the hand-raiser anymore. One sentence, flatly. Then lay your head back down.
I'm a hand raiser. The lack of participation in classes used to piss me off. It's not my problem. The prof needs to learn how to manage a classroom. It's his job. You'll be doing him - or her - a favor.
posted by Xoebe at 11:53 AM on October 22, 2009
Revel in the silence. Take pleasure it, knowing that it is you who have help create the painful awkwardness that makes everyone in the room squirm. If you need to, lay your head down on the desk. It will make others wonder what in the world is going on.
You might even be asked if you are okay, or the prof might even come down on you for "not paying attention". Tell everyone you are not comfortable being the hand-raiser anymore. One sentence, flatly. Then lay your head back down.
I'm a hand raiser. The lack of participation in classes used to piss me off. It's not my problem. The prof needs to learn how to manage a classroom. It's his job. You'll be doing him - or her - a favor.
posted by Xoebe at 11:53 AM on October 22, 2009
Holy crap, i just realized why most people in this thread have said they are hand raisers - including me. It's effing AsMeFi. It was made for people like us.
You will never know how many posts I have spent up to a half hour writing, then deciding I wasn't really contributing to the discourse. I take those posts and paste them into a text file in my desktop.
Somebody above said writing down your answers was a good idea. Yeah, it is. Keep busy, and express yourself, but not to everyone else.
posted by Xoebe at 11:57 AM on October 22, 2009 [2 favorites]
You will never know how many posts I have spent up to a half hour writing, then deciding I wasn't really contributing to the discourse. I take those posts and paste them into a text file in my desktop.
Somebody above said writing down your answers was a good idea. Yeah, it is. Keep busy, and express yourself, but not to everyone else.
posted by Xoebe at 11:57 AM on October 22, 2009 [2 favorites]
unless you're actually interrupting people or are somehow coercing the prof into calling on you alone during class, it's not your problem if other people are shy.
Although I used to espouse this point of view myself, since I began doing more teaching than class-taking my perspective has changed.
In looking at this problem, I suggest you start with the question: why is there an opportunity for the student to talk in class? That's not really a given, though it's become more common than not. In the not-too-distant past, an average college or graduate class consisted of an hour or 90 minutes or even two or three hours of straight lecture, with the professor reading from notes or perhaps speaking extemporaneously.
Student speaking in class arose from the infusion of progressive philosophies into the classroom. It was part of a slow and still-incomplete revolution that changed pedagogy from something that was teacher-centered (the teacher did the work, the classroom was set up for the convenience of the teacher, the student's job was to listen to the teacher) to student-centered (the student did the work, the classroom was set up for students, the student's job was to direct his or her own learning, the teacher was a facilitator who created the conditions for learning).
Over time, those philosophies coupled with still-developing understandings from cognitive science to produce an awareness that most human beings learn constructively. That is, they gradually construct understandings of the world based on the knowledge and experiences available to them. These understandings are necessarily imperfect. it follows that the process of education should be designed so as to add experience and new knowledge which will make the understandings grow fuller all the time.
The recognition that human beings construct knowledge led to ideas of active learning, or interactivity. The theory is that when being active in your own learning, you the learner are the one to decide to learn, direct your attention, seek what you need in order to learn more, and so on. I am sure it feels like that's what you're doing by speaking a lot in class. But you're only partially right.
From the instructor's point of view, there is a challenge. Faced with a room full of eight or ten or fifteen or twenty self-directed learners, the instructor has to do something to justify your spending your time and money there. S/he has to deliver some value and show that some knowledge has been gained by you. A good instructor understands constructivist learning theory and knows that everyone's minds need to be actively engaged in order for learning to take place. Hence, the questioning, and hence the opportunity to speak.
If you were the only person in a private tutorial, you would speak all the time, and perhaps be quite challenged. but that's not the situation you're in. You're in a shared educational experience involving other people at different developmental points and stages of knowledge acquisition. You are all there, presumably, because you have something to gain. But no one person's needs trump any other's. If there are course fees, everyone's course fees are being covered at the same rate. Everyone is entitled to an equal opportunity to learn. As I noted above, if you need more personal attention or faster progress, you could probably arrange tutorials or independent study for credit. My point is that you are engaged in a shared, community, educational process.
By speaking too much, people can indeed impact that shared process in negative ways. Dominant personalities tend to bluster their way through, and the responses of others are not necessarily due to 'shyness.' It can be a wise decision. Quite often, the decision is simply based in not wanting to engage in a one-on-one with another person in the class which really dominates the discussion. That can be a real derail, unless a full-class debate was planned. It's a wise use of resources. By tolerantly waiting out the too-frequent contributions, the quieter people are hoping to get back to the syllabus more quickly. They may not consider this an important sacrifice because they may not require as much kinetic learning, or learning-by-speaking, as the talky student. But they are being forced to spend time off-task, especially if you're covering information by talking that they already understood.
Speech in class has to be seen as a finite resource. There's only so much time. Everything said should be to a purpose. Ideally, the instructor knows what that purpose is, and when s/he's not speaking, s/he knows why the students are. Now sadly, that's not always the case; and one person's domination of the class is actually a sign of pedagogical skills that aren't as well developed as they could be. There are a lot of strategies for managing class discussion. Some are softer and more conversational, and we are all familiar with those, though it's harder to do than it looks. But some are quite direct: giving everybody the equivalent of a jelly bean. Requiring that everyone speak at least once during every class session. Calling on every student once during each session. Setting up student-to-student interactions, such as pairs or threes, in which discussion takes place. Reporting out from small group discussions with rotating leadership. Rotating student presentations. And so on. good teachers recognize that for whatever reasons - conditioning, cultural reasons, learning style, whatever - not everyone talks in front of groups as easily as others. That's why a variety of discussion modes, and defined use of discussion, is preferable.
So I'm not letting instructors off the hook here: it's their job to know why they are having discussion and how to manage discussion - though this knowledge of pedagogy is often apallingly rare in higher education. But as a self-regulating learner, it's good to know how to be a participant in a learning discussion. It involves not dominating the group. If you haven't defined your reason for asking a question and what you expect yourself and/or the class to get out of questioning or commenting that you wouldn't get if it went unsaid, then don't ask it. Or ask it after class, when it's not shared class time you're using.
If it's a consistent problem with a consistent professor, and you feel there's never enough time for everyone to discuss, then that might be something to bring up during office hours..."I wonder if we could do some more interactive things, like pair off for discussions and then share our responses." But if you're finding that your concern is that you want to talk more than is appropriate...or if you feel this way in every class...then it's not just about other students being too quiet. Don't worry about them, worry about you, and in that worry about whether, when you speak, something that both you and the instructor and the whole class can identify as important and useful is going on.
(Because I used to have this problem, I'm conscious of it. One thing that helped me remember to control my speaking as both a class and then a meeting participant was reading a study of people who speak in the business world related to their degree of power in their organizations. It was found that the least powerful people speak the most in a meeting. The most powerful people speak least. People whose status is middling speak a middling amount of times. The reason: the most powerful people control their need to speak. They are confident in their power and intellect and they are making final decisions. They can afford to listen first. The tactical people, in the middle, ask tactical questions. The least powerful people are most concerned with displaying their skills and strutting for attention in order to feel like a power player. If you want to be seen as a person of higher status, speak a middling amount - not a lot.
posted by Miko at 12:04 PM on October 22, 2009
Although I used to espouse this point of view myself, since I began doing more teaching than class-taking my perspective has changed.
In looking at this problem, I suggest you start with the question: why is there an opportunity for the student to talk in class? That's not really a given, though it's become more common than not. In the not-too-distant past, an average college or graduate class consisted of an hour or 90 minutes or even two or three hours of straight lecture, with the professor reading from notes or perhaps speaking extemporaneously.
Student speaking in class arose from the infusion of progressive philosophies into the classroom. It was part of a slow and still-incomplete revolution that changed pedagogy from something that was teacher-centered (the teacher did the work, the classroom was set up for the convenience of the teacher, the student's job was to listen to the teacher) to student-centered (the student did the work, the classroom was set up for students, the student's job was to direct his or her own learning, the teacher was a facilitator who created the conditions for learning).
Over time, those philosophies coupled with still-developing understandings from cognitive science to produce an awareness that most human beings learn constructively. That is, they gradually construct understandings of the world based on the knowledge and experiences available to them. These understandings are necessarily imperfect. it follows that the process of education should be designed so as to add experience and new knowledge which will make the understandings grow fuller all the time.
The recognition that human beings construct knowledge led to ideas of active learning, or interactivity. The theory is that when being active in your own learning, you the learner are the one to decide to learn, direct your attention, seek what you need in order to learn more, and so on. I am sure it feels like that's what you're doing by speaking a lot in class. But you're only partially right.
From the instructor's point of view, there is a challenge. Faced with a room full of eight or ten or fifteen or twenty self-directed learners, the instructor has to do something to justify your spending your time and money there. S/he has to deliver some value and show that some knowledge has been gained by you. A good instructor understands constructivist learning theory and knows that everyone's minds need to be actively engaged in order for learning to take place. Hence, the questioning, and hence the opportunity to speak.
If you were the only person in a private tutorial, you would speak all the time, and perhaps be quite challenged. but that's not the situation you're in. You're in a shared educational experience involving other people at different developmental points and stages of knowledge acquisition. You are all there, presumably, because you have something to gain. But no one person's needs trump any other's. If there are course fees, everyone's course fees are being covered at the same rate. Everyone is entitled to an equal opportunity to learn. As I noted above, if you need more personal attention or faster progress, you could probably arrange tutorials or independent study for credit. My point is that you are engaged in a shared, community, educational process.
By speaking too much, people can indeed impact that shared process in negative ways. Dominant personalities tend to bluster their way through, and the responses of others are not necessarily due to 'shyness.' It can be a wise decision. Quite often, the decision is simply based in not wanting to engage in a one-on-one with another person in the class which really dominates the discussion. That can be a real derail, unless a full-class debate was planned. It's a wise use of resources. By tolerantly waiting out the too-frequent contributions, the quieter people are hoping to get back to the syllabus more quickly. They may not consider this an important sacrifice because they may not require as much kinetic learning, or learning-by-speaking, as the talky student. But they are being forced to spend time off-task, especially if you're covering information by talking that they already understood.
Speech in class has to be seen as a finite resource. There's only so much time. Everything said should be to a purpose. Ideally, the instructor knows what that purpose is, and when s/he's not speaking, s/he knows why the students are. Now sadly, that's not always the case; and one person's domination of the class is actually a sign of pedagogical skills that aren't as well developed as they could be. There are a lot of strategies for managing class discussion. Some are softer and more conversational, and we are all familiar with those, though it's harder to do than it looks. But some are quite direct: giving everybody the equivalent of a jelly bean. Requiring that everyone speak at least once during every class session. Calling on every student once during each session. Setting up student-to-student interactions, such as pairs or threes, in which discussion takes place. Reporting out from small group discussions with rotating leadership. Rotating student presentations. And so on. good teachers recognize that for whatever reasons - conditioning, cultural reasons, learning style, whatever - not everyone talks in front of groups as easily as others. That's why a variety of discussion modes, and defined use of discussion, is preferable.
So I'm not letting instructors off the hook here: it's their job to know why they are having discussion and how to manage discussion - though this knowledge of pedagogy is often apallingly rare in higher education. But as a self-regulating learner, it's good to know how to be a participant in a learning discussion. It involves not dominating the group. If you haven't defined your reason for asking a question and what you expect yourself and/or the class to get out of questioning or commenting that you wouldn't get if it went unsaid, then don't ask it. Or ask it after class, when it's not shared class time you're using.
If it's a consistent problem with a consistent professor, and you feel there's never enough time for everyone to discuss, then that might be something to bring up during office hours..."I wonder if we could do some more interactive things, like pair off for discussions and then share our responses." But if you're finding that your concern is that you want to talk more than is appropriate...or if you feel this way in every class...then it's not just about other students being too quiet. Don't worry about them, worry about you, and in that worry about whether, when you speak, something that both you and the instructor and the whole class can identify as important and useful is going on.
(Because I used to have this problem, I'm conscious of it. One thing that helped me remember to control my speaking as both a class and then a meeting participant was reading a study of people who speak in the business world related to their degree of power in their organizations. It was found that the least powerful people speak the most in a meeting. The most powerful people speak least. People whose status is middling speak a middling amount of times. The reason: the most powerful people control their need to speak. They are confident in their power and intellect and they are making final decisions. They can afford to listen first. The tactical people, in the middle, ask tactical questions. The least powerful people are most concerned with displaying their skills and strutting for attention in order to feel like a power player. If you want to be seen as a person of higher status, speak a middling amount - not a lot.
posted by Miko at 12:04 PM on October 22, 2009
Perhaps if you thought about the real life implications of continuing this behavior...
I assume you've gone back to school to acquire a new degree to lead to a new avenue of employment. Having been a supervisor over 10 years, I've interviewed over 100 people in that time and I can pick up on a person like you in the first five minutes. You are not a bad person; I'll just never hire you. What I write in the Comments section of my evaluation of such individuals is the same:
"Has all of the answers, but none of the questions"
posted by teg4rvn at 3:44 PM on October 22, 2009 [1 favorite]
I assume you've gone back to school to acquire a new degree to lead to a new avenue of employment. Having been a supervisor over 10 years, I've interviewed over 100 people in that time and I can pick up on a person like you in the first five minutes. You are not a bad person; I'll just never hire you. What I write in the Comments section of my evaluation of such individuals is the same:
"Has all of the answers, but none of the questions"
posted by teg4rvn at 3:44 PM on October 22, 2009 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
Bring three jelly beans to every class. Every time you make a point, eat one. Once you're out of jelly beans, that's it, no more talking. It's a simple exercise to make you ration yourself and think about when as well as what you say.
(You can replace the jelly beans with peanuts or jaffas or anything you please, as long as it's small and edible)
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 7:32 PM on October 21, 2009 [32 favorites]