Card trade in advice?
July 20, 2009 6:30 AM Subscribe
Newbie car trade in advice sought. Looking to swap my newish Honda Civic for an older minivan (yay!) of roughly equivalent value. Dealer trade in? Sell separately?
I'm way more confused by the process than I should be.
So I've got a 2008 Honda Civic with only 8,000 miles on it, in generally good condition other than a few paint scratches.
Looking at a site like Edmunds, a dealer would sell this car for ~$16,000. Or I could trade in to a dealer for ~$13,000.
I'm looking to get a minivan of some sort, probably a Honda Odyssey since that seems to be the one everyone drives. I could kick in a couple thousand extra on top of what I get for the civic, but no more. From what I can see so far, I'd be looking at something from 2005 or so, depending on other factors.
Questions:
1. Should I get the paint scratches and such fixed before trying to trade in/sell?
2. Should I do a dealer trade in, or try to sell the Civic separately and buy the van with cash?
3. If I do a dealer trade in, is there any advantage to going to a Honda dealer who does used cars?
I live in New Jersey, if it's relevant.
Thanks in advance for any advice.
I'm way more confused by the process than I should be.
So I've got a 2008 Honda Civic with only 8,000 miles on it, in generally good condition other than a few paint scratches.
Looking at a site like Edmunds, a dealer would sell this car for ~$16,000. Or I could trade in to a dealer for ~$13,000.
I'm looking to get a minivan of some sort, probably a Honda Odyssey since that seems to be the one everyone drives. I could kick in a couple thousand extra on top of what I get for the civic, but no more. From what I can see so far, I'd be looking at something from 2005 or so, depending on other factors.
Questions:
1. Should I get the paint scratches and such fixed before trying to trade in/sell?
2. Should I do a dealer trade in, or try to sell the Civic separately and buy the van with cash?
3. If I do a dealer trade in, is there any advantage to going to a Honda dealer who does used cars?
I live in New Jersey, if it's relevant.
Thanks in advance for any advice.
If you can fix the scratches yourself, or can get it done cheaply, do it.
Check around for the best deals you can make. Email dealers. They're desperate! If you do buy a used van from a non-dealer be sure to do a CarFax search.
I have a Toyota Sienna which I really love, it's my second one. They've both been super reliable, and I bought both used. It seems to ride a bit higher off the ground than the Honda van, something that's useful if you drive on dirt roads.
posted by mareli at 6:50 AM on July 20, 2009
Check around for the best deals you can make. Email dealers. They're desperate! If you do buy a used van from a non-dealer be sure to do a CarFax search.
I have a Toyota Sienna which I really love, it's my second one. They've both been super reliable, and I bought both used. It seems to ride a bit higher off the ground than the Honda van, something that's useful if you drive on dirt roads.
posted by mareli at 6:50 AM on July 20, 2009
1. Should I get the paint scratches and such fixed before trying to trade in/sell?
Generally, it costs more to fix cosmetic damage than it's worth. Of course, it depends. If the scratches are a glaring defect and confined to a small area, it might be worth it to repaint that panel. Most buyers are used to seeing a few scratches on used cars, though, and may not even notice.
2. Should I do a dealer trade in, or try to sell the Civic separately and buy the van with cash?
You'll get more for the car by selling it privately, obviously. It's more work, but to me, it's worth it. Also, trading in gives you one more angle for a car dealer to manipulate you. i.e. "We'll give you a really great price on the car you're buying, but only $9k for the trade in." Screws with your emotions.
3. If I do a dealer trade in, is there any advantage to going to a Honda dealer who does used cars?
Somewhat N/A, but if you want to buy the van used, why not buy privately, too? Then you're not paying the dealer markup and there's a chance you're not dealing with slimeballs. Just make sure you have someone knowledgeable look it over mechanically.
posted by knave at 8:21 AM on July 20, 2009
Generally, it costs more to fix cosmetic damage than it's worth. Of course, it depends. If the scratches are a glaring defect and confined to a small area, it might be worth it to repaint that panel. Most buyers are used to seeing a few scratches on used cars, though, and may not even notice.
2. Should I do a dealer trade in, or try to sell the Civic separately and buy the van with cash?
You'll get more for the car by selling it privately, obviously. It's more work, but to me, it's worth it. Also, trading in gives you one more angle for a car dealer to manipulate you. i.e. "We'll give you a really great price on the car you're buying, but only $9k for the trade in." Screws with your emotions.
3. If I do a dealer trade in, is there any advantage to going to a Honda dealer who does used cars?
Somewhat N/A, but if you want to buy the van used, why not buy privately, too? Then you're not paying the dealer markup and there's a chance you're not dealing with slimeballs. Just make sure you have someone knowledgeable look it over mechanically.
posted by knave at 8:21 AM on July 20, 2009
seconding the advice given already - sell it privately. A Honda Civic (reliable, good mpg, etc) will not be hard to get rid of at all and you should be able to demand a good price for it.
posted by mbatch at 8:36 AM on July 20, 2009
posted by mbatch at 8:36 AM on July 20, 2009
Agreeing that selling privately is a good choice. However, I've done two trade-ins with CarMax and found their trade-in prices to be very good. Both times I got at least as much as I would have from a private party sale, and it was a lot less hassle. If there's one in your area it's worth finding out what they'll give you for the car, since you can get a printed quote and still walk out the door without any real hassle.
posted by krisak at 8:50 AM on July 20, 2009
posted by krisak at 8:50 AM on July 20, 2009
You might also want to consider sales tax issues. Can't speak for NJ, but here in TN you pay sales tax on the net difference (= actual purchase price) of the "new" vehicle, not an assessed value of the vehicle. So, $13,000 for your trade in vs. $13,000 for their vehicle = net difference of $0.00 = no sales tax = win.
Annnd I'm fresh out of equals signs. Excellent.
/somewhat off topic, if you look at Honda Odysseys, be very very careful about the transmission. Wiki link here. We bought a used 2002 with only 70,000 miles on it along with a power train warranty. We had to have the transmission replaced at 80,000. !!! Other than that, it's been a wonderful vehicle.
posted by ZakDaddy at 9:30 AM on July 20, 2009
Annnd I'm fresh out of equals signs. Excellent.
/somewhat off topic, if you look at Honda Odysseys, be very very careful about the transmission. Wiki link here. We bought a used 2002 with only 70,000 miles on it along with a power train warranty. We had to have the transmission replaced at 80,000. !!! Other than that, it's been a wonderful vehicle.
posted by ZakDaddy at 9:30 AM on July 20, 2009
Response by poster: ZakDaddy: Thanks, I hadn't thought of that. I *think* (looking at this PDF), NJ has a similar sales tax credit for trade ins.
I'm going to look into selling it privately first. Would potential buyers have problems getting financing though?
posted by malphigian at 10:11 AM on July 20, 2009
I'm going to look into selling it privately first. Would potential buyers have problems getting financing though?
posted by malphigian at 10:11 AM on July 20, 2009
Best answer: All good advice here, but here's a little more information regarding dealers, Honda dealers, and used cars:
1) The dealer is not going to pay you any more for your trade than what they go for at auction. Your car is pretty new, though, and depending on locale there might not be too many 08 Civics changing hands between dealers. They'll use auction price or Black Book price as a way of valuing your trade-in. Off the cuff valuations can be done by Edmunds 'True Market Value', which is a good resource that you've already found. TMV is a lot closer to some real-world price than KBB is, that's for sure. (I had one guy come in with an Isuzu Trooper which is essentially a gigantic set of problems held up by four tires and claim some insane number from KBB - I looked it up on KBB, and yes, they did value it at over $10k. TMV said $4k, which was much more sane).
2) All Honda dealerships sell used cars. If they did not , they would be out of business, because they make basically no money selling new cars. Salesmen certainly do not make any money selling a new car unless the person is a sentient cabbage that is able to make legal contracts, or are easily fooled by number 3, which is...
3) You will be ripped off for your trade-in. If you introduce the idea of a trade-in AFTER you've looked at the car you want to buy, it will be like the rails have been ripped out of the tracks of the deal and the salesman will want to go back and change everything you've nominally agreed upon. The trade-in is a source of profit on the sale of a new car because no customer will pay anywhere close to sticker unless the new car is HOT HOT HOT (i.e, PT Cruiser when first released). If you are totally upside-down on your trade-in (owe more than its worth) perhaps some wonderful financial wizardy on the dealers part will fix that with the added cost of you wanting to leap to your death from a high place shortly thereafter, mostly because of how much you will eventually end up paying for all of this.
4) CarMax is good because they are straight up - they will tell you just how much they are going to shaft you on the trade-in, but of course if CarMax is far away from you it will be a wasted afternoon. CarMax doesn't care WHAT car you buy from them, and they aren't concerned how your trade-in relates to you buying a car at all. By contrast, the salesman at the Honda dealership is going to be VERY concerned about which individual car you want to purchase - two identical used 2005 Odyssey's sitting on the lot might be the same to you but the dealership has paid different amounts for them and that relates to how much the salesman gets paid.
Final Tip: If you go to the dealer, your best weapon is to walk out. If possible, contact their Internet department first because sometimes those groups are separate from regular floor salesmen and operate under different guidelines/commission structures. If you sell your Civic and then want to buy the van from a dealership, go for one under the Honda Certified Used program - they go through those cars pretty well, and they carry a premium because of it, but it's worth it because of warranty, etc.
posted by Skrubly at 2:49 PM on July 20, 2009
1) The dealer is not going to pay you any more for your trade than what they go for at auction. Your car is pretty new, though, and depending on locale there might not be too many 08 Civics changing hands between dealers. They'll use auction price or Black Book price as a way of valuing your trade-in. Off the cuff valuations can be done by Edmunds 'True Market Value', which is a good resource that you've already found. TMV is a lot closer to some real-world price than KBB is, that's for sure. (I had one guy come in with an Isuzu Trooper which is essentially a gigantic set of problems held up by four tires and claim some insane number from KBB - I looked it up on KBB, and yes, they did value it at over $10k. TMV said $4k, which was much more sane).
2) All Honda dealerships sell used cars. If they did not , they would be out of business, because they make basically no money selling new cars. Salesmen certainly do not make any money selling a new car unless the person is a sentient cabbage that is able to make legal contracts, or are easily fooled by number 3, which is...
3) You will be ripped off for your trade-in. If you introduce the idea of a trade-in AFTER you've looked at the car you want to buy, it will be like the rails have been ripped out of the tracks of the deal and the salesman will want to go back and change everything you've nominally agreed upon. The trade-in is a source of profit on the sale of a new car because no customer will pay anywhere close to sticker unless the new car is HOT HOT HOT (i.e, PT Cruiser when first released). If you are totally upside-down on your trade-in (owe more than its worth) perhaps some wonderful financial wizardy on the dealers part will fix that with the added cost of you wanting to leap to your death from a high place shortly thereafter, mostly because of how much you will eventually end up paying for all of this.
4) CarMax is good because they are straight up - they will tell you just how much they are going to shaft you on the trade-in, but of course if CarMax is far away from you it will be a wasted afternoon. CarMax doesn't care WHAT car you buy from them, and they aren't concerned how your trade-in relates to you buying a car at all. By contrast, the salesman at the Honda dealership is going to be VERY concerned about which individual car you want to purchase - two identical used 2005 Odyssey's sitting on the lot might be the same to you but the dealership has paid different amounts for them and that relates to how much the salesman gets paid.
Final Tip: If you go to the dealer, your best weapon is to walk out. If possible, contact their Internet department first because sometimes those groups are separate from regular floor salesmen and operate under different guidelines/commission structures. If you sell your Civic and then want to buy the van from a dealership, go for one under the Honda Certified Used program - they go through those cars pretty well, and they carry a premium because of it, but it's worth it because of warranty, etc.
posted by Skrubly at 2:49 PM on July 20, 2009
Response by poster: Skrubly: Thanks for that detailed post, very helpful.
The TMV is interesting. It says my Civic is $13,976 as a trade in, $15,640 if I sell it privately. I know it's not exact, but that's ~$1600 or so. But, I'd also save ~$900 in taxes with a trade in... so It's maybe more like a $700 difference.
Confusing. I've got no problem walking out of dealerships, so no worries there.
posted by malphigian at 6:43 PM on July 20, 2009
The TMV is interesting. It says my Civic is $13,976 as a trade in, $15,640 if I sell it privately. I know it's not exact, but that's ~$1600 or so. But, I'd also save ~$900 in taxes with a trade in... so It's maybe more like a $700 difference.
Confusing. I've got no problem walking out of dealerships, so no worries there.
posted by malphigian at 6:43 PM on July 20, 2009
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posted by zeoslap at 6:46 AM on July 20, 2009