Hand Me My Lightsaber. Don't Ask Why. Just Hand It to Me, OK?

July 16, 2009 3:20 PM

Beware: Extreme nerd-itry dead ahead. In any of the various media permutations of the Star Wars universe, was it ever explained why there is such an emphasis on melee weapons?

I get that in a universe with Force powers, there are denizens that can block blaster fire with lightsabers or even their bare hands. But the Jedi / Sith, or the superskills of a character like General Grevious, are few and far between compared to the enormous size of the story's universe.

So why is it that there are so many other characters depicted using swords, spears and other handheld hoo-hah, like the gaderffii of the Sand People.

You know, here on Earth, once the rifle was invented, it wasn't long before it dominated the battlefield...

posted by Cool Papa Bell to grab bag (34 comments total)

Looks better on film.
posted by P.o.B. at 3:32 PM on July 16 [7 favorites]

spears and other handheld hoo-hah, like the gaderffii of the Sand People.

While I dont think its ever spelled out in the extended universe, but part of the allure of the SW universe is that you have savages living next door to cultures with highly advanced technology. The empire was always seen as kind of the British empire and its subjects the backwards people of the developing world. The rebels were well equipped revolutionaries, but for the most part all that stuff existed because only a certain class could afford the advanced weaponry.
posted by damn dirty ape at 3:33 PM on July 16

In the video game, Knights of the Old Republic, it's mentioned that projectile weapons + spaceships = explosive decompression, so when there's fighting to be done on board, everybody switches to melee weapons in order to avoid killing themselves and their allies.

That doesn't really apply to the broader universe, but then, US Marines wear swords as part of their full-dress uniform. Possibly the melee weapons are a status symbol?

Beyond that, as P.o.B. mentions, it looks cool.
posted by lekvar at 3:33 PM on July 16

Jedi are essentially space samurai. And samurai don't use guns much. And sword/battleaxe/dual wield is way more impressive than gunfire. See also: Indiana Jones and his whip. He HAS a gun ... but the whip is cooler.
posted by macadamiaranch at 3:41 PM on July 16

here on Earth, once the rifle was invented, it wasn't long before it dominated the battlefield...

The rifle was invented in the mid-15th century. 500 years later, the US Army was still training (and equipping) its soldiers in the use of the bayonet. (And what, really, is the difference between the gaderiffi of the Sand People and an empty rifle with a bayonet?)

Much of the Rwandan genocide of 1994 was carried out with machetes.

As recently as last year, a war was being fought in rural Kenya with bows and arrows.

My point? That people (or Ewoks, or Sand People, or whatever) will use (and use effectively) whatever weapons they have available to them, regardless of the prevailing level of technology in the rest of the world (or galaxy).
posted by dersins at 3:43 PM on July 16 [4 favorites]

It looks good on film. There's no rhyme or reason to what goes on the the Star Wars universe. Purists may even call it fantasy as there's nothing scientific about it.
posted by GuyZero at 3:47 PM on July 16

Yeah, the advanced cultures like the Empire don't seem all sharey with the effective weapons technology. I'm not surprised they're waiting to let the Sand People, Ewoks, and so on all figure it out on their own. (And the Jawas apparently have -- they use a taser thing on Artoo).

Alternative answer: because compared to blasters, they're elegant weapons for a more civilized age.
posted by olinerd at 3:52 PM on July 16 [3 favorites]

technology requires materials and maintenance. Border worlds don't necessarily have access to materials and or the necessary skillsets in adequate quantities.
A stick, on the other hand, never runs out of bullets.
posted by Billegible at 3:56 PM on July 16 [1 favorite]

The in-universe explanation for the gaderffii is that Tatooine was a resource-poor planet, and the primitive Sand People had to make do with whatever they could scavenge. Although they could build or steal projectile weapons, expending resources for ammunition just doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Other than that, there aren't a whole lot of non-Jedi melee fighters in the movies. Even the Ewoks rely more heavily on traps and ranged projectiles. The Imperial Guards force pikes, but we never actually see them in action, which leads me to think that they're probably the counterpart of the ceremonial weapons carried by the guards at Buckingham Palace.

The real-world explanation is that the original Star Wars was a mashup of The Hidden Fortress and The Dam Busters, with a little Triumph of the Will thrown in at the end. The Death Star trench run takes care of the Dam Busters portion, but for that Kurosawa feeling, you're going to need some sword fights.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 3:56 PM on July 16

Oh dear gods I cannot believe I am about to do this but, for the purposes of explaining things within the story:

Light sabers are not swords. They certainly can function like them, but they're far more versatile. They can jab, slice, drill, chop through doors, and so forth. They can reflect blaster bolts.

When a Jedi shows up, they are not merely monks with telekinesis, they're to some extent roving peacekeepers, and their weapons must reflect their philosophy. The Jedi are all about the control; the lightsaber is not merely versatile but an instrument of personal defense as well as up-close and fine-grained justice, just as the Jedi are themselves.
posted by adipocere at 4:09 PM on July 16 [6 favorites]

In the video game, Knights of the Old Republic, it's mentioned that projectile weapons + spaceships = explosive decompression, so when there's fighting to be done on board, everybody switches to melee weapons in order to avoid killing themselves and their allies.

Shield systems that can hold out massive energy weapons, and they can't keep the air in? Sheesh.
posted by rodgerd at 4:17 PM on July 16

Look at your typical Empire Stormtrooper. Supposed to be elite fighters bred for battle. Their accuracy is legendarily bad. Obviously, physics in the Star Wars universe don't work like our universe, and blaster weapons are not particularly reliable at anything longer range than across a table.
posted by Saydur at 4:18 PM on July 16 [1 favorite]

The sand people use rifles as well (at some point the announcer mentions them shooting at pod racers in EP1).

Jabba's fat guards have the axes, but those seem to be ceremonial or restricted to the close-quarters use of herding prisoners etc. as the rest of his gang uses regular ranged weapons.

The Ewoks lacked advanced technology and, if Lucas wasn't a terrible hack, would have been curbstomped so hard. It's not like stormtroopers had never fought in a forest before.
posted by Spacelegoman at 4:23 PM on July 16

What has been said above.

Also, not all species have great eyesight. Shooting ranged weapons is not "pull the trigger rapidly in the direction of your enemy and hope it hits". It requires aim, timing, and other skills. Some species may find it easily to just run up and smash (or poke with the pointy end of a dagger which is much quieter (I think) than your average blaster).
posted by silkygreenbelly at 4:26 PM on July 16

The macroeconomic answer is that for the 10,000 years that the Jedi kept the peace, the galaxy was not a terribly militarized place. A street thug packs a pistol because they're plentiful and cheap, which is more certain in a world with large weapons manufacturers profiting by supplying antagonistic states through their wars and long standoffs. Without that giant weapons market, perhaps advanced weaponry simply did not become highly developed, industrially, and benefit from the economies of scale that, in our world, can put guns in the hands of children for pennies. The Empire, of course, came about because someone finally did take the initiative to militarize. And as has been said, they likely don't share around the very tools that keep them in power.

It's actually quite likely that the Empire would want to keep any sort of effective weaponry out of the hands of normal people everywhere. Perhaps blasters were resultingly expensive or rare, hard to find ammunition or service parts for, and so a melee weapon would still be of considerable use to a security guard or farmer, etc.
posted by scarabic at 4:47 PM on July 16 [1 favorite]

That's why Star Wars were so successful. Every time there is any choice, they don't think for a second and go with anything that looks or sounds cooler.

Dune thought this through and had personal shields that will stop anything moving fast enough but it has to allow fast movement within some limits not to restrict wearer's movements, therefore you can still have sword fights but can't use rifles.
posted by rainy at 4:48 PM on July 16

I would argue that Star Wars started as a world in which the swordsman was an anachronism in a time of gunfighters. Then, beginning with Jedi, the lightsaber, along with Ewok rocks and other exotic things, began to take over the universe, which was becoming less about flying an awesome spaceship and more trying to be this timeless myth.
posted by johngoren at 5:20 PM on July 16

Obviously, physics in the Star Wars universe don't work like our universe, and blaster weapons are not particularly reliable at anything longer range than across a table.

And aim under a table is far more accurate than aim over a table - regardless of who shoots first.
posted by The World Famous at 5:23 PM on July 16 [5 favorites]

I'm surprised no one has brought this up (and if someone has I apologize).

At the end of the first movie, the Death Star is protected by a forcefield, deflector shield, whatever the hell you want to call it, that prevents the rebel fleet from blasting it out of the sky. Maybe shields like that are only proof against energy weapons?

Personal forcefields don't seem to be all that uncommon...doesn't Grievous have one too? And the droid soldiers in one of the new movies?
posted by JaredSeth at 5:26 PM on July 16

Empire stormtrooper[s are] supposed to be elite fighters bred for battle.

I always took them to be conscripts drafted from planets under Imperial rule, forced to serve, just trying to keep their heads from getting blown up. Clone troopers were elite fighters bred for battle, but by the time Episodes 4, 5, and 6 roll around (25? years into the empire), clones were too expensive and so the conscription of subjugated people was the only way to keep up Imperial forces.
posted by incessant at 7:02 PM on July 16

I always took them to be conscripts drafted from planets under Imperial rule, forced to serve, just trying to keep their heads from getting blown up.

Except that Luke wanted to go to the Academy to become a stormtrooper. And Obi Wan talked about how "only Imperial Stormtroopers are so precise" or something like that, so that sort of shoots that theory down.

Star Wars doesn't make any sense, and is self-contradictory all over the place. Either Lucas made it all up as he went along and never really kept track of any of the detail because he didn't really care about detail (which means he has no respect for the viewer or, really the films themselves) or he had the whole Star Wars universe dreamed up all along, except that he dreamed it up stupid. Either way, Star Wars was way better when I was a kid in 1977 than it is now, and the best way to view Star Wars is by watching Episodes IV and V and pretending that the rest of the movies were an offensive parody created by a malicious dummy with more money than sense (which isn't far from the truth).
posted by The World Famous at 7:09 PM on July 16 [1 favorite]

Except that Luke wanted to go to the Academy to become a stormtrooper.

No, he did not.
posted by marble at 8:29 PM on July 16 [1 favorite]

No, he did not.

Did so infinity.
posted by The World Famous at 8:34 PM on July 16 [3 favorites]

I thought he wanted to go to the Academy to become a pilot (like his buddy, Biggs Darklighter).
posted by coriolisdave at 8:54 PM on July 16 [1 favorite]

Doesn't seem much different to 21st century Earth. Private citizens tend to have melee weapons (knives, bats) or small firearms, as do state police officers (batons, revolvers). Only the military and massive private corporations have access to serious hardware, and they're not afraid to use it. The Jedi are an anachronism from 'a more civilised age', much as we might reminisce about rapier-waving musketeers or samurai.
posted by obiwanwasabi at 9:40 PM on July 16

I always took them to be conscripts drafted from planets under Imperial rule, forced to serve, just trying to keep their heads from getting blown up.

Except that Luke wanted to go to the Academy to become a stormtrooper. And Obi Wan talked about how "only Imperial Stormtroopers are so precise" or something like that, so that sort of shoots that theory down.

The academy trains the imperal officer class surely? There is no explanation as to why there was a switch from officers dressed as stromtroopers as shown in Eps 2 & 3 to the distinctly separate officers shown in 4-6 though.

Obi Wan's observation is undermined by our own observations that the stormtroopers can't shoot for shit anyway.

At the end of the first movie, the Death Star is protected by a forcefield, deflector shield, whatever the hell you want to call it, that prevents the rebel fleet from blasting it out of the sky. Maybe shields like that are only proof against energy weapons?

The first death star is at no point shown with a shield, the rebels don't attack it directly with their own measly capital ships as it is (a) very big and (b) has a very large fleet with it so they have no chance of winning. The strategy is thus to send small fighters in against which the Imperial fleet is less effective in the hope of targeting the one known weakness. If the Empire could install shields on death stars they would not have needed the Endor based shield generator in RotJ.
posted by biffa at 3:36 AM on July 17

Ok, so I had the details mixed up. Be that as it may, there were deflector shields to prevent the use of energy and particle beams, but that physical items (like droids for example) could pass through. I'm just guessing that might have something to do with the use of melee weapons.

Although, biffa, you just made me wonder...if a shield can be installed on individual droids or the stupid Gungans can generate them, why the heck couldn't one be installed on the Death Star itself?
posted by JaredSeth at 5:51 AM on July 17

Now you want real science as well as pretend science?

Dunno how the shields work, the site you link to says something about the energy level of the thing passing through the shield.

We never learn what the relationship is between increasing volume and the energy load of a shield needed to protect that volume, this may render really big shields impractical, and Lucas seems to go with that for the sake of the story in RotJ. Its not impossible that there is some SW techbook somewhere that discusses this but that's reading a bit too far in my book.

The Gungan shield thing is of course Lucas sucking arse in terms of internal consistency of his universe.
posted by biffa at 6:20 AM on July 17

I thought it was interesting to read O' Connel's _Of Arms and Men_ which argues that military organizations purposely chooses more antiquated weapons for cultural reasons even if technology is overwhelming and more efficient. The book "demonstrates how social and economic conditions determine the types of weapons and the tactics used in warfare and how, in turn, innovations in weapons technology often undercut social values"

Dune did think it through more and allowed the Fremen to be able to use both close, personal combat and to conquer star systems. Star Wars? Well, that one is ripe for a lot of speculation.
posted by jadepearl at 6:38 AM on July 17

I was sure that the mission briefing in Episode IV mentioned that the first death star was shielded, and according to the script here, which looks like a slightly early version, it was. At the very least the exhaust port was "ray shielded", which is why the rebel pilots had to use photon torpedoes. I always thought that the shield generator thing on Endor was only needed because the one on the second death star wasn't up and running.

Obi Wan's observation is undermined by our own observations that the stormtroopers can't shoot for shit anyway.

Except that in episode 4, the only time that we see stormtroopers shooting at anyone is on board the Death Star when they are deliberately letting the intruders get away (they also shoot at the millennium falcon as it flies away from Tatooine, but that doesn't tell us much). Lucas doesn't actually decide to make them terrible shots until episode 6, which I think can be more or less ignored.
posted by A Thousand Baited Hooks at 7:24 AM on July 17

Except that in episode 4, the only time that we see stormtroopers shooting at anyone is on board the Death Star when they are deliberately letting the intruders get away

Have you never seen the first 10 minutes of the movie?
posted by The World Famous at 11:34 AM on July 17 [1 favorite]

Look at your typical Empire Stormtrooper. Supposed to be elite fighters bred for battle. Their accuracy is legendarily bad.

To say nothing of their "armor", which doesn't seem to do anything except impede their movement. They can still be knocked out via punches/kicks, and a single blaster shot still kills them like they were wearing a T-shirt.

Lots of things in Star Wars make little or no sense under scrutiny. It's all about how it looks on the big screen.
posted by barc0001 at 12:20 PM on July 17 [1 favorite]

Except that in episode 4, the only time that we see stormtroopers shooting at anyone is on board the Death Star when they are deliberately letting the intruders get away

Have you never seen the first 10 minutes of the movie?

Actually the stromtroopers seem to do a pretty good job of storming the rebel ship given they go in through a single hole which should make them astonishingly easy targets, the rebels get pushed back very rapidly. Of course one could argue that the rebels make a total arse of defending their ship given the control of ship board conditions one might assume they still enjoy. As others have noted, gun battle very cinematic.
posted by biffa at 2:28 PM on July 17

Have you never seen the first 10 minutes of the movie?

Ha. I knew I would forget something.
posted by A Thousand Baited Hooks at 3:47 PM on July 17