help - how can I stop from turning into "A**hole Dad"? (more)

June 29, 2009 3:26 PM

Father of 2 girls (1 & 5 yr) and am becoming increasingly annoyed at the challenges of parenthood.

I thought I liked kids/ fatherhood, but, alarmingly, am beginning to doubt it, more than I ever thought I would - even though I love my girls to death. I work a stressful job, on an overnight shift and am with the girls in the afternoons until my wife gets home. The kids are often a source of stress between the two of us as well, even though we were married for more than 10 years before we had our first, and have an outstanding marriage. We often joke about what a mistake having kids was. HA HA ACH (these are 'good kids' bytheway) How can I foster a better attitude to deal with the stress of having kids? To be sure, there are loads of moments of clarity, love, etc. (I'm not a monster!).. I try to practice meditation and foster mindfulness, BUT I’m finding myself wince more and more at my own gruff reactions, terse tone of voice, and resentfulness & impatience.

posted by anonymous to society & culture (29 comments total)

There's some good related discussion in this recent question.
posted by odinsdream at 3:28 PM on June 29

Try going out on your own and doing something for yourself. Like, go bowling with a buddy.

Go on dates with your wife.

Try to make time for yourself and away from your children.
posted by royalsong at 3:32 PM on June 29

you and your wife need to change your life so you guys work/sleep/parent simultaneously. right now you're both single parenting to a degree. if you work overnights then you have the kids after a full night at work. contrary to the beliefs of people who work first shift, overnights aren't just shifts at a different time, they take a different type of mindset to get through the grind of the long hours and aren't often helped by screaming kids right after it's over.
posted by nadawi at 3:34 PM on June 29 [6 favorites has favorites]

Good on you for wanting to make things better.

Recently my own mother apologized to me for all the yelling she did when we were kids. I'm 41 now, so that was a long time ago, but she still carried around feeling bad about yelling so much when we were kids. I think that it would suck to carry around guilt at how you handled stressful parenting, so don't be like my mom having to apologize at age 74 for stuff that happened decades earlier.

You are working an overnight shift and your wife works days? That is really stressful in and of itself, and it may be that you are focusing on your daughters as the source/cause of the stress rather than perhaps recognizing that your current situation really isn't working so well for all of you as a family. Some people do fine on overnight shifts. Some people think they do fine on overnight shifts but wind up really stressed out.

If you could switch things around so that you and your wife both worked days, and parented together evenings/weekends, would that change how you are feeling about fatherhood?
posted by ambrosia at 3:47 PM on June 29 [2 favorites has favorites]

Become one of them. Surrender to their silliness, their jokes and their free spirits. They have much to teach if only you will listen.
posted by ZenMasterThis at 3:50 PM on June 29 [3 favorites has favorites]

We often joke about what a mistake having kids was. HA HA.

Don't do that. The five year old, at least, won't appreciate it the first time she overhears it.

It will stay in her mind for twenty or thirty years. Not good.
posted by rokusan at 3:51 PM on June 29 [19 favorites has favorites]

Having in the past parented toddlers while working third shift I can confidently say that the shift has more to do with your mood than the kids do.
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 3:59 PM on June 29 [4 favorites has favorites]

It sounds like you are burnt out and need a break. The kids are not the problem - the fact that you seem tired, stressed, and short of "me time" and "us time" (as well as money perhaps) is the problem. You're parenting on opposite shifts, and probably don't get to see each other very often. And while splitting the parenting shifts saves money on child care, it can wreak havoc on a marriage.

Do you have any relatives or friends who can step in to babysit even for an afternoon, and allow you and your wife to get away for a walk in the park or lunch out at a restaurant? If you have no-one, maybe it's time to get to know your neighbors and develop some sort of babysitting cooperative. Can you pay for childcare even once or twice a week to allow you to rest and recuperate? Even a small break from parenting can recharge your batteries. Good luck!
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 4:02 PM on June 29 [1 favorite has favorites]

You don't go into much detail about what it is about fatherhood or caring for them that is difficult. You find yourself being grouchy at them in a way that you don't like, but in order to solve the problem I think you need to take a more detailed inventory of your feelings. You have said that the kids are also a source of stress between you and your wife but you don't say why.

The next time you find yourself in grouchy mood while you are with them, or are in conflict with your wife because of them, ask yourself the following questions:
1. How do I feel right now? Angry? Frustrated? Bored? Tired? Lonely/isolated? Overwhelmed? Something else?
2. What need do I have as a person that is going unmet and is causing me to feel this way? It could be a lack of adult connections, a lack of agreement with your wife about routines for caring for them, a lack of proper sleep, a lack of time to yourself. . . or maybe you just need a snack :)

Once you have identified your feelings and unmet needs, write them down. Keep track of them over the course of a week or two and look for a pattern.

I agree with others who have said that your schedule, which doesn't appear to allow you time for yourself, with friends, or alone with your wife, could be a factor. But you need to assess this for yourself.
posted by mai at 4:06 PM on June 29 [2 favorites has favorites]

FWIW, I have two kids, a boy and a girl, aged 8 and almost 5, respectively. My wife and I were also married for 7-8 years before we had children. I've found that my time with them has become much more enjoyable as they've gotten older. I think the early years are very hard, because the kids (by virtue of being infants/toddlers/etc.) are so needy and the parenting experience so defined by all the damn "management" you have to do just to keep one kid's diaper dry and the other from running into the street. (Literally -- I lost a couple of years over that incident, for sure...)

Now that our kids are out of diapers and able express themselves, we're all having a lot more fun, and the parenting experience has become OMG-so-much-more rewarding to me. So in that regard, I can tell you as one dad to another that things will change as your girls get older, and the grind will lessen considerably. Of course, that's still a few years away for you, but I guess the takeaway here is that the extreme neediness of early childhood doesn't last, and transitions into something much more enjoyable and mutually interactive.

I'll also say that you have the misfortune of caring for your kids during the late afternoon "witching hour", when they are most tired and cranky. Not an easy row to hoe.

Do you take your kids out for walks or bike rides? I don't know if you live in an urban, suburban, or rural environment, but I found when I had one or both kids, we all got along better if they had an outlet for their boundless energy that didn't tax me too much, and we all got some fresh air in the process. Going down to the playground and letting the big one play while the little one napped in the stroller (or hung out in the sling or Baby Bjorn, or flopped around on a blanket) did a lot to relieve my stress and wear them down a bit.

Finally, I'll nth the suggestion that you should schedule one night a week for yourself, and at least one night a month for a date night for you and your wife. Parenting is hard work, and it sounds like your job is also hard work; you gotta give yourself a chance to recharge, to be a grownup interacting with other grownups in a kid-free environment. Same goes for your wife, and your relationship together.

Hang in there.
posted by mosk at 4:15 PM on June 29 [1 favorite has favorites]

I was going to just favorite this but thought I would add why.

My grandma was 6 in 1912. She accidentally heard her parents having this conversation and it stayed with her for her whole life. In the late 90's (and her late 90's) we were talking about her parents and she brought it up. She was always so sad and never brought it up with them. She said (fully understanding the dark humor of it): "Yup, 1912. The Titanic sank and I found out my parents hated me."

Just be careful. Everyone here has better/more productive input, but thought I would add that little semi-related story.
posted by Tchad at 4:32 PM on June 29 [3 favorites has favorites]

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt. The above commenters are right - you are both single-parenting, and it's a bloody hard job.

It's easy for people to say 'oh, change your working hours' but that depends entirely on your job, doesn't it? Sometimes it's impossible to change something that isn't perfect. What you need to do, then, is focus on another way to improve your situation.

You both need 'you' time. For me, one belly-dancing class a week gives me the break I need. One hour. That's all it takes, and I come out of it feeling like Malibu again, instead of 'just G & D's mum'. It gives me the energy and enthusiasm to continue on my path of single-parenthood, and makes me a better mum because I come home rejuvenated and cheerful. Even if you don't have family nearby to mind your kids, as I am lucky enough to have, forking out to pay a babysitter would be worthwhile.

You know what? You ARE a great dad. You are concerned enough about this situation to seek advice, and in my book that makes you an awesome parent.

We all get stressed, we all raise our voices from time to time... and what works for our family is a genuine apology. I do it to my kids (although they're older than yours). I explain that I'm tired/stressed/upset, and I say I'm sorry I took it out on them because they did not deserve it. They hug me & forgive me, and the whole drama is forgotten.

And the older they get, the less I yell. I don't know if that's because their behaviour is better, or my patience is better, or because we're learning to get along with each other - but the important thing is they know that I feel bad when I lose my cool. It might also play a part in trying to teach them to have a conscience & consider the feelings of others, I guess, if they can see that I feel bad because I yelled at them.

Oh, and one last thing... my mother told me I was ugly when I was 12. Yes, I still remember it clearly 29 years later, and no, I've never felt the need to go to a therapist and sob dramatically about it. Joking quietly with your wife about how awful your kids are will not destroy their lives. (Sometimes I think particular commenters just visit this site to exercise their judgemental gene. Those who have attained perfection should just stay in their perfect world and wallow in their wonderfulness, instead of leaping in and making hurtful accusations about/to someone who is seeking advice and guidance.)

Best of luck.
posted by malibustacey9999 at 5:10 PM on June 29 [1 favorite has favorites]

First, I want to nth the problem with shift working like you are doing. If there is any way to end that, that will help you and your wife immensely. Putting the kids in daycare and just having them a couple of hours a night and weekends (with you and your wife tag teaming) is a lot easier way to be a parent.

I say this as the single mom of three. I do get to hand them over to dad at times and take alone time, but mostly they are all mine all the time. It is the never endingness of it that is hard, not the kids themselves. So a lot has to do with time management and chunking child care out into chunks that are tolerable. It is one thing to pass the kids back and forth to each other (like I do) but having two adults with the kids sharing the childcare makes it a lot easier and more fun.

I can't tell you exactly what kind of schedule you need to do, but you and your wife need to plan for enough sleep and time to make healthy foods and take care of yourself, have alone time, etc. And then split the childcare in an equitable way but still share in it. Kids, especially young kids are tough and time/energy intensive. Much of dealing with it has to do with managing your time and health into something doable, and that seems to be more your problem than not liking the kids.

Also, I agree, it gets TONS easier as they grow older. So hang in, it won't always be this intensive.
posted by Bueller at 5:14 PM on June 29

I too am a dad, to a 2-and-a-half year old and a 7-month-old. I don't work nights, but agree with previous comments suggesting that doing so must only add to your stress level. I do work a tough job, from home, and it often feels like I go straight from one job ("work") to the other ("dad").

I think you need to do more than carve out day to devote time to yourself. Rather, I think you need to give yourself some "me-time" each day. Even if it's only 5 or 10 minutes, I think that's significant. Play a video game, read a book, watch a movie, surf the web, or just veg. You've earned it. I find that I often have one article left in a tab that I really want to read, and by giving myself a few minutes to do that before I finish work and come "home" (which for me is "downstairs"), allows me to focus on enjoying my kids, vs. (at best) tolerating them.

Good luck, and good on you for trying to address this.
posted by lexfri at 5:21 PM on June 29

I think you're getting some very spot-on answers, especially with regard to schedule and really the fact that you're both single-parenting in effect. It's really hard and exhausting. You're tired.

It does get easier, especially when they're in school and as they become more independent. Right now, you have to know exactly what they are doing every second of every day and there is no downtime.

That said, you will lose it sometimes, or "fail" in some way as a parent. You'll have to learn to forgive yourself and keep loving your kids and making sure that they know that.
posted by idb at 5:29 PM on June 29

Evaluate physical issues first. Are you eating okay? Are you tired? Are you getting enough exercise? Sleep?

What about intangibles -- Time that belongs to you alone? Time alone with your wife? Time with your kids that's just for fun, not doing any Tasks?

If the answer to any of these is No, address those issues first, before proceeding further.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 5:29 PM on June 29

My wife is a student and takes night classes, I work all day and she cares for our 3 and 5 year olds.

1.) It gets easier. 1 year olds are a ton of physical work and totally dependent. 5 year olds are just learning how to make people do things and practice all the time (manipulative). It's not easy and I'm very sympathetic, but keep in mind the challenges will change but in time you'll get a bit more time where you can trust them.

2.) You and your wife need to compete with each other in how much time you give the other person for personal pursuits. My wife is working on starting a non-profit and I like to go running. We find that competing with each other in how much time we give the other benefits all four of us. Take your time and relish it, and make her take hers.

3.) You are NOT a bad dad. Being a dad is just really, really hard. Forgive yourself more often and you'll see an improvement in your parenting skills.
posted by Toekneesan at 5:30 PM on June 29

Having in the past parented toddlers while working third shift I can confidently say that the shift has more to do with your mood than the kids do.

On review, yeah, likely this.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 5:31 PM on June 29

Awww, I'm sorry you're going through such a rough time. I've definitely been in your shoes and know how it feels to sometimes clearly be under the impression that you suck as a parent. I can virtually assure you, however, that by the sheer merit of the fact that you've given it this much thought - and have posted this thread, that you don't suck nearly as much as you think you might.

My girls are 4-1/2 and 6-1/2, and it absolutely gets a little easier with every month and year they get older. As your little one becomes a little more independent and becomes more of a playmate for her sister, they will ease up needing you to entertain them so much (and if you haven't fostered independent play yet, by all means encourage it NOW!).

It is absolutely not out of the realm of possibility that *you* could be going though your own version of postpartum depression. You know, it's not exclusive to mothers, especially if you're pulling single-parenting sessions the majority of the day. If you're in the financial (and insurance) position to talk to a doctor, consider the possibility of anti-depressants (we like to call them 'happy cat pills' in our house).

Also, take advantage of the summer, and any middle school or younger high school kids that might be around. They might not be old enough to be able to stay by themselves with both kids, but they could definitely provide welcome distraction and allow you some pseudo-alone time. Take a nap, watch a movie on your computer, go take an uninterrupted shower, eat a meal that you don't have to share with anybody else. The helper could make the kids lunch, give them baths, play with them, maybe even throw in a load of laundry. I know that the 8th grader that lived next to me when I moved in would've swooned at the opportunity to do that for me. I was just too depressed to take advantage of her (and was too embarrassed at how pathetic I thought I seemed to the outside world at the time). Learn from my mistakes.

Finally, a long time ago, a very sage friend of mine told me that it's enough if you're an OK parent 70% of the time and a great parent 30% of the time. At the end of the day -- and this is really, truly what gets me through the shitty days (and I still have more than I care to mention) where I've screamed and yelled and hollered way too much --- I remember that I still have this very strange power to make things all better just by the wonder of being Mommy. I can make monsters go away by coming into a room, and make loneliness disappear by laying down in bed next to my resident little persons, and am still forgiven by simply giving a really big hug and whispering that I'm sorry and tomorrow will be better. I promise.

Big Hugs to you. Memail me if you need to talk more.
posted by dancinglamb at 5:51 PM on June 29 [2 favorites has favorites]

I've found that it helps me and it helps my kids if I tell them how I feel. Sometimes I have a hard time being patient. I try to tell my kids why ("Daddy didn't sleep well, I'm very tired. Can you help me?"). There was a point this winter where I was very, very sick and could barely move myself around. I was also short of patience and made sure that I told my kids that I loved them, and that right now I felt very sick. My two year old started to recognize the look and would ask me if I feel sick. If I said 'yes' he asked why. It was a conversation starter, not an outburst which is a stopper. When I felt better, he question turned into "daddy, you feeling better right now?"
posted by plinth at 5:55 PM on June 29 [1 favorite has favorites]

1. Sleep. Sounds like your job causes sleep deprivation/imbalance. It's natural to get cranky.

2. Own your emotions. It's never the girls that cause you to be X. It's your anger, happening inside your body. Owning it is as easy as saying (to yourself) "I'm so cranky. I'm so tired. My eyes are burning. The girls are screaming. I really want to scream right now."

Find ways to express your anger energy (the impulse to scream/raise voice, hit, etc.) by doing fun/crazy things that do not hurt anybody. Going into the other room and squeezing a pillow while screaming into it is a practical although not very creative approach. Find other ways. Be aware of how your kids feel when you express your anger. Try until you find a way that allows you to express anger without seeing fear on their faces.

3. Carve out time for yourself (could be just 30 min / day, but uninterrupted time to do whatever you want, by yourself, just for you).

4. Where does the stress of having kids come from? What are the stressful situations? It is possible that you are expecting behaviors that are not age appropriate or that normal behaviors trigger you. Please elaborate.

5. Check out Alfie Kohn's Unconditional Parenting. Amazing book that can potentially bring peace and collaboration into situations that looked impossible to resolve.

6. Forget about being a good/bad father. Many "good" parents inflict terrible abuse on their children. Start paying attention to what's going on for your children, most importantly what they are feeling and what they truly need ( the core principles of compassionate parenting). Kids have lots of things going on for them. Things that you can't imagine as being important may be crucial for them. Big emotions are proven to change a child's brain chemistry beyond what they can control, etc.
posted by andreinla at 5:59 PM on June 29

Television is an important tool in the parenting arsenal. There is nothing wrong with parking them in front of the great glass eye for a bit if the alternative is a grumpy dad. If you don't already get the Noggin channel, I highly recommend it. This may seem obvious -- but your statement about practicing meditation & fostering mindfulness made me wonder if maybe you weren't setting the bar for yourself a bit too high.
posted by selfmedicating at 6:29 PM on June 29 [1 favorite has favorites]

Did you have preconceived notions of what parenting would be like? Or what life would be like with kids? We all did. If you truly let go of those notions (and sometimes they are in the back of our minds) then you won't be at odds with the reality versus the fantasy--this is what really causes a lot of stress that we bring upon ourselves. An above all --let go of the idea that you can be in control at all times with kids and families. It never works. Good Luck
posted by sandra194 at 7:55 PM on June 29

I know others have mentioned the shift work, but I wanted to say how exactly that could be particularly hard -- especially on you, and even worse than being a single parent. Every night, I am relieved to get the children to sleep. I enter those two hours of post-child-bedtime evening a bit of a wreck, but after a couple of hours of reading or watching a movie, I exit them relaxed and recharged.

It occurred to me that you don't get this relief. You never put them to bed and then have a couple of hours with your wife to sit, talk, relax, and then to go to bed together, because you have to work. Post-child-bedtime evenings are a very pleasant part of life with small children and what makes it balanced and sane.

Could you get this time in some other way? Or -- would just knowing other parents rely heavily on this time for their happiness in parenting make you feel better for feeling frustrated and burnt-out? Because, we do. "There was never a child so lovely but his mother was glad to get him to sleep."
posted by palliser at 9:06 PM on June 29

When its my turn to take care of the kids (2 and 4 years) I take them OUT. For some reason, out there, I can be 'good dad'. At home, for some reason, I am prone to slipping into grumpy, terse behavior. I think its that I work full time and go to school full time and I can hear the laptop calling me...
Get them out. Hike them, play them, run them, get them tired!
Don't beat yourself up.
posted by BrodieShadeTree at 9:11 PM on June 29

I used to work the graveyard shift for about 9 months. For the first three months I told myself that I liked it. Around the middle I started to question it. At the end I couldn't get off graveyard fast enough.

And this was when I was single and unattached. I can't imagine raising kids with your wife in a tag-team situation.

This may be a moot point, as you can't change your job situation, but....change your job situation. Try to work days if at all possible and your life will be completely different.
posted by zardoz at 6:04 AM on June 30

Get checked for depression.
posted by hellboundforcheddar at 6:43 AM on June 30

Please get counseling. Take your wife, too, perhaps. It isn't funny to joke that having kids was a mistake.

I'm 26 and my dad (who's never been as thoughtful as you seem to be) still mentions off-hand what a pain in the ass it was to have kids at my age. (Yeah, that means me & my sister.) It hurts really bad, even though it's his effort at parental advice.

So please get counseling; don't let bitterness begin to fester. Your girls WILL pick up on it, and those wounds might never heal.
posted by motsque at 7:04 AM on June 30

I know my father loves me a lot, but for a patch of time when I was growing up, he was a huge grumpy asshole. Once he called me at home and started yelling about something and made me cry. When he got home later and listened to the answering machine, he heard our phone conversation (the machine had picked up). He was so shocked at how he sounded, and came and apologized to me. He said he hadn't realized how he must sound to me and didn't mean take to xyz out on me, etc. That meant SO MUCH to me. Now that we're both older and he's calmed down a lot, whenever he has a ridiculous reaction, he calls back to apologize. And it still makes a huge difference.

Every time you "wince" at your behavior, say something to your kids. The one-year-old might not understand yet, but the five-year-old will get that "Daddy is grumpy about ___, he's not really mad at you, he's sorry he sounded so mean/angry." It's good to learn at a young age that you love them no matter what, and that other people's emotions and reactions are not always about them.
posted by thebazilist at 8:33 AM on June 30 [1 favorite has favorites]