Melbourne, Monash and U. Melbourne?

June 26, 2009 5:37 PM

Please tell me about Melbourne, Monash and U. Melbourne.

My wife is being encouraged by a fairly important researcher to get a master's at Monash University in Melbourne, where he teaches. If we did this, I would probably take the opportunity to get a second master's or a PhD, at Monash or U. Melbourne.
We know nothing at all about Monash, U. Melbourne or life in Melbourne. We're all the way around the globe in Chile, so this would be a major move.
So:

• What's life in Melbourne like (esp. for a couple with a 3 year old)?
• How good is the film department in Monash? The computer science department at Monash or U. Melbourne?
• Any other schools I should be looking into?

I'm an architect with an interest in Comp. Sci. approaches to spatial analysis, in case that's relevant.

posted by signal to education (19 comments total)

Another sub-question re living expenses: How much would it take for the 3 of us to survive in a non-fancy but comfortable and fun neighborhood, maybe near the university, including lodging, food, transportation, preschool, health?
posted by signal at 5:59 PM on June 26

As a Spaniard transplanted to Melbourne and the recent father of a two month old, I can tell you that this is a great place to live and raise a small kid: friendly people, lots of parks, and both medicare and the council child services (immunisation, child-rearing lessons, nurse visitations) are top-notch. Your wife's International Student Health Coverage will take her up to Medicare status on a dime (it was around 350 AUD a year for me), and same for you if you enroll as an International Student, but I don't know how this applies to spouses or children.

Monash does not have a film department of note. The place to study film in Melbourne is the Victorian College of the Arts, now part of Melbourne University.

The computer science department at U. Melbourne is very good. I took a subject there with the people responsible for the Python NLTK, and it rocked. Enrolling in a coursework program at the Monash School of IT, however, is a throw of the dice. At some point they decided to drop the "Computer Science" and call it "IT", take as many fee-paying foreign students as they could, became a java school, and basically watered down what was a very good program.

I ended up dropping out of a masters by coursework at Monash because I could not see the point to it, but I might go back and try a research masters' later on. CEMA is quite nice (and their interests might overlap with yours), and the people at the Constraint Solving and Optimisation Group are amazing. So I would recommend Monash if you are thinking of doing research and know the people involved, but not for coursework. Unimelb I would recommend in either case.

Another place to consider is RMIT. It has a much lower profile than either Monash or Unimelb, but as I understand it they are doing work in computational architecture. They also have a videogame program, which might overlap with your interests (or maybe not). I will ask around, your question has piqued my curiosity.

As to location, Monash has two different campuses, Caulfield and Clayton. Both of them are on the same train line, so you can shuttle between both of them. Currently all the interesting bits of the school of IT are at Clayton, which is a good hour away from the Melbourne CBD (Central Business District), where both Unimelb and RMIT are. Living around Monash Clayton, Oakleigh would be my choice. It is a 20-15 minute ride away from Monash Clayton if you don't mind cycling (7 min by car), and 28 mins from the CBD by train.

However, I have heard that the bulk of Monash School of IT will be moving to Caulfield soon. You don't say what your wife will be studying, but the first thing to find out is whether her program is at Caulfield (closer to the CBD and to Unimelb, RMIT, VCA) or Clayton (further away), and plan accordingly.
posted by kandinski at 7:00 PM on June 26

Not the info you really want, but helpful in its own small way: "Monash" is pronounced Mawnash. Or maybe Mahnash. (Just not Moh-nash.) And it's Uni Melbourne, not U Melbourne or U of Melbourne....

Aussies split on the Melbourne vs. Sydney question, but basically it's a lovely, seaside, cosmopolitan city.
posted by kestrel251 at 7:04 PM on June 26

I studied at the University of Melbourne's Parkville campus and have friends who studied at Monash, at Clayton. But we didn't study anything related to computers, film making or architecture! So I can tell you a bit about living in Melbourne and the two unis, but not much about those specific areas of study that isn't publicly available.

First up, it's Mon-ash, not Maw-nash. Unless, perhaps an Australian accent sounds like Maw-nash to foreign ears? And anyone will know where you're talking about whether you say Melbourne Uni or the University of Melbourne. I have never, ever heard anyone refer to it as Uni Melb when speaking, but that's how it refers to itself on its website. That's a change since the time I was there, so perhaps now people do actually say ''Uni Melb''.

Campuses: University of Melbourne and Monash Clayton are a fair way apart. They're both serviced extremely well by public transport, but, you know, it's still a bit of a hike between the two.

As far as the differences between the two campuses, Monash Clayton was, to me, in the middle of a suburban wasteland. Melbourne Uni, on the other hand, was a lovely sandstone campus at Parkville, an easy walk to the city, to where I lived in Fitzroy and to a million other cool suburbs to live, shop, eat and explore in - Brunswick, Carlton, North Carlton, Richmond, Abbotsford, Collingwood.

Courses: You should absolutely sign up for the Good Guide, which rates Australian universities and courses, including postgrad courses, indpendently to see where each institution ranks for the areas you are considering studying.

You can check out Computer Science at Melbourne here; Architecture Building and Planning here. To be honest, I didn't even know Monash *had* a film school, but here it is, at the Clayton campus. Monash IT's page is here.

If you aren't tied to those two universities, you could also look through the sites of RMIT; Swinburne; La Trobe, Deakin and Victoria Universities and the Victorian College of the Arts (VCA), now run by Melbourne Uni.

Living in Melbourne: Every uni in Australia has an international students' office and quite a lot of them publish information about cost of living. The University of Melbourne's version is here and Monash's is here. These offices will often assist with finding somewhere to stay.

Some more info from the Department of Immigration about studying in Australia; there are so many international students in Melbourne the Victorian Government has built a special international student portal; you could also check out Studies in Australia.

Melbourne is a great place to live, but it can be expensive rent-wise. You can look at real estate listings at Realestate.com.au or at Domain.com.au.

To see what's going on in Melbourne, you could check out The Age; the ABC; and have a listen to RRR community radio online. And there's some general info about Melbourne from the City of Melbourne.

You mention that you live in Chile, but not if you are Chilean? There's a big Chilean community in Melbourne. There's Chilean radio here and some Chilean community links here. Melbourne Uni has a Latin American Students Association.

And a caveat: of course your partner's researcher will encourage her to come to Monash where he/she works. Because your partner will be paying handsomely for the privilege of a post grad degree from an Australian University and, along with all the other international students, swelling the institutional coffers considerably. That's not to say you shouldn't do it, or that it's not a good place to study. But it is something you should be aware of.

FWIW, I love, love, LOVED Melbourne and would recommend it as a great place to live, to anyone. It's awesome, I miss it and visits back are huge highlights in my year. I hope lot of Melbourne folk chime in with info for you, too! If you have any other questions, feel free to MeMail me.
posted by t0astie at 9:51 PM on June 26 [1 favorite]

Great answers, so far. Thanks! A clarification: my wife would be studying Film Criticism, not Film Making.
posted by signal at 10:02 PM on June 26

In that case, also check out Melbourne Uni's School of Culture and Communications. Which is where I did post grad studies in... drumroll please! Art History and Cinema Studies, many many years ago. I was looking at multimedia and photography not film, but when I was there at least, it was great. They have a separate Cinema Studies department now. /End endorsement.
posted by t0astie at 10:10 PM on June 26

I have lived in Melbourne for most of my life (born here). I have never heard the school referred to as anything other than "Melbourne Uni" (Melb'n Yooni). And Monash is pronounced "Moh-nash", at least to my Australian ears (where the "oh" is like the o in "sock")

I can't comment on much other than pronunciation in regards to universities, because I never went to one. But from what I can see, expect a mix of students from all over the world, particularly Asia.

As for the city and culture :

Most of us are very proud of our city. It is the most European influenced city in the country, mainly due to an influx of Greek and Italian immigrants after WWII. In more recent decades, there has been a lot of immigration from parts of Asia, and even more recently, Africa. The Chinese have a very strong influence as many of them came for the Gold Rush in the 19th century.

The inner city and surrounding suburbs are all about cafes, live music, pubs, trendy little specialty shops, not-so-trendy little shops, parks.

The outer suburbs can be pretty bland, much like many cities around the world. Huge shopping malls. And .... um... well, it varies from suburb to suburb.

It's a very spread out city, when you take all the outer suburbs into account. In some outer suburbs, you NEED a car. But in most inner suburbs, you can get by without a car. The tram network is quite good, and the trains are always there, but are EXTREMELY crowded in peak times. I read an article recently (can't find it now) which said Melbourne is the most "sprawled" city in the world.

t0astie's links above are all very good.

Feel free to IM me if you want a general opinion of any particular suburbs or areas.
posted by Diag at 10:48 PM on June 26

Diag has it. The 'o' in Monash is short, like in sock. It's the same sound as monarchy, monocle or Montana.
posted by t0astie at 11:59 PM on June 26

Melbourne is my home town. Melbourne Uni has the prestige but Monash also has a good reputation. Monash is a big sprawling campus whereas Melbourne Uni is compact.

The inner-northern suburbs around Melbourne uni are delightful: old, characterful, cosmopolitan and fun. It can be easy to find rental apartments or small houses just a short tram, bike or walk away from Melbourne uni but you won't get much 'bang for your buck'. Even small one-bedroom apartments in this area can be AU$300+ per week.

On the other hand Monash Uni is in Clayton. Clayton is a working-class but pleasant enough suburb. (I have family who live in Clayton so I'm not a snob). There just isn't much going on. It can feel a bit like it's miles from the action, especially at night. Apartment rentals can also be expensive here due to the demand from students.

I had a friend who was on exchange (undergrad physics) from UC Berkeley. He was at Monash and I was Melbourne Uni living in Carlton. He always regretted going to Monash after he saw what the lifestyle was like in Carlton, Fitzroy, Brunswick and the city. Mind you, we were 20-somethings with no kids. I suspect you will find a happy medium. If it is important to you, the latin community hub is in Johnston St, Fitzroy.

Good luck.
posted by evil_esto at 1:05 AM on June 27

I don't know much about the film department at Monash, but if you are talking about getting supervision from Adrian Martin, he's an interesting character. I mean this in an entirely good way.
posted by Wolof at 1:48 AM on June 27

I'm a born and bred Melburnian who studied at Melbourne Uni and RMIT. For the past ten years I have lived about 500m from Melbourne Uni, and for the last four of those I have been a fulltime dad to an almost 4yo boy.

t0astie and kandinski have given you some excellent advice and links, and I haven't got much to add to it, but you are welcome to MeMail me if you think I could answer any specific questions about looking after a small child in the city.

I think you'll probably find almost regardless of what cities you've lived in that Melbourne feels spread out. If your wife was to go to Clayton then that is a long way by most people's standards from 'the city', even though it is still thought of as a part of Melbourne. If you want to enjoy some of the colour and movement of a new culture then I'd certainly recommend trying to live closer to the city, but by the same token if I was your wife I wouldn't want to drive great distances to get to uni every day...

And like at least one of the other commentators I'd note that RMIT has a good reputation (at least locally) in some (but certainly not all) fields, and in general terms they tend to be the ones you appear to be interested in. If your wife is at Clayton and you live near the city then it would probably be worth checking out.
posted by puffmoike at 5:03 AM on June 27

Melbourne is a lovely city. Do you know which Monash campus? Apartment rentals around the campuses can be difficult. But both Melbourne campuses are on major transport routes, so it's not hard. Melbourne has a great standard of loving, clean, safe and plenty for the mind.
posted by mattoxic at 5:28 AM on June 27

Oh, and Melbourne is definitely the 'home' of architecture in Australia, even if Australia's best known building is in Sydney and was designed by a Dane who never came to Australia.

I just Googled Melbourne Architecture and the first few websites that came up were embarrassingly bad. Perhaps some keener architecture buffs will be able to point you to something a little more inspiring?

In the meantime Google Images gave me a better quick visual overview.

And this Google Earth overlay from the Australian Institute of Architects (the professional body) will give you an idea of how few commercial buildings in the area around Monash's Clayton campus have won awards in the past few years compared to those in the immediate vicinity of the city.
posted by puffmoike at 5:33 AM on June 27

Thanks for all the awesome answers, everybody. More numbers (a la evil_esto) as to what it costs to live in an interesting part of the city would be appreciated.
posted by signal at 5:52 AM on June 27

I've lived in Brisbane, Canberra, Sydney and Melbourne, so I don't have a particular stake in one city or the other. I can tell you, however, that Melbourne is a lovely place to live.

Don't be scared of people talking about Monash Clayton as suburban wasteland. It's not Soho or anything but there are some great neighbourhoods out there.

Oakleigh is a lovely, Greekish neighbourhood, Springvale is just up the road, it's considered dodgy by some (i did have my bike stolen there) but it's the best Vietnamese in Melbourne bar none, and has a fabulous burgeoning Sudanese community as well. Glen Waverly is also cyclable to Monash, and is a nice, Chinese-ish neighbourhood.

All these suburbs have train stations that will get you into the city in 35, 45, and 40 minutes respectively. Trains in Melbourne are as safe as houses. They do stop at midnight like the pumpkin carriage, but as a consequence they're always full of people and very safe pretty much all the time.

Those suburbs are not great for nightlife but the lived- in experience of all of them is very pleasant. Glen Waverly is close to some nice parks, as is Oakleigh. Rent will be pretty cheap - ballpark figure for a three bedroom townhouse or house would be between $300 - $500 AUD a week. I lived in Mulgrave - a suburb next to Springvale, ten minute ride from Monash in a niceish, older three bedroom house for $260 a week. Oakleigh will be on the higher end of that spectrum.

Main thing is these suburbs - with possible exception of Glen Waverly - have no nightlife. When the restaurants close, consider the suburb closed. If you're catching a cab from the city, Springvale will set you back about $80 bucks or more to get home. Foodwise, frugal shopping (Asian grocers, hurrah!) will set you back maybe $100 a week for two. YMMV.

Makes a night out expensive if you miss that last train. Feel free to memail me for more neighbourhood questions.
posted by smoke at 7:08 AM on June 27

Yeah, sorry, I meant that it rhymed with 'sock'. No disagreement. To my (non-Aussie) ears, representing the spelling as 'Mohnash' makes it rhyme with 'moan'.
posted by kestrel251 at 7:53 AM on June 27

Canadians here. We were in Melbourne last year for a few weeks with our then-3-year-old when Mr. Hilksom was doing a lecture series. We were based in Docklands, then. We'd been to Melbourne before on book tour, at that time based downtown. My brother lived in Melbourne for three years from 99-02, my childhood penpal (S'porean) went to Monash, and we have Cdn & Aus friends sprinkled throughout the city.

As an English-speaking foreigner, I loved Melbourne. And Melbourne with a young child is awesome. Great public transit, great walkability, great easy street food, great weather, great parks.

Based on my impressions of Monash via my old penpal, I suggest going to Melbourne Uni. I suggest living in Carlton or Fitzroy. (I have no idea what it would cost to live in these suburbs.) There is a f*cking kick-ass park at Carlton Gardens, behind the museum (the fact that you can see it from space is only one of many things in its favour, also self-link photo here). As a parent of a small child you know how superb life would be if you were three blocks from one of the best parks in the country (and a huge children's museum, by the way, right there, too). At night you can watch the flying foxes swooping overhead, a huge hit with the under-10 set.

I'll tell you that St. Kilda (east of CBD) is also a superb place to be, but even as clueless as I am I know that it's very expensive. If you can afford it, go for it. Great beach, great parks, great main strip, great transit access, great people.
posted by Mrs Hilksom at 10:45 PM on June 27

Hi Signal,

Me-mail me for more of an idea on the cost of living in Melbourne and give me some idea of your personal finances. Happy to help.

I live in Brisbane now so I can give you some perspective/comparison.
posted by evil_esto at 3:52 AM on June 28

Thanks so much, everybody. You're all winners, so pardon me if I don't mark each answer as "best".
posted by signal at 7:59 PM on June 28