Never been kissed!

February 22, 2009 1:06 AM

[Relationship (or lack thereof) Filter] I'm a 21 year old chick, getting ready to graduate from college this May, and I've never been in a relationship. Worse yet, I've never been on a date, fooled around, or even kissed someone! I'm like Drew Barrymore in Never Been Kissed, only without Michael Vartan to save the day.

So, about me: I'm a 20 year old female. I'm 5'9 and slightly overweight - I'm not obese, but I'm not a stick by any means. I'm cute and have nice hair. I'm intelligent, occasionally witty, nice, and vaguely quirky. I spend most of my time in class, at work, doing homework, or singing in the university choir.

For a long time I considered myself to be socially awkward, but I have it on pretty good authority that others don't perceive my as such. My biggest social problem is that I don't know how to take "next steps" - moving from casual acquaintances in class to friends who hang out. As such, I have trouble making friends at all, let alone prospective boyfriends.

My only experience with anything romantic/intimate/dating-ish comes through my friends or through the movies. It never really bothered me in the past - I was much more concerned with doing well in school and whatnot. Now I'm feeling like, every day that passes, the situation gets worse.

I've had crushes on guys before, but I don't know how to see if they like me or ask them out. And even if I went on a date, I wouldn't know what to do with myself! I don't even know how I could explain it to my date. I'm just completely and utterly at a loss.

Can anyone help me at all?

[You can email [e-mail] with questions/private comments/whatever.]

posted by anonymous to human relations (31 comments total)

Guys are not really complicated at all, if you see a guy you like just tell them outright, and ask them if they're interested. Trust me, it's a huge relief for a guy to get asked out by a girl, no guy ordinary would get offended or annoyed by it.

Obviously, you'll feel awkward doing it, but if you're willing to solderer through the awkwardness it will be fine. There are no long-term consequences to getting turned down.
posted by delmoi at 1:24 AM on February 22 [4 favorites]

Do you have single male friends? as in males that would call you up to have lunch... Those guys would date you if they thought they had a chance with you. Ask one to the movies.
posted by magikker at 2:16 AM on February 22

I'm in my mid-thirties, and can see (from the responses so far, and other comments in AskMefi) that things are quite different for your age group than for my group when I was your age. Apparently, guys your age wait by the phone for girls to call and ask them out. So I guess, you can do that with great success. (Not that girls didn't ask guys out when I was your age, but it just wasn't the norm.)

But, things will change when you are out of school. You'll be exposed to a larger group of people, including men who ask women out.

I guess my help is just a word of encouragement -- you will be asked out, you will be kissed and much more. You are just a late bloomer in this area. And when it happens, the guy won't think it's a negative that you've not done all this before.
posted by Houstonian at 2:45 AM on February 22

I was in a very similar situation - then got my first kiss & my first boyfriend a month and a week before I turned 21. I've done the asking-out-a-guy thing, maybe to an obsessive extent, but I also had a knack for choosing unavailable people (either they liked boys or they were attached, bah!!) so sucked to be me.

I'd say just go with the flow. No need to be a heat-seeking missile - but if an opportunity looks good, go for it!
posted by divabat at 3:04 AM on February 22

I like divabat's answer. My experience as a skinny guy was that the girls thing only clicked for me once I'd had enough hassles over it that I'd stopped caring about it. Stop looking and it will come kind of thing. On the other hand, I think given your situation if you find a guy you like and they seem available, ask them out. It will take some intestinal fortitude to do this if you have limited experience in this area.

Oh as a self-described slightly overweight 20 year old girl, I suspect you're one of either a morbidly obese person in denial, or more likely a person of normal weight hypersensitised to society's unrealistic expectations. Of course there's a third option, that you're actually what you described, in which case you approximate the second category (I'm not into excessively skinny btw [ but also I'm already taken ;) ] ).
posted by singingfish at 4:29 AM on February 22

(1) eye contact
(2) Smile

Repeat as necessary
posted by Ironmouth at 5:54 AM on February 22 [3 favorites]

Do you have single male friends? as in males that would call you up to have lunch... Those guys would date you if they thought they had a chance with you. Ask one to the movies.

This may be the case, but it's not the truism that it's often made out to be. If you're truly not a part of the dating scene and have always been, those male friends might think of you and value you as someone 'safe' they don't have to perform around, which can be a relief.

Trust me, it's a huge relief for a guy to get asked out by a girl, no guy ordinary would get offended or annoyed by it.

Unless, say, he isn't interested in her and they've had a friendship on that basis for some time.

I would not take kindly to being suddenly propositioned by my longtime female friends, on the basis that I'm male and should be interested if normal.

If you're going to do that, do it because you've had a longstanding crush on one of them, and think he might feel the same way--and understand you might undermine the friendship (at least temporarily, until the awkwardness fades.)
posted by snuffleupagus at 6:10 AM on February 22

Ironmouth nails it. Absolutely fool-proof way to get a guy to ask you out. Decide who you want to go out with. Every single time you pass him, make eye contact and smile. You don't have to say anything. You don't have to stop and make conversation (I mean, you can but you don't have to). I absolutely guarantee that he will cave within a month or sooner. Careful with this, because like I said, it is completely foolproof (I have given this advice in the green before, and had MeMails telling me that it does in fact work). I have tested it in the field (um, back when I was single, lo these many years ago.)

You're on your own for kissing. In books guys are suckers for girls who have never been kissed. Don't know about real life.
posted by nax at 6:26 AM on February 22

Uh, Houstonian? For real? I'm 33 and back in my day I asked guys out. Lots of my girlfriends asked guys out. In fact, I'll hazard a guess that it slowly started to become more common in the 70s and has grown exponentially since then. The truth of the matter is, that no one likes to ask people out. Fear of rejection is strong!

Maybe anon could consider dissecting her love life and challenging herself to be more assertive, outgoing, available and interested just like she has pursued her schoolwork. Are there not men in choir? Flirt with them and then ask them out for coffee. Done. That guy may not become a boyfriend or kiss you but it sounds like anon needs to get over the hump of just being assertive and hanging out with guys one-on-one.

Anon, make a point to talk to the guys in your social circle. Assess how you look and project yourself and make moves to improve yourself as necessary. College is such a great time to meet any and every kind of person that I think anyone can find someone to hang out with. It's really a great opportunity for romantic experimentation and you shouldn't let it pass you by. Maybe make it a point to talk to a guy one-on-one every day. Even if it's just to nudge the guy next to you in class and say, "What do you think of this Heidegger stuff?" Listen, be engaged and watch for topics which spring off into other interests.

If there are no guys in choir or they have already been deemed unlikely or unavailable -- time to come up with a new venue. Find an interest group (with men in it) and pursue it. That's really the only way.

Good luck!
posted by amanda at 7:15 AM on February 22 [2 favorites]

Do you have anyone you know who you would trust to set you up with someone? That may be what it takes to get over that first hurdle of meeting someone and going out on a date. Even if it doesn't work out with the first guy, you'd feel more comfortable with the idea of going out on dates and have a slightly better understanding of interacting with men in a romantic, flirty way.

I was in your place at one time. Just before I graduated, a friend of mine set me up with his best friend. It turned out that it had been someone I had been friends with years ago and had never been able to stop thinking about. This guy confessed that he had always wanted to ask me out, but had had his heart broken a number of times and was afraid of rejection. So we found ourselves put together by a friend and after that, everything was easier. We dated on and off for a number of years. I moved away and dated other guys, but eventually I went back to him and we're married now. So, you just never know what will happen! Good luck!
posted by bristolcat at 7:33 AM on February 22

And even if I went on a date, I wouldn't know what to do with myself! I don't even know how I could explain it to my date. I'm just completely and utterly at a loss.

Purely for this issue of confidence, internet dating services are your friend. I was in your situation at 23. I went on dates with boys through internet dating services, and here are the bonuses:

- You are a girl. They will contact you. You will only have to sort through your responses, not actually initiate anything if you don't want to.

- You can be a terrible date and then go home and think "Gosh, that was embarrassing. Glad I don't have to ever see him again!" And then you can learn from it and be a better date with other people. You get to experiment and then start over with a clean slate.

- You get to date lots of different people if you want. If you are just doing it as a "learning to date" exercise, it takes lots of pressure off you, and you can just be curious about them and learn about what kinds of boys (or girls) you would like to date. You can play with different looks, with different dating strategies, with different types of people. You don't have to be really self-conscious, because you can just run away afterward if you don't want to see them again.

- Odds are you'll get kissed and then that won't be an issue anymore. There are lots of temporary stand-ins for Michael Vartan around. Maybe even as cute as him if you're lucky! :)

- You'll suddenly have a range of stories to tell -- movies you've seen, art galleries you've visited, fun events around town.

- Lightning could strike! You might meet a really cute boy who you're totally into!

And then, when your confidence is up and you know more of what you want and how to act when you get it and you're totally crushing on some hottie, go ask him out.
posted by heatherann at 7:37 AM on February 22 [8 favorites]

You seem to be thinking of male/female interaction as an either/or choice. When I was in school, back in the Paleolithic age, I didn't go on dates, as much as spend time studying with boys, hanging out in their dorm rooms, laughing at choir rehearsal, writing snarky notes to each other in class, playing records at the radio station, doing all the things I did with female friends. And I hardly considered myself someone who was "hot" according to the masses (I was slightly heavy, didn't know how to dress, hardly ever wore makeup, etc). But you'll learn: it doesn't matter!

Who are you attracted to? Make eye contact, say hi, ask if they want to study for Class X, work on a music piece for choir. A date is just a formal interaction; keep it informal, and you won't freeze up under "performance anxiety." Kissing someone is easy; finding someone that you want to want to keep kissing is another matter.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 8:11 AM on February 22

Don't rule out internet dating sites. You will definitely be asked out. And you will be able to pre-screen.
posted by hellboundforcheddar at 8:12 AM on February 22

Trust me, it's a huge relief for a guy to get asked out by a girl, no guy ordinary would get offended or annoyed by it.

"ordinary guy"

A much-needed clarification.
posted by Zambrano at 9:08 AM on February 22

Hi Me-from-Sophomore-Year!

I have so many things I want to tell you, that I can barely get them into a cohesive structure.

- You are not alone. There are gobs of people in your situation. Every single time someone posts a question of this sort on Ask.Metafilter, I want to run over and tell person they are fine.

- You need to risk looking like a goof. No one gets flirting, kissing, sex perfect the first time. That's fine. Some of the more endearing, fun experiences are the fumbling ones. Enjoy!

- Guys probably have been flirting with you but you are clueless. Because you are clueless you don't respond in a flirting way. They take that is a "no thanks" and move on to another girl. (I know of what I speak - when I got started on Facebook I heard from 7 guys from my high school who told me they had a crush on slightly-chubby-high-school me. ME! I promise you that I did not have a clue.)

- Me-from-Sophomore-Year, I promise you that you'll be fine if you let yourself take the risk. You get a bit of a late start. Your a little wiser for it and you generally make smart choices about men and birth control and sex. You meet someone who probably had a late start of his own and you figure it out together.
posted by 26.2 at 9:11 AM on February 22 [4 favorites]

This may be the case, but it's not the truism that it's often made out to be. If you're truly not a part of the dating scene and have always been, those male friends might think of you and value you as someone 'safe' they don't have to perform around, which can be a relief.

See, maybe I'm a weirdo, but to me, that sounds like an excellent foundation for a good (romantic) relationship.

OP, I didn't get kissed until two weeks after high school ended because I was terrified that, if I tried, a guy would push me away in disgust. Having been in your position, I know that people saying stuff like "once you start kissing people you'll realize you were freaking out over nothing" just sounds impossible right now--but once you start kissing people, you'll realize you were freaking out over nothing. I got kissed eventually--and I'm sure that if you put yourself in solo situations with guys, you will too--but in retrospect, I can see that I missed my chance with a lot of great people because I was too scared to make a move. Dive in. Your life will be richer for it!
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 9:18 AM on February 22

Maybe you should flirt with girls as well as guys, you'd be surprised how much easier the next step is if you find the right staircase.
posted by geoff. at 10:15 AM on February 22

You are not alone. There are gobs of people in your situation. Every single time someone posts a question of this sort on Ask.Metafilter, I want to run over and tell person they are fine.

Speaking as a decent-looking, but chronically shy male who didn't kiss a girl until he was 22, the above advice is true and cannot be repeated enough. ((( Group hugs for all late-bloomers )))

Just ask a guy who you've shared a laugh with in class out for coffee and go out and enjoy yourself.
posted by porn in the woods at 10:23 AM on February 22 [1 favorite]

Thirding internet dating as a way to learn how to flirt, date, and get over the awkwardness.
posted by entropyiswinning at 10:30 AM on February 22

Never been kissed? Maybe you should start thinking of this as "I have never kissed anyone."
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 10:37 AM on February 22 [9 favorites]

Ditto the 'you-are-not-alone' theme.

Instead of focusing on the lacks in your life, you could also acknowledge the positives.

- You have lots of practice interacting with people successfully. This is just an area you haven't explored yet for various reasons.
- It's like riding a bike. Once you've done it, you never forget how. The trick is to learn without falling too much or getting hurt unnecessarily. Perhaps you just haven't felt a powerful enough motivation to risk the learning curve to get the reward.
- You have all the biological and social skills you need hardwired in. Now all you need is motivation, opportunity and willingness to experience the new and unfamiliar.

Your environment sounds pretty safe and predictable. Have you thought about getting into some arenas that are new to you? When I was shopping for dalliances I would head for anywhere people are congregating and interacting. Dances, bars, festivals, music. The main thing is be somewhere you can feel somewhat safe and also be able to meet the opposite sex.

Post on Craig's List platonic section. At least you can meet people and I suspect if it's the opposite sex, there's a potential for something further. Simply meeting people with no expectation is a great way to ramp up to relationship. Also Internet dating.

The sex thing is probably the biggest bump in the road. You could shop around for a quick and easy sexual tryst. Go to a bar with a friend and pick someone up. Get a little drunk (just a little).

Try reading Camille Paglia. She's got some great material on sex, strangers and the challenges involved. My translation: we have powerful forces in our psyches pushing us to combine our DNA with strangers. It's dark, heady wine with the potential for disaster mixed with the joys of union.

Volunteer to help in some avenue where lots of males are. 99% of relationship is based on availability. Make yourself more available. Be places where there is less competition.

I read about one guy who basically interviewed women on short 15 minute 'dates' until he found 'the one'. I think he did hundreds or thousands of interviews and did indeed find the perfect match. Contrast this with most people's matchmaking process....go on a few dates, have sex with someone, get involved, settle down, figure out this isn't meeting your particular set of needs, break up, rinse repeat until some facsimile of compansionship shows up.

You'll find someone, have faith and it will all work out.
posted by diode at 11:18 AM on February 22 [3 favorites]

First off, it's perfectly fine to ask guys out; I've been doing it for 20+ years. (Well, not for the past four, since I've been in a relationship, but you get my drift.) Some guys said yes (and many of them commented at one point or the other that they liked being asked out), some said no, and either way the earth kept turning. (For the record, I met my current partner online.)

Anyway, I really wanted to address this:

And even if I went on a date, I wouldn't know what to do with myself!

One of the best insights about dating that I ever heard (can't remember if I read it somewhere or what) is that you should look at dating as an opportunity to practice being yourself. That's it. There's no real mystery to what to do with yourself except to be yourself. Ask questions about your date, answer his questions about yourself, and see if you enjoy yourself. Above all, don't try to be something you're not (e.g., you know he's into bebop, so you spend the night before the date trying to cram the History of Jazz), or take the responsibility for the "success" of the date (e.g. "I have to be totally sophisticated and cool, otherwise it will be a disaster.")

Following from this, the only criteria in judging the first few dates you have with someone: "did I enjoy myself?" That's it. You don't worry about parsing out whether he seems into you, or if you think he's your "type" (or trying to figure out whether you're his type), or how much your mother would love it (or not!) if you married this guy, or whether you shouldn't have told that goofy anecdote about that family vacation to the Grand Canyon when you were 6. Just: "did I enjoy myself?" Then proceed accordingly.

So let yourself off the hook! Keep it simple. If you know how to be yourself, then you know what to do on a date. You'll get there.
posted by scody at 12:11 PM on February 22 [5 favorites]

And about clearing the "not been kissed" thing: do you have an affectionate gay male as a friend? Ask them if you could kiss them, then do it. Ta-da - now you can't say you have "never been kissed"!

Hey, worked for me.

(said gay guy wasn't my first kiss by a longshot - I already have a pretty open-minded boyfriend. But he was hot. The funny thing was, the moment I found my boyfriend, I was suddenly 'kissable' - by EVERYBODY. Men, women, straight, gay, whatever! It's like a watershed, really.)
posted by divabat at 12:58 PM on February 22

Nthing the online dating. From what I've read, if you try it, prepare for an onslaught of nonsense, guys who ignore what you say in your post, etc., people way outside age/distance parameters, etc., but there will be some decent candidates in there.

Gotta disagree that smiling and eye contact is a sure-fire way to get results. I've two nephews, 18 and 21. Their 24-year-old sister relates that her friends think the nephews are at least okay-looking, far better in a good number of opinions.

Quick, funny story. Took the older one to a basketball game when he was 18. We sat in front of a couple 30-something (attractive) teacher women and they were having fun, some drinks, a little boisterous in a good way, at one point talking some basketball with my nephew. One teacher asked him his age. He told her. She said, "If you were a little older I would eat you up like candy."

Think of the reddest thing you have ever seen. His face was like that.

The guys are both in college, doing well, generally not: morons, excessive partiers, incapable of uttering a coherent sentence, devoid of interests outside of computer games... and for reasons that are unclear, clueless and gutless with women.

I met the older one for lunch, he was walking out of class, talking to a gal (who was cute by any reasonable standard), it looked like they were both enjoying the conversation. Nephew said she was cool, in one of his classes, they often talked before and after the class, she complimented him on his work, asked him for tips, sought him out to chat... and the guy wanted to ask her out for lunch or an ice cream, but he was kinda not sure and doubting she'd say yes.

If ever you've wanted to scream, "Wake up" to someone or done it, you know how I felt.

In the course of conversations, both nephews have related that they have no idea about all this, no aptitude whatsoever for picking up on clues.

Sure, they're not a statistically relevant sample, but a sense that there are others like them.

I say when in doubt, take your shot with asking 'em out. Assuming it doesn't include wolverine-like mauling, the thought applies to kissing them, too. Prospects are not insubstantial that they will be thrilled beyond words.
posted by ambient2 at 1:57 PM on February 22

I didn't get physical until after college either. A bunch of my female and male friends didn't either, or had/have had one partner for their entire "youth" (late teens through most of the 20s). Don't worry--I think all this hook up culture in media and online tends to make people think it's bizarre not to have a list of exes after college. But that's silly--there are tons of people that sounds a lot like you. Normal, just a little shy or unsure, that's all. The idea you have to have a million partners right out the gate before you're smart enough to find the right one is bunk. There's no correlation. Some of the women I know who brag the most about how many boyfriends they've had are still romantic train wrecks.

My approach, which is only one of many obviously, is to just be open to getting to know interesting people when I encounter them. I always start out as friends first. It's worked for me--and I've only had 2 real relationships, and I'm engaged to the second dude I ever really dated. The path to getting to a good relationship varies wildly. I wish this was more commonly understood, amid the plethora of chick dating books and romantic comedies. Sigh.
posted by ifjuly at 3:14 PM on February 22

There have been several questions like this on AskMe before.

I'll say it again: I'm 28 and a virgin. While I've had a boyfriend, I've never been kissed on the lips, only on the cheek.

Last time I was at my annual GYN appointment, I joked with her about the movie The 40-Year-Old Virgin being the story of my life. She said, "actually, it keeps you safe from a lot of diseases."

It's No Big Deal. Really, you may think you're some kind of freak (you said "every day that passes, it gets worse), but you're not, and everything is fine.
posted by IndigoRain at 7:34 PM on February 22 [1 favorite]

I'm a late bloomer as well - in fact, I think I was just your age when I had my first kiss. I was lucky enough that I had several friends who had as little experience as me at that point, so I didn't feel like a complete freak, but I totally get the anxiety and inferiority complex that comes from watching your friends hook up, or listening to them swap stories about having been sexually active/dating for years, when you haven't even started!

If you want the gorey details of how I got from point A to point B, you can me-mail me. The long and the short of it is - put yourself in situations where someone might approach you, such as parties and bars, or try to get yourself some time alone with people you find attractive. I think 9/10ths of these things is timing. And then - make it clear what you want. You can do it non-verbally - Ironmouth is absolutely spot on, do not underestimate the importance of eye contact and smiling. You may think you do it enough, but you don't! Or, if you think the guy is especially shy/clueless, just tell them what you'd like. The worst thing that happens is that they reject you, which sucks, but. Really? Is not the end of the world.

Eventually, once you get the hang of this, you're going to look back on all the times you totally missed the signals and could've hooked up with someone. I've had no less than three people tell me they had crushes on me in the years before I had my first kiss. I tell you this not to make you feel bad but to make it clear - you're not a freak, you're not even that unusual, and you're certainly not undesirable. Good luck!
posted by shaun uh at 8:51 PM on February 22

Ironmouth nails it. Absolutely fool-proof way to get a guy to ask you out. Decide who you want to go out with. Every single time you pass him, make eye contact and smile. You don't have to say anything. You don't have to stop and make conversation (I mean, you can but you don't have to). I absolutely guarantee that he will cave within a month or sooner. Careful with this, because like I said, it is completely foolproof (I have given this advice in the green before, and had MeMails telling me that it does in fact work). I have tested it in the field (um, back when I was single, lo these many years ago.)

I had a female friend express skepticism once. A month later she called back and said how amazed she was that it worked. It works.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:16 AM on February 23

Just remember that it's much better to be a late bloomer than one of those people who flame-out in high school and then spend the rest of their days looking back at when they were cool...

I hadn't kissed a girl until college and was awkward and shy as a child. I never considered myself to be part of the "cool crowd" back when it mattered.

But now I'm in my 30's and it just keeps getting better. I got over my shyness, turned that around into a great career where I routinely give presentations to rooms full of people. I learned to flirt and converse, got confidence from that, and parlayed that confidence into a wonderful relationship with a beautiful woman who agreed to be my wife.

Blooming late has definitely treated me well, and it probably will you too. Just dont' sweat it...
posted by Ashman at 9:00 AM on February 25

... Nephew said she was cool, in one of his classes, they often talked before and after the class, she complimented him on his work, asked him for tips, sought him out to chat... and the guy wanted to ask her out for lunch or an ice cream, but he was kinda not sure and doubting she'd say yes.

If ever you've wanted to scream, "Wake up" to someone or done it, you know how I felt...both nephews have related that they have no idea about all this, no aptitude whatsoever for picking up on clues.


I'm like this. I'm not sure why. I'm pretty good at other modes of interaction. Part of it, as others have mentioned, is that I'm extremely skeptical of the wisdom that suggests any/most women near my age cohort showing a personal interest in me or who appear to enjoy my company are hoping for/open to sexual advances. If two guys get into a habit of talking before or after class, collaborating on assignments and hanging out afterwards does that have to mean that they have the hots for each other, or might it be that they've forged a friendship? (You don't get to speculate as to their sexual orientation. The whole point is that people can have platonic friendships with members of the gender that they identify as a sexual object. )

Part of these conversations, it seems to me, involves changing standards of gender relations. Perhaps for the Boomer generation there was always a stronger question of sexual interest or at least sexual politics underlying their friendships with members of the opposite gender, as that generation was sort of collectively involved in trying to shift the ground and had to deal with where they started as much as where they were headed. But to me, today, viewing the world that way seems anachronistic at best and flatly misogynistic at worst.


I say when in doubt, take your shot with asking 'em out....Prospects are not insubstantial that they will be thrilled beyond words.

If you don't know how to do this success can seem impossibly unlikely. That's the problem with changing standards and evolving relations: we haven't yet settled on let alone optimized new practices to accommodate them. So we get a lot of infelicity by trying to graft the old courtship kabuki of sex and power onto a new configuration. At least, that's one of the problems.

I don't mean this to be pure chatfilter, either. Hopefully the OP can take some comfort that the shoe is on the other foot just as often (maybe more often?) and that it's not unreasonable to be confused in today's context. Widespread confusion exists on both sides of the equation, in fact, and is probably perpetuating the whole mess.

Be good to yourself, be open to people--I feel that when you don't know what else to do you can always do this, and it can't help but make you more attractive and increase your odds of meeting someone special. Simple, and not very dramatic, but true on a basic level.
posted by snuffleupagus at 9:28 AM on February 25

I think most gals who join peace corps are in a similar situation.

I personally do not advocate casual relations however - go ahead and flirt but be clear you want marriage first.
posted by peter_meta_kbd at 4:30 PM on April 12