Dating bilingual: how can we improve our communication?

January 6, 2009 12:21 PM

Bilingual/interlingual relationship filter: how do I not treat my S.O. condescendingly?

I've been in a relationship with him for a few months. I live in his country. He speaks good, but not great English and is in a grad program that involves writing in English. I read many simple words of his language, but only speak it on a very basic level. He often helps me with my language skills, especially pronunciation, and sometimes I ask him to only speak it to me so I can improve. But, often he corrects me even if I don't ask for it and it's a running joke how I'm not really able to pronounce his name correctly because my rolling-r skills are lame.

The problem is that he hasn't asked me to help him, so I'm not sure what's kosher or not. Also, I often find myself simplifying what I say to him to an extent that I know is unnecessary and even condescending. Other natives tell me that they wish native English-speakers would correct them, but I'm pretty uncomfortable with it. I tutor some natives in English writing, but my S.O. has never asked me for this and I've always thought maybe it was because he might be embarrassed or something. Yeah, I also am afraid that if I ask him about this, it will come across as condescending. Should I just dive in and correct? Are there more gentle methods I can use? Should I just let him speak the way he wants?

I don't know many others in similar relationships, so tips are appreciated!

posted by anonymous to human relations (22 comments total)

Ask him whether he generally wants correction or not, but ask it at a random moment - not when he has just made a mistake. Otherwise it sounds like asking permission to fix something he just did. I think you'll do ok if you say something like "I really appreciate the way you help me with <language>, but I'm not sure whether you want me to help you if you say something off in English. Should I mention those things to you?"
posted by vytae at 12:30 PM on January 6

In these (Non-S.O.) situations I always just correct people, in the most banal, non-berating way, and move on. Based on their response(s) you can usually pick up on whether they want to be corrected or not. I have found, in 99% of these situations, the non-English speaker is grateful, and encourages me to continue correcting them, even if it means interrupting.

If you think you come across as condescending, though, perhaps you might ease into it?
posted by mbatch at 12:31 PM on January 6

My husband's native language is German, his second language English (for me, it's the reverse). We do correct each other, but we're careful about it. We don't do it in fromt of other people or when what's being said is more important than whether or not it's being said correctly.
posted by Flipping_Hades_Terwilliger at 12:37 PM on January 6 [3 favorites]

I often find myself simplifying what I say to him to an extent that I know is unnecessary and even condescending.

I don't think it's condescending to simplify your English so that he understands it. It's better than not understanding you at all. It pays to remember, though, that people can understand much more than they can say, so don't pitch your vocab level to exactly the same as his - talk to him above his speaking level.

I wouldn't worry about correcting him too much, especially if he hasn't asked. I would correct the most obvious repeated mistakes though. No need for hyper-vigilance, but just a pointer or two as a girlfriend not a teacher.

In general I wouldn't worry about being condescending - in general people like help with their language. Just test it out: when he makes one of his same old mistakes, tell him the correct version and judge his reaction. Surely he'd be okay with it
posted by dydecker at 12:38 PM on January 6

This is a boundary that needs to be defined. Obviously your desire to correct him is derived from your desire for him to succeed with his English skills, as this will both advance his studies and also strengthen your relationship.

So you need to sit down and have a Talk about this subject. Tell him that you want to be available as a resource he can use to learn about English, but that you don't want to cross the line (by becoming overly simplistic, condescending, etc.), and so you need him to help you figure out exactly how far you should take that. Does he want you to edit your papers for him? Does he want you to speak English naturally, without simplifying anything? If so, does he want you to explain/simplify when he looks confused, or only when he requests clarification?

Its good you're worried that bringing this up with him might come across at condescending. That means you don't want to condescend him. The typical approach to these situations is the sugared plum...sweet on the outside, sour but digestible on the inside. Start by complementing him about his English skills/progress, but then suggest that you want him to realize his full potential as quickly as possible, and you think that taking a more active engagement in his language learning could be beneficial. Explain that you don't want to be condescending and that you're perfectly happy with the way things are, but that if you establish some good ground rules for these types of exchanges it can be a positive, fulfilling learning experience. Most importantly, if he is open to working this out, make it clear that he needs to indicate if he feels like he's being condescended to. This means you have to be receptive to hearing it. Accepting criticism from an SO is really difficult in any relationship, and language barriers don't make it any easier, but managing this is crucial to any relationship, and developing these structures will be beneficial to other areas of your relationship.

Now here's the hard part: if he says he likes things the way they are and doesn't want your help, or doesn't want that to be part of your relationship, you have to respect that and stick with it.

These conversations are never easy, but if you maintain a supportive attitude, positive outlook, and respectful tone, you can figure out how to proceed.
posted by baphomet at 12:41 PM on January 6

my biggest piece of advice is to never ever correct him, or have him correct you, in public.

if you make a major gaffe in front of other people - so what? dust yourself off, pick yourself up, and move on. if you do that, you'll get the respect for being brave enough to speak the language and trying to fit in - and if you do it once (say, use the word 'joke', when you mean 'appointment') you'll never EVER do it again.

it is tough for people in a bilingual relationship to not correct or hover. but even if it's tough for you in a group or at the bank, just ask him to let you get through it.

i'd offer the same advice about you towards him.
posted by micawber at 1:03 PM on January 6

Seconding vytae and micawber -- at some random moment, just ask him in a "for the record, what would you rather I do?" sense, and see what he prefers. But unless he specifically says it's okay, I'd also avoid a big call-out in public ("Dude, it's pronounced 'po-TAY-to', not 'po-TAH-to'! Hey, you hear what he said, everyone?") because that could be embarrassing (even if he has asked you for help).
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:07 PM on January 6 [1 favorite]

This is a great question -- as the husband of a non-native English speaker (English would be her third or fourth language, after Armenian, Swiss, and high German), I sympathize. My wife is always open to my correcting her, and she asks questions frequently, but still I find myself getting a little condescending every now and then, even as open as she is to being corrected. Early in our relationship, I didn't correct her unless she asked for it; I'd suggest you do the same and wait for his prompting. Don't bother simplifying your own English, though. I agree with Flipping_Hades that it's not something to do around others unless requested.
posted by incessant at 1:08 PM on January 6

my biggest piece of advice is to never ever correct him, or have him correct you, in public.

ABSOLUTELY, though I'd extend "in public" to "in front of anyone else".

Correct him, but then tell him you find his mispronunciation adorable. Then fuck his brains out.
posted by mkultra at 1:24 PM on January 6 [1 favorite]

This is an interesting and complicated question.

I think your boyfriend would appreciate it if you spoke English at normal speed, although it may be frustrating for you if you're trying to get across more difficult concepts.

I didn't (and still don't) like it when Japanese people dumbed down their speech because of my perceived Japanese ability. Learning Japanese, if I didn't understand something, I tended to say so.

I also was strategic in terms of how I approached learning Japanese. If there was a phrase or word I didn't understand, I took note of it. This is something your boyfriend should be doing.
posted by KokuRyu at 1:29 PM on January 6

My SO corrects my English once in a while, during conversation (never in front of other people I think), though he probably does it more than I realise. It's usually just flowing with the conversation, not making a big deal of how to correctly speak English. Quite often, it's because I say something and he doesn't understand and asks me to repeat; I then tend to try different ways of pronouncing those words and ultimately spell it out if we don't manage communication by then (ooooh, you meant that!).

If you are concerned about mispronunciation, by all means correct him (just repeating in a quizzical way the faulty word with the wrong pronunciation does work), he'll probably appreciate it.

If however you are concerned about his grammar, the best thing you can do for him is to really speak naturally in front of him, not simplifying what you say. He will pick up more by hearing you than by you correcting him. Encourage him to read in English too if he doesn't already. You can also suggest reading over an assignment of his before he hands it in, from experience I don't ask often because I consider it a tedious and boring job for my SO to do. If you do so, you can then point out some recurring problem if there is any, or start a discussion on why it's better to say such and such rather than thingy thing.

Also, other people are right to say he knows (and understands) a lot more of the English language than the one he uses. But if you have been really dumbing down your English for him, you might want to slowly rise the level of what you say.

I think any help will be appreciated as long as you a) don't halt the conversation to start teaching the proper way to speak English and b) don't pick up on everything he messes up.
posted by tweemy at 3:18 PM on January 6

I agree with those who say don't correct him unless he asks you to, especially if you're in public.

It's important to remember that you're both communicating mainly in your language even though you're in his country. From experience I can say that your boyfriend would probably appreciate it more if you made a significant effort to learn his language than if you tried to improve his English....I don't mean this in a snarky way and you're probably working on your local language skills already, but if you aren't and you plan to stay in his country it's really worth the effort.
posted by juva at 3:20 PM on January 6

Well first off, I agree with the others that you should, in some random moment have a short discussion about what he wants help with or not. Also, you could start out maybe by having that conversation for your langauge skills rather than his (tell him you like how he randomly corrects you, or mention a blooper you said or something to start thigns off).

Anyway, since your question kinda revolves around what to do if you don't have this convo (or maybe you do and it comes out ambiguous, etc)... heres my two cents..

--Never correct him during a fight or angry/frustrated moment. It doesnt matter how bad he screws up or if he even says remotely what he means, don't correct. Instead, clarify. Do rephrase or ask follow up questions though if it matters for you to understand what he feels especially if its a fight between the two of you.
--Dont correct him in front of others unless perhaps necessary to help him get a point across. (because, really sometimes your lack of help when you should give it could be frustrating if he's trying to explain something to someone and saying the wrong word and they don't get it, he'd probably much rather you remind him than let their convo go on in confusion)
--When you do correct him, do so lightheartedly
--When you correct him...let him decide whether he wants an explanation/debate/clarification or to just leave it as "oh."
--Take note of when your corrections seem to bug him and try not to do it in that form/time.
--Almost always correct any mistake that would be really important or save him embarrassment (for instance, accidentally saying a swear word instead of a similar word)

--Try to spend some time extra conscious during a few conversations to find a happy medium between his understanding and your language level. Even if you have to speak easier for him, try to make it sound natural.

He may be at a level where he is kind of struggling and isnt ready to accept corrections, like he's already thinking too hard to focus on being picky about it. (for instance, maybe he'd rather put his effort into begin able to use the past tense rather than get all his prepositions in place)
Make communication between you two as a couple come first always. See how he takes it when you do a couple larger corrections and eventually get that suggested convo in... good luck

p.s. i feel your pain, i'm a couple years in without being able to correctly say my SOs name. in my opinion its a very subtle difference but in everyone elses opinion, well...they say "who?"
posted by nzydarkxj at 3:32 PM on January 6 [1 favorite]

beautiful question...

my beloved who speaks korean first and a pretty scatalogical version of present tense english second and i go through this daily. she says crazy shit with great confidence, i laugh hysterically and sometimes correct her. other times i hug her madly and declare her a poet first class.

my wee point: given that this is your S.O. i assume you are building a very sweet emotional environment for him. hopefully it's reciprocal. that being the case you can guess at the rules and know that they will always be flexible. anything done with a smile and true affection goes down easier than the stern school teacher crap.

can i have brownie points for this answer? viele gluck!
posted by artof.mulata at 4:53 PM on January 6 [1 favorite]

I'd ask if he wants help, but then be willing to BACK OFF if you get the feeling it's unwelcome.

Every once in awhile it completely infuriates me with Mr. 26.2 corrects my Spanish. If you get the sense that this is not a good time to offer corrections, then just stay silent.
posted by 26.2 at 6:26 PM on January 6

My cousin's wife is not a native english speaker. He corrects her all the time. It's not condescending. She smiles, corrects herself, and keeps going.
posted by salvia at 11:08 PM on January 6

Be sure not to only point out errors under certain circumstance, i.e. when already annoyed.
Don't belabour the point if they just go "oh, ok" or "oh, that's right", sometimes just a reminder is enough already. Live with the fact that some stuff just ain't going to change, certain phrases or misspronunciations might be there for good, because hey, who cares :)
posted by Iteki at 3:48 AM on January 7

I found nzydarkxj's comments very insightful. Indeed, most of the comments on this thread are excellent. The only thing I can add is that if you are considering taking the relationship "to another level" whatever that means in your context, that you consider whether this question is important to you. If it's not a vital question for you, just icing on the cake, that's ok and you don't even have to bring it up. If it is important, you can say that you've found that you are fixated for good or bad on making his English excellent because you want to be able to communicate about nuances; or because you don't want to appear to be dating a foreigner (whatever your reasons are) and somehow ask if its ok whether he can be your project. If it's not ok, you should know that before agreeing to take it to another level.
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I say that because as I think we all understand and don't need to say what appears to be a question of language is just the context in which underlying relationship and personality issues arise.
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On a personal note, my wife is still learning English and I'll share the thing that is most difficult for me. When I correct her tenses, she does great. But when I try to correct her pronunciation of the A I and E, she seems intent on not learning it as a matter of principle (this week, the word is YEAST. It's come up three times, and always she says, "Yist.") Which brings up another point - those of us who are "natural correctors" may tend to reinforce in our own mind it the somewhat silly idea that it matters in some important sense whether a person's pronunciation is perfect.
posted by peter_meta_kbd at 4:11 AM on January 7

I find the gentlest way to correct (and be corrected) is to just parrot things back correctly. For example:

'Yesterday, I went in the movies...'
'Oh, you went to the movies?'
'Yeah, i went to the movies and....blah blah blah'.

It doesn't disrupt the flow of the conversation, and you're not stopping and correcting which can be more condescending. It doesn't work for all types of mistakes, but your boyfriend will pick up that you're saying something a little differently and learn from that, without it being a 'teacher-student' moment, and it doesn't really sound any different than just having a regular conversation.
posted by Emilyisnow at 4:40 AM on January 7

I would avoid explaining why something is wrong and just do as Emilyisnow says, by parroting the correct pronunciation or correct tense. Your SO probably knows the rules and just forgets.
posted by Gor-ella at 7:47 AM on January 7

I'm an ESL teacher. Live error correction is not as useful as pedagogically untrained native speakers or language learners tend to think it is, so don't stress about it. (People may indeed briefly parrot the correction, but they generally forget it a split-second later, so generally all you've done is wasted a few seconds of time and set yourself up for some frustration later when they repeat the same mistake.) You can ask him if he wants to be corrected, of course, but what you two decide will be more about your relationship than about his language skills.

IF you and he really want to work on corrections, do not focus on individual errors in live conversations. I know it's hard to resist (so hard!), but most modern research indicates it's far more effective to focus on patterns. Quietly keep track of repeated error types--important ones that really interfere with the listener's comprehension, not nitpicks--and let him know about those later. Only bring up one or two error patterns at a time, preferably related ones, and make sure he has some kind of good resource (a good textbook or website) where he can find practice and examples in context (this is really important--a sign of a bad ESL book is one that has isolated, disconnected practice and example sentences with no surrounding context). Give him plenty of time before you bring up another one.

However ... a globetrotting professor I had during graduate school said that she always cautioned couples in relationships like yours to watch out for "role conflict": trying to be teacher-student can get in the way of being partner-partner. It works for some couples, definitely, but it doesn't work for others. If your helping him or his helping you causes conflict in your relationship, back off and work on your second languages individually. As long as you're both trying, particularly if you're doing anything like extensive reading on your own, you'll both get better with time even if you both speak freely and incorrectly for now.

Good luck!

(and @ peter_meta_kbd -- heh, pronunciation is very difficult to change, especially in adults. Hearing the difference can actually be the hardest thing; she may not even be able to hear that she's saying it incorrectly.)
posted by wintersweet at 4:16 PM on January 7

Ah, I think I left out something important: Without knowing him personally, yes, I think you should ask him outright. I don't think it would be condescending. I would just say something like, "Hey, I noticed that you frequently correct my YourLanguage. Your English is a lot better than my YourLanguage, of course, but does that mean you want me to correct YourLanguage when you make mistakes?" If he says yes, then I would bring up the idea of the pattern method I mentioned above. If he says no, then I'd let it drop. (And you can bring up however you feel about his correction of your speaking, or ask him to use the pattern thing with you--it really is a lot more effective.)
posted by wintersweet at 5:26 PM on January 7