Kids + Snow = Fun. Help Us Keep It That Way!
December 12, 2008 3:22 PM Subscribe
We're going to be introducing our nearly-4-year-old son to the joys of snowshoeing, igloo-building and possibly even snow-camping this season. Help us not screw it up for him!
We want our son to have a joyful, happy introduction to "serious" snow-play this winter. In particular, we want to avoid letting our preconceptions turn it into some hellish forced-march kind of nightmare for him. So we're turning to you, MeFites who run around with their kids in the snow!
Our background: experienced outdoorspeople with extensive two-adult, four-season backpacking/camping/hiking resumes in the Western US, particularly the Sierras. Both of us have the body of knowledge to safely snowshoe and/or camp in winter conditions, and both of us have enough safety and wilderness medical training to, if necessary, protect and evacuate an injured hiker.
Our son's experience: flat hiking up to two miles with a very light load (his Diego backpack with a water bottle, snacks and a windbreaker), car camping both at sea level and elevation, and scramble-hiking on trails in various national parks and places like Sandia Mountain in New Mexico.
We want him to, above all, have fun. We'd also like to give him the experience of snowshoeing into a place with just what we're carrying, and making a camp in the snow, complete with building an igloo. So here's our list of questions:
What should we shoot for, given his age?
How should we expect him to react to this?
What do kids this age REALLY like to do in the snow?
From those of you who've done this: what are your tips and tricks?
Thanks in advance!
We want our son to have a joyful, happy introduction to "serious" snow-play this winter. In particular, we want to avoid letting our preconceptions turn it into some hellish forced-march kind of nightmare for him. So we're turning to you, MeFites who run around with their kids in the snow!
Our background: experienced outdoorspeople with extensive two-adult, four-season backpacking/camping/hiking resumes in the Western US, particularly the Sierras. Both of us have the body of knowledge to safely snowshoe and/or camp in winter conditions, and both of us have enough safety and wilderness medical training to, if necessary, protect and evacuate an injured hiker.
Our son's experience: flat hiking up to two miles with a very light load (his Diego backpack with a water bottle, snacks and a windbreaker), car camping both at sea level and elevation, and scramble-hiking on trails in various national parks and places like Sandia Mountain in New Mexico.
We want him to, above all, have fun. We'd also like to give him the experience of snowshoeing into a place with just what we're carrying, and making a camp in the snow, complete with building an igloo. So here's our list of questions:
What should we shoot for, given his age?
How should we expect him to react to this?
What do kids this age REALLY like to do in the snow?
From those of you who've done this: what are your tips and tricks?
Thanks in advance!
Best answer: It seems like hiking and camping in the snow (what you call "serious snow play") could be a bit much for a not-yet-four year old.
What about just building a snowman? That seems more a four year old's speed.
posted by jayder at 3:36 PM on December 12, 2008 [2 favorites]
What about just building a snowman? That seems more a four year old's speed.
posted by jayder at 3:36 PM on December 12, 2008 [2 favorites]
Best answer: I have experience camping with kids, but not in the snow. Fall back plans are vital, but I don't know what exactly applies to snow camping. Perhaps plan to reach the planned campsite fairly early and see how much of it you can set up, and if he's really not into it head back to the vehicle for an experience he's more used to (or bring along a tent to the site). Then the next day you can head back out and finish the campsite and get him really used to it and ready to spend the night there.
If you have plenty of time you could practice building an igloo several times until he is comfortable with the general idea of it. While building it he is going to get a general idea that parts of it could collapse. You want to get him to trust in you, as he did during your other camping experiences, that the igloo will be safe and warm.
posted by Science! at 3:41 PM on December 12, 2008
If you have plenty of time you could practice building an igloo several times until he is comfortable with the general idea of it. While building it he is going to get a general idea that parts of it could collapse. You want to get him to trust in you, as he did during your other camping experiences, that the igloo will be safe and warm.
posted by Science! at 3:41 PM on December 12, 2008
Best answer: As I recall from those long-ago days, kids get cold easily and quickly, then the fun is over.
Also, hiking in snow is terrible and difficult for a grown person. A kid will get over the fun part of that in about 30 feet.
If I were doing this, I'd have lots of warming up capabilities (with backups), camp near the car and plan all activities around the campsite.
Or, just make a day of it and let the kids sleep in a warm bed at home. Remember, you want him to enjoy this so he'll be excited for the next time.
posted by trinity8-director at 3:53 PM on December 12, 2008 [1 favorite]
Also, hiking in snow is terrible and difficult for a grown person. A kid will get over the fun part of that in about 30 feet.
If I were doing this, I'd have lots of warming up capabilities (with backups), camp near the car and plan all activities around the campsite.
Or, just make a day of it and let the kids sleep in a warm bed at home. Remember, you want him to enjoy this so he'll be excited for the next time.
posted by trinity8-director at 3:53 PM on December 12, 2008 [1 favorite]
It seems like hiking and camping in the snow (what you call "serious snow play") could be a bit much for a not-yet-four year old.
Seems to me it would be better to initiate him now- he'll never know any different, as long as he's warm!
posted by sunshinesky at 4:14 PM on December 12, 2008
Seems to me it would be better to initiate him now- he'll never know any different, as long as he's warm!
posted by sunshinesky at 4:14 PM on December 12, 2008
Best answer: Maybe your first trip ought to be to one of the Snow Parks in the Sierra? There are at least two on 50 headed towards Tahoe.
The prime benefits would be snow play (Sledding! Snowman building! Short snowshoe treks, just to test the waters!) and close access to your car, should a getaway become necessary.
And I'm going to mefimail you for your favorite snowshoeing spots, 'cause I want to go, and I'm over 4, so I can go if I damn well want to.</small?
posted by mudpuppie at 4:28 PM on December 12, 2008
The prime benefits would be snow play (Sledding! Snowman building! Short snowshoe treks, just to test the waters!) and close access to your car, should a getaway become necessary.
And I'm going to mefimail you for your favorite snowshoeing spots, 'cause I want to go, and I'm over 4, so I can go if I damn well want to.</small?
posted by mudpuppie at 4:28 PM on December 12, 2008
Best answer: I found an excellent method for making igloos that I've been wanting to try. You need some inflatable inner tubes to make it, but if you have the supplies, it's supposed to just take 1 1/2 to make. The website is no longer up, but the instructions are here and the
Do you have enough of a yard that you could make this? And then you could see how comfortable it is for a few hours before deciding if you could do it overnight?
I've got a five-year old who would probably stay outside from sun-up to sun-down if I didn't stop him. He never notices when he's cold or wet, so make sure you're hyper-vigilant about the temperature and exposure.
posted by saffry at 5:22 PM on December 12, 2008 [1 favorite]
Do you have enough of a yard that you could make this? And then you could see how comfortable it is for a few hours before deciding if you could do it overnight?
I've got a five-year old who would probably stay outside from sun-up to sun-down if I didn't stop him. He never notices when he's cold or wet, so make sure you're hyper-vigilant about the temperature and exposure.
posted by saffry at 5:22 PM on December 12, 2008 [1 favorite]
Best answer: We are planning a trip up to Tahoe over the Christmas break with our 4 1/2 year old and 2 1/2 year old. I am an experienced camper, hiker, backpacker and winter camper. There's just no way I'd even try something like what you're considering but then, I've got two kids to consider and my wife.
As for building an igloo, you don't have to be deep in the wilderness to do it and you don't even need deep snow. I've dug out numerous digloos over my years before I realized I didn't have to deal with winter and moved to Santa Cruz. It takes a while to make a big enough pile of snow to dig into and clear out which makes it important to have a cabin space to retreat to.
But there is nothing more awesome than sleeping in a snow shelter of your own making. Just make sure to put a couple of breathing holes in it and listen to him. When he starts to make noises like it isn't fun anymore, don't push it. Let him go warm up and get his batteries recharged and he'll want to do more.
Have fun!
posted by fenriq at 11:23 PM on December 12, 2008
As for building an igloo, you don't have to be deep in the wilderness to do it and you don't even need deep snow. I've dug out numerous digloos over my years before I realized I didn't have to deal with winter and moved to Santa Cruz. It takes a while to make a big enough pile of snow to dig into and clear out which makes it important to have a cabin space to retreat to.
But there is nothing more awesome than sleeping in a snow shelter of your own making. Just make sure to put a couple of breathing holes in it and listen to him. When he starts to make noises like it isn't fun anymore, don't push it. Let him go warm up and get his batteries recharged and he'll want to do more.
Have fun!
posted by fenriq at 11:23 PM on December 12, 2008
One of the good things about snowshoeing/x-country skiing versus dry hiking when considering winter camping is the ability to use a sled that attaches to your waist to carry the weight of the gear. My thought here is that if he does get tired, and the sled is lightly packed, he could sit on it, either the rest of the way to the intended destination or back to the car.
posted by hungrysquirrels at 5:32 AM on December 13, 2008
posted by hungrysquirrels at 5:32 AM on December 13, 2008
Response by poster: Thanks for all the excellent answers!
Based on what we're reading, snow camping is RIGHT OUT. We're really liking the "cabin above the snow-line" idea that jamaro suggested and fenriq reinforced, but please keep the ideas coming: this has all been tremendously helpful.
posted by scrump at 7:31 AM on December 13, 2008
Based on what we're reading, snow camping is RIGHT OUT. We're really liking the "cabin above the snow-line" idea that jamaro suggested and fenriq reinforced, but please keep the ideas coming: this has all been tremendously helpful.
posted by scrump at 7:31 AM on December 13, 2008
Skiing man. Start them skiing young - I'm an expert skier but I still wish my folks had started me at a younger age (I think I started around 6 or 7). All I remember was a terrible first day with dad trying to teach me - it was cold and snowing and dad's yelling at me and what the hell are these things on my feet and why am I trying to stand on them and I hate my life. Then day 2 they put me in lessons with some awesome pretty young thing who showed me why skiing is the best thing in the world (make your pizza slice!), and by the end of that day when mom and dad picked me up I made them wait while I climbed back up 300 or so feet of slope in a blizzard so I could show them how I was now a skier.
Put a brain bucket on his noggin and some sticks on his feet and get him a lesson. Pretty soon he'll be riding with you guys.
posted by allkindsoftime at 7:35 AM on December 13, 2008
Put a brain bucket on his noggin and some sticks on his feet and get him a lesson. Pretty soon he'll be riding with you guys.
posted by allkindsoftime at 7:35 AM on December 13, 2008
Response by poster:
I think ski/board lessons is on the list for when he hits 5 or so: maybe a family holiday somewhere like Whistler. Not just yet, though.
posted by scrump at 7:47 AM on December 13, 2008
Put a brain bucket on his noggin and some sticks on his feet and get him a lesson. Pretty soon he'll be riding with you guys.This is an awesome idea, but it'd have to apply to all three of us: neither of us have skied since we were in grade school.
I think ski/board lessons is on the list for when he hits 5 or so: maybe a family holiday somewhere like Whistler. Not just yet, though.
posted by scrump at 7:47 AM on December 13, 2008
Best answer: You know, as a snowboarder, if I had a kid I would get them on skis asap. When they're little and stubby they don't even think twice about it- years ago, I spent a lot of time as a beginning snowboarder at the bottom of the beginner lift at Blackcomb, and those little kids in the preschool lessons were fearless. I'd do skiing rather than snowboarding, too: you have a lot more control over stopping and slowing as a beginner skier. I taught preschool gymnastics for years, and 3-4 year olds can learn amazingly fast, and seem to be generally of a development level where the things they learn really stick with them. So if you change your mind, Northstar-at-Tahoe has a toddler/parents ski lesson for 3-4 year olds and their parents (Northstar or Sierra would be my choice for tubing, as well).
I agree with folks saying get a cabin where you can do all the hiking and igloo building you want, but when he gets tired or bored, you can head back in. You may find yourself sleeping in the igloo anyway, and then you know he's ready for something more next time.
posted by oneirodynia at 3:42 PM on December 13, 2008
I agree with folks saying get a cabin where you can do all the hiking and igloo building you want, but when he gets tired or bored, you can head back in. You may find yourself sleeping in the igloo anyway, and then you know he's ready for something more next time.
posted by oneirodynia at 3:42 PM on December 13, 2008
Best answer: Will you stay with snow outside the windows? If so - get tealights (bigger ones at Ikea are great) and start making snowballs!
Now, make a circle with the balls and put another row of balls on top, but a smaller row, your goal is a small cone (or pyramid) shape with snowballs stacked on each other. There should be gaps between balls to allow light to seep through but not huge ones if it's windy.
Stick a lit tea light in the middle, put the last single ball on top to close your little pyramid, and go inside to enjoy a cup of cocoa. Let kiddie look out the window to the dark falling and see his beautiful snow lantern. (Google image search to the Swedish word "snölykta" to show what they look like). They leave quite an impression the first time you see them as a kid (speaking from experience).
posted by dabitch at 3:27 PM on December 14, 2008 [2 favorites]
Now, make a circle with the balls and put another row of balls on top, but a smaller row, your goal is a small cone (or pyramid) shape with snowballs stacked on each other. There should be gaps between balls to allow light to seep through but not huge ones if it's windy.
Stick a lit tea light in the middle, put the last single ball on top to close your little pyramid, and go inside to enjoy a cup of cocoa. Let kiddie look out the window to the dark falling and see his beautiful snow lantern. (Google image search to the Swedish word "snölykta" to show what they look like). They leave quite an impression the first time you see them as a kid (speaking from experience).
posted by dabitch at 3:27 PM on December 14, 2008 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Also having been four where the was plenty of snow - the really likes were
1) sleigh, just being it it when parents were pulling and going down small hills. WEE!
2) angels. I have no idea why making angels in snow as so much fun but there ya go. Angels all around.
3) name the animal pawprint/hoofprint in the snow. Early fascination with me. Taking a walk back of the house was sufficient for this adventure.
I didn't build igloos until I was around six or seven, but then we're talking large ones that took several days to build. I did not ski until around six (might have served me better to start that earlier as some people here say) and I did not skate until 5.
My daughter just turned three and was so much better standing on her skates the first time than I was. She's got her feet firmly planted, while I wobbled quite a bit.
posted by dabitch at 3:38 PM on December 14, 2008
1) sleigh, just being it it when parents were pulling and going down small hills. WEE!
2) angels. I have no idea why making angels in snow as so much fun but there ya go. Angels all around.
3) name the animal pawprint/hoofprint in the snow. Early fascination with me. Taking a walk back of the house was sufficient for this adventure.
I didn't build igloos until I was around six or seven, but then we're talking large ones that took several days to build. I did not ski until around six (might have served me better to start that earlier as some people here say) and I did not skate until 5.
My daughter just turned three and was so much better standing on her skates the first time than I was. She's got her feet firmly planted, while I wobbled quite a bit.
posted by dabitch at 3:38 PM on December 14, 2008
Response by poster: Well, we now have some excellent, low-key plans, thanks to all of you. You helped us ramp way back, and we stand a much better chance of FUN versus CRAZY.
posted by scrump at 10:12 AM on December 22, 2008
posted by scrump at 10:12 AM on December 22, 2008
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Ultimately, to make sure it's fun for him, you should be ready to take your cues from him. This means you're willing to give up something you really want to do, if he hates it. Based on what he's done so far, if he's warm enough and you have enough different tricks up your sleeve, something will work. Just throw stuff at the wall and see what sticks.
posted by winston at 3:34 PM on December 12, 2008 [2 favorites]