How to stay true?
December 3, 2008 12:38 PM Subscribe
From "just friends" to "more than friends"; and tips for staying true in a monogamous relationship?
I recently (as of a month ago) started dating my best friend. He had been very much in love with me for a long time, and I was always adamant that I would *never* see him that way.
Somehow, praise Jebus, something clicked and changed inside my head and I saw that I absolutely could see him that way. I have very narrow criteria for a life partner (things like must be vegan, choice of religion, etc. ) and he has always fit all of these things perfectly. Add to that he's been my best friend for years and we spend so much time together having fun, and he's adorable, and I don't know what took me so long.
Its weird adjusting to boyfriend/girlfriend after so long of "just friends", but its going well overall. Even though he's objectively very handsome, my feelings of physical attraction to him are slowly but steadily building, which is fine by me, and he's being very patient. It's certainly a change from the instant chemistry of other relationships I've had, but it feels permanent.
If I mess this up, I cannot fathom how I could ever again find a guy so perfectly matched to me and also as in love with me and devoted to me as he is.
Still there is a small part of me that at times feels very restless and trapped. Its a very small part of my lizard brain that I'm determined to ignore, and the impulses I would act on if i gave in, I know would lead down a miserable road.
In fact, the only time I ever remember being utterly free of these impulses, I was in a really bad relationship with a man who was a a total asshole who made a point of letting me know how I would never measure up to his ex girlfriend and he was not in love with me. I was so insanely infatuated with him and so caught up in the thrill of the chase/drama, that I didn't have a spare moment to let my mind wander to other guys.
So the question is, now that I'm in a relationship that's perfectly healthy and wonderful and what I want to be in for the rest of my life, how can I reduce my random pangs for what I know I really don't want?
I'm looking for mental exercises, behavior modifying techniques, or just personal anecdotes from people in monogamous relationships on how you make yourself more fully committed.
Three disclaimers:
1)I'm can't afford therapy, and there really isn't much in the way of free services I have access to.
2)I think polyamory is way rad for some people, more power to them, but it's not for me.
3)I've never cheated on anyone in the past, nor do I ever plan to. I just want help on avoiding impulses to stray or at least lessening them.
I recently (as of a month ago) started dating my best friend. He had been very much in love with me for a long time, and I was always adamant that I would *never* see him that way.
Somehow, praise Jebus, something clicked and changed inside my head and I saw that I absolutely could see him that way. I have very narrow criteria for a life partner (things like must be vegan, choice of religion, etc. ) and he has always fit all of these things perfectly. Add to that he's been my best friend for years and we spend so much time together having fun, and he's adorable, and I don't know what took me so long.
Its weird adjusting to boyfriend/girlfriend after so long of "just friends", but its going well overall. Even though he's objectively very handsome, my feelings of physical attraction to him are slowly but steadily building, which is fine by me, and he's being very patient. It's certainly a change from the instant chemistry of other relationships I've had, but it feels permanent.
If I mess this up, I cannot fathom how I could ever again find a guy so perfectly matched to me and also as in love with me and devoted to me as he is.
Still there is a small part of me that at times feels very restless and trapped. Its a very small part of my lizard brain that I'm determined to ignore, and the impulses I would act on if i gave in, I know would lead down a miserable road.
In fact, the only time I ever remember being utterly free of these impulses, I was in a really bad relationship with a man who was a a total asshole who made a point of letting me know how I would never measure up to his ex girlfriend and he was not in love with me. I was so insanely infatuated with him and so caught up in the thrill of the chase/drama, that I didn't have a spare moment to let my mind wander to other guys.
So the question is, now that I'm in a relationship that's perfectly healthy and wonderful and what I want to be in for the rest of my life, how can I reduce my random pangs for what I know I really don't want?
I'm looking for mental exercises, behavior modifying techniques, or just personal anecdotes from people in monogamous relationships on how you make yourself more fully committed.
Three disclaimers:
1)I'm can't afford therapy, and there really isn't much in the way of free services I have access to.
2)I think polyamory is way rad for some people, more power to them, but it's not for me.
3)I've never cheated on anyone in the past, nor do I ever plan to. I just want help on avoiding impulses to stray or at least lessening them.
Or, maybe, to trick your body into telling your brain that you're pregnant; can you try birth-control pills?
posted by nicwolff at 1:15 PM on December 3, 2008 [2 favorites]
posted by nicwolff at 1:15 PM on December 3, 2008 [2 favorites]
When we enter into monogamous relationships, we do so because we recognize that the safety and stability of the relationship is more advantageous and beneficial within the framework of our lives than engaging in multiple sexual relationships that are less emotionally relevant and/or secure.
The mental exercise you should engage in is reminding yourself that you made a choice for good reasons and that undermining the choice is not worth the fleeting satisfaction of fulfilling a primal curiosity.
It's will-power, plain and simple. When we see a man/woman/cupcake/pair of shoes/etc that we want but know we can't bear the cost of having, we have to replace the potential satisfaction we're forsaking with a satisfaction in the choices we've made and the benefits we've enjoyed. The next time your brain wants to get frisky with someone new, spend a few minutes enjoying your imagination and then remind yourself that your stable, long-term relationship pays dividends on the care you give it, and be happy with everything it has and can still bring you.
posted by chudmonkey at 1:15 PM on December 3, 2008 [8 favorites]
The mental exercise you should engage in is reminding yourself that you made a choice for good reasons and that undermining the choice is not worth the fleeting satisfaction of fulfilling a primal curiosity.
It's will-power, plain and simple. When we see a man/woman/cupcake/pair of shoes/etc that we want but know we can't bear the cost of having, we have to replace the potential satisfaction we're forsaking with a satisfaction in the choices we've made and the benefits we've enjoyed. The next time your brain wants to get frisky with someone new, spend a few minutes enjoying your imagination and then remind yourself that your stable, long-term relationship pays dividends on the care you give it, and be happy with everything it has and can still bring you.
posted by chudmonkey at 1:15 PM on December 3, 2008 [8 favorites]
The only way to make it stop is to get pregnant.
posted by nicwolff at 3:13 PM on December 3 [+] [!]
WHAT WHAT WHAT?!
Having a child to try and 'fix' a relationship is a HORRIBLE idea.
posted by WinnipegDragon at 1:20 PM on December 3, 2008 [2 favorites]
posted by nicwolff at 3:13 PM on December 3 [+] [!]
WHAT WHAT WHAT?!
Having a child to try and 'fix' a relationship is a HORRIBLE idea.
posted by WinnipegDragon at 1:20 PM on December 3, 2008 [2 favorites]
1.) It takes time and eventually goes away by growing and maturing in your new relationship.
or
2.) It never really goes away, those pangs for crazy drama, but you learn to live with them and they disappear into the background.
2a.)Meditation technique for achieving this:
Lie or sit somewhere quiet, make sure you're relaxed and let the thoughts run free in your head, but envision them as, say 3D squares, which you objectively look at, acknowledge that they are there, then push aside and move on to the next thought and do the same. This trains your psyche to not be afraid of whatever thoughts are in your head and more importantly, not be consumed by them. They're just idle things that pop into your head at times and you don't have to listen to or follow everyone of them.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 1:21 PM on December 3, 2008 [3 favorites]
or
2.) It never really goes away, those pangs for crazy drama, but you learn to live with them and they disappear into the background.
2a.)Meditation technique for achieving this:
Lie or sit somewhere quiet, make sure you're relaxed and let the thoughts run free in your head, but envision them as, say 3D squares, which you objectively look at, acknowledge that they are there, then push aside and move on to the next thought and do the same. This trains your psyche to not be afraid of whatever thoughts are in your head and more importantly, not be consumed by them. They're just idle things that pop into your head at times and you don't have to listen to or follow everyone of them.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 1:21 PM on December 3, 2008 [3 favorites]
recently (as of a month ago) started dating my best friend. He had been very much in love with me for a long time, and I was always adamant that I would *never* see him that way.
Somehow, praise Jebus, something clicked and changed inside my head and I saw that I absolutely could see him that way.
Ruh-roh, there' goes the whole ladder theory. Looks like 1/3 of the answers to relationshipfilter are done. Now, if we can just get rid of the auto DTMFA answers, we'd stick with the 1/3 that actually help.
I've never cheated on anyone in the past, nor do I ever plan to. I just want help on avoiding impulses to stray or at least lessening them.
I think you need to trust yourself. You have everything you need to stay faithful. There's nothing wrong with feeling attracted to other people. Its normal. I remember the first time it happened while I was in a serious relationship, I freaked out, but I got through it. You can too. Usually when you get in trouble is when other stuff is stressing you out and your mind seeks drama for distraction. Be aware of what's going on in your head and around you and you'll be fine. Avoid alcohol in situations where you are feeling attraction from others. Often people turn to it to deal with the feelings they do have. Usually the source of big mistakes.
Your lizard brain wants you to have sex with men it thinks would be better genetic mates than the one your hyper-evolved human mind has decided is the one for you. The only way to make it stop is to get pregnant.
I'd stay away from this explanation. These sort of easy explanations are momentarily helpful to those who want an easy answer to explain their heartbreak, but usually lead you away from the real issues that are a problem. Frankly, when people are attracted to people who are hurting them, its because they are trying to "fix" their feelings about a past issue that they have never dealt with and they keep going back to the same thing.
Finally, one way to avoid cheating is to be honest with yourself. If, down the road, things die out, don't wait until something bad happens, give a guy a break by breaking up with him if it isn't working out. That's the honest and fair way of doing it.
I'd bet your fears of cheating mask something deeper--a fear that this relationship might work out. Explore those feelings.
posted by Ironmouth at 1:35 PM on December 3, 2008 [4 favorites]
Somehow, praise Jebus, something clicked and changed inside my head and I saw that I absolutely could see him that way.
Ruh-roh, there' goes the whole ladder theory. Looks like 1/3 of the answers to relationshipfilter are done. Now, if we can just get rid of the auto DTMFA answers, we'd stick with the 1/3 that actually help.
I've never cheated on anyone in the past, nor do I ever plan to. I just want help on avoiding impulses to stray or at least lessening them.
I think you need to trust yourself. You have everything you need to stay faithful. There's nothing wrong with feeling attracted to other people. Its normal. I remember the first time it happened while I was in a serious relationship, I freaked out, but I got through it. You can too. Usually when you get in trouble is when other stuff is stressing you out and your mind seeks drama for distraction. Be aware of what's going on in your head and around you and you'll be fine. Avoid alcohol in situations where you are feeling attraction from others. Often people turn to it to deal with the feelings they do have. Usually the source of big mistakes.
Your lizard brain wants you to have sex with men it thinks would be better genetic mates than the one your hyper-evolved human mind has decided is the one for you. The only way to make it stop is to get pregnant.
I'd stay away from this explanation. These sort of easy explanations are momentarily helpful to those who want an easy answer to explain their heartbreak, but usually lead you away from the real issues that are a problem. Frankly, when people are attracted to people who are hurting them, its because they are trying to "fix" their feelings about a past issue that they have never dealt with and they keep going back to the same thing.
Finally, one way to avoid cheating is to be honest with yourself. If, down the road, things die out, don't wait until something bad happens, give a guy a break by breaking up with him if it isn't working out. That's the honest and fair way of doing it.
I'd bet your fears of cheating mask something deeper--a fear that this relationship might work out. Explore those feelings.
posted by Ironmouth at 1:35 PM on December 3, 2008 [4 favorites]
The only way to make it stop is to get pregnant.
WHAT WHAT WHAT?!
Having a child to try and 'fix' a relationship is a HORRIBLE idea.
I don't think "get pregnant" was advice as to how to fix the relationship so much as pedantry concerning the "lizard-brain" reference, about which nicwolff was technically correct though not necessarily helpful.
I think those impulses are just part of being human, and you can't really do too much to reduce them. It's remembering not to act on them that really counts. Don't get bent out of shape because of "thinking about cheating," just don't let it turn into actually cheating.
posted by solipsophistocracy at 2:11 PM on December 3, 2008
WHAT WHAT WHAT?!
Having a child to try and 'fix' a relationship is a HORRIBLE idea.
I don't think "get pregnant" was advice as to how to fix the relationship so much as pedantry concerning the "lizard-brain" reference, about which nicwolff was technically correct though not necessarily helpful.
I think those impulses are just part of being human, and you can't really do too much to reduce them. It's remembering not to act on them that really counts. Don't get bent out of shape because of "thinking about cheating," just don't let it turn into actually cheating.
posted by solipsophistocracy at 2:11 PM on December 3, 2008
I think you need to learn to give yourself more credit, but I can understand your fears. I used to fear that I would always be tired of sex after the initial fireworks and I dreaded that point in every relationship I was in where the passion would fail and I would inevitably start dreading that point every night where I'd have to find a nice way to say no. When my relationship with Mr. Messy started, I was again dreading that turning point because the fireworks were SO amazing and I never wanted to lose that feeling. Almost 2 years later, the fireworks are still there, I still look forward to every opportunity to have sex, and I realized that maybe the issue wasn't me, but that I just hadn't found the right person to share everything with before now.
The point being, if you're right about how you feel, over time you'll realize that those fears are just fears and that those thoughts might never come about because you're REALLY happy and not just telling yourself that you are.
Try not to worry about it too much and enjoy the beauty of your wonderful new relationship!
posted by messylissa at 3:08 PM on December 3, 2008
The point being, if you're right about how you feel, over time you'll realize that those fears are just fears and that those thoughts might never come about because you're REALLY happy and not just telling yourself that you are.
Try not to worry about it too much and enjoy the beauty of your wonderful new relationship!
posted by messylissa at 3:08 PM on December 3, 2008
So you've got a good thing, but there's a part of you that enjoys drama and doesn't feel totally fulfilled unless there's drama in that aspect of your life?
That's pretty typical, actually; consider we feed ourselves (as children and adults) a fairly steady diet of drama-as-relationship-substitute through movies and television. After all, nobody would come to see your movie if it were about a normal, boring relationship with no stress, right? So we condition ourselves to expect drama in a "real" relationship, and if we don't have it, we miss it. It's kind of sad, really.
So there are a couple of options I can think of:
1. Live vicariously through a steady diet of fake drama-filled relationship entertainment, the kind that will fill that void yet leave you feeling "thank goodness I don't have a relationship like that!"
2. Find other areas in your life and start taking the kinds of risks you used to take in your relationships, as a means of obtaining that drama. Not the core stuff like your job or your family relationships, of course; more like hobbies and scary stuff like performing publicly. Find things that, if they go well, would be fantastic -- but even if they don't, the drama generated will feed the beast.
3. Learn to live with it. Everybody has urges and desires that they can't (or at least shouldn't) fulfill, but so long as it's not excessive it's harmless, and can in some cases provide good fantasy fodder. Just accept that those feelings are part of who you are, but not part of what you want or need in an actual relationship.
posted by davejay at 3:51 PM on December 3, 2008 [5 favorites]
That's pretty typical, actually; consider we feed ourselves (as children and adults) a fairly steady diet of drama-as-relationship-substitute through movies and television. After all, nobody would come to see your movie if it were about a normal, boring relationship with no stress, right? So we condition ourselves to expect drama in a "real" relationship, and if we don't have it, we miss it. It's kind of sad, really.
So there are a couple of options I can think of:
1. Live vicariously through a steady diet of fake drama-filled relationship entertainment, the kind that will fill that void yet leave you feeling "thank goodness I don't have a relationship like that!"
2. Find other areas in your life and start taking the kinds of risks you used to take in your relationships, as a means of obtaining that drama. Not the core stuff like your job or your family relationships, of course; more like hobbies and scary stuff like performing publicly. Find things that, if they go well, would be fantastic -- but even if they don't, the drama generated will feed the beast.
3. Learn to live with it. Everybody has urges and desires that they can't (or at least shouldn't) fulfill, but so long as it's not excessive it's harmless, and can in some cases provide good fantasy fodder. Just accept that those feelings are part of who you are, but not part of what you want or need in an actual relationship.
posted by davejay at 3:51 PM on December 3, 2008 [5 favorites]
Having a child to try and 'fix' a relationship is a HORRIBLE idea.
But she didn't ask how to fix the relationship; the relationship is "perfectly healthy and wonderful and what I want to be in for the rest of my life". The question is "how can I reduce my random pangs for what I know I really don't want?"
The questioner has decided to be the faithful girlfriend of someone to whom they're not naturally strongly attracted. By way of answering the question as asked (which no-one else here is doing so far), I suggest that she invoke the powerful pair-bonding instinct that raised oxytocin and estrogen levels have been shown to produce in mammals, either by getting pregnant or by taking hormone-based birth control.
posted by nicwolff at 3:52 PM on December 3, 2008
But she didn't ask how to fix the relationship; the relationship is "perfectly healthy and wonderful and what I want to be in for the rest of my life". The question is "how can I reduce my random pangs for what I know I really don't want?"
The questioner has decided to be the faithful girlfriend of someone to whom they're not naturally strongly attracted. By way of answering the question as asked (which no-one else here is doing so far), I suggest that she invoke the powerful pair-bonding instinct that raised oxytocin and estrogen levels have been shown to produce in mammals, either by getting pregnant or by taking hormone-based birth control.
posted by nicwolff at 3:52 PM on December 3, 2008
I think part of being fully committed IS having those fleeting feelings of restlessness, not getting rid of them. It's knowing on an emotional and visceral level that you could hook up with someone else, and it would probably be fun and exciting (momentarily), but you choose not to. And the reason you choose not to is that it matters so much more to you to be faithful to your partner. Every time I feel a little pang of "maybe I should have dated around more before settling down" or feel attracted to someone other than my partner, my personal strategy is to think about how confident I am in our relationship, how much I love him, and how worthless that drama and risk is to me compared to what I have with him.
posted by Meg_Murry at 6:01 PM on December 3, 2008 [2 favorites]
posted by Meg_Murry at 6:01 PM on December 3, 2008 [2 favorites]
I doubt you'll ever find a way of getting that little voice inside you to go away completely. It's the worst part of all of us, and everyone has the capacity for self-destruction. Even people who have been happily married for years experience the kind of thing you're talking about. Thus, the question isn't "How do I make this go away?" but "What do I do when I feel this way?"
Telling yourself the truth is probably one of the best things you can do. You may feel trapped, but the truth is that you're exactly where you want to be. You may feel like you want something "more," but the truth is that 1) this guy does seem to be most of the things that you want and 2) even if someone else matched a different set of desires, that someone would fail to meet another set. You may feel like you want to sleep with someone else, but the truth is that you don't really want to do that and would feel terrible afterwards. You may feel like you just have to act on your impulses, but the truth is that you always have a choice to make. I guess you could call this kind of self-advice some kind of behavior modification.
Your mention of religion in your question was brief enough that I can't offer any specifics there, but if it's one of the major monotheistic religions, you've got access to a well-established tradition which encourages fidelity. If you're part of a church/synagogue/mosque, I'll guarantee you that someone there would be willing to talk to you about these issues and how your particular faith tradition deals with them. I know less about Eastern religions, but family figures pretty highly in most of them too, so there's bound to be something out there. But more to the point, as you've suggested that you share a faith with your boyfriend, using those resources could be very helpful in the long run, as strengthening those kinds of bonds between you is always good for a relationship.
posted by valkyryn at 6:02 PM on December 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
Telling yourself the truth is probably one of the best things you can do. You may feel trapped, but the truth is that you're exactly where you want to be. You may feel like you want something "more," but the truth is that 1) this guy does seem to be most of the things that you want and 2) even if someone else matched a different set of desires, that someone would fail to meet another set. You may feel like you want to sleep with someone else, but the truth is that you don't really want to do that and would feel terrible afterwards. You may feel like you just have to act on your impulses, but the truth is that you always have a choice to make. I guess you could call this kind of self-advice some kind of behavior modification.
Your mention of religion in your question was brief enough that I can't offer any specifics there, but if it's one of the major monotheistic religions, you've got access to a well-established tradition which encourages fidelity. If you're part of a church/synagogue/mosque, I'll guarantee you that someone there would be willing to talk to you about these issues and how your particular faith tradition deals with them. I know less about Eastern religions, but family figures pretty highly in most of them too, so there's bound to be something out there. But more to the point, as you've suggested that you share a faith with your boyfriend, using those resources could be very helpful in the long run, as strengthening those kinds of bonds between you is always good for a relationship.
posted by valkyryn at 6:02 PM on December 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
I think you need to trust yourself. You have everything you need to stay faithful. There's nothing wrong with feeling attracted to other people. Its normal. I remember the first time it happened while I was in a serious relationship, I freaked out, but I got through it. You can too. Usually when you get in trouble is when other stuff is stressing you out and your mind seeks drama for distraction. Be aware of what's going on in your head and around you and you'll be fine. Avoid alcohol in situations where you are feeling attraction from others. Often people turn to it to deal with the feelings they do have. Usually the source of big mistakes.
Oh god, seconded. Please listen to everything that Ironmouth just said. It's perfectly normal to be attracted to people outside of your relationship. Hell, you might even get little crushes now and then. You're a human being, an animal; these feelings are perfectly normal. What matters is what you do with these feelings, not that they exist at all. If you've felt these things, but avoided two-timing in the past, you're on the right track. I honestly don't think you can obliterate these feelings completely in a monogamous relationship, and I don't even know if you should. As long as your private fantasy life has no bearing on your relationship--especially on how you feel about your significant other when you're with him--you're doing fine.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 7:19 PM on December 3, 2008
Oh god, seconded. Please listen to everything that Ironmouth just said. It's perfectly normal to be attracted to people outside of your relationship. Hell, you might even get little crushes now and then. You're a human being, an animal; these feelings are perfectly normal. What matters is what you do with these feelings, not that they exist at all. If you've felt these things, but avoided two-timing in the past, you're on the right track. I honestly don't think you can obliterate these feelings completely in a monogamous relationship, and I don't even know if you should. As long as your private fantasy life has no bearing on your relationship--especially on how you feel about your significant other when you're with him--you're doing fine.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 7:19 PM on December 3, 2008
It sounds more like the issue is "restless and trapped" than actually being sexual attracted to someone else. In that case, when the feelings come up, start working on some interesting fantasies about your boyfriend and then see what you can manage to put into action. Something playful and surprising that will remind both of you that this is a wonderful relationship. it could be sexy or romantic or it could be just fun.
Some random ideas:
kidnap him after work, check into a hotel and order room service.
meet him at the door (or somewhere else) in a coat and nothing else
go to the beach and watch the sunset
play paintball
pick him up at a bar and/or acting out other scripts
The main thing is to spend time imagining all the interesting options and then pick one that appeals to you and go for it. Maybe if you do it once, you will find him surprising you some time.
posted by metahawk at 7:25 PM on December 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
Some random ideas:
kidnap him after work, check into a hotel and order room service.
meet him at the door (or somewhere else) in a coat and nothing else
go to the beach and watch the sunset
play paintball
pick him up at a bar and/or acting out other scripts
The main thing is to spend time imagining all the interesting options and then pick one that appeals to you and go for it. Maybe if you do it once, you will find him surprising you some time.
posted by metahawk at 7:25 PM on December 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
The questioner has decided to be the faithful girlfriend of someone to whom they're not naturally strongly attracted.
That's not what I read. I read that it was a question of speed of buildup of attraction and not a question of how handsome the person is. From my own experience, "instant" attraction was always about me working out some sort of past drama, because I've had the same experience. When I was overwhelmingly and rapidly infatuated, the woman turned out invariably to be a manipulative person who was highly untrustworthy. I'd get all wrapped up and quickly hurt.
Now that I'm older and I've decided to learn my lessons instead of ignore them in the hope that I could continue to deny that some painful lesson I learned was not true, suddenly, these people don't do it for me. Its like romantic magic in reverse. It isn't that my "lizard brain" suddenly shut off, its that I realized that what I thought was attraction was my mind trying to work out past incidents I wanted to deny hurt me. I don't have "instant chemistry" any more--I think people are cute, but I don't have that "this is fate" feeling.
"Going on birth control" isn't going to help fix this problem. Plenty of women on birth control cheat and feel these types of feelings and plenty of women not on birth control don't.It isn't a matter of hormonal attraction at all. The problem is your need for drama to try and make whatever causes this to go away.
That's why the fact that the only time you didn't feel this way is when you were with a manipulative ex who treated you worse than anyone.
Its my experience that some people look for easy explanations and answers that rely on taking a simple pill, or subscribing to some sort of hierarchical and easy-to-absorb explanation such as "ladder theory" or the latest from the "seduction community." Those explanations and answers seek to change the manipulated into the manipulator--they posit that this is the only way to live and it is best to control others rather than to e controlled. This is a powerful draw because it allows people not to confront the real issues at the heart of their problems. But it always ends up the same way--eventually the newly-minted manipulator meets their match and becomes the victim again. In essence, these modes of thinking are about fundamentally denying that we are going to get hurt and an attempt to control for outcomes rather than face the more painful aspects of human attraction. Ironically, they are a recipie for getting repeatedly hurt. The "control" gained is a painful illusion.
Real change is harder and involves facing things you have spent a lifetime creating a system to avoid facing, taking steps you've previously refused to acknowledge were an option to take. The answers are never as easy as "take a birth-control pill."
Anon, your statements make me confident about your chances here. You recognize the fundamentally painful nature of your past relationship and your more-slowly developing emotions for your new dude indicate that you are not driven by past drama to fall in with just anyone. It shows that you have learned the lessons that you refused to learn earlier and are wisely slowly investing in your current love affair.
The answer to how to avoid feeling the crush furies you've felt before is to recognize them as what they are and not attempt to use them as a method of reenacting past pain. Its about awareness of your own feelings, trust in your own abilities, and taking difficult steps to engage feelings you'd rather not face.
For that reason,I recommend that you get sliding-scale therapy in your area. Its likely available, so make sure you aren't giving yourself some sort of excuse not to go.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:33 PM on December 3, 2008 [4 favorites]
That's not what I read. I read that it was a question of speed of buildup of attraction and not a question of how handsome the person is. From my own experience, "instant" attraction was always about me working out some sort of past drama, because I've had the same experience. When I was overwhelmingly and rapidly infatuated, the woman turned out invariably to be a manipulative person who was highly untrustworthy. I'd get all wrapped up and quickly hurt.
Now that I'm older and I've decided to learn my lessons instead of ignore them in the hope that I could continue to deny that some painful lesson I learned was not true, suddenly, these people don't do it for me. Its like romantic magic in reverse. It isn't that my "lizard brain" suddenly shut off, its that I realized that what I thought was attraction was my mind trying to work out past incidents I wanted to deny hurt me. I don't have "instant chemistry" any more--I think people are cute, but I don't have that "this is fate" feeling.
"Going on birth control" isn't going to help fix this problem. Plenty of women on birth control cheat and feel these types of feelings and plenty of women not on birth control don't.It isn't a matter of hormonal attraction at all. The problem is your need for drama to try and make whatever causes this to go away.
That's why the fact that the only time you didn't feel this way is when you were with a manipulative ex who treated you worse than anyone.
Its my experience that some people look for easy explanations and answers that rely on taking a simple pill, or subscribing to some sort of hierarchical and easy-to-absorb explanation such as "ladder theory" or the latest from the "seduction community." Those explanations and answers seek to change the manipulated into the manipulator--they posit that this is the only way to live and it is best to control others rather than to e controlled. This is a powerful draw because it allows people not to confront the real issues at the heart of their problems. But it always ends up the same way--eventually the newly-minted manipulator meets their match and becomes the victim again. In essence, these modes of thinking are about fundamentally denying that we are going to get hurt and an attempt to control for outcomes rather than face the more painful aspects of human attraction. Ironically, they are a recipie for getting repeatedly hurt. The "control" gained is a painful illusion.
Real change is harder and involves facing things you have spent a lifetime creating a system to avoid facing, taking steps you've previously refused to acknowledge were an option to take. The answers are never as easy as "take a birth-control pill."
Anon, your statements make me confident about your chances here. You recognize the fundamentally painful nature of your past relationship and your more-slowly developing emotions for your new dude indicate that you are not driven by past drama to fall in with just anyone. It shows that you have learned the lessons that you refused to learn earlier and are wisely slowly investing in your current love affair.
The answer to how to avoid feeling the crush furies you've felt before is to recognize them as what they are and not attempt to use them as a method of reenacting past pain. Its about awareness of your own feelings, trust in your own abilities, and taking difficult steps to engage feelings you'd rather not face.
For that reason,I recommend that you get sliding-scale therapy in your area. Its likely available, so make sure you aren't giving yourself some sort of excuse not to go.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:33 PM on December 3, 2008 [4 favorites]
I will strongly second Ironmouth on some of that. The idea that chemistry is often (at least sometimes) a warning sign is what I was getting at here. And chemistry has turned into anti-chemistry for me as well, which is what I was getting at in the third paragraph here. I'm still in the middle of learning, so I feel the spark of "that person is the one for me" for about ten seconds, then it switches to "and that's why I'm going to stay far away from them." Then in the time that remains (I work in a restaurant, so I get to do a lot of people watching from a distance), I try to figure out exactly what mannerisms and facial expressions were the spark / the warning sign. What was I being warned of? What type of person do I think that person is? Why am I vulnerable to that? What interactions do I imagine would occur? It sounds like you're on the right track and it might help you to similarly try to unpack what it is that is a spark for you that "[you] know [you] really don't want." Seeing a therapist can help you as you try to get explicit about what patterns there are, but friends can also help you spot patterns. So, step one is to get better in honing your ability to categorize and deflect the "sparks" that tend to arise.
On the other side, (I'm about to switch metaphors), as you focus on the lows rather than the highs of relationship crack, it's also worth developing a taste for how healthy food makes you feel. So, the other things that might help are to develop a quiet admiration for this new good partner, while seeing enough of his vulnerability that you want to protect him, and also developing a strong sense of gratitude for all the ways that he strengthens and supports your life. As you're saying, having someone you admire and want to protect, someone who strengthens you and helps you make your life what you want it to be -- that is worth much more than some dangerous spark.
posted by salvia at 12:43 AM on December 4, 2008 [5 favorites]
On the other side, (I'm about to switch metaphors), as you focus on the lows rather than the highs of relationship crack, it's also worth developing a taste for how healthy food makes you feel. So, the other things that might help are to develop a quiet admiration for this new good partner, while seeing enough of his vulnerability that you want to protect him, and also developing a strong sense of gratitude for all the ways that he strengthens and supports your life. As you're saying, having someone you admire and want to protect, someone who strengthens you and helps you make your life what you want it to be -- that is worth much more than some dangerous spark.
posted by salvia at 12:43 AM on December 4, 2008 [5 favorites]
Act III of this episode of This American Life was really helpful to me.
posted by BugsPotter at 5:22 AM on December 4, 2008
posted by BugsPotter at 5:22 AM on December 4, 2008
I guess I'll dissent a bit here. It sounds like it might be possible that you're forcing yourself to be with this guy because you've convinced yourself that it's the "right" thing to do because he's such a "great" guy who has waited so long for you. Avoid that. You shouldn't have to be convincing yourself that everything is "wonderful" and "permanent" when you've been dating less than a month.
posted by footnote at 6:44 AM on December 4, 2008
posted by footnote at 6:44 AM on December 4, 2008
I enthusiastically second footnote. You don't want to hear this, but: there are alarm bells all over this post that signal resignation, forced optimism and the vain hope that you can convince yourself to be attracted to him.
I dislike nicwolff's analysis that equates your hesitation to neanderthal urges ("me want healthy BABBY") but there's something to be said for the chemistry of dating. Chemistry certainly isn't foolproof, but you've been around this guy for years without the slightest spark of fire and now you love him, want to be with him forever? This only happens if Nora Ephron is writing the script to your romance. There's a reason we describe the compelling force that draws us to lovers as attraction. You know, like magnets, like charged atoms? Maybe you sense that he's a bad genetic carrier, or, eh, maybe you're just not that into him and you feel guilty about it because dammit, he's so nice and vegan and in love with you! In five months, you're going to be frantically suppressing the competing pulls of guilt and suffocation. Sure, can you wait this relationship out and hope for the best, or you can not string this guy along for a fun experiment in Head vs. Heart.
posted by zoomorphic at 7:16 AM on December 4, 2008
I dislike nicwolff's analysis that equates your hesitation to neanderthal urges ("me want healthy BABBY") but there's something to be said for the chemistry of dating. Chemistry certainly isn't foolproof, but you've been around this guy for years without the slightest spark of fire and now you love him, want to be with him forever? This only happens if Nora Ephron is writing the script to your romance. There's a reason we describe the compelling force that draws us to lovers as attraction. You know, like magnets, like charged atoms? Maybe you sense that he's a bad genetic carrier, or, eh, maybe you're just not that into him and you feel guilty about it because dammit, he's so nice and vegan and in love with you! In five months, you're going to be frantically suppressing the competing pulls of guilt and suffocation. Sure, can you wait this relationship out and hope for the best, or you can not string this guy along for a fun experiment in Head vs. Heart.
posted by zoomorphic at 7:16 AM on December 4, 2008
Its weird adjusting to boyfriend/girlfriend after so long of "just friends", but its going well overall. Even though he's objectively very handsome, my feelings of physical attraction to him are slowly but steadily building, which is fine by me, and he's being very patient. It's certainly a change from the instant chemistry of other relationships I've had, but it feels permanent.
Maybe you sense that he's a bad genetic carrier, or, eh, maybe you're just not that into him and you feel guilty about it because dammit, he's so nice and vegan and in love with you! In five months, you're going to be frantically suppressing the competing pulls of guilt and suffocation.
You shouldn't have to be convincing yourself that everything is "wonderful" and "permanent" when you've been dating less than a month.
I'm going to tell the OP to trust herself regarding where she sees the relationship going. She says her attraction is building, not declining. She also said it "feels permanent" and nowhere stated that she was trying to "convince" herself of anything. Frankly, it sounds like a question of repressed attraction because the guy wouldn't beat her up like the jerk she was with before. We can't predict what is going to happen "five months from now," nor do we have any idea that he is a "bad genetic carrier" (I don't see how an emotionally abusive person is really a "good genetic carrier" or would be a good parent to raise a child to maturity and bearing offspring.) We don't know. But I think the OP does and she has already made her choice.
If it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out. That is the risk we take. Not taking a risk here seems, well, stupid and caving in to fear. Yes, there is the chance that it doesn't work out. But to apply a one-size-fits-all cookie cutter view of attraction when there are as many ways of feeling attracted to people as there are people out there is a mistake. I'm going to venture a guess that the new boyfriend, who has been waiting for his opportunity, fully knows what the chances are and is perfectly willing to take the risk. Otherwise, why would he have stuck around for so long?
That's why I suggest to you, OP, that you follow the advice that answers your question. Even taking birth control to reduce urges (does that work?) is better than advice that does not tell you how to deal with her occasional attraction for others, which is all that she requested.
I will reiterate what I have said before. It isn't any different than the advice I usually give which is to pay attention to what is going on in your head right before you do have pangs of attraction for another. Usually that problem is seeking some sort of resolution and your subconscious mind will create drama to avoid that issue. Then, after you figure out what the problem is, address it. Act fearless in confronting it, allow that problem to fill your mind. Trust that the powers you have already displayed in the past in not letting this feeling lead to self-sabotage will continue to serve you well. Finally, explore the fears that you have that the relationship will work out--those are the types of things that can put you in situations where you might make a mistake.
It is really hard for people who have been hurt in the past to take the chance to open up to a person who genuinely cares about them. Sometimes it doesn't work out. But better to have it not work out than not to take the chance at love.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:02 AM on December 4, 2008 [2 favorites]
Maybe you sense that he's a bad genetic carrier, or, eh, maybe you're just not that into him and you feel guilty about it because dammit, he's so nice and vegan and in love with you! In five months, you're going to be frantically suppressing the competing pulls of guilt and suffocation.
You shouldn't have to be convincing yourself that everything is "wonderful" and "permanent" when you've been dating less than a month.
I'm going to tell the OP to trust herself regarding where she sees the relationship going. She says her attraction is building, not declining. She also said it "feels permanent" and nowhere stated that she was trying to "convince" herself of anything. Frankly, it sounds like a question of repressed attraction because the guy wouldn't beat her up like the jerk she was with before. We can't predict what is going to happen "five months from now," nor do we have any idea that he is a "bad genetic carrier" (I don't see how an emotionally abusive person is really a "good genetic carrier" or would be a good parent to raise a child to maturity and bearing offspring.) We don't know. But I think the OP does and she has already made her choice.
If it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out. That is the risk we take. Not taking a risk here seems, well, stupid and caving in to fear. Yes, there is the chance that it doesn't work out. But to apply a one-size-fits-all cookie cutter view of attraction when there are as many ways of feeling attracted to people as there are people out there is a mistake. I'm going to venture a guess that the new boyfriend, who has been waiting for his opportunity, fully knows what the chances are and is perfectly willing to take the risk. Otherwise, why would he have stuck around for so long?
That's why I suggest to you, OP, that you follow the advice that answers your question. Even taking birth control to reduce urges (does that work?) is better than advice that does not tell you how to deal with her occasional attraction for others, which is all that she requested.
I will reiterate what I have said before. It isn't any different than the advice I usually give which is to pay attention to what is going on in your head right before you do have pangs of attraction for another. Usually that problem is seeking some sort of resolution and your subconscious mind will create drama to avoid that issue. Then, after you figure out what the problem is, address it. Act fearless in confronting it, allow that problem to fill your mind. Trust that the powers you have already displayed in the past in not letting this feeling lead to self-sabotage will continue to serve you well. Finally, explore the fears that you have that the relationship will work out--those are the types of things that can put you in situations where you might make a mistake.
It is really hard for people who have been hurt in the past to take the chance to open up to a person who genuinely cares about them. Sometimes it doesn't work out. But better to have it not work out than not to take the chance at love.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:02 AM on December 4, 2008 [2 favorites]
I don't think pregnancy or birth control is necessarily your best solution, because I don't believe baby lust is necessarily the cause of this kind of churn.
It may well be that you're used to a certain level of stress and turmoil in your relationships and when it was at it its worst, you felt the most engaged and absorbed. When this stress and turmoil is lessened, thoughts can start looping and creating this tension where none exists (or should exist).
Engage yourself productively in things that tap your core talents and interests. Handicrafts, artisan cabinetry, oil-painting, building houses for the poor, writing the best ever vegan cookbook...something that takes a bit of risk and trusting yourself to do the right thing for the right reasons and has nothing to do with your relationship.
Make romance and appreciation for your best friend a priority, giving yourself the chance to repeatedly reinforce new, healthy relationship habits over the top of prior bad programming.
Explore the other thoughts and worries going on when these "urges" come to the fore. As others have said, you may actually be ready to work out some other issue and these thoughts are the byproduct of a deeper reaction/thought process you haven't fully regarded, explored, or worked through as of yet. Try stream-of-consciousness writing when you begin to feel that pressure and see what comes out of it.
You may also want to check out books from the library on mindfulness and resisting self-destructive behaviour. At minimum, it'll be distracting reading. At best, you may learn some new coping skills or interesting facts about yourself.
I'm not sure how accurate I feel the MBTI is across the board, but if you guys haven't taken the tests and compared results, you may just be missing out on an interesting way to look at the similarities and differences that could be causing psychic friction (or lack of friction, depending on what's behind it) for you.
Whatever you do, I wish you luck, strength, and perseverance.
posted by batmonkey at 12:59 PM on December 4, 2008
It may well be that you're used to a certain level of stress and turmoil in your relationships and when it was at it its worst, you felt the most engaged and absorbed. When this stress and turmoil is lessened, thoughts can start looping and creating this tension where none exists (or should exist).
Engage yourself productively in things that tap your core talents and interests. Handicrafts, artisan cabinetry, oil-painting, building houses for the poor, writing the best ever vegan cookbook...something that takes a bit of risk and trusting yourself to do the right thing for the right reasons and has nothing to do with your relationship.
Make romance and appreciation for your best friend a priority, giving yourself the chance to repeatedly reinforce new, healthy relationship habits over the top of prior bad programming.
Explore the other thoughts and worries going on when these "urges" come to the fore. As others have said, you may actually be ready to work out some other issue and these thoughts are the byproduct of a deeper reaction/thought process you haven't fully regarded, explored, or worked through as of yet. Try stream-of-consciousness writing when you begin to feel that pressure and see what comes out of it.
You may also want to check out books from the library on mindfulness and resisting self-destructive behaviour. At minimum, it'll be distracting reading. At best, you may learn some new coping skills or interesting facts about yourself.
I'm not sure how accurate I feel the MBTI is across the board, but if you guys haven't taken the tests and compared results, you may just be missing out on an interesting way to look at the similarities and differences that could be causing psychic friction (or lack of friction, depending on what's behind it) for you.
Whatever you do, I wish you luck, strength, and perseverance.
posted by batmonkey at 12:59 PM on December 4, 2008
If you're anything like me, the "restless and trapped" feeling has other sources beyond purely sexual/animalistic impulses. I find it's often something I feel when deep down the bigger issue is that I'm afraid I will lose my individuality when I seriously commit. And it IS very push-pull--I adore all the coziness of fully cohabitating coupledom, including the nights in watching movies and the Saturdays we just sleep in, hang out one-on-one, and eat and maybe shop or read together and that's it. Yet I worry that same coziness means some kind of gradual slide into being the robotic entity that is The Couple. It also has more to do with my age and situation in life right now--the transition from the 20s to the 30s, the getting serious and marrying and having a "career" and giving up crazy outfits and staying out late at shows and all that. And the truth is, it's a matter of balance. Try making a conscious effort to do things that affirm your individual self and independence--for me that's scheduling alone time to work on my writing, going out with friends solo sometimes, checking out interesting things alone occasionally (shows, art galleries, the library, whatever) just to remember I can. I find if I'm working on a unique project of my own it really makes me glow, and just strengthens my relationship as well as my own sense of self-worth--it reminds my fiance of why he fell in love with me in the first place, and reminds me my life is still what I make of it. I find it's really easy to backslide into social and artistic/career laziness when I feel so comfortable romantically. Try to keep the other parts alive and maybe you'll feel better.
And of course, communicate. Let him know how your life's going, be an advocate for his life as well, etc etc...
posted by ifjuly at 9:33 PM on December 4, 2008 [2 favorites]
And of course, communicate. Let him know how your life's going, be an advocate for his life as well, etc etc...
posted by ifjuly at 9:33 PM on December 4, 2008 [2 favorites]
congrats on your new relationship. you sound exactly like i did a couple years ago. i had the same epiphany where i realized that a very close friend was perfect for me for so many reasons. we knew each other inside and out, had the same sense of humor, wanted the same things out of life, we already had the same friends, the list goes on. so i confessed these feelings, and we got together. moved in together, whole nine yards. i thought that it would never get any better. but a few months into it i had to admit to myself that it just wasnt the same in real life as it was on paper. i craved something else. we just didnt have that magic spark. and as hard as it was, we broke up. now i'm with someone who is actually much better for me even though i would have never thought so in a million years. anyway, this is a tangent. and im certainly not trying to say it WONT work, it just seems like you are putting a lot of pressure on this seemingly perfect union. i just wanted to say, don't ignore your feelings because you think this is as good as its going to get.
anyway, on to the cheating thing. when it comes to cheating on someone you are dating, i personally believe that it only happens when one person is unhappy/ interested in someone else but too much of a wuss to break it off with their SO. i have never cheated, either because:
A. Even though I found myself attracted to other people, I realized that it was just a fleeting thing and that I had it much better with who I was with. So I never acted on it.
or, B. If I met someone for whom who my feelings were too strong to deny, I did the respectable thing and broke it off with my SO before acting on my other feelings.
So if you experience (A) I find the best thing to do is try to imagine in detail (ok, sorry if this is a little weird) but imagine in detail exactly what it would be like. Be as realistic as possible. If I hooked up with this person what would happen? Would it be awkward? Would the sex be as good with this person as it is with the person I am with? What about the next day? Would we date? What would we talk about? How long would it be before things got boring and I started to regret it? Once I get it all laid out in my mind, it NEVER looks as good as what I already have. so i just enjoy the feeling of attraction and unleash any of that extra sexual tension on my boyfriend.
So . . . what if you think about all these things, and the grass is still greener on the other side? Well then maybe you have a case of (B). It may not even be that this other person is so great, it may just be that you're unfulfilled in your current situation. If you keep having feelings like (B) I think that's a sign that it's time to move on. I have found in my experience that if you are having these feelings, they don't usually go away. instead they just get stronger. so if a situation like this arises, just be honest with yourself. and if the situation calls for it, then do the right thing for both of you. but don't feel like this relationship HAS to be it. i wish you the best and hope that it is everything you want- but if it isn't, don't take it too hard. sometimes it's the person you LEAST expect who lands the biggest, most obnoxiously persistent hook in your heart.
posted by lblair at 5:14 PM on December 5, 2008
anyway, on to the cheating thing. when it comes to cheating on someone you are dating, i personally believe that it only happens when one person is unhappy/ interested in someone else but too much of a wuss to break it off with their SO. i have never cheated, either because:
A. Even though I found myself attracted to other people, I realized that it was just a fleeting thing and that I had it much better with who I was with. So I never acted on it.
or, B. If I met someone for whom who my feelings were too strong to deny, I did the respectable thing and broke it off with my SO before acting on my other feelings.
So if you experience (A) I find the best thing to do is try to imagine in detail (ok, sorry if this is a little weird) but imagine in detail exactly what it would be like. Be as realistic as possible. If I hooked up with this person what would happen? Would it be awkward? Would the sex be as good with this person as it is with the person I am with? What about the next day? Would we date? What would we talk about? How long would it be before things got boring and I started to regret it? Once I get it all laid out in my mind, it NEVER looks as good as what I already have. so i just enjoy the feeling of attraction and unleash any of that extra sexual tension on my boyfriend.
So . . . what if you think about all these things, and the grass is still greener on the other side? Well then maybe you have a case of (B). It may not even be that this other person is so great, it may just be that you're unfulfilled in your current situation. If you keep having feelings like (B) I think that's a sign that it's time to move on. I have found in my experience that if you are having these feelings, they don't usually go away. instead they just get stronger. so if a situation like this arises, just be honest with yourself. and if the situation calls for it, then do the right thing for both of you. but don't feel like this relationship HAS to be it. i wish you the best and hope that it is everything you want- but if it isn't, don't take it too hard. sometimes it's the person you LEAST expect who lands the biggest, most obnoxiously persistent hook in your heart.
posted by lblair at 5:14 PM on December 5, 2008
Friends to more than can be hard, but it's how I hope "the one" happens for me. All the marriages I've seen fail have been because the two people don't know how to damn good friends as the base of their relationship, and end up working against each other instead of with each other. I've always said my idea of true love is someone to commit insurance fraud with, and I believe whole heartedly that partner in crime will be my best friend first and foremost.
That said, here's a good comic on a very similar situation: http://xkcd.com/513/
posted by jtarchi at 12:56 PM on January 11, 2009
That said, here's a good comic on a very similar situation: http://xkcd.com/513/
posted by jtarchi at 12:56 PM on January 11, 2009
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by nicwolff at 1:13 PM on December 3, 2008 [3 favorites]