Is there a canine version of Feliway?
October 13, 2008 9:28 PM Subscribe
There's a miserable yapping barking dog right behind the front door of the apartment across the hall, and it's driving me mental. Rather than deal with the skeevy-looking tenants at 12:30 AM I just want the dog to go bark elsewhere in their apartment. If it were a cat I'd spray a little Feliway under their door... is there something I can spray under there that will make that dog avoid the area?
Back in the 80's we used something called Bitter Apple to train our dogs. They hated it. Not sure if it'll work to spray in advance though.
posted by rouftop at 10:00 PM on October 13, 2008
posted by rouftop at 10:00 PM on October 13, 2008
This is a bad idea. It's the middle of the night and you want to spray a potentially irritating chemical into another apartment without permission. If someone did that to me I would file reports with both my landlord and the police. That is a private residence. That is their home.
If you have a problem and are not comfortable confronting them, you need go through your landlord or rental association. Does your landlord have a 24hr line you could call and complain, even anonymously, repeatedly, tonight? Can you gather other residents within ear shot and all approach the owners as a group?
posted by Science! at 10:06 PM on October 13, 2008 [12 favorites]
If you have a problem and are not comfortable confronting them, you need go through your landlord or rental association. Does your landlord have a 24hr line you could call and complain, even anonymously, repeatedly, tonight? Can you gather other residents within ear shot and all approach the owners as a group?
posted by Science! at 10:06 PM on October 13, 2008 [12 favorites]
I agree with Science!. Monkeying with other people's animals without their knowledge or permission could backfire rather badly, in several ways. Esp. if the people are "skeevy." Start with your landlord, if no results there try a noise complaint with the police.
posted by frobozz at 10:18 PM on October 13, 2008
posted by frobozz at 10:18 PM on October 13, 2008
Best answer: I'd try a fresh, uncapped magic marker that is 'accidentally' dropped at the door. It's been my observation that dogs can't stand the smell of them.
posted by crapmatic at 10:38 PM on October 13, 2008
posted by crapmatic at 10:38 PM on October 13, 2008
Best answer: The Feliway equivalent for dogs is DAP (Dog Appeasing Pheremone), and it replicates the pheremone that a mother dog puts out to her puppies, and therefore promotes a 'sense of well-being' for the dog.
It's available in a spray, diffuser, and a collar and produced by Ceva (example UK product page here)
But - this sounds more like a behavioural habit for the dog, and DAP is not designed to break behavioural habits. A water pistol (used by your neighbours, *not* you) used on the dog when it approaches the door is a tried and tested way of breaking bad behaviour patterns.
You may want to talk to skeevy neighbours anyway and find out why the dog is barking that late at night. Does it have separation anxiety? Need to go for a walk? Like the other posters here, monkeying around with other people's pets is not. cool.
Try the usual communication channels first.
posted by jim.christian at 10:39 PM on October 13, 2008
It's available in a spray, diffuser, and a collar and produced by Ceva (example UK product page here)
But - this sounds more like a behavioural habit for the dog, and DAP is not designed to break behavioural habits. A water pistol (used by your neighbours, *not* you) used on the dog when it approaches the door is a tried and tested way of breaking bad behaviour patterns.
You may want to talk to skeevy neighbours anyway and find out why the dog is barking that late at night. Does it have separation anxiety? Need to go for a walk? Like the other posters here, monkeying around with other people's pets is not. cool.
Try the usual communication channels first.
posted by jim.christian at 10:39 PM on October 13, 2008
Sorry that you are going through this- we have a neighbour that goes away on weekends and locks their yappy little shitty little dogs in the garage for the weekend. I've never met my neighbours, but I hate them with a passion.
Get noise canceling headphones- it's the only way I can work on weekends.
Don't touch their apartment- or risk antagonising the dog further.
posted by mattoxic at 10:46 PM on October 13, 2008
Get noise canceling headphones- it's the only way I can work on weekends.
Don't touch their apartment- or risk antagonising the dog further.
posted by mattoxic at 10:46 PM on October 13, 2008
You need to be an adult about this. You have a problem, the way to solve it is to either speak to these tenants directly or go through the intermediary of the landlord. The solution is not and should never even be considered to be to introduce an irritant to someone else's private home in the effort to somehow stifle their animal. You have no idea what effect anything you might spray or stick under the door might have on the dog. You have no idea what effect anything you might spray or stick under the door might have on the tenants, either.
If I found out that you were responsible for introducing something into my home that injured or killed my beloved pet, I'd sue you for the statutory limit in my jurisdiction. If I found out that you were responsible for introducing something into my home that caused me or my child to have an allergic reaction or an asthma attack, I'd do my damnedest to have you arrested for assault.
Suck it up and go to bed. In the morning, call the landlord. If you are bound and determined to stick something under the door, make it a politely worded note about the problem the noise caused you.
posted by Dreama at 10:49 PM on October 13, 2008 [4 favorites]
If I found out that you were responsible for introducing something into my home that injured or killed my beloved pet, I'd sue you for the statutory limit in my jurisdiction. If I found out that you were responsible for introducing something into my home that caused me or my child to have an allergic reaction or an asthma attack, I'd do my damnedest to have you arrested for assault.
Suck it up and go to bed. In the morning, call the landlord. If you are bound and determined to stick something under the door, make it a politely worded note about the problem the noise caused you.
posted by Dreama at 10:49 PM on October 13, 2008 [4 favorites]
Response by poster: At least answer the question before moralizing, thanks. My landlords are, as best we can determine, Italian tax cheats whom no-one has ever seen including the managers. The management company exists only to collect the rent and evict tenants when possible and would be delighted that I'm miserable. And NYPD doesn't really put a high priority on someone's-dog-is-barking calls.
I'm not worried that much about a confrontation, but the sad truth of life in the big city is that if I can fix the immediate problem without starting a whole inter-tenant thing we're all better off. In any case, I tried knocking on their door and they're out which is presumably why the dog is barking.
Obviously I'm asking for non-hazardous sprays such as a dog's loving owner would use on their own pet. Magic marker gets points for availability, and I'll order some of that pheromone for next time - odorless, safe, if it works that's perfect.
posted by nicwolff at 11:03 PM on October 13, 2008 [1 favorite]
I'm not worried that much about a confrontation, but the sad truth of life in the big city is that if I can fix the immediate problem without starting a whole inter-tenant thing we're all better off. In any case, I tried knocking on their door and they're out which is presumably why the dog is barking.
Obviously I'm asking for non-hazardous sprays such as a dog's loving owner would use on their own pet. Magic marker gets points for availability, and I'll order some of that pheromone for next time - odorless, safe, if it works that's perfect.
posted by nicwolff at 11:03 PM on October 13, 2008 [1 favorite]
Followup: the ASPCA has some useful info on their NYC Resources FAQ, which lists the NYC hotline for barking dog complaints:
My neighbor’s dog barks constantly! To whom can I complain?
Complaints about barking dogs in New York City can be made to the Department of Environmental Protection at 311.
posted by zippy at 12:36 AM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
My neighbor’s dog barks constantly! To whom can I complain?
Complaints about barking dogs in New York City can be made to the Department of Environmental Protection at 311.
posted by zippy at 12:36 AM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks zippy, not a best answer for this question but a good idea, I'll call 311 about it as well.
posted by nicwolff at 12:51 AM on October 14, 2008
posted by nicwolff at 12:51 AM on October 14, 2008
People train dogs with crazy high-pitched whistles that only the dogs can hear. What about some high pitched noise generator pointed under your door, towards their door to keep him away from it.
posted by No New Diamonds Please at 1:13 AM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by No New Diamonds Please at 1:13 AM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
Don't make doggy fear the door or it may resist going out to do its business.
posted by batmonkey at 1:39 AM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by batmonkey at 1:39 AM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
The magic marker - are the fumes potentially toxic/damaging? If the issue here is to avoid the noise being made by the dog, then anything you use that could be potentially harmful to said dog is not what I would call the best way to go. It could potentially harm the dog, alter it's behaviour, and perhaps land you in some hot water.
I think calling the ASPCA is a good direction to take, and I'd also pimp DAP again (the wife is a veterinary nurse). Perhaps buy some and leave it as a 'present' for your neighbours.
posted by jim.christian at 3:02 AM on October 14, 2008
I think calling the ASPCA is a good direction to take, and I'd also pimp DAP again (the wife is a veterinary nurse). Perhaps buy some and leave it as a 'present' for your neighbours.
posted by jim.christian at 3:02 AM on October 14, 2008
The answer to your question is: nothing.
There is nothing you can do to make the dog move away from barking at its own door. That's what some dogs, particularly ones that don't get much attention from their owners, live for. They don't have much to do, so they steadfastly guard their territory by standing at its boundary and warning off all comers.
Your moving away from his boundary is the reward he gets every time it happens. Even if he were to be punished with [insert some substance or means of moving him from door], he'd still get the reward of your leaving. And you'd be the only one to do this, presumably, so your presence would be the only one giving him punishment; everyone else walking by would result in reward without punishment. So he's got no reason to stop.
Nthing what Science! said. Although you're quite rightly driven to the point of anger about the barking, the neighbors may not even be aware of all the barking or of how angry it makes other people. First step is to give them a chance to correct it. You never know--they may surprise you and save you the trouble of trying to answer this impossible question of how to make a barking dog move from its life task.
posted by ImproviseOrDie at 5:14 AM on October 14, 2008 [3 favorites]
There is nothing you can do to make the dog move away from barking at its own door. That's what some dogs, particularly ones that don't get much attention from their owners, live for. They don't have much to do, so they steadfastly guard their territory by standing at its boundary and warning off all comers.
Your moving away from his boundary is the reward he gets every time it happens. Even if he were to be punished with [insert some substance or means of moving him from door], he'd still get the reward of your leaving. And you'd be the only one to do this, presumably, so your presence would be the only one giving him punishment; everyone else walking by would result in reward without punishment. So he's got no reason to stop.
Nthing what Science! said. Although you're quite rightly driven to the point of anger about the barking, the neighbors may not even be aware of all the barking or of how angry it makes other people. First step is to give them a chance to correct it. You never know--they may surprise you and save you the trouble of trying to answer this impossible question of how to make a barking dog move from its life task.
posted by ImproviseOrDie at 5:14 AM on October 14, 2008 [3 favorites]
I like the idea of a high-frequency noise generator aimed under your door at theirs, but I don't think it will work to keep it on all night. The dog will either get used to it and ignore it, or it will drive him nuts and he'll bark even more.
If you're handy with electronics (or know someone who is), you could make a sound-activated noise generator that emits a high-frequency sound for a duration of a couple of seconds every time the dog barks. There may even be something like this on the market. In theory, this could provide negative reinforcement that would eventually trigger a "barking = unpleasant sound" disincentive in his doggy brain.
However, I agree with ImproviseOrDie that there may be nothing you can do directly. This is indeed a behavioral issue, and (speaking from experience with many rescue dogs) bad behaviors are generally only correctable through regular daily interaction between the dog and its owners. I've had dogs that might have been deterred by negative sound reinforcement, but I've had others that definitely would not have been.
Another thought: insulation around a door can noticeably reduce sound levels. You might be able to install adhesive foam weatherstripping around the edges of the door without it being noticeable to the managers (or they might not care anyway). At the very least, you could put a towel or one of those beanbag "snakes" along the bottom edge of the door at night. I used to do this to block out the sound of neighbors' late-night revelry, and while it didn't eliminate the noise, it helped.
Even though the owners are out at night, in your place I would be nervous about a random neighbor observing me spraying an unknown (to them) substance near/under the door. If a substance is odorless and harmless, it's very hard to prove after the fact that that's what you actually sprayed while the neighbors are shrieking OMG POISON.
Skeevy or not, if the neighbors are out at night they may have no idea this is happening. I completely understand what you mean about avoiding inter-tenant drama, but why not write a friendly anonymous note from "the people in your hall"?
posted by [user was fined for this post] at 8:59 AM on October 14, 2008
If you're handy with electronics (or know someone who is), you could make a sound-activated noise generator that emits a high-frequency sound for a duration of a couple of seconds every time the dog barks. There may even be something like this on the market. In theory, this could provide negative reinforcement that would eventually trigger a "barking = unpleasant sound" disincentive in his doggy brain.
However, I agree with ImproviseOrDie that there may be nothing you can do directly. This is indeed a behavioral issue, and (speaking from experience with many rescue dogs) bad behaviors are generally only correctable through regular daily interaction between the dog and its owners. I've had dogs that might have been deterred by negative sound reinforcement, but I've had others that definitely would not have been.
Another thought: insulation around a door can noticeably reduce sound levels. You might be able to install adhesive foam weatherstripping around the edges of the door without it being noticeable to the managers (or they might not care anyway). At the very least, you could put a towel or one of those beanbag "snakes" along the bottom edge of the door at night. I used to do this to block out the sound of neighbors' late-night revelry, and while it didn't eliminate the noise, it helped.
Even though the owners are out at night, in your place I would be nervous about a random neighbor observing me spraying an unknown (to them) substance near/under the door. If a substance is odorless and harmless, it's very hard to prove after the fact that that's what you actually sprayed while the neighbors are shrieking OMG POISON.
Skeevy or not, if the neighbors are out at night they may have no idea this is happening. I completely understand what you mean about avoiding inter-tenant drama, but why not write a friendly anonymous note from "the people in your hall"?
posted by [user was fined for this post] at 8:59 AM on October 14, 2008
Building on some of the other replies: offer to dogsit :D
(I have sympathy for the pup; it doesn't know it's doing wrong and is probably really lonely and trying to do right while existing without input)
posted by batmonkey at 10:07 AM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
(I have sympathy for the pup; it doesn't know it's doing wrong and is probably really lonely and trying to do right while existing without input)
posted by batmonkey at 10:07 AM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
You could write a nice note with extra smiley faces:
Howdy neighbours, it's your across-the-hall-neighbour here. Sometimes when you're out your dog barks for a couple hours- I'm a dog-lover myself, and our family dog used to do this too. As a friendly neighbour gift, here's the trick that made her stop. Every time we went out we gave her one of these with a spoonful of peanut butter jammed waaaay inside... no more barking, happy doggie for hours!
Happy Thanksgiving, folks...
Your friendly neighbour.
Attach to a Kong and a large sealed jar of peanut butter with a bow around it.
posted by pseudostrabismus at 10:36 AM on October 14, 2008
Howdy neighbours, it's your across-the-hall-neighbour here. Sometimes when you're out your dog barks for a couple hours- I'm a dog-lover myself, and our family dog used to do this too. As a friendly neighbour gift, here's the trick that made her stop. Every time we went out we gave her one of these with a spoonful of peanut butter jammed waaaay inside... no more barking, happy doggie for hours!
Happy Thanksgiving, folks...
Your friendly neighbour.
Attach to a Kong and a large sealed jar of peanut butter with a bow around it.
posted by pseudostrabismus at 10:36 AM on October 14, 2008
I'm enjoying the moralizing going on in this thread. I can't tell you what's right and wrong, but I have huge sympathies for your situation, and here is what I did in a similar situation. This might not be helpful, but might give you some other ideas on how to wage covert anti-dog ops.
I lived on the third floor of a brownstone, we had a deck in the back, which was actually the 2nd floor's roof. One side of the deck was the exterior wall of the adjoining building's 3rd floor, so that apartment had windows looking out onto our deck. Bedroom windows. The sex noises never really bothered me, but the fellow would leave his beagle locked in his bedroom while he worked (a cook, the late shift). Beagles are pretty annoying. Since it was summer, he would leave his windows open and the poor dog barked nonstop while he was gone.
The dog was basically cool, and I would often feed him (covertly raising the screen a little bit) in the hopes that he would get full and have to poop in my neighbor's shoes. That didn't seem to work, but then I came up with this cunning plan: I used a squirt gun to shoot water through the screen onto his bed. After several nights of coming home to "damn dog peed on my bed again", the dog was removed. Where it went I don't care, all I knew is I could sleep again.
posted by Area Control at 12:43 PM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
I lived on the third floor of a brownstone, we had a deck in the back, which was actually the 2nd floor's roof. One side of the deck was the exterior wall of the adjoining building's 3rd floor, so that apartment had windows looking out onto our deck. Bedroom windows. The sex noises never really bothered me, but the fellow would leave his beagle locked in his bedroom while he worked (a cook, the late shift). Beagles are pretty annoying. Since it was summer, he would leave his windows open and the poor dog barked nonstop while he was gone.
The dog was basically cool, and I would often feed him (covertly raising the screen a little bit) in the hopes that he would get full and have to poop in my neighbor's shoes. That didn't seem to work, but then I came up with this cunning plan: I used a squirt gun to shoot water through the screen onto his bed. After several nights of coming home to "damn dog peed on my bed again", the dog was removed. Where it went I don't care, all I knew is I could sleep again.
posted by Area Control at 12:43 PM on October 14, 2008 [1 favorite]
What about an ultrasonic dog barking deterrent? A friend in Phoenix had almost this same issue (her barky neighbor was on the other side of the shared apartment wall instead of across the hall) and was gifted one of the cheaper versions of this sort of thing and it worked like a charm for her.
It should at least get the dog to move away from the door area, as you hope.
posted by Brody's chum at 9:14 AM on October 15, 2008
It should at least get the dog to move away from the door area, as you hope.
posted by Brody's chum at 9:14 AM on October 15, 2008
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by middleclasstool at 9:46 PM on October 13, 2008