Work Hard, Play Hard

September 2, 2008 10:59 AM

How do I screen for awesomeness in potential new entry-level hires at our small, close-knit company? Some of our recent hires have been boring and anti-social, and it's ruining the office culture that makes us love our jobs (which in turn affects our productivity).

I work at a small company where traditionally, most of the staff have been driven by their commitment to the company's mission, leading us to bond very tightly. We all work long hours, so we spend a lot of time together, and we've become quite close friends. We have a lot in common; most of us took the job because the focus of the company is a strong interest of ours, and so we talk about that interest a lot. We eat lunch out together, go out together after work, and most of us have social lives that revolve around our work friends. This may sound unspeakably boring to some people, but it's how we've chosen to live our lives, and we like it. (Please don't judge. I'm very happy.)

The problem is that some of our more recent hires just want to do their jobs and go home, nothing more. They don't want to put in extra hours at the office (the fact that 40 hours a week is often not enough to get their jobs done, so we often have to pick up the slack, is a separate issue), and they certainly don't want to be our friends and hang out with us outside the office. They're no fun. One guy didn't even laugh when we changed his screen saver to a picture of a silly monkey. They're really, really boring, and it's making coming to work less fun for the rest of us.

Moreover, it's driving down morale at the company, causing the rest of us to get less work done. We've always done a lot of informal brainstorming over lunch or drinks, and with these new folks around, people are doing less of that. Socializing is down, complaining is up, and people are talking about leaving the organization, which has always had very low attrition thanks to people's love for the office culture.

I'm now in a position to do some phone interviews of candidates for jobs that would make up about 5% of the company when all is said and done. I would like to fill these jobs with people who will be hardworking and committed to the company's work, but also fun and awesome. The question is, how do I ask a job candidate "Do you like to eat lunch out most days and go out to happy hour a few nights a week?" How can I find out in a job interview whether people are fun and passionate and have a sense of humor and want to be my friend? Are there questions I can ask? Something I can say to people to let them know that this is a "work hard, play hard," kind of organization, and that if they don't want that, they shouldn't take the job?

I realize that I could screen out a lot of people who can't spend time out after work or have different interests based on age or familial status. I do not want to do that a) because it's illegal, and b) because some of our best, and most fun, employees have been older and/or married with kids. Please don't suggest that I engage in pernicious profiling.

posted by decathecting to work & money (32 comments total)

My company is like yours - and sometimes it's not always for the best, but that's the way things are. I've always explained the environment to candidates and made sure they were aware that if that was not an environment they like, then they might not feel as comfortable here. For the most part, this has worked. We still have a few hires who keep to themselves and leave as soon as they can, but that's okay, and we don't try to force them to hang out with us. They DO get their jobs done, and that's the main point. Honestly, I don't always want to hang out with my coworkers either, and no working environment stays 100% buddy-buddy forever as it expands. Reality just doesn't work that way.

If not getting their work done is an issue, you may want to explain to interviewees that overtime could be expected of them. If they know that going in and still won't pull their weight, then someone needs to have A Serious Talk.
posted by katillathehun at 11:10 AM on September 2, 2008

Take a tack from ITA software and have all your want ads targeted at the hubris of your potential hires e.g., "Wanted: programmers with backgrounds in system administration, firefighting, crisis management, sleep deprivation, and hard drinking."
posted by mkb at 11:11 AM on September 2, 2008 [1 favorite]

I don't have any good advice to give you about the telephone calls, BUT I think you should definitely use the language you've used in this AskMe question in your future help wanted ads.

By the time I got to this:

Some of our recent hires have been boring and anti-social, and it's ruining the office culture that makes us love our jobs

I knew that there was no way in hell I'd ever want to work at your office. I am one of those "boring, anti-social" people. I like boundaries. Boundaries are good. I don't particularly care to share details of my personal life with people with whom I have, at best, an economic relationship.

So this AskMe question managed to screen out one potential problematic hire beautifully.
posted by jason's_planet at 11:13 AM on September 2, 2008 [8 favorites]

You could take candidates out to lunch with your group and see how they mix in. You can also look for candidates that have previous, independent interest in your kind of work.

While you evaluate these guys, though, you might want to consider that not everyone has the same sense of humor.

One guy didn't even laugh when we changed his screen saver to a picture of a silly monkey.

A lot of people wouldn't laugh at this, but it doesn't mean they're no fun or that they wouldn't work as hard as the rest of you guys.
posted by ignignokt at 11:16 AM on September 2, 2008

I've been in places where "what blogs do you read?" was used to screen candidates about how much they kept up on their tech developments, but it also shows a lot about the person.

Are these interviews solely over the phone? In-person group interviews are fantastic for figuring this out - coworkers descend into banter with one another, the interviewee sees how teammates interact, and if they're willing to hop in you're got a winner. I got my first web dev job by getting into an argument about the decemberists.
posted by soma lkzx at 11:16 AM on September 2, 2008

Well, I for one would not want to work in your company, because I like to do my job and go home and don't like working extra hours, nor would I enjoy feeling pressured to befriend my coworkers. If the office culture was made clear to me in the interview, I would think twice about accepting an offer.

Some constructive advice:
- Hire lots of interns for limited, four-month terms. Those that fit in really well, you can offer a full-time position.
- Network; only hire people you already know, or take referrals from people you trust who understand your work culture.
- Explicitly ask in the interview, "how would you feel about working long hours, devoting yourself to this company's mission, and becoming close friends with your co-workers?" Might as well be honest.
posted by PercussivePaul at 11:20 AM on September 2, 2008 [3 favorites]

You may want to talk to someone with a professional background in HR, as you are wandering very close to some very bright lines. If your team is pretty much monocultural (which it sounds like from your description), you run the risk of screening out people of various protected classes- minorities, people of different ages, disabilities, etc.

Publically asking how to screen out people with different cultures than you have- which this question pretty clearly does- can establish a pretty convincing pattern of behavior that an opportunistic EEOC lawyer will use to extort lots of cash from your company.

Although you pay some lip service to the screening problem at the end of your question, it really is essentially what you are doing- and you must be very careful with this; you are definitely playing with fire.
posted by jenkinsEar at 11:22 AM on September 2, 2008 [1 favorite]

I'm with Jason's_planet on this one. What you've described so far is pretty effective. I know, I wouldn't want to work there either. To put it into corporate-ese a bit I might say something like "there's some blurring between work and home life at Company X. We encourage and enjoy hanging out after hours as we feel some of our best ideas come in a more relaxed social settings." It lets potentials know you all hang out and that (while not required) actual work is accomplished there as well.

Of course there will be people who will ignore this and sign on anyhow, but you can't really do much more than be as upfront as possible.
posted by Wink Ricketts at 11:22 AM on September 2, 2008

Seconding Jason's Planet....post....there would be no way In hell I would work where you work (and I've been told that I am TOO friendly at times)......You should expect people to put overtime and DO THEIR JOB......if Hanging out with co-workers and spending lunch hours with them is required you've suddenly have ruled out those people who come in earlier in the day in order to go the gym during lunch.....so make sure that you express the following in your posting:

1) Overtime work is often necessary and expected.

2) Prospective employee HAS TO socialize with other co-workers who think as themselves as awesome because they hang out with each other instead of having life outside of work (some people do other things other than working, you know like having a family, a second career, consulting, etc)

3) May have to sacrifice your lunch to do "informal brainstorming".

4) May access your computer and change your screensaver (and god knows what else) as a joke......

If the prospective employee doesnt mind these things then you are GOLD..But there's no better way to screen somebody than by telling them the situation they are about to get themselves in and finding out if that is a situation that seems apealing to them.
posted by The1andonly at 11:24 AM on September 2, 2008 [4 favorites]

I like the hire interns/see who works out the best idea, myself. I worked in a job like this right out of college and loved it dearly -- we worked hard, we played hard, we had a damn good time. It was heartbreaking (although $$++) to leave. If at all possible, you really should try taking the candidates out to lunch with some of the team members, it seems like the best low-pressure way to find out if they're fun people as well as good-like-their-resume.
posted by bitter-girl.com at 11:27 AM on September 2, 2008

To answer your question, if you're doing in-office interviews, I'd have the first interview be the formal interview, and the second interview be an informal lunch with several of your coworkers (as several above posters have mentioned), and see who they like. On the subject of working extra hours, make it clear in the first interview that overtime is often required. Mentioning the "work hard play hard" environment during the interview is okay.

However, it saddens me that you equate "fun" and "awesomeness" with becoming part of your work clique and going out drinking several times a week. You might be missing out on some wonderful people that way - not just wonderful employees, but wonderful friends. I left my last job in part due to a boozy chainsmoking partytime work environment; although I enjoy hanging out with coworkers, I can only fit in a happy hour once every two weeks or so, and I prefer to know about it well enough in advance so that I can fit it in my schedule. And as much as I love chatting with the people at the office about video games or shoe shopping or whatever craziness Tyra Banks is up to, a lot of the time I just need to quietly get stuff done, without my cubemates conversing in song, and without worrying about someone chucking Nerf balls at me.

By all means hire people you'd like to be around, but it might be time for your company to reconsider what "part of the team" is all about, and allow some room between "one of the gang" and "humorless stick-in-the-mud."
posted by Metroid Baby at 11:32 AM on September 2, 2008

Two thoughts:

1) It sounds like you're in the second stage a lot of startups hit, where the hot molten core of true believers is starting to cool down, and it's hard to find true believers who weren't there at the beginning. A lot of the old school true believers find this limiting and depressing, and whatever, but it's expecting everything to remain the same forever that's unrealistic.

2) If your company culture is ruined because some people aren't immediately assimilated, you need to work on the company culture.
posted by chesty_a_arthur at 11:33 AM on September 2, 2008

So you're judging this guy because he didn't laugh at you changing his screen saver to a monkey? What's next, someone not having a sense of humor because they don't like lolcats? Have you considered the fact that maybe it was just a lame gag, and that this person doesn't hang out, not because he is anti-social, but because he just doesn't like you on a personal level?

It seems to me that what you want to screen for isn't so much sociability and "awesomeness" but someone similar to you, and someone who enjoys your company. That seems kind of weak to me, and it seems like your staff needs to grow up a bit, but if it is that important to you, asking people what their favourite books, films, video games, tv shows, etc. are would be a good way to check for compatibility.
posted by paradoxflow at 11:35 AM on September 2, 2008 [1 favorite]

Sounds like an excellent place to work.

I had a simlilar experience at an interview at a Fox News station (in a top 3 or 4 market). They asked me about my interests and hobbies and told me I would be working with a tight-knit group who were lots of fun and engaged in the same type of antics you described. The executive producers I talked to were loose and I could tell they were playing me to see if I had a sense of humor. Two or three people interviewed me and they were all laid-back and fun. And this was News Corp, in a big city- so a small company like yours should be able to get away with more probing questions like happy hour or whatever. I don't see any problem with it.

I think after you have established that the person is qualified for the job, this line of questioning is just the next logical step in an interview.

(I would point out that in TV news, it's taken for granted that you work long hours and you work through lunch and/or dinner. I turned down the job because of a better offer but I would have liked to have worked there.)
posted by Zambrano at 11:35 AM on September 2, 2008

what is this, a frat?

this is a bad economy, and people are taking jobs they don't want. maybe your shop is in that category for these people. maybe they really are dull, horrible people. either way, you can't _expect_ people to socialize with their coworkers, perhaps they have families and their own friends.

the thing about extra hours is tough to comment on without knowing your business, the job roles, or the state your in, but it's just bad policy to expect a hire to work as many 'voluntary' extra hours as another. if you hired based on assuming all potential hires will put in a more than 40 hour work week, you underhired. it's unclear whether your comment about '40 hours a week not being enough to get their job done' refers to the new employees, or the fact that the extra time is crucial to getting the work done, if the latter is true, you're unfairly putting the burden of a two-employee workload on one. no wonder they don't laugh at office jokes or

lastly, asking people if they 'like going to happy hour' is pretty much asking them if they drink, and that's wholly over the line.
posted by tremspeed at 11:37 AM on September 2, 2008

no wonder they don't laugh at office jokes or go out for happy hour. that should have said.
posted by tremspeed at 11:40 AM on September 2, 2008

Do the "boring" new hires have any incentive to work extra hours for the fun of it? I'm assuming the people already there have a bigger piece of the pie and think they'll benefit if the company does well. I've known people to go in the zany jobs like you describe and this is a real landmine. They will not benefit if product x gets released early, all they'll get is ostracized from family/friends for the long hours! Even big companies do this and it all turns out to be a load of shit when you work 60 hours a week and then get a 2.1% raise despite excellent reviews (I'm bitter!). Maybe this isn't the case.

Another thing I'd like to add is that people should go to lunch with them sometimes just one on one, you know? I'm introverted but am very talkative with people I know. Invariably with every job I take people ask me to large lunches with 5+ people. This turns into the 5+ people talking and me listening as an outsider. If it was just me and any one of the people it would be so much better and after 2 or 3 times make me more comfortable with the larger group.

Maybe make them take a Briggs Myer test and get extroverts only?

So anyway, I'll agree with most. Make sure it's known that people often work more than 40 hours a week and that although it might not be required it would impact bonuses/promotions. I think a lot of people, myself included, would have loved something like this when I was single and just moved to a new city. But it would have took some individual efforts to get to know me to help me open up.

Oh and I can't imagine a silly monkey ever being funny! My sense of humor is so much more sick and disgusting. It sounds like a David Brent / Michael Scott joke on Tim / Jim from the Office UK / US. Awkward at best.
posted by wolfkult at 11:47 AM on September 2, 2008

Seconding everyone who says to essentially lay out the situation to potential hires in the same way you do here.

I know for sure after reading that blurb that I would have absolutely no interest in working for your company, ever. As such it's an effective way to filter out people who see work as a job and not as the defining feature of their lives.

I also second speaking to an HR professional, as what you want to do sounds very much to me like discrimination. Perhaps they will think otherwise, or at least give you some tips on how to avoid legal troubles.
posted by splice at 11:51 AM on September 2, 2008

We have a lot in common; most of us took the job because the focus of the company is a strong interest of ours, and so we talk about that interest a lot.

Mention the company focus in the phone interview. Chat with them a little bit about it.

If people respond enthusiastically to that focus, bring them in for in-person interviews.
posted by jason's_planet at 11:54 AM on September 2, 2008

(By the way, if someone at work changed my screensaver or messed with the things on my desk, especially if I weren't firmly enmeshed in the work clique, "ha ha silly joke" would not be my first reaction. Instead, I would wonder if they were making fun of me or trying to make it uncomfortable for me to work there. Practical jokes might be sending your coworkers the wrong message.)
posted by Metroid Baby at 11:57 AM on September 2, 2008 [1 favorite]

Maybe you should place the help wanted ads in publications that cover your company's focus?

And nthing what others have said above: talk with your HR department to make sure that your hiring practices aren't inadvertently breaking the law.
posted by jason's_planet at 11:57 AM on September 2, 2008

This might help.
posted by Happy Dave at 12:01 PM on September 2, 2008

Trying to do this over the phone is very, very hard. I'm not sure there's really a good way to do it; some people may come across as dead over the phone, but may be a great time in person — and vice versa, of course.

I've worked at a place very similar to yours, and the best thing they did was basically pass interviewees around the office. Anyone who wanted an interview with a potential new hire could do one, or sit in on one, and at the end of the day everyone who'd participated with that candidate could sit in and have a say (not really a vote, it wasn't a democracy, but opinions were considered by management) at the thumbs-up/thumbs-down meeting. This worked pretty well. Every once in a while you still got a closet case, or somebody who just didn't mix with everyone else, and they tended not to stay too long. But it maintained a good critical mass of people who enjoyed being around each other, and that's what made the office work.

They also used to take all the candidates out to lunch, and anyone who wanted to come (and lots of people did — boss picked up the tab) could. That was a nice way of seeing how the candidate interacted with a group. It may be out of your control, but if you could get some money to do that with each in-person candidate (and just to bring them into the office in general), I'd recommend it. It's nice to get a potential candidate out of the office and relaxed with a group of people.

But phone interviews? That's just hard. I guess if I were you, I'd just try to do whatever you can to keep the conversation casual and unscripted, and just try to get an idea of who the person is. Try to ask them about stuff they've done rather than hypotheticals, and see if you can just get a discussion going. But be very careful about asking outside-of-work questions, and run your whole strategy past your HR department; there's a fine line you'll have to walk.

Sounds like you've found a fun place to work; good luck.
posted by Kadin2048 at 12:05 PM on September 2, 2008

A company's culture is simply the sum total of the behaviors of its employees. Change the employees and you will may end up changing the culture. If you want to grow as a company, you may need to accept that you'll have different personality types coming on board who may not share your beliefs. In fact, I'll wager that in order to innovate successfully, you MUST encourage diversity. Does that mean you have to change the culture? Maybe not...but it might change anyway.

I've found that phone screens are only helpful for eliminating the most egregious non-fits. If you want to screen for cultural fit, have as many people interview the candidates as possible, separately, and get together later to share impressions. If anyone sees any red flags, consider not hiring the person.
posted by drinkcoffee at 12:07 PM on September 2, 2008

Think all the ideas so far are good here - I've been in interview situations where I've been asked what I enjoy or value in an office environment - Often because people are hoping interviewees will speak about past experience in, or state they would enjoy an office environment similar to the one they have.

But the HR part of me is agreeing with JenkinsEar and is saying: Danger, will robinson! Danger! I realize you are asking about 'fit' - but you're putting yourself in a tough spot if the time past the 40 hr. work week isn't always necessarily about work, but socialization. Because what you're talking about is penalizing someone who is capable of doing the work (and perhaps doing their work) but perhaps not socially engaging with the rest of the team in the way that you'd like.

Also, when you talk about an 'awesome' work environment from an HR standpoint, the 'silly monkey'.....(really, a monkey? Clearly you haven't heard the phrase: "one person's silly monkey, another non-laughing man's 'hostile work environment' lawsuit")...on your colleague's screensaver alone is just hot enough to set some HR folks ears ringing.

So don't leave it up to your judgment - try to find yourself a HR sort who can ensure that the range of your interview questions - as well as how you're asking the question - doesn't put you in hot water. Few people who fell on the wrong side of the EEOC/the law, imagined that they had crossed some line.

Good luck.
posted by anitanita at 12:11 PM on September 2, 2008

It's understandable that you want everyone to have fun and get along but, to some extent, companies need a mix of people to avoid insular/conformist thinking, and groups of friends don't scale.

So obviously try to hire people who are enthusiastic and committed, but embrace a bit of diversity. The best workplaces I've dealt with have had a core culture around which various loose, overlapping social groups form in different contexts (work, partying, interests, etc.), so everyone pretty much gets along and respects each other, but aren't expected to be best buddies.

Does it matter if not everyone wants to go for a drink after work? Is it fair to expect anyone to constantly work beyond their supposed work hours? Maybe some of the anti-social people bring a different perspective to projects? And perhaps that guy had a really traumatic monkey-related incident as a child..?
posted by malevolent at 12:17 PM on September 2, 2008 [2 favorites]

One of the interview rating factors at a former employer was, "Is this person interested in a job or a career with us?" It sounds like you are more interested in the latter, the people that will live and breathe your work. That can usually be sussed out via a candidate's background, degree of interest and preparation, etc. They may not become your BFF (and don't expect this right away anyway, as most people are "on guard" for at least the first six months), but they may be more likely to have the same level of dedication to the mission as the other employees.

I also wanted to comment on this:

The question is, how do I ask a job candidate "Do you like to eat lunch out most days and go out to happy hour a few nights a week?"

I get that each culture is different. In some places people tend to bring lunch, in others people tend to buy. Most times there's a mix. However, your expectations in this area are incredibly unfair to prospective candidates and current employees. Particularly with the economic situation being what it is. I can't afford to eat out each day and go out for drinks, and I am decidedly not entry-level, nor do I live extravagantly. I have student loans to repay and am trying to sock aside savings each month. A few dollars for lunch each day and drinks a few nights a week can easily turn into $250 or more per month (and that's being conservative) and nearly 3K per year. That is a big chunk of change for entry-level candidates. Not everyone wants to spend their money that way and it sounds like your culture doesn't recognize that.

If everyone ate in the office (even if they went out and brought lunch back), that might erase that divide a bit. You could also bring the alcohol into the office and you might get a few more takers (I was at a place that did this - had a weekly happy hour for employees in the office, but it was no big deal if you sat it out).

p.s. If someone changed my screensaver I might wonder what else they were doing on my computer. And if I had sensitive information on my system (donor info, for example), I would be even less amused.
posted by ml98tu at 12:27 PM on September 2, 2008 [1 favorite]

It it possible to bring people on a trial basis? I know a place that brings people on for a month probation. 80% of the people get chucked after that month. But the rest stay there for years and years and work their asses off.

When bringing them on location for interviews, show them around and relate some anecdotes and see how they relate. "Here's the lunch area, where we often hash out new ideas. And there's bob's screen saver. Once we changed it to a monkey and we all lol'd." If they say "That's great, I love to talk about work on my breaks. And the monkey screen saver reminds me of the time we plugged jane's mouse into joe's computer and we were like roffl." then you know you have a match.

Watch your legal back. Basing hiring or firing decisions on what people do when you're not paying them can get you into trouble.

It sounds like you're interviewing for friends, not for employees. That will not serve you or your company in the long term.

Oh and my computer is the other thing of mine you should never touch without my permission. I would go apeshit if you replaced my screen saver.
posted by Ookseer at 12:28 PM on September 2, 2008

Basically, it seems you're saying that your workplace is only really successful if everyone is on the same page and puts in above average effort. In truth, even one of those things being true in a typical work place is a very nice accident - and having both be true would be exceedingly rare.

Your company's success depending on both, however, sounds like you're not really setting up good odds for yourselves. It's tough to hire competent people. Period. Add in the additional hurdle of also being best friends forever, or else we all go broke? Good luck with that.

If a competent new hire is dragging you guys down, are you sure the problem is with the new hire? We're not talking about the fine tuned chemistry of a team winning the World Series or the NBA Finals, here. We're talking about a company, where your customers fork over cash to pay your salaries. There's lots of boring old ways to do that.

But you want an answer: mine your existing employees' social/professional networks. You will not randomly find the people you're looking for, regardless of how the job description reads. If there are no more buddies to be dragged into the cult, you have a choice: either stop growing, or grow up.

You could also do like the hot startups here in the bay area - dedicate a LOT of effort towards building your brand. That way, job candidates brainwash themselves into thinking they want in to your little club. In other words, if you can't FIND the people you want, put out propaganda to make people transform themselves into the people you want.
posted by NoRelationToLea at 12:28 PM on September 2, 2008 [1 favorite]

I am a screensaver-passwording, don't-touch-my-shit, passing-up-the-happy-hour, socially reserved person in an industry known far and wide for debauchery. I work at one of the companies *most* known for its hard-drinking, 80-90 hour-a-week, we're-in-all culture.

I work as hard as my job requires, I try not to push huge amounts of OT on my guys, I socialize during office parties, and I appear to have a rep as a pretty solid contributor and idea person. I may not be an exciting social butterfly, but if you want to know where things stand and how we should proceed, I'm probably decent to ask.

Takes all kinds. You need to be *very* careful trying to protect an insular culture that might be causing you guys to miss out on solid performers who don't do body shots off the CFO every Thursday night. ;)

also, at the last place I worked, one of the senior execs sat down at a coworker's computer and hijacked his IM client to impersonate him because "it was funny." everyone in the *building* was password-locking their screensavers by 2pm that day, and everyone knew not to leave their machine unattended near that exec, whose sense of "funny" pretty much hit everyone's "not to be trusted" buttons.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 12:39 PM on September 2, 2008

Do the current hard-core employees you seem to belong to have ownership in the company (stock, profit sharing etc...)?

If not then you are fucking insane for putting in the hours you do and you shouldn't inflict your fucked up environment on others.

If so will the new employees you are hiring have a similar degree of ownership? (and no, giving someone 5000 options when all the old guard have 50,000 doesn't count).

If not why should they be expected to be as emotionally invested in the company?
posted by Riemann at 12:39 PM on September 2, 2008 [2 favorites]

Have you tried:

Interviewing candidates?

Not having job descriptions which regularly require more than fourty hours of week a work?

Free lunch/drinks?

Interviewing candidates?
posted by shownomercy at 12:43 PM on September 2, 2008